Paging is a must
There might be interesting discussions beyond the first page. The "Read more" button is not good enough : if I click on an interesting thread on the 3rd page, clicking on "back" only brings me back to the FIRST page.
There might be interesting discussions beyond the first page. The "Read more" button is not good enough : if I click on an interesting thread on the 3rd page, clicking on "back" only brings me back to the FIRST page.
We should certainly fix the problem that you mentioned, but we can do it without implementing paging.
Do you have other examples of cases that require paging?
We should certainly fix the problem that you mentioned, but we can do it without implementing paging.
Do you have other examples of cases that require paging?
Simply clicking the "Read more" button results in duplication of articles being shown, so it's not a very ideal implementation in that regard either.
Comments already have paging, which is good. The list of News articles has paging, which is good. I think the boards might be the only place without paging, but I could be wrong :/
On top of everything everyone else has mentioned, paging makes it easier to navigate and more user friendly.
Tumblr and twiiter are the only major websites I know of that use this style, and that's because they are designed for rapid, short exchanges of information, with follow, like, and, in tumblr's case, reblog as the primary options for adding new information.
This is more like reddit, 4chan, and the like, and they use pages too.
Of course, all that is still ignoring the over-arching problem with using a board instead of a forum, but I'll take what changes I can, where I can.
I appreciate your attention to these issues, gentlemen.
First and foremost: I hate infinite scrolling.
But let me ask you, why is paging so bad? Why does it need to be avoided like this? What makes infinite scrolling so superior?
Also, how are you going to address really old topics? Let's say I read a topic(or even worse, only noticed a topic title) and later wished to find it again, but to my dismay it has moved off of the front page. Now depending on the speed of the board and/or the length of time since I last saw the topic, I could be scrolling for a long time till I find it. But with paging, I can roughly guesstimate the approximate speed to time ratio and select a page to jump to to begin my search for the topic (yes, I have actually done this many times)
And before you bring up the search engine, either A) I don't remember enough of the topic for an adequate search (my memory is very visual centric, even if I don't remember the words themselves, the moment I see them I can remember it) or B) I have already used the search engine and there are a ton of results I need to sift through. Either way, being able to jump to a mid-point really helps save time by cutting out a large chunk of content I don't need to sift through to find what I need. But with infinite scrolling, it's just tedious and inefficient.
Tho, I will say, I appreciate that you chose not to automate the infinite scrolling, that's the type I hate the most (I like being able to actually scroll to the bottom of my screen)
Paging is hard because you can reply to previous posts, adding your comment to any page. This would make the idea of pages a bit different in nested vs chronological, and I think this is why "read more" is there.
Infinite scrolling solves a lot of problems that existed with pagination but introduced new issues at the same time.
Infinite scroll as implemented across most of the web is less than desirable and often leads to a lack of 'anchoring' (feeling and knowing your current location within the page). It's also extremely difficult to get back to where you were, in the event you choose to actually dive in.
We do need to address the 'show more' button, both on the Boards Home and within discussions. When we do, it will be a smart implementation that gives you clear focus on where you are. If you haven't seen this fantastic demo by Google's team I recommend playing around with it. They are testing out ways to solve the obvious issues with infinite scrolling and it was one of their potential solutions.
The latter is along the lines of the smart visual contextualizing I'd want to see implemented here.
Hello!
is the Team that works on the Help & Support boards planing on replying to one of the 100+ threads about LoL being unplayable do to constant dc/Ping issues? Almost all of the posters are stating that they have no internet issues whatsoever and cannot play LoL in fear of DC then being reported and banned.
please help?
thanks,
Handsomz (NA)
Hello!
is the Team that works on the Help & Support boards planing on replying to one of the 100+ threads about LoL being unplayable do to constant dc/Ping issues? Almost all of the posters are stating that they have no internet issues whatsoever and cannot play LoL in fear of DC then being reported and banned.
please help?
thanks,
Handsomz (NA)
You weren't aware? Riot hasn't had a Red post on Help & Support/Bug section since 2009. This is why it takes a couple of years to fix various bugs. Man... if only this weren't mostly true. The Bug section is particularly worthless which is sad because it results in very long time frames to fix issues unless they are immensely game breaking demanding disable/hotfix.
I have seen the demo by Google's team. It's great, it seems to work on their example. If you implemented such a solution, it would be OK. The only gripe I have is it's not here already where it's needed , namely on the board thread lists.
I also tend to prefer Chronological view to Discussion view. Flat is better than nested.
We're looking to potentially solve the disparity between Chronological and Discussion comment views where they can live together in one world. It's not an easy problem space to solve but it's a great challenge.
Infinite scrolling solves a lot of problems that existed with pagination
LIKE????????
LIKE????????
It's rare that I get to dive into the logistics of usability so I am happy to answer this.
Infinite scrolling came about partially to solve the issue of discovery / browsing and partially to help with the issue of losing content per-page on use of pagination.
