Would like to understand what is going on with Dominion matchmaking

Dr Easter·Feb 27, 2015·9 votes·1,202 views

You win a few matches, get up in MMR, nice games, cool people. When you think the game will get better because in theory higher MMR = more skilled players that understand how Dom works. You get more trolls, more people with 10 ~ 200 wins that say they know how to play but defend a tower by staying under it, and they still want to teach you what to do. You get more people that won't follow the tank into the jungle no matter how much you spam the assist me ping after seeing an enemy alone in the map. And this continue till you drop your MMR quite a lot. Then you rise again, and everything repeats. It's getting frustrating. When you have a match with cool people it's fun even when you lose. But holy shit Riot... things are getting out of control. I know it's not a mode that people treat serious (thanks to Riot itself) but damn... please add ranked to it so at least I can find more players interested in the mode and maybe form a team. For God's sake.

22 Comments

Wuju LordMar 4, 20156 votes

I would love so greatly to see ranked dominion games. Truly I would.

Champion SkinMar 1, 20153 votes

Hmm... I don't know what's up with that as I don't really play dominion and I am not any good at it...

Oh and I wonder what happened to dominion draft... I heard it kind of feel apart after a bug or something which enabled you to leave with no penalty making it so that somebody almost always left

Dr EasterMar 1, 20153 votes

Yes, Riot took ages to fix the bug. When they did it was already too late. If only they replaced blind and draft queues for a single blind draft would be already very good.

SKOBODOMar 9, 20153 votes

The biggest issue with Dominion is, and has been for a while, the long queue times. I suspect Blind Draft would make them even longer, and I'm not convinced people would use the bans properly (banning a champion that got a new skin is rather rude towards people who want to play that champion. I don't even know why you're complaining about Sona, she's a very strong champion. It's not like they're picking Draven or something).

Anyway, this might lead to longer queue times which makes me sceptical of it. That's my main issue with it. If it could be done without more toxicity or more queue-dodges or longer queues, I wouldn't mind bans.

Dr EasterMar 9, 20153 votes

Please give up. Your messages get in my inbox and I already know what they are about. I already know you don't get it so it's just more of the same -_-"

Daddy Forge GodMar 10, 20153 votes

{quoted}

Please give up. Your messages get in my inbox and I already know what they are about. I already know you don't get it so it's just more of the same -_-"

i think you should stop as your the one who caused the problem -_-

Dr EasterMar 10, 20154 votes

Nah, I'm not. This discussion about blind draft has happened for years in the old Dominion forums (NA). And Sylian was pretty much the only one against this for reasons that makes no sense. So I know with who I'm talking. ;) He doesn't even get why you would ban a champion to avoid having it in your team. Like someone with Shaco that has no idea how to back cap, or the enemy team with a Shaco and you are the only in the team that knows what to do but you aren't with a champion that is good enough for the task. And that happens quite a lot so it's a champion you'd ban sometimes. Or Riven when people were spaming her in Dom and going solo 4x1 because they saw a Korean doing it in SR and killing everyone. Or like now that people were picking Sona just to test a skin and building her in bad ways, being like one less player in the game (and he doesn't believe nor accept it). Etc. This stuff happens a lot in Dom ^_^ And then he thinks it's rude to ban champions because of this (like it never happens in ranked or draft SR duh). But hey! I'm a Dom player and I see Riot ignoring the mode for so long. What I want to do is rude, what Riot does is not. For sure... You should see his discussion on Lulu... The guy is a good player and has some knowledge but damn.... sometimes he just need to consider what others think.

SKOBODOMar 10, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Nah, I'm not. This discussion about blind draft has happened for years in the old Dominion forums (NA). And Sylian was pretty much the only one against this for reasons that makes no sense. So I know with who I'm talking. ;)

This is false, for two reasons. Firstly, argumentum ad populum is a fallacy. Secondly, I did support it originally. Here is the thread: http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=4444237

Thirdly, there were people in that thread opposed to Blind Pick. Just reading the first 10 pages, I count 4 people against it and 2 on the fence. At that point in time, I was for it (but with 2 bans per team instead of 3). Considering not that many different people were writing in the thread, it stands to reason that quite a significant minority was against it. So your "was pretty much the only one against this" is flat out wrong, aside from the fact that I wasn't against it back then.

{quoted} He doesn't even get why you would ban a champion to avoid having it in your team.

