Spirits, Gods and Demons

6FlagsFunnelCake··16 votes·3,008 views

So with the somewhat recent revelation of Gods and Goddesses in Runeterra, I've come to a very interesting theory regarding what exactly a God is in Runeterra, which actually segways into what a Spirit or Demon is as well! (Be warned, this one's gonna be a long ride...)

So this one's a bit tricky, but hear me out here. So through Shen's lore we know of a Spirit World where almost all natural magic originates, as well as the place where the Proto-Vastaya hail from. Now, due to it's name, this is obviously the place where Spirits come from. So where am I going with this? Well, in Ornn's lore, he mentions how he dislikes his 'siblings' meddling with mortal affairs and taking physical form, as seen by Volibear and Anivia, the only ones we know are canonically his siblings.

Now my headcanon is that, since the Spirit World is where magic comes from, those closer to the Spirit World are much more magical (as seen by Vastaya being closer to the spirit world and innately being more magical). So my guess; Gods and Goddesses are just really, really powerful Spirits. Hear me out, we know of a few deities in League. Some of them, such as Elise's Spider-God or the Gray Lady from the Glorious Evolved, are more like 'misinterpretations' of other things. However, there are some deities that seem very, very real. We already talked about Ornn, Volibear and Anivia, but another Champion is also considered a goddess of Zaun; Janna! However, it's clearly stated that she's just a wind spirit that favors to help Zaun, so this just proves that Spirits can be considered deities by some cultures. In a big twist, this is also the case for Volibear! As seen in the Vastaya Q&A, where he's stated as something akin to "a primal Freljordian nature spirit/force of nature," proving that he isn't a real 'God,' just a really, really strong nature SPIRIT!

Other beings we know are on this 'God' level of Spirits are Nagakabourous and Aurelion Sol (in a weird way). Nagakabourous, despite us not seeing them physically, is very real a God as seen by Illaoi's powers, probably the most powerful of them all as they don't even need to take full physical form. Aurelion Sol however has been stated to be a Demi-God compared to Nagakabourous, but still more powerful than Ornn and his siblings. However, he may be a special case since the Spirit World is purely Runeterra, whereas Aurelion is a Space Dragon, not coming from Runeterra at all. Another strange factor to this is the Aspects, but we simply know near to nothing about them so trying to guess what they are is just a whole different rabbit hole to fall in.

So now that we know that Gods and Goddesses are just glorified Spirits, what is Ornn's talk of 'siblings?' Well, I theorize that **all spirits, demons and gods/goddesses are considered 'siblings' to one another, and Ornn may just consider Volibear more of a brother due to how close they are, you don't exactly hear about Janna or Kindred's shenanigans in Freljord or with Ornn. Along with that; Demons, demons aren't as tricky, I think they are simply 'bad spirits'. Much like Kindred, a Spirit of Death, Tahm Kench has a tendency to change his shape depending on who he's talking to and which culture he's in. Now some people may be wondering; "Wait but how can something like Janna be related to Kindred or Ornn?" Well, as seen from our various Spirits and Demons, they like to take physical form in their own special ways. Some like Brand or Maokai like to possess physical bodies, while others like the Gods, Kindred of Janna live off of 'prayer' or are just that prominent and powerful in the Material world. Now finally, the list:

Gods/Goddesses Ornn Volibear Anivia - These ones are pretty obvious and canonically called Gods, so there's not much to say for them. NagakabourousIllaoi - As stated before, Nagakabourous is an extremely powerful God, more so than the previously mentioned three, and even more than Aurelion, so powerful that they don't even take physical form, they just sort of cling to Illaoi and spread their faith around.

Spirits Janna - This one's pretty obvious and already stated above as a powerful wind spirit that is considred a goddess by Zaun. Kindred - Now Kindred is pretty tricky and I have another short theory just for her Them (Riot, give Wolf some spotlight in-game...). Now, I highly doubt that they are Death Itself in a sense, but rather a spirit that has sort of 'clinged' to the concept of Death, which (due to how prominent Death is in the...well...living world) has grown extremely powerful and prominent in almost every culture of Runeterra. This can be seen in how the /dev on Vastayan Evolution describes the spirit world as "a mirror world where the spirit of every living thing and every of type of thing exists. The souls of every person, the spirit of animals, the essences of species and of locations, elements, and even ideas exist in that dimension as powerful forces, which interact and create a type of magic in Runeterra." Maokai - As seen in his bio, he's a nature spirit of the blessed isles who possessed a tree and absorbed the magical waters of the isles. He clearly stated as a spirit in his bio, so he belongs here. Ivern - As for our other Tree-Boy, he's more like an 'associate' of a spirit, much like how Illaoi is a priestess of her God. Ivern has the essence of the God-Willow, (theoretically) one of the most powerful nature spirits in the world, so it's just a really strange way of taking physical form.

