Riot. This ends now.

Lïghtkeeper··40 votes·4,759 views

The most disgusting thing has been allowed to happen on League and gaming in general. Whenever something goes wrong, or you mess up, or an ally messes up, the proper response has grown to become "kill myself" or "kill yourself". I've absolutely had enough of it. It's disgusting and virulent. To just say that without actually considering the implications or the people you're shaming by simply saying that. Riot, clearly you don't care about the player base if this isn't going punished. So people clearly need a lesson.

Do you know how many Americans die to suicide annually? 42,773. Do you know how many people on average commit suicide in the United States daily? 117. How many hours exist in a day? 24. How many people on average commit suicide in just one hour? About 4 or 5. How long does a game of League typically take? 30 - 45 minutes.

So in the time frame of you sitting and playing League, possibly telling someone to kill themselves, or telling people that you are going to kill yourself, 2 people likely already have. Every single game you play. Every time you queue up.

So how do you disgusting people find it okay to say that just so lightly? To end someone's life is not something you just type about in a video game. And I'm done with people not being reported and insta-banned for it. It belongs way beyond hate speech. That's talk of murder. Cyber bullying is a huge factor in teen suicide, and you have no idea what impressionable minds are playing with you.

If you want to educate yourself and be part of the good people who want to see an end to suicide being a topic so lighthearted as puppies, then you can click the link, or just take it upon yourself to report anyone who says it and keep yourself from saying it. This isn't a trend to follow.

https://afsp.org/about-suicide/suicide-statistics/

133 Comments

Keepe17 votes

Hi. I am a clinically depressed individual who has spent time in psychiatric care, committed to the mental ward for suicidal tendencies, and recommended for residential care for my mental issues.

Yes. "Kill Yourself" should be (and is) a report-able offense. But where I take issue here is quite simple. You seem to be taking it out directly on Riot. So, in short, as a possible victim to the very hatred you are lobbying against. Please go take a cold bath, throw some ice cubes in there, and cool the heck down.

Insta-banning, in my humble opinion, should never be the case. Everyone deserves at least one chance because, despite popular belief, everyone is capable of having one bad day and everyone should be able to enjoy at least one warning, whether that be through an ingame pop-up or an email.

And that's all it takes to reduce the sanest man alive to lunacy. That's how far the world is away from madness. Just one. Bad. Day.

http://66.media.tumblr.com/e59d75f1b39420c13962e2503d58f6b1/tumblr_o52il9AbLu1rrkahjo1_500.gif?noredirect

But, as it stands, this entire issue is a punishable offense, and Riot DOES act on it. So, again, takest thine britches and thus cooleth them verily.

Astôlfo5 votes

It's irrelevant if you have a bad day. There are certain boundaries you should not ever cross. This is one of them. They do not get to complain.

Keepe5 votes

And who are you to decide what boundaries are appropriate to never cross?

Sometimes people just lose it and they say something they do not mean or might regret. That is why I would argue they need a warning. At some point, this sort of thing just slips out and they might not even realize it. So with that one warning, that one chance, they get their reality check. If they choose to ignore, then they would need to face the consequences of their choice.

Think of it like this, using a rather extreme analogy. What's the difference between manslaughter and murder? One is with intent, the other (while still a serious issue) is not.

Now show me someone who, in anger or frustration, had never had a certain line, an insult, slip from their lips without really intending it. There are very few people alive who can hold such a claim.

I've never told anyone to kill themselves. But I could understand why someone generally amiable would see issue with having that insta-ban. All because of that one bad day.

Astôlfo3 votes

Except phrases such as "kill yourself" can be potentially marked as criminal depending on the consequences, along with just being part of cyberbullying in general which also has various laws surrounding it.

That's irrelevant. Sure, they might say something they didn't mean or might regret. So what? They still said it. That's not magically going away. For a larger-case example in the real world, you think the Philippines president calling the USA president a "whore" after he got upset at something and lashed out (although there are debates on whether or not this was actually intended) is alright and just able to be passed off as nothing big because they 'just lost it and said something they didn't mean or might regret'? Which led to said USA president canceling the once-in-years/presidency sort of meeting that was planned with them? Do you think just going "oops, i got mad, i didn't mean it, sorry" will fix it? There are warnings. For minor things. That is the only kind of warning that is needed.

