Champion Update…Update – 1/30/15

RiotFruity Sebbles··32 votes·123,104 views

Hey guys,

Fruity Sebbles here for the Champion Update team. It’s been a while since we last shared what the team’s working on, and now that we’re wrapping up Tristana’s update I’d like to preview some of our current projects and the thinking behind them.

If you prefer the tl;dr, we’re currently working on a visually-focused update for Kassadin as well as a more general Ryze update. We’re also still cranking away on Poppy’s comprehensive update. Read on below if you’d like details straight from the designers!

THIS IS THE DISCLAIMER - Keep in mind the following does not represent a comprehensive list of what’s on our radar or even being worked on. Everything mentioned below is tentative, not tied to dates, subject to change, delay, cancellation, obliteration, etc.

Tristana

In case you missed it, Tristana’s update is now live! As with all our projects, we’ll be monitoring Tristana past her release for any final tweaks we may need to make. She’ll also be getting a new splash sometime in the next few patches.

Kassadin

Art thoughts by Riot Tokkelossie

Confession time. I've been a massive Kassadin fanboy since the first time I played him. The misunderstood hero who turns the dark power of the Void back on itself, fighting fire with fire, standing alone against a force that could threaten all of Runeterra - how awesome is that?

I think we can all agree though that Kassadin's visuals could do a lot more to live up to his awesome premise. As one of the original 40 champions, he's been left behind as League’s visual quality bar has continued to rise over time.

Unlike some older champions, Kassadin has always had a distinct personality and theme to his visuals, and we definitely want to maintain those traits in the course of this update. Our approach has very much been to take what Kassadin is, identify the most important elements in his visual design, and then refine things to match LoL's current standards. Kassadin's latest splash did a great job of following that approach and served as a useful reference point for our work.

We’re also focused on improving Kassadin’s in-game read. His original model has such a strong contrast between the black costume and its white trim that details become difficult to discern at in-game scale. Nudging his color scheme in ways that improve his in-game read without changing his identity will allow us to really highlight Kassadin’s key visual elements and make him pop on the battlefield.

Ryze

Art thoughts by IronStylus

Ryze lives in a very unique space within League of Legends. He’s not a standard fantasy wizard with white hair and a robe. He doesn’t cast magic from a wand. He doesn’t cast spells from incantations. We want to make sure his update communicates these traits and reinforce his uniqueness. With that in mind we plan to keep his major reads (blue skin, big scroll, spell book) while streamlining and update some of his details.

With Ryze’s update we want to better convey that he’s a master of his magic (and running) in a way that’s kinetic and physical, almost punching his magic out in the same way an expert martial artist expresses his skill. Communicating the runic element is also important, so glyphs, runes, and other forms of character-based effects are key factors.

Since we’re solidifying Ryze’s identity as a solitary and nomadic mage who’s on the run, we want to make sure that’s reflected in his appearance by playing up a more rugged feel to his gear and clothing. Again, we want to remain faithful to his major reads while injecting a little more grit that shows off his resilience as a hardened spell-slinging battlemage.

Gameplay thoughts by RiotRepertoir

Ryze’s kit has a strong identity, but it’s pretty binary based on his distance from you. Get too close and you’re getting hit by the full force of his “always on” kit, every time. This limits our ability to tune him as he’s an absolute terror when his numbers are too strong. Thus, our overall goal is to preserve his particular identity as a "tanky, in-your-face mage" while focusing his power into windows that create more relevant decisions for both Ryze and his opponents.

Essentially, we want to increase the highs and lows when Ryze is in a scrap - bigger wins when he’s skillful, as well as better opportunities for his opponents to interact with his gameplay. To do that, we have to build more unreliability in to his kit. Skillshots are one way to do that, with his Q the obvious candidate to become a skillshot in return for longer range. We do like Ryze’s brand of close-range mastery, so rather than turn everything into skillshots we’re building clearer power/timing windows into the rest of his kit.

Finally, we want to better visualize and clarify Ryze’s power as well as what exactly he’s doing to his opponents. Some examples include better presenting his rapid-fire casting and making his E’s behavior more controllable and understandable (again, for both Ryze and his opponents).

