Apparently few people on this board know what 'Grimdark' actually means.

Ethereal311··3 votes·1,144 views
Darker and Edgier - TV Tropes

"A tone shift that seeks to make a work of fiction more serious, cynical or gritty. In theory, archetypes which we are usually accustomed to acting in a more noble setting will have to act in one where they must think and act grimly in order to make progress, thus forcing re-examination of the tropes involved or the ability to use new tropes and expand the setting making for different sorts of characters and stories. In practice however, writers can be too lazy to make use of what most of those words mean and ending up randomly "spicing up" a work with gratuitous gore, cursing, and sex to make the work "more adult" - often overdoing it in the process. "

This is exactly what Fortune and Shadows as well as Burning Tides are, and it's in the wrong kind of grimdark. I don't see an expansion of any trope critique and the gore and cursing are nothing more than spice that can be considered poorly done at times. It actually pisses me off too much for me to read it in a single sitting. I'm of the firm belief that it is one hell of pathetic attempt at lore writing, but that's just me. If you're not convinced, read further into the link and tell me how the hell it's not.

6 Comments

Dreamspitter2 votes

{quoted}

"A tone shift that seeks to make a work of fiction more serious, cynical or gritty. In theory, archetypes which we are usually accustomed to acting in a more noble setting will have to act in one where they must think and act grimly in order to make progress, thus forcing re-examination of the tropes involved or the ability to use new tropes and expand the setting making for different sorts of characters and stories. In practice however, writers can be too lazy to make use of what most of those words mean and ending up randomly "spicing up" a work with gratuitous gore, cursing, and sex to make the work "more adult" - often overdoing it in the process. "

This is exactly what Fortune and Shadows as well as Burning Tides are, and it's in the wrong kind of grimdark. I don't see an expansion of any trope critique and the gore and cursing are nothing more than spice that can be considered poorly done at times. It actually pisses me off too much for me to read it in a single sitting. I'm of the firm belief that it is one hell of pathetic attempt at lore writing, but that's just me. If you're not convinced, read further into the link and tell me how the hell it's not.

#IN THE GRIM DARKNESS OF THE FUTURE...

http://i.imgur.com/rLiAw1d.jpg

#THERE IS ONLY GRAHAM MCNEILL

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graham_McNeill

LordHippoman2 votes

I don't think Shadow and Fortune is too grimdark. A better word for that kind of thing is usually "gratuitous" anyway.

Shadow and Fortune is depicting a dark incident that has a lot of death and loss occurring. So I don't mind them mentioning that MF's crew has been mostly cut down, or that the docks are filled with bodies. That's natural description.

Like, "A corpse was hanging from the dock" isn't necessarily gratuitous if it serves a purpose. If it's something stupidly cringey like "A dead corpse of an orphan hung from the docks, it had like six stab holes in it and blood was still pouring from it", that's gratuitous, that's someone telling the author "You can do M rated stuff" and them then doing it just for the sake of trying to be more "adult", like you mentioned. I think so far S&F has avoided that.

There were a few spots in Burning Tides that sort of did that. I still think the part with Gangplank scrimshawing the sailor went on longer than necessary. We got that Gangplank was a cruel and vicious leader within like 2 sentences of that. We didn't need THAT much description, and it sorta dragged on and felt pointless. So I see your point, but I'd disagree with the application of it in S&F. Olaf's portions are pretty much entirely comic relief, for example.

Dreamspitter1 votes

{quoted}

I don't think Shadow and Fortune is too grimdark. A better word for that kind of thing is usually "gratuitous" anyway.

Shadow and Fortune is depicting a dark incident that has a lot of death and loss occurring. So I don't mind them mentioning that MF's crew has been mostly cut down, or that the docks are filled with bodies. That's natural description.