Your analogy is flawed. In either case, someone still dies. Whether or not they intended it is irrelevant. They're still going to immediately get hit with a prison sentence, in addition to fines or the like. The only thing that varies is the length, obviously. I'm of the opinion that a phrase like "kill yourself" deserves an instant permaban. But the current system generally has it as an instant 2-week ban. Which is essentially the same as your flawed analogy actually represents. Which works as well.

Okay? So? That's irrelevant. Just because someone lashes out in anger or the like doesn't magically excuse them. They're still going to get hit with whatever punishment they deserve, no matter how potentially harsh it may be.

It's irrelevant if they "have an issue with being instabanned" for telling someone to kill themselves whether or not it was a bad day for them. Their opinions are irrelevant and they do not get to complain. Also, they are not the ones deciding the punishment. By the very fact they agreed to the Summoners' Code and ToS when they signed up, if Riot decides to make it instantly permaban worthy instead of 2-week ban, then they're free to do so. They don't even have to announce it. There is no specific rule stating the length of ban for an offense like this. In addition, Riot is free to do whatever they please with the accounts in this game. Which, coincidentally enough, belong to no one except Riot. So the complaint that "they took my account" is also invalid, because it was never their account in the first place.

Keepe4 votes

I am not going to lie and I will tell you this much now; I am not going to waste the time reading your entire post since it is obvious that you don’t care for any opinion but your own.

So here’s what I got skimming through your wall of text.

Yes, phrases such as “kill yourself” can be marked as potentially criminal. So can phrases like “You’re the bomb” to be honest. What comes into play is the context.

You’re right. What they said is not going to go away. Hence the warning. It is letting the individual know “This behavior is not acceptable. We won’t be so polite again.” It’s a reality check, like I’ve already said. And in my opinion, a two week suspension can count as a warning. When I think “Insta-Ban”, I consider that to be a permanent suspension.

As for the “flawed analogy”, intent is actually quite relevant.

Someone lashing out in anger again refers to what I stated earlier. Context is key.

You’re right. Riot decides the punishment for the crime. Not you. Not me. The final say goes to Riot. Which leads us back on topic, as I said from the very start.

But, as it stands, this entire issue is a punishable offense, and Riot DOES act on it. So, again, takest thine britches and thus cooleth them verily.

So what's the issue here?

Itankyou1 votes

Naww that shit deserves perma. Humans are terrible and need to know they are horrible.

Keepe1 votes

If that's your opinion, I respect it. I disagree, but I respect it.

SecondAirbane1 votes

{quoted}

Naww that shit deserves perma. Humans are terrible and need to know they are horrible.

humans also made TV computers and every house in this world languages etc etc where's your arguement

also a permaban for first offense nah nah get that BS outta here

Itankyou1 votes

UR AN ANIMAL.

scazzman6 votes

what if someone is calling for a self execution play, such as dying to avoid a gank or a proxy Singed example. hey singed. you're low. now might be a good time to kill yourself before you get ganked

Ńathan5 votes

why does kys offend you so much lol

Hyperiön4 votes

The question is why aren't you offended by it. If you were a super depressed person, and league was your way of relaxing and having fun, then all of the sudden teams of people just keep telling you to kill yourself because you aren't very good.

Thats why it needs to be filtered out or something. it is crazy how many people spew that shit out at people.

Morality Coach4 votes

The world doesn't owe super depressed people anything. Improve your diet by eating a large serving of vegetables before eating any meats or grains, and start using a bicycle for transportation if you're depressed.

Depression is easy to deal with, it's usually the result of eating hot pockets every day.

Lifestyle choice, no sympathy

Karunamon4 votes

Someone should tell the people that write the psychology diagnostic manuals that. Heck, you should submit a paper - this is nobel prize winning science if you can prove it.

Morality Coach3 votes

The DSM V states that exercise is more effective than antidepressants for treating depression. Pubmed says its equal

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21495519

Depression is the result of being physically lazy and having a diet with no nutrition in it 9 times out of 10.

GaleWinUnleashed5 votes

Exercise is a way to deal with depression. That does not imply that lack of exercise is the cause.

Mr Fidori1 votes

The thing you linked literally says the following:

While effective, exercise has not been shown to reduce anxiety to the level achieved by psychopharmaceuticals.