Poppy

Fear not, we’re still working on her! Check her section in last year’s Champion Update dev blog for the early details.


That’s it for now. We’ll be back with more updates as these projects (and others!) move closer to completion!

222 Comments

Clopping Pony15 votes

item 3070 Urgot item 3070

Macis13 votes

Yorick I'm A Believer....

Sciaphobia232 votes

Yorick will join his corpses before Rito get around to looking at him I feel :(

RIP along with Evelynn

Hellhammer9 votes

Yay Poppy gets a mention!!!, I bet the team assigned to her rework is burning the midnight oils trying to come up with how rework her.

I check the news twice a day and the boards constantly for anything about poppy.

hurray!Poppy

RiotIronStylus22 votes

She's currently in pre-production, I may or may not be personally working on her.. cuz.. ya know, armor.

Lockbox8 votes

I think my biggest question about everything changing with Poppy is "Will she still be the 'serious' Yordle?" Will her over all tone as the Iron Ambassador still be "Jokes? I don't know any jokes" or will it shift towards the other female Yordles "That tasted purple / wanna see the fireworks?" Kennen and Poppy are the two champions that tell me that Yordles aren't just explosive happy nutters, that there's some depth to their stories. (Honestly there's a little something in all there stories which is why I like them, but overall these two the most) Though admittedly Kennen's E makes it hard to take him seriously.

I trust you guys know what you're doing, but since I don't know what that is yet I still worry about what direction Poppy will take, you know?

Kitten of Evil5 votes

I hope she keeps her personality. I really like it. Lulu is just way too whimsical. "Never look a tulip in the eye!"

9Q1IMGTQP38 votes

This is still leaving a big questionmark open: Are you still going to degrade Kassadin into merely a MTU as stated here by Ironstylus:

"I think we have opportunities to do an MTU on him. ~ Ironstylus" (source)

Are you simply going with it now? It would be a disaster for me if a so called Kassadin fanboy is working on him but doesnt want to give Kassadin the VU he deserves and needs.

Best wishes.

RiotIronStylus14 votes

Here's how I see things:

We have plans and **opportunities. **

The plans include a lot of the known big updates, the Visual & Gameplay Updates (VGU's) which are planned out usually super far as they need a lot of planning for execution. The projects can take months to do (maybe a year). They're heavily comprehensive. They're often used for the worst offenders in our game, often characters that need complete gameplay, art and thematic rebuilding, sometimes one of those aspects, sometimes all. The Sions, Tarics, etc. We slot and fantasy slot these far in advance.

The opportunities include lower scope Model & Texture Updates (MTU's) which aren't planned quite as far out, and are usually jumped on when we see an open slot, or a new gameplay update has been cracked, or we have the ability to borrow art resources from another team. Also when they're themeatically "safe". Nasus was done in this way. The legendary skin enabled his VU. These MTU's are usually built on what we have, existing rig, tweaked animations, etc. The reason being is that if we made them as high scope as full large-scope projects, you wouldn't see them for a year or more. We simply can't accomodate doing 8 Sions a year.

While yes, a lot of these champions could benefit from complete tear-downs, we have great opportunities that present themselves. In Kassadin's situation, Tokkelossie, being a big Kassadin fan, had made a completely new model on his own time. So boom, we had a start. Additionally, we started working with an outsourcer that has proven really, REALLY effective in making quality models, and we've begun to leverage them on skins, especially existing skins for VU's. The fast ramp-up can be attributed to having the existing new base model, some work the skins team had been doing, his VFX being in a good place, and a 3D external partner able to handle both reconcepting and remodelling the existing skins allowed us to jump on this.

Would it be nice to burn everything down and rebuilt it from scratch? Sure, if we can do that in an optimal time. We could knock down the house, re-pour the foundation, build a new frame, etc. But sometimes, because the opportunity to save time and resources is there, we build on top of a workable foundation with the frame intact.