This is incorrect. I do get why you would want to ban a champion to get it on your team, but doing so is rather rude. If you don't want a champion on your team, then ask them to not play it (which is kind of rude still, but better than banning it). If they're not listening and you're not okay with that, then maybe start playing with premades.

{quoted} Like someone with Shaco that has no idea how to back cap, or the enemy team with a Shaco and you are the only in the team that knows what to do but you aren't with a champion that is good enough for the task.

How do you know that they don't know how to play Shaco, or don't know how to deal with Shaco? And do they have to know how to play a champion in order to pick it? People learn from playing (most do, anyway), so even if they do poorly one game, it's not a huge deal. Telling them they aren't allowed to play a champion because they might do poorly with it, however, is pretty rude.

From my experience, people are quite often flat out wrong on which champions are weak. I've heard people call Morgana and AP Nidalee weak on Dominion, so yeah. If those people banned Morgana or Nidalee because they thought those champions were weak, I'd be pretty annoyed if I wanted to play one of those.

{quoted} Or Riven when people were spaming her in Dom and going solo 4x1 because they saw a Korean doing it in SR and killing everyone.

You'd ban Riven? She's a very potent botlaner and I know some very good Riven players.

{quoted}

Or like now that people were picking Sona just to test a skin and building her in bad ways, being like one less player in the game (and he doesn't believe nor accept it)

Sona is really strong, and most Sonas I see do well with her, even if they don't have ideal builds. How do you know they're picking Sona just to test her skin, anyway? I liked Sona even before the skin was released.

{quoted}

And then he thinks it's rude to ban champions because of this (like it never happens in ranked or draft SR duh).

I think people doing it in SR probably shouldn't be the ones doing the bans, yeah. Ban for the enemy team, not your own team, that's trolling and toxic. Two wrongs don't make a right.

{quoted}

But hey! I'm a Dom player and I see Riot ignoring the mode for so long. What I want to do is rude, what Riot does is not. For sure...

When did I say what Riot did wasn't rude? I never did say that.

{quoted} You should see his discussion on Lulu...

I'm not sure how this is relevant to the discussion? We're discussing Blind Draft, not Lulu. That's off-topic, if you want to discuss Lulu you could create a new topic.

Dr EasterMar 10, 20152 votes

+Sigh+ +Facepalm+ You don't really get it. And that's why this is waste of time. http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mchqkfIoFb1riyc77o1_500.jpg

SKOBODOMar 10, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Please give up. Your messages get in my inbox and I already know what they are about. I already know you don't get it so it's just more of the same -_-"

You come across as rather arrogant here. It's generally better to refute ones point than attacking the person with flimsy things like "you don't get it" and "I already know what they are about". If you do have good arguments to support your conclusion, then please, go ahead and show us them. If you cannot refute my points, saying "you don't get it" doesn't exactly prove me wrong, now does it?

Your arguments have been rather flimsy. Blind Draft so you can prevent people from playing Sona to test a skin. I've already explained why it's a bad idea to ban a champion just to prevent your teammates (or the enemy team, for that matter) to play the champion. I will admit that banning a champion because the champion is annoying (like Shaco, or Teemo) is a good argument for Blind Draft. Banning a champion because it's OP is also a good, supporting argument for Blind Draft, but you don't seem to think that's important.

So, Blind Draft to prevent people from playing champions with new skins (ie you being toxic and rude towards your teammates) and to prevent enemies from playing annoying champions. The skin reason is a bad reason and I'd argue it's actually an argument against Blind Draft. Reducing the amount of annoying champions is a good reason.

Here is what my main argument looks like:

Blind Draft will likely increase queue times (Premise 1). Blind Draft will likely increase toxicity (Premise 2). Blind Draft might actually increase tryharding (Premise 3). Conclusion: Blind Draft is a bad idea right now.

Let's look at each premise more closely, shall we? Premise 1: Queues will probably be longer for two reasons: Partly because fewer people will play Dominion (since it's less casual, and you'd need a minimum amount of champions to play too), and partly because the amount of queue-dodging will increase (because of toxicity and them having their champion banned).

Premise 2: Toxicity will probably increase for a few reasons. The host might ban the "wrong" champions (thus gets flamed by their team), and people might be annoyed if OP champions are open and no one in their team picks them, but someone in the enemy team does.

Premise 3: If a certain champion is banned most of the time but sometimes is left open, then when it is left open it will more likely be picked. People might also feel that they should pick the best of what's left open and thus they might focus mainly on high tier 2 champions instead of picking other champions. The champions played might stagnate a bit.