Morality Coach1 votes

We are talking about depression not anxiety, and nothing is going to take the edge off like a big xanny bar, what's your point? lol

You beefy sad sacks are gonna get with the vegetable program as long as I'm around.

Mr Fidori1 votes

First off, anxiety is a big part of depression. Second, if you claim that their not related, then why are you linking irrelevant things?

redfeenix8 votes

Depression is easy to deal with

???

tooomine1 votes

yeah, homie, you're conflating an emotion with a brain problem. It is the height of ignorance.

You r brain is an organ. Organs sometimes fail in their given task. Are you gonna say to a person with double kidney failure that they're overreacting to the slow poisoning of their blood, and that they should stop getting dialysis and move on with their lives?

NO. You're gonna recognize that it sucks that their organs have failed in the task of toxin regulation in the blood system.

Depression is one of the times when you brain fails at the endorphin regulation of your blood, similar to kidney failure.

You're medically ignorant, and extremely insensitive. maybe, in the future, you'll take the time to consider the medical and scientific evidence behind a condition, the type that I just made you loosely familiar with, before you go off on some super irrelevant and entirely inconsequential effort to protect your world view from the reality of the human condition.

Morality Coach1 votes

In rural China when you get depressed you drink celery root and cabbage extract and go on a nature hike, but go on believing what you want.

Lifestyle choice 19 times out of 20.

tooomine1 votes

This isn't a discussion, homie. this is a scientifically documented reality that you're choosing to ignore. I offer you the same flippance, man. go on believing what you want. but you now know the scientific basis that overturns your poorly informed decision. that's all I can do for you. I can't make you choose to live in the real world.

Morality Coach1 votes

Yeah your kidney brain analogy was really scientific, lol.

How much do you weigh?

GaleWinUnleashed3 votes

Offense has nothing to do with it. It's encouraging someone to end their own life OVER A VIDEO GAME. We're here to have fun, but there may very well be some players gaming to try and take their minds off of a depressing situation they're going through. You can't possibly know whether that one little comment of yours might be enough to tip someone over the edge and influence their decision to commit suicide.

It's not something to joke about or type "lol" in response to.

https://i.imgur.com/1HvNiEO.png?noredirect

xXxAltaïrrxXx2 votes

Why would I care if some stranger want to end their life, it doesnt affect me whatsoever... lmao

GaleWinUnleashed2 votes

Good. Then it also doesn't affect you to NOT tell them to kill themselves.

Whether you care or not is your business. Nobody is trying to control your thoughts. But as soon as you act on those thoughts and actually advise someone to commit suicide, it becomes everyone's business. Keep it to yourself and we don't have a problem.

https://i.imgur.com/1HvNiEO.png?noredirect

xXxAltaïrrxXx2 votes

I never said word "kys" to anyone. My post was just adressing this fuss about depression, suicide etc... I mean this is internet, if people are so triggered by some words maybe they should stay away from it.

GaleWinUnleashed2 votes

I appear to have somewhat misinterpreted your earlier comment, then. You'll have to forgive me, this is a rather touchy subject.

tooomine1 votes

As a clinically diagnosed depressed dude, I specifically disclaim any responsibility you try to enforce upon me for your emotional well being. Its not my job to manage your emotions through adjusting my dialogue. that responsibilty lies with you. asking me to make sure you don't have a bad experience is co-dependent, and I will have no part in it.

GaleWinUnleashed1 votes

I'm not asking that anyone put in effort to improve the environment for others. I'm asking that we afford others the common courtesy of not making it worse, specifically referring to the practice of making frustration-fueled comments and actions designed to attack and degrade total strangers. It's entirely natural for a competitive setting such as this to evoke some strong emotions. All I ask is that we remember that the being on the other side of the screen is a fellow emotional person, and to direct some of the more negative emotions (and comments) toward more constructive (or at least less destructive) endeavors.

The biggest problem with online communication is also its greatest strength; that you don't see the person face-to-face. This is a bad thing when it causes us to not think of the other side of the conversation as a normal human being, as deserving of respect as any random stranger on the street. But it can also be a boon, because you can vent your true feelings without the other party seeing any sign of it. You can cry or laugh or scream at your computer screen without the slightest worry about what the other party may think of you.