9Q1IMGTQP38 votes

I wanted a simple yes or no answer. Anyways, I take that as a confirmation. Sad to see that after the more than 3 years that Kassadin mains had to suffer from "Oh dont worry he is somewhere high up the VU list" our favorite champion does even get stripped off this very glimpse of hope, you might argue that his abilities are "okay" due to being updated together with his rework and I would agree on that completely, but as you know, there is more to a champion than that, his VO is nonexistent as of now and his triangle-shaped body has no place in the game.

I dont want a Sion-tier relaunch, just a honest look at Kassadin.

Thanks for answering, I appreciate it.

RiotIronStylus6 votes

We've taken that honest look, and given time, planning, resources, etc. This is what we can do to deliver some badly-deserved quality for Kassadin in a timely manner.

9Q1IMGTQP35 votes

Appearently, honestly wouldnt have mattered to me waiting 3 more years and getting something good in trade.

RiotIronStylus14 votes

I don't think that'd be the attitude of the majority of our players who are looking for some nice quality changes in the near future versus 3 years from now.

9Q1IMGTQP34 votes

Well near future probably depends a lot from when you're looking at it, that "near future". ;)

RiotIronStylus9 votes

Weeks to months rather than months to years :P

9Q1IMGTQP36 votes

Well have been years for me already, but dont worry since the 4 years that I play this game I never stopped supporting this company even through times of misdecisions, and I will probably not stop here now.

AngelSpite3 votes

Good for Kassadin. He needs it, but what about Evelynn. Have you decided what she is? :) Evelynn

RiotIronStylus12 votes

No idea. This is a tough one and will need probably the same amount of pre-production time as Sion, if not more.

DemiluniS7 votes

can we have an explanation why she always getting put back?! you've been talking about her rework ever since 2 years ago, and it's always about "we don't know what she exactly is"... and when you relaunched the twisted treeline the lore team said she didn't have altar interaction because they didn't want to reveal her lore yet, which all leads they didn't have anything ready for her...same goes now, she got her short lore in the client but nothing more than that.... I don't even wanna get to her gameplay, she got nerfed and forgotten. why Eve players have to suffer from another "stealth rework where?!!!"

Siachi6 votes

I hope you guys can give Kassadin a new Voice Over: I'm still kind of miffed that Alistar, who has a total of FIVE lines for moving and attacking, didn't get a new VO with his update, but that's besides the point.

Plus there's the thing where he still has his Silence joke despite not having a silence anymore, and how he has ONE line that even uses the word 'void' (And it's not even The Void), despite so much of his character having to do with The Void.

Also, just a suggestion: As long as he has a way to interrupt channels, he should totally get a line for interrupting Malzahar's Nether Grasp, like when he 'frees' an allied champion from Malz ult. Plays up the rivalry a bit, don't you think?

EDIT: I hope this doesn't come off as a stand-offish "Do this or I won't be happy" sort of thing. I just think Kassadin can be an interesting character with a proper VO, but his current VO doesn't really give much to go off of. And I trust you guys will know what you're doing when it comes to his art and models and the like.

RiotIronStylus8 votes

Right now, with the current outlook, Kassadin VO wouldn't be in scope with what we're planning. It's of course a nice-to-have, but right now the bandwidth we have is mainly in the modelling department. Given the current constraints we feel what we're planning will add value in a time frame that won't leave players hanging for a year.

Siachi6 votes

Well, that's a bit disappointing. It's probably just me, admittedly someone who hasn't played as much Kassadin as others, but I'd rather have a new voiceover and no model changes for Kassadin than a model change and no new voiceover.

But, I guess I can't ask artists to do audio and lore stuff, and sometimes you just have to take what you can get, so I'll just have to see what you come up with for his new model. I'll try to be optimistic either way.

Say he were to get a new voiceover, or you had a good opportunity for it: would it require another visual update again for it, or could you technically throw it on the newer upcoming model and add a few animations to the model so it fits?

EDIT: Thank you for the response regardless!