Browse-ability is much lower when pagination is used, especially on articles or in longer form content that shouldn't be broken up. There is also an interruption of natural mental flow when a page reload is necessary to navigate between context. Then there is the issue of implementation: How many pages per batch? How many articles / content per page? Is there support to view all, and does viewing all in a pagination layout always respect the preference of the viewer? There isn't a consensus across the web and that's why the experiences vary so widely. Some good, most bad.
Now infinite scrolling address the issues of browse-ability, allowing for easy discovery of content or new media through constantly fresh items. It also solves the problem of the page reload since it is auto-loading in the background and ready when the viewer is. There is no need for consensus on across pagination styles, batch paging, or view all status.
That being said, infinite scroll is far from perfect. Constant loss of place, navigating into items and back again often loses the original context, cognitive overload from no relative 'end point' to name a few.
In the end it depends largely on the intent of the viewer. Are they using the site to browse content or are they intent on finding specific things? I personally believe a blend of both leads to a better experience for different types of viewers and a better experience overall.
The option to switch so as to appease all parties might be a prevalent thought at this point.
LIKE????????
It's rare that I get to dive into the logistics of usability so I am happy to answer this.
Infinite scrolling came about partially to solve the issue of discovery / browsing and partially to help with the issue of losing content per-page on use of pagination.
Browse-ability is much lower when pagination is used, especially on articles or in longer form content that shouldn't be broken up. There is also an interruption of natural mental flow when a page reload is necessary to navigate between context. Then there is the issue of implementation: How many pages per batch? How many articles / content per page? Is there support to view all, and does viewing all in a pagination layout always respect the preference of the viewer? There isn't a consensus across the web and that's why the experiences vary so widely. Some good, most bad.
Now infinite scrolling address the issues of browse-ability, allowing for easy discovery of content or new media through constantly fresh items. It also solves the problem of the page reload since it is auto-loading in the background and ready when the viewer is. There is no need for consensus on across pagination styles, batch paging, or view all status.
That being said, infinite scroll is far from perfect. Constant loss of place, navigating into items and back again often loses the original context, cognitive overload from no relative 'end point' to name a few.
In the end it depends largely on the intent of the viewer. Are they using the site to browse content or are they intent on finding specific things? I personally believe a blend of both leads to a better experience for different types of viewers and a better experience overall.
That is not a viable excuse to remove paging entirely. That is not a big of an issue. Infinite scrolling gives you trouble in skipping parts of a discussion when you intent to just skim through. It'll be hard to find what is not very old or very new.
Once again I post my suggestion of implementing both:
Infinite scrolling can overload slow machines when trying to check large threads, even with the See more button. Implementing paging along the current scrolling, should fix that as well. Here's an example on this website that uses both (I disabled NSFW content): https://chan.sankakucomplex.com/?tags=rating%3Asafe&commit=Search
- You can use your mouse wheel to scroll endlessly.
- On the bottom left it shows until what page you have loaded.
- You can start on page X and use infinite scrolling from that point.
- Page number is not shown (if you scroll up). However, it should be.
- The best of it all: You can disable auto paging.
[Yes, it's a bump]
Looks like you may have missed another comment I made in this thread.
When the team has an opportunity to address the issue of pagination — the solution in the aforementioned comment will be along the lines of what we'd be looking to implement.
The answer is so simple we've all missed it...
Have a tab for recent pages visited and a way to bookmark comments or threads. Maybe even organize them into custom groups. You can also "lock" your place in a page so in case of "Oops I exited my browser" you can get to your exact pace
For "adventurous" people, add a shuffle button so someone who reads a lot of threads doesn't have to become Nautilus
looking for new ones. Combine this with the Google thing and losing your place/threads you like will be a thing of the past. :D
Infinite scrolling solves a lot of problems that existed with pagination but introduced new issues at the same time.
Infinite scroll as implemented across most of the web is less than desirable and often leads to a lack of 'anchoring' (feeling and knowing your current location within the page). It's also extremely difficult to get back to where you were, in the event you choose to actually dive in.
We do need to address the 'show more' button, both on the Boards Home and within discussions. When we do, it will be a smart implementation that gives you clear focus on where you are. If you haven't seen this fantastic demo by Google's team I recommend playing around with it. They are testing out ways to solve the obvious issues with infinite scrolling and it was one of their potential solutions.
The latter is along the lines of the smart visual contextualizing I'd want to see implemented here.
This is super cool and would go a long way to helping with the paging issue. I'd recommend making the page indicator on the bottom larger so it's easier to know what page you are currently on as you scroll through. This seems to combine the best of both methodologies.
We should certainly fix the problem that you mentioned, but we can do it without implementing paging.
Do you have other examples of cases that require paging?
Pretty much any nested discussion that surpasses 3 replies. I give up after that even if the topic interests me because sorting through the chaos of who replied to who or who someone was talking to in that format gives me more of a headache and frustration to a point that I don't even care where the conversation was going.