I believe those premises are reasonable and they all support my conclusion.

Dr EasterMar 10, 20152 votes

As I said: we already discussed this a lot with you in the old forums. You can read all the reasons there if you want to. But I'm not wasting my time on this with you again. All my reasons are there, and there are other great ones from players with a lot more experience than me, the ones you should focus more IMO, feel free to check it again and again and again. If it was a new player I'd try. Not going to read your post btw, no reason to do it. As I also already said: I know exactly what you wrote without even needing to read it, saw it too much in the old forums.

SKOBODOMar 4, 20152 votes

I don't think Blind Draft is a good idea at this point. There aren't enough OP champs right now to really warrant it, I bet a lot of people would spend the bans on annoying champions like Shaco over really strong champions like Kha'Zix or Leona.

As for matchmaking, most non-high-level-tournament people tend to have a poor "flow" of the map.

Dr EasterMar 4, 20155 votes

Sylian please stop focusing on OP champions every time people talk about blind draft. This is annoying. If we had blind draft now I could ban Sona, she is good but having people using her just to "test" a skin.... come on! Or Shaco because it's annoying to be the only that know what to do with him but not always being with a champion that can do it easier. Etc.... there are other reasons....

SKOBODOMar 4, 20153 votes

{quoted}

Sylian please stop focusing on OP champions every time people talk about blind draft. This is annoying. If we had blind draft now I could ban Sona, she is good but having people using her just to "test" a skin.... come on! Or Shaco because it's annoying to be the only that know what to do with him but not always being with a champion that can do it easier. Etc.... there are other reasons....

Banning champions for your own team is rather rude, and I doubt people are playing Sona just because she got a new skin. She's pretty strong anyway, but not strong enough to warrant a ban. Blind Draft costs more than it's worth right now.

Dr EasterMar 4, 20155 votes

Here comes the same flawed arguments. Nevermind bro, I won't waste my time with this. Blind draft (ranked would be better) is a must no matter how much you try not to believe this. Have a good day. And yes people are picking her to test a skin. Heck DJ Sona affected even her picks in ranked -_-"

Kholdstare13Mar 13, 20152 votes

If they really refuse to give us ranked, then why not just change the name first and THEN give it to us?

How about the "I actually give a fuck about taking this shit seriously, and want to have my skills evaluated and track my progress" queue?

But seriously, I was the one who started the thread on the old forums asking for a queue merge into blind draft. I don't see how reducing it to a single queue for normals would somehow reduce volume. It just lets players feel safer by banning champions they hate to play against. Example: I main AD Malz bot, and I would love to ban Vi. Vi is not OP in general, but I always struggle against her as AD Malz.

Dr EasterMar 13, 20151 votes

hahah epic queue name xD I agree on all points with you :)

Dr EasterMar 3, 20151 votes

Well... this is the worst wave of bad teams I've ever seen in Dominion :(

SKOBODOMar 11, 20151 votes

You're turning it into a waste of time. I've given clear arguments and counter-arguments. You've just avoided them and decided to say "You really don't get it", which is incorrect. I do get it, and I've proven that you've been wrong about several facts. If you don't want to support your argument, don't create a thread.

"Sigh", "Facepalm"? Please act more mature, I abhor demagogy.

Dr EasterMar 11, 20152 votes

What about if you disagree do not comment on my threads? ;) You don't get it, I have nothing else to say. I know exactly what your posts are since the Dominion Forums, there is no reason to discuss with you, specially because you are never going to listen. The only that needs more maturity here is you that never know when to stop. And your posts only makes this more and more truth.

SKOBODOMar 12, 20151 votes

A summary of my main points:

Blind Draft is likely to lead to longer queues and more toxicity. The cost is likely higher than the gain, thus it should not be implemented.

@Penteano: If you just get people who agree with you to post then it'll be rather one-sided. Blind Draft is nice in theory, but in practice it's likely to cause more harm than good.

You keep focusing on the person. Don't. Focus on the argument and not the person. Ad hominem is a fallacy, after all.

Dr EasterMar 12, 20151 votes

Since you'll never get it and won't stop posting after I requested quite a lot. Here is a good song. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FWMebzGZGZc

If you want more, keep posting.

Meanwhile Bard is available. As dealing with the matchmaking wasn't bard enough now it's a Bard spam, gotta take a break from Dom :-)