RiotC3Sound9 votes

{quoted} I hope you can give Kassadin a new Voice Over: I'm still kind of miffed that Alistar, who has a total of FIVE lines for moving and attacking, didn't get a new VO with his update, but that's besides the point.

Hey Siachi!

A lot of time goes into writing the backstory, bio, script, the in-game text, recording the VO, editing, processing, localizing, casting and recording in 15+ languages around the world...

If we were to do this with every champion we wanted, we wouldn't be putting out a new update but once every so often. So while we take our larger projects through this longer pipeline, we cant take every project champion update chooses to touch through the process.

That said, we arent ruling out VO for future projects just yet. We are deliberating what can take the longer road for the upcoming year.

Thanks!

  • C3
DwarvenGiant6 votes

On what scale Ryze's update will be? A full VU or MTU?

RiotIronStylus16 votes

Currently we're looking at a full Visual & Gameplay Update.

DwarvenGiant5 votes

I have some more questions, if you don't mind:

  • What do you plan on doing with MTU'd and TU'd (e.g: Anivia and Rammus) champs in the future? I mean, you'd eventually need to update their VO and Animations (And models, for some of them).

  • From what I understand from a recent comment made by one of the ChampUp guys (I don't remember exactly who it was), when you're done with Poppy, it's most likely that you'll have to choose between Yorick and Urgot, I mean, who to (Almost)Sion-Scope-Update next, right? Do you think you'll give Yorick a full VU or a lesser treatment (MTU)?

Can't wait for the Poppy and Taric (and in the more far future- Urgot) updates! I used to be a Taric, Poppy and Urgot main in the past, so I have high expectations! :D

Derpy Mike4 votes

(Sorry if it has)But has it been explained why Riot doesn't do "traditional" skins for reworked/updated champions anymore? If I remember correctly, Trundle, Karma, and Sej got Traditional skins(looks like their pre-rework state) with their champion updates, but Yi, Sion, and now Tristana didn't. Yi and Trist I understand because they both look extremely similar to their pre-update state. But It strikes me as strange that Sion got an entire champion re-release without a Traditional skin. Is this just something they don't do anymore?

RiotIronStylus13 votes

Currently we're not planning on continuing with traditional skins, as we haven't seen as much value payoff as we initially thought they'd provide.
That could change, but currently that's our stance.

Derpy Mike7 votes

That's fair enough. Honestly I don't remember the last time I saw A traditional skin used in game.

RiotIronStylus9 votes

Exactly, the appearance/use of them is really rare.

Masalar8 votes

Aw, I use them on Trundle and Karma a lot, and did on Sej til the Poro skin. Still, can understand why.

Auryiel12 votes

And yet Karma's traditional skin is the only one that kept her old, vastly superior VO Sadly, I'll never buy a Karma skin, however awesome, because of this

I know this isn't exactly your department (not at all, in fact...) but maybe you've heard something so I wanna ask : have you ever thought about making available/selling voice packs?

Purodyuusaa5 votes

{quoted}

Exactly, the appearance/use of them is really rare.

I know this isn't your department, but do you think you could find out if Riot has any plans to put those traditional skins back on sale? Iirc, Riot never said they wouldn't come back. I have Traditional Sejuani and Traditional Trundle but made the terrible mistake of not picking up Karma before her update and that one skin eludes me.

Thryale5 votes

I never use karma's "classic" skin. I always use her traditional skin when I play her. (really really really dislike her "classic" skin)

I also think lee sin's traditional skin is one of the best skins he has.

Failbot Deploy6 votes

{quoted}

Exactly, the appearance/use of them is really rare.

The problem with that logic is that you only had them available short term in stores or to those that owned the champions previously. These were considered trash champions or troll picks and thus nobody played/bought them. That said, those are the only skins I use on those three champions. I don't like their updates and I haven't been fond of their other skins.

TerraRising6 votes

{quoted}

Exactly, the appearance/use of them is really rare.

But, wasn't that the point of the Traditional skins? I may be wrong, but I thought that the Traditional skins were to appease the hardcore fans who were wholly disappointed in a rework and wanted something close to what they had lost. IronStylus, you were there, you should remember it!