Like, "A corpse was hanging from the dock" isn't necessarily gratuitous if it serves a purpose. If it's something stupidly cringey like "A dead corpse of an orphan hung from the docks, it had like six stab holes in it and blood was still pouring from it", that's gratuitous, that's someone telling the author "You can do M rated stuff" and them then doing it just for the sake of trying to be more "adult", like you mentioned. I think so far S&F has avoided that.

There were a few spots in Burning Tides that sort of did that. I still think the part with Gangplank scrimshawing the sailor went on longer than necessary. We got that Gangplank was a cruel and vicious leader within like 2 sentences of that. We didn't need THAT much description, and it sorta dragged on and felt pointless. So I see your point, but I'd disagree with the application of it in S&F. Olaf's portions are pretty much entirely comic relief, for example.

Really?

Gangplank,” breathed the urchin, his voice thick with fear and awe.

“Captain, I figured you’d want to hear this,” said the mate.

Gangplank said nothing, nor did he turn, still intent as he was on his work. The scarred sailor nudged the boy forward. He stumbled before he caught his footing and shuffled closer. The child approached the captain of the Dead Pool as he would a cliff’s edge. His breath quickened as he caught full sight of the captain’s work.

Basins of bloody water sat upon Gangplank’s desk, along with an array of knives, hooks, and gleaming surgical implements.

A man lay upon the captain’s workbench, bound tightly with leather straps. Only his head was free. He looked around in wild desperation, neck straining, his face covered with sweat.

The boy’s gaze was inexorably drawn to the man’s flayed left leg. The urchin suddenly realized he couldn’t remember what he came here to do. Gangplank turned from his work to stare at the visitor. His eyes were as cold and dead as a shark’s. He held a slender blade in one hand, delicately poised between his fingers, like a fine paintbrush.

“It’s a dying art, scrimshaw,” said Gangplank, his attention returning to his work. “Few have the patience for carving bone these days. It takes time. See? Every cut has a purpose.”

Somehow, the man was still alive, despite the ragged wound in his leg, the skin and flesh peeled back from his thighbone. Transfixed with horror, the lad saw the intricate designs the captain had carved upon that bone; coiling tentacles and waves. It was delicate work, beautiful even. That just made it even more terrible.

Gangplank’s living canvas sobbed.

“Please...” he moaned.

Gangplank ignored the pathetic plea and set down his knife. He splashed a cup of cheap whiskey over his work, clearing it of blood. The man’s scream threatened to rip his own throat out, until he slumped into merciful unconsciousness, his eyes rolling back in his head. Gangplank grunted in disgust.

“Remember this, boy,” Gangplank said. “Sometimes, even those who are loyal forget their place. Sometimes, it’s necessary to remind them. Real power is all about how people see you. Look weak, even for a moment, and you’re done.”

The child nodded, his face now drained of color.

“Wake him,” said Gangplank, gesturing toward the unconscious crewman. “The whole crew needs to hear his song.”

As the ship’s surgeon stepped forward, Gangplank swung his gaze back to the child.

“Now,” he said. “What did you want to tell me?”

“A... a man,” said the boy, his words faltering. “A man on the Rat Town docks.”

“Go on,” Gangplank said.

“He was tryin’ not to be seen by the Hooks. But I seen him.”

“Mm-hmm,” Gangplank muttered as he began to lose interest. He turned back to his work.

“Keep goin’, lad,” the first mate urged.

“He was playing around with some fancy deck of cards. They glowed funny.”

Gangplank stood up from his chair, like a colossus rising from the depths.

Doesn't really seem overlong, at least in my opinion -well it's under 400 words. Maybe like what amounts to half a page.

Gives me a cool idea. What if...you carved magical runes and figures into your bones, that when activated would glow and shine through your flesh?

:D

LordHippoman1 votes

Gives me a cool idea. What if...you carved magical runes and figures into your bones, that when activated would glow and shine through your flesh?

:D

Ryze's tattoo magic is kinda along those lines.

GenoXx2 votes

Like i said before Grow up

Ralanr1 votes

Yeah, it's not grimdark. People are mislabeling it. It has dark moments and that's fine.

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