Demons TahmKench - Much like Kindred or Janna, it seems like he takes physical form by making deals with others, while also spreading his influence in other cultures, as seen in Bilgewater. Brand - Though his lore is kinda old right now, he was confirmed by the Shuriman lore update to be the powerful fire spirit that Xerath freed, since Brand was the only thing capable of fighting two ascended beings. My guess is that they'll keep the whole 'possessing a random viking' aspect, as it fits the idea of a demon possessing someone to take physical form. Fiddlesticks Shaco Nocturne - Ah, our spooky trinity. We have very little lore for all three of them right now, but these three are the only ones that have relations with one another, as seen by their "Related Champions" in the Universe Page. Nocturne however, was confirmed to be the Nightmare Demon that killed Garen and Lux's grandpa, as well as the one who appeared in the "For Demacia" story. Fiddlesticks on the other hand had a short story as well, where his actions matched that of a super-natural spirit of crows and fear, perhaps he possessed a scare-crow to take physical form?

Other AurelionSol Soraka - These two are celestial beings, literal Aliens to Runeterra. Because the Spirit-World is solely the source of RUNETERRAN magic, they don't exactly count as Spirits since they don't come from Runeterra, despite being super powerful.

Bard - Bard is Bard. Bard is a Multiversal Entity who only arrives to keep the fabric of reality in tact. Bard in-game is not the actual Bard, Bard takes physical form by possessing a strange puppet. Bard is one of the most powerful things in League Lore, though Bard doesn't show it since Bard only acts to keep Multiverse-Breaking-Things from happening. Bard is Bard.

TL;DR: Gods and Goddesses are just really strong Spirits/Demons and they all consider each other siblings.

26 Comments

AFilthyCaitMain4 votes

I like this theory. +1.

Zyranium2 votes

I think with Evelynn rework this month, we'll have a demon update and more details about her kind

6FlagsFunnelCake5 votes

That is extremely possible, even more reason to be excited for her rework! It makes sense considering she has a cult that reaches all the way to Demacia, which is half way across the world from the Shadow Isles.

Along with that, Zilean can possibly be a Urtistan time-spirit or something.

Darius Strada2 votes

I think you are underpowering Aurelion Sol a bit. There might be more powerful beings than Aurelion Sol (excluding the Dark Stars that are not canon and the Void since it's pretty much unknown) but I don't think Nagakobouros is stronger than him.

6FlagsFunnelCake1 votes

Maybe, we simply just don't really know enough about Nagakabourous to really tell. He does have a quote for Illaoi, stating that she "doesn't understand her God." Along with that, I remember a discussion about how Aurelion Sol is technically a Demi-God and how a Rioter confirmed that he may be powerful, but Nagakabourous is something completely different and stronger (I can't find it, as it's a really old post form a year ago, so a Rioter backing me up might help). But i dunno, I might be a little biased cause I love me my Polynesian Tenta-Babe <3.

Chembaron Yamada1 votes

You are kinda correct, it got stated that Nagakabouros is way more powerful than Aurelion Sol. Funnily enough, looking around for the quote stating that, I found another quote saying that Aurelion Sol is at best demigod tier (just like Ornn, Anivia, Volibear, etc... they are considered demigods, not gods ^^).

You can find this quote here.

Chembaron Yamada1 votes

Riot themselves stated that Nagakabouros is much more powerful than Aurelion Sol. Aurelion Sol is taunting Illaoi as a lesser being, in that context it got stated that compared to Nagakabouros, "Aurelion Sol is the beetle calling the ant small".

Source.

Darius Strada1 votes

{quoted}

Riot themselves stated that Nagakabouros is much more powerful than Aurelion Sol. Aurelion Sol is taunting Illaoi as a lesser being, in that context it got stated that compared to Nagakabouros, "Aurelion Sol is the beetle calling the ant small".