Hit a punching bag, shout at your monitor, whatever works to vent your emotions without causing unnecessary harm.

https://i.imgur.com/1HvNiEO.png?noredirect

tooomine1 votes

That's a bit unfair, dude. I'd appreciate it if you, and everyone else in the community, would be so kind as to not co-opt my emotional health issues into a straw man argument to further a thread that is, ultimately, an attempt at cyber bullying.

If you want to completely ignore the avenues that in game chat affords a person having a bad day to express that frustration ( a point that I have yet to see anyone bring up) while simultanously asking every player to claim responsibility for any action that might even be slightly misconstrued as a destructive act by any person in an emotional torpor, please have the balls to do it in your own right, and on your own terms. I don't need people using an arguably abusive stereotype of who I am to aggrandize their own equally (if not more) abusive causes.

This is not a healthy position you're asking the community to take. It would be more appropriate, and ultimately better for individual health, if you were advocating that people who find the terms to be offensive to mute players and report them after game. encouraging that kind of positive behaviour from an individual would be far far better than to keep victimizing us in the name of protecting the victims.

GaleWinUnleashed1 votes

I'm unsure where that first paragraph comes from. I made no attempt to convey any aggression toward you personally, and I'm sorry if it came across that way.

Moving on...

The way I see it, the mute button is completely worthless when it comes to the health of the community as a whole. How about an analogy: imagine a city where most residents own and carry guns, and a portion of them are willing to use them. Some of this portion acts on that desire occasionally, mounting an assault on random houses from a position in the street, though they do not enter the houses. All of the houses have doors that can be shut to completely block any outside attack. Many residents that come under fire choose to close this door, but they know by the sound that someone is still out there, shooting at them. The bullets can't reach them behind their doors, but it's still quite stressful to be under fire.

There may be a few random ricochets that hit residents that for some reason choose not to close their doors, but the shooters are not deliberately aiming to kill anyone; they're just shooting at houses.

So, the rate of injury in this city is fairly low. But does it sound like a place you'd want to visit? Or live?

Wouldn't it be much better if you could live in a city where everyone still has guns, but understands that guns are dangerous and chooses to use a firing range instead of taking shots at houses?

The impenetrable doors (the mute button) are a defense mechanism against the shooters that, for whatever reason, decide to fire in the direction of total strangers because they like pulling a trigger. Doors don't fix the root problem, nor do they protect people that forget to close them.

The city's problem isn't even that guns exist. It's that there are people who shoot at buildings with little to no provocation, without regard for who might be in the way, and with no apparent guilt for their actions.

All it takes to fix the city is for there to be an area of the city set aside for shooting, and for the shooters to use it instead of houses for target practice.

That firing range already exists. It's called your house, or wherever you're sitting with your computer. Now all we need is for the gun enthusiasts to be willing to restrict their shooting to this safe area, instead of lazily taking potshots at houses as they stroll past.

https://i.imgur.com/1HvNiEO.png?noredirect

redfeenix5 votes

Holy shit there are a lot of ignorant people out there eh ? Damn this thread is really a downer some of these comments are just terrible...

Karunamon4 votes

[slayer-pantheon-thumbs]

Signed. If I had my druthers, any "kill yourself" type posting would be an instant permaban.

Randomonium4 votes

Riot has cracked down on this pretty hard. In the past week I've gotten 2 in client messages saying that people I reported got punished. Problem with this free to play model is that people who think that kind of behavior is acceptable can just make another account. I've run into people who specifically have smurfs that they log onto to be toxic towards other people because they don't care about losing those accounts.

tooomine2 votes

I think you're the problem, dude, with your insistence that its not only socially acceptable for riot to attempt to manage people's emotional responses to a negative stimuli for them, but that it is, in some way, actually socially desirable.

Randomonium2 votes

Bit confused by your post. Are you saying that people should be allowed to say "kill yourself?" If so then I'm sorry but the law is not on your side. There have been plenty of cases where people have been brought up on charges for cyber bullying. Furthermore, if Riot allowed things like cyber bullying (which is illegal) then that could open them up to lawsuits in the event that someone actually does commit suicide over what someone says to them in game.

Additionally, Riot owns this product and this sets the terms of use. You agree to those terms of use when you sign up to play the game. If you break the terms of use then they have the right to terminate your account. You actually agree to let Riot terminate your account "for any reason or for no reason" when you click that "I agree" button every patch. In many ways its just like any privately owned business in the real world. If you act like an ass then that establishment has the right to refuse service to you, kick you out and ban you from entering again.