Take, for instance, Karma. When the Karma rework was released, so much of the original champion had changed (removal of her fans, completely new voice over and altered background lore) that the original champion was considered "gone" by her fans. The Traditional skin was used as a way to keep those fans (as it were) from poo-pooing on the entire rework. And, if someone wanted to buy Karma and the traditional skin two weeks after release, they could.

Then, the skin was permanently put on the "Limited Edition" list, never to be sold again. That way, new fans could focus on the rework and those skins. The same thing happened with Sejuani and Trundle. You either owned the champion and got the skin that represented the

I think the popularity of those "Traditional" skins would increase if the company allowed people to buy them again. I would also assume that's the exact reason why Riot doesn't sell them.

Then again, I could be wrong and that ChampUp just doesn't want to do them anymore. :)

Chromatic Eagle5 votes

But people like them for sentimental value.

Linna Excel3 votes

I use traditional Sej exclusively when I play her. If I had traditional Karma I'd use it from time to time if I were a Karma player.

I think your sample size is too small and the champs you used were wrong. Plus most people can only get a traditional skin if you owned the champ before the change happened. Some like Sej aren't common picks. Traditional karma is not in the store even if I wanted it.

Tendrian3 votes

The problem I have with them is that the ones you released for the most part didn't end up at all looking like the actual classic version of the champion (Trundle), or flatout lacking iconic things (Karma's fans, Sejuani's shield..).

Actual classic skins might have great value - the half assed ones that have been put out so far sure don't have.

LankPants9 votes

That's a shame, as an avid Sejuani player I've almost exclusively used traditional Sej since the rework. I love having the traditional skin and I think if any of my other champs got major VUs I'd like to have the traditional skin for them.

Keagn4 votes

You have a good point, and I respect it, but in all honesty I can't help but feel a love for the traditional skins.

Future generations of league players may only know Trundle as The Troll King, who has a large army at his command. But once, he was the cursed troll, the filth of existence. I feel like identities like this should be preserved in some manner other than being able to hunt for them in internet-land. I know I would use my Traditional Trundle skin I was awarded with more often if I had the internet to support good matches.

Luxadin4 votes

Thank you so much, Riot Tokkelossie. You have answered my prayers. Being someone who has explored his character through running an askblog for years, I'm happy to see that there's a rioter who enjoys him. Funny how this post appears two days after I tweeted wondering if there was a rioter that liked Kassadin.

Well, I can't wait to see the final product!

RiotRiot Tokkelossie9 votes

High Five Absolutely :D I'm very excited to share what we've been doing with you and all the other Kassadin players out there. Kassadin

BabyBaluga11184 votes

I thought Poppy was next in line to be re-released? has that changed? can we expect her before summer?

Junkο4 votes

So the champion update schedule on the support page is irrelevant again?

Leaff4 votes

Well the new Kassadin update..erm well to say the very least Riot, Im disappointed.

Let me get this straight. Your champ updates, are BADASS. You did an AMAZING job on nasus, and a very good job on tristana, sivir, sion, etc. Whats the one thing that all of them have in common? They all had visual updates. Now its time for me to be not so nice.

This is NOT a visual upgrade. This is a MTU + slight ability changes.

First up, the model: You guys didnt do bad on this. You made him more updated, and look better. But, you did stick to the classic look of him. Which is not a bad thing, but I think due to that, there was no "Wow!" factor or "Awesome" factor. You guys didnt do anything to him that made him look like what he is, a void badass. He is actually quite small if I should say so myself.

Abilities. Abilties mean a lot to me, they show the power of the character. And, to be honest I see a TINY difference. Like the slightest bit. Q: His q is his 2nd "main" (Besides riftwalk) ability, and yet I see no difference. Its slightly darker than before. W: I actually do think you did a good job on nether blade. A cool animation. Even though I think the stabbing could really use some sort of effect on them. Like a orange/purple wave goes over the target he attacked. E: This was the most fail part of the abilities. The Q at LEAST had some after effects when it hit the target. Force pulse literally didnt change