Source.

Curious. Rito should tell us more about Nagakobouros

Robertsmash1 votes

https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/story-art/icewate2-what-exactly-are-illaois-powers-and-which-champions-would-survive-the-test-of-nagakabouros?show=flat&amp;comment=000000000001

"On Nagakabouros faith:

"A god's appearance is limited only by those observing it" -Illaoi

Illaoi's power: Illaoi is powerful because she is personally capable of serving her god--- that's actually a rare gift. That puts her on the same level as Moses at the very least. Channeling her god's power (not generating it) is extremely difficult.

On the question of which champs would pass her test:

This was a fun discussion in house. Many would pass-- but more than a few would fail (currently). Obviously being a League of Legends champion- they have a much higher win % than normal folks-- but the test's goal isn't to kill. It is to spur growth and movement. Yeah, Braum is a certain pass. Jhin would not. The new champ i worked on named R__ would pass.... opps I've said too much.

Against the Shadow Isles Champs:

Illaoi in world (as opposed to "in game") is insanely strong against the undead. (After all her religion is about "life" in all its messiness serving the universe's plan).

RE Aol Sol vs- Nagakabouros:

Aol Sol is, at best, a demi-god-- he serves only one reality and exists on only one realm. He mocks humans because they are as small to him as mites to us. BUT comparing him to Nagakabouros is like comparing a dung beetle to the theory of relativity. He's just pointing out he has a better view in the rug."


That whole thread had some very interesting and informative replies from WAAARGHbobo.

The Last Ballad1 votes

I'm guessing R____ is Rakan?

The DrBonjigollo2 votes

Question: What about the Watchers?Lissandra I think they'd go under demons or demi-gods unless they're all just witches or something?

Zyranium2 votes

[{quoted}](name=The DrBonjigollo,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=cml2JWLJ,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2017-09-03T08:41:12.713+0000)

Question: What about the Watchers?Lissandra I think they'd go under demons or demi-gods unless they're all just witches or something?

Watchers are supposed to come from Space, they are aliens I think. It was confirmed that they are not from the void, but are a different species.

Ebonmaw Dragon1 votes

{quoted}

Watchers are supposed to come from Space, they are aliens I think. It was confirmed that they are not from the void, but are a different species.

Well, Aurelion is from the space as well but he is there

6FlagsFunnelCake1 votes

Aurelion doesn't count as a spirit. Just like the watchers, he's an alien, an immensely powerful one at that.

BestJhinUniverse2 votes

I hope the vengeful wraiths of the shadow isles corrupt that spirit world.

Bionic Jellyfish1 votes

I'm not that sure Janna is canonically a wind spirit, here: http://gameinfo.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/game-info/champions/janna/#champion-lore she is not, but here: http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Janna she is, and its hinted at (but not confirmed) that she was born out of prayers from sailors for clear skies. So that would mean, according to your theory, that she was an ideal that became a spirit

Cetri10 votes

The "Game Info" section is suuuuuuuuper outdated (it doesn't have any 2017 champs, for example, and that includes reworks like Urgot). http://universe.leagueoflegends.com/en_US/champion/janna/ ^universe is what ya gotta check out for anything up-to-date.

Whyte Lyon1 votes

Here's the obsured thing about all these champs being paired under the same category. Some are infinite and others rely on sustenance to continue their existence.

Characters like TK and other such demons feed off emotions (specifically suffering) and maybe memories as well. It is the absolute crux of their existance, and if gone unsatisfied they fade away. On the other hand Janna is the only non-demon that requires something to exist. But it would be werid that she has to gain her sustance from something different than demons do, yet both are apparently under the same umbrella. Y'know, why can't a benevolent spirit resort to malevolence if the former just isn't working any more and vice versa?

Not to forget that Ornn, Maokai, Bard and co don't require anything to exist (although purpose is definitely what keeps them lively).

LiteUpSketchers1 votes

So what's an Ascended then?

6FlagsFunnelCake2 votes

Ascended are ancient individuals who have learned to use the Shuriman Sun Disc to harness the power of the sun, turning them more magical and practically immortal.

Not exactly a Demi-god but definetly not anything human, so let's consider it something like a "human +"

Also, may I remind you, the Sun was forged by Aurelion Sol, an immensely powerful and magical being, it could be possible that stars contain a fragment of this power as well. When Aurelion Sol forges a star, it isn't just a burning ball of gas, it looks more like a sparkly, crystal ball.