Ultimately we are the ones who decide what is and what is not socially acceptable and desirable and the community has spoken very vocally and very overwhelmingly that we won't tolerate cyber bulling or bigotry of any kind. People think they can get away with that crap online because they are anonymous. I'm quite happy that they can't in this game.

tooomine2 votes

In a large portion of the US, the law is on my side. please don't conflate your personal localized experiences for a persuasive argument. it falls short of the mark.

cyberbullying is not illegal (in many states in the nation). But, perhaps more specifically, in the state in which riot reserves the right to have all actions adjudicated (california), it is not illegal either. there is very little threat of a lawsuit in that regard. I find the the entirety of your first paragraph to be a convoluted and unpersuasive attempt at an emotional persuasion (if not explicitly misdirection).

Concerning the second and third paragraphs of your argument, I find the second paragraph to be of little importance. and while I agree with you in the third paragraph that the community should set standards for what is acceptable behaviour, I would appreciate it if you would not co-opt my emotional helath issues to further the cause of your SJW bullying of the community and riot directly in this thread. The truth is, you choose cyber bullying in this context. the community is, at least in this vocal minority, very accepting of the practice, QED.

I'm hoping you'll take the time to take a breath, and realize that your claim, in the ways that you have tried to tie it to the OP's claims, lacks any degree of validity because it doesn't 1) come from a person with mental health issues, or 2) address any statistical or scientific evidence that this kind of behaviour has a deleterious effect on people. You have instead set up a straw man, wrapped it in the rhetorical armor of a social defense of a mental health problem, and used that to bludgeon anyone who doesn't think like you do. You are doing far more damage than the guys who say KYS in the thread, homie, and you're so self-righteous that you will probably STILL refuse to see it.

Randomonium1 votes

Did you even fact check what you said? 48 out of 50 states have laws against bullying and specifically state in that statute that these laws apply to bullying done with electronic methods.

Cyberbullying is a misdemeanor in California (Cal. Pen. Code 653m) punishable up to one year in prison or a $1,000 fine (or both.)

Riot has said they will not tolerate bullying or toxic behavior. They have the right to enforce whatever code of ethics they want in their game because its their property. This is in response to your comment that Riot's influence is not acceptable or desirable. You may not find it acceptable or desirable but its their product so you play by their rules. If you don't like it then leave.

The community is not in favor of toxicity or cyber bullying. Any thread on the forums will show you that. In fact, no online community I've ever been a part of is in favor of toxicity or cyber bullying. There's a reason why people who engage in such behavior are called trolls.

Are you saying that any claim I make isn't valid because I don't have mental health issues? 1) how do you know I don't and 2) why would not having mental health issues invalidate my opinion? That would be like saying I can't be against racism unless I'm a minority.

There are many cases where people have committed suicide after being cyber bullied. If that's not scientific evidence then I don't know what is. Furthermore, you don't need to provide scientific evidence to argue something is immoral. Such debates are often made with logical arguments rather than anything that could be defined as statistical or scientific. Cyber bullying really comes down to the golden rule, which is a hallmark of pretty much every civilization on the planet. Don't be rude or disrespectful to others because you wouldn't want them to be rude or disrespectful to you. I'm sure you wouldn't want me to be rude or physically violent to you so why would you be rude or physically violent to someone else?

This really has nothing to do with self-righteousness, it has to do with speaking up for what I and many other people feel is wrong. I've seen the damage that bullying can do. I've seen the pain that a suicide can cause a family and a community. “The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.” In my mind, bullying people, either physically or emotionally, is evil and I won't stand by and let it happen to someone, even if they are a complete stranger. I've stood up to bullies since I was a kid. I firmly believe its the duty of strong people to protect the weak. Its why I joined the military and have served on active duty for 8 years. And when I get out of the military I will continue to protect members of my community from physical, verbal or emotional abuse whenever I encounter it.

tooomine1 votes

http://cyberbullying.org/bullying-laws

california: not a criminal sanction.