We should certainly fix the problem that you mentioned, but we can do it without implementing paging.
Do you have other examples of cases that require paging?
Removing features does not make for a better forum experience. The old boards have paging, and if you want people to actually buy that this is a viable replacement to the old forums, you should at least ensure that the features are still there. Sometimes it's fun to skip around in pages to see older posts, or skip to the end to see history. You have the ability to do this obviously, as the topics themselves are paged, so why not just implement it into the thread browsing?
Paging would be superior to infinite scrolling in something like this in my opinion.
Infinite scrolling can overload slow machines when trying to check large threads, even with the See more button. Implementing paging along the current scrolling, should fix that as well. Here's an example on this website that uses both (I disabled NSFW content): https://chan.sankakucomplex.com/?tags=rating%3Asafe&commit=Search
We should certainly fix the problem that you mentioned, but we can do it without implementing paging.
Do you have other examples of cases that require paging?
less excuses, more paging pls
hello Pendragon, i am jagged, and i amonge many others are having a problem on the twisted treeline,
i dont know where to begin...
well there are bots on them.. i believe these bots are made by players, for xp, ip, rp, and money.
i think they use VM's and VPN's...
anyways TT is cluttered with them.
if you don't Q with a couple friends its likely to get one on your team or on the opposing team, and mind you they are a huge disadvantage to whatever team they are on... and honestly ruin the experience of the game to all on that match. most of the time.
i was just wondering if you had any clue they where there, and if so what is being done. or is anything being done or is it gonna be left alone.
I hate them... and i love league, i play Twisted Treeline primarily and prefer it to any other game mode.. me and my friends love TT.
now all my friends are getting off league cuz this problem.
plz let me know if you know whats going on, or if Riot only wants to deal with SR. i herd a rumor that Riot considers TT, Dom, and aram side games and wouldn't do anything unless its on SR
your reply is highly appreciated.
hello Pendragon, i am jagged, and i amonge many others are having a problem on the twisted treeline,
i dont know where to begin...
well there are bots on them.. i believe these bots are made by players, for xp, ip, rp, and money.
i think they use VM's and VPN's...
anyways TT is cluttered with them.
if you don't Q with a couple friends its likely to get one on your team or on the opposing team, and mind you they are a huge disadvantage to whatever team they are on... and honestly ruin the experience of the game to all on that match. most of the time.
i was just wondering if you had any clue they where there, and if so what is being done. or is anything being done or is it gonna be left alone.
I hate them... and i love league, i play Twisted Treeline primarily and prefer it to any other game mode.. me and my friends love TT.
now all my friends are getting off league cuz this problem.
plz let me know if you know whats going on, or if Riot only wants to deal with SR. i herd a rumor that Riot considers TT, Dom, and aram side games and wouldn't do anything unless its on SR
your reply is highly appreciated.
This problem might be choking TT and Dominion to death, and rampant in ARAM; but that doesn't mean it isn't all over entry elo SR, it just bypasses most people who are level 30s already for SR. Riot hasn't openly done anything in over a year, since acknowledging the issue and promise that a super secret soon(tm) fix is in the works. Between the bots and the elimination of our own forum sections, all of us alternate game mode players are getting completely marginalized by Riot... Who has thus far demonstrated that they really just don't care about our problems.
I've had the "Read More" button break several times today. It's not a very good option. I click it and nothing loads about 50% of the time.
I fail to see what problems forum pages create. They're extremely useful... on the front page you have popular or new topics, and on later pages you have older ones. If you wanted to see how people felt about Yasuo a week ago, for example, you might click on page 40-50. Infinite scroll disgusts me. I want to access what I want, when I want it. Restricting that is just going to annoy me.
I like paging more, but what I do to not lose my place is open the thread in a new tab simply by clicking it with the middle mouse button.
What I want is being able to access a random page at this level
http://i.imgur.com/B8nY2o4.png
As the "Show more" button serve page sized chunk of contents, why don't you give links just like here, on the chronological view?
XKCD op
AJungleOutThere said (OP):The "Read more" button is not good enough : if I click on an interesting thread on the 3rd page, clicking on "back" only brings me back to the FIRST page.
As a stop gap solution, right click the interesting thread and open it in a new tab instead of forward/back browsing.
I don't see why you have to make things so complicated. People prefer pages, it's a familiar concept that we've seen a lot. Why make things needlessly complicated by trying to mimic a google tech demo? At least give us options if you want to play around with ideas.
What I do to avoid your "back" button problem is, when I open a thread I right click the thread and select "open in new tab" so that I don't lose my place.
This is a self-demonstrating image of why I believe show more buttons suck.
Because this behavior is what I see EVERY SINGLE TIME I press the show more button.
[I don't even know if the image attached. >_>]
There might be interesting discussions beyond the first page.
Just trust the hot threads. You're only supposed to care about what's popular. Baaaaaa.