LiteUpSketchers1 votes

Wait, so we calling Xerath, who can probably obliterate Runterra with the snap of his fingers when he ain't held down by chains,

Azir, who can summon legions of undead sand soldiers and create Shuriman castles out of thin air,

And Nasus, being capable of chaining Xerath and being able to build full tank and three shot someone, xd,

'Human +?'

Sure, but I think they're higher up on the God tier list than say Ivern.

Also, more questions because I actually like this theory, what is Cho'Gath? Is he just a big scary monster or is he something more? What about Vel'Koz and his quest for knowledge?

Would Malzahar be considered a god ever since he's been reborn by the Void? He created sentient life such as Kog'Maw, and seems to be regarded of a being of great power down there, being named the Prophet of the Void and such.

Karthus has defied death, and is technically a spirit, so by definition of your rules isn't he a god too?

Edit: more questions!

What's a Darkin?

Is Thresh godlike?

Are all the Shadow Isles characters godlike?

HonestJohnTheCon1 votes

{quoted}

Wait, so we calling Xerath, who can probably obliterate Runterra with the snap of his fingers when he ain't held down by chains,

Azir, who can summon legions of undead sand soldiers and create Shuriman castles out of thin air,

And Nasus, being capable of chaining Xerath and being able to build full tank and three shot someone, xd,

'Human +?'

Sure, but I think they're higher up on the God tier list than say Ivern.

Also, more questions because I actually like this theory, what is Cho'Gath? Is he just a big scary monster or is he something more? What about Vel'Koz and his quest for knowledge?

Would Malzahar be considered a god ever since he's been reborn by the Void? He created sentient life such as Kog'Maw, and seems to be regarded of a being of great power down there, being named the Prophet of the Void and such.

Karthus has defied death, and is technically a spirit, so by definition of your rules isn't he a god too?

Edit: more questions!

What's a Darkin?

Is Thresh godlike?

Are all the Shadow Isles characters godlike?

Ivern's also a Human +, it just happens that the + was a spirit, so he's technically on the same levelish as Azir. Also, Ivern, Tahm Kench, and Bard are much more powerful than they seem. They're just lazy, manipulative, and impossible to understand respectively.

LiteUpSketchers1 votes

Potatoes are always watching

6FlagsFunnelCake2 votes

Ivern holds the source of all natural magic, the most ancent ad powerful on runeterra, within his body. Thing is, iverns so in tune with his abilities that he doesn't really show off his power in a destructive way, much like how Bard is a multiversal entity but only cares about sparkly space eggs in ionia.

Also, xerath...can't do that. The most destruction we've seen from him lore wise is just blow up a city in Shurima, still stupidly powerful nonetheless.

Cetri3 votes

I would actually consider Ivern on a tier above the Ascended - after all, if one managed to kill Nasus, that'd be it, whereas it's implied that Ivern's soul would just hop in another tree.

Short of perhaps Vel, Cho is probably the most intelligent Void champ thus far, especially if, as many people speculate, his is the voice A-Sol heard in his story.

Could be wrong, but I don't think Malz created Koggy, he merely summoned him from the Void. I also think the Void is using him more than he is using it, if that makes sense.

Karthus is not a spirit in the sense that Ornn, Janna, Ivern, etc are. He's a powerful undead sorcerer, sure, but nowhere near god-tier, especially out of the Black Mist's reach.

Darkin are living weapons. It's not clear yet exactly what binds them to their weapons or what they would be if unbound, but they are pretty powerful. We know of three: A sword, a scythe, and a bow - Aatrox Kayn Varus

See Karthus.

Mordekaiser is probably the most powerful singular entity on the Isles, and Maokai is a bonafide spirit like Janna. That said, the only champs I'd call anywhere near godlike would be Bard and maybe Kindred.

CrimsonLotus31 votes

About shaco I don't think he is a spirit rather a different species or something maybe human from the glade. We've seen another champion who is related to the glade Lulu she found pix in the glade or something like that so maybe Shaco not a spirit. Same with Nocturne and fiddle nothing really seems spirit-like about them or in their lores compared to the others you showed. There isn't enough lore to say what they may be however I don't believe they are spirits

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