Randomonium1 votes

Don't just blindly believe what websites tell you. Look up California penal code 635m. Cyber bullying is prosecuted under that law.

skocc3 votes

The mute option exists for a reason :)

ModPrandine5 votes

{quoted}

The mute option exists for a reason :)

The Mute button is not an excuse to act like a jerk. If you're forcing people to mute you then you've done something wrong.

tooomine1 votes

right. but that doesn't mean that KYS should be insta ban. its verbal harass, just like anything else. not any more offensive or less offensive than any other type of verbal harass.

ModPrandine

{quoted}

right. but that doesn't mean that KYS should be insta ban. its verbal harass, just like anything else. not any more offensive or less offensive than any other type of verbal harass.

I never said that it should be. However, Riot has a zero-tolerance policy against things like hate speech, and since KYS is often taken as meaning Kill Yourself, you can hopefully see where allot of people are coming from on that. Now of course you could say something along the lines like "but context matters yo" and while that is true sometimes, keep in mind that it's often very difficult to determine emotion/intent through text, especially when the original poster of the message doesn't even take the time or the effort to make his message and/or intent clear to others who may not understand the messages intent.

Magical Player1 votes

{quoted}

I never said that it should be. However, Riot has a zero-tolerance policy against things like hate speech, and since KYS is often taken as meaning Kill Yourself, you can hopefully see where allot of people are coming from on that. Now of course you could say something along the lines like "but context matters yo" and while that is true sometimes, keep in mind that it's often very difficult to determine emotion/intent through text, especially when the original poster of the message doesn't even take the time or the effort to make his message and/or intent clear to others who may not understand the messages intent.

I thought kys meant kids yall suck for the longest time, and i can see kys being thrown around alot because kys(kids yall suck) is a completely different scenario that kill yourself, but both are easy to apply in the same situations. just because an acronym is thrown out doesnt mean it means what you think it means

Astôlfo3 votes

They shouldn't have to mute you in the first place. Your argument is invalid. Dismissed.

tooomine1 votes

No, his argument is a strong one against the type of emotionally charged bullying that this thread seems to be so deeply entrenched upon. This whole thread is an attempt to bully riot games into a co dependent emotional exchange with the select few people who have supported the thread so far. It ignores any inkling of statistical or scientific data that pertains to how league is affecting players, choosing, rather, to intentionally conflate the vast aggregate of all suicide data with something that might be persuasive in a meaningful way.

is KYS reportable? in some contexts, yes. is it worse than any other thing you can say to a person? absolutely not. this whole discussion is far out of hand, and seems to be executed by people who are not dealing with (and who do not understand) the emotional issues they allege to be defending. as a guy who has been clinically diagnosed with depression for 18 years, I specifically disclaim any responsibility you have for your responses to a stimuli. asking me to take that on would be more deleterious to my experience in this game, and asking riot to do so is equally unhealthy and inappropriate. The mute button exists for a reason. it exists because people are responsible for managing their response to a negative stimuli. No further action needs to be taken.

If there was any degree of integrity amongst this thread, its constituent members would delete their comments and move on.

Mootie3 votes

I suffer from multiple mental health disorders such as schizophrenia, paranoia, and so on. I overcame depression and suicidal tendencies (tried to overdose multiple times and passed out in an attempt to hang myself) and one reason I managed to overcome my depression is freedom of expression, or what's left of it, on the internet. I'll be damned if you people on your high horses who find every little thing to complain about take that away too. Right now it's "killing myself" and "kill yourself" and next week it'll be "I hate Yasuo" and "Stupid minions" and before too long it'll be "git gud kiddo". May as well remove the entire chat. This coming from someone who has attempted to end his life and eventually learned from it, if you are sad enough that someone telling you to kill yourself over a game like League is enough to push you over the edge, then I don't think you should be playing this game in the first place. You should seriously seek help and look toward other alternatives for entertainment. Kids these days are saying it in schools like it means hello; hell they said it all the time back when I was in school. I'm not saying I approve of it, I'm just saying I don't really care if people want to say it. I just know what it will ultimately lead up to if they further crack down on chat restrictions. I'll receive some flack for saying this, but if you are brave enough to fight the thoughts and overcome suicidal depression, then I'm proud of you. The ones who give in, well... I just see it as preventing overpopulation, a means to escape when you have no way out, and survival of the fittest. I've known friends who have committed suicide but it had no correlation to gaming or the Internet. It was school and parenting related everytime. So if you want to blame something, then target the source: Bad parenting and the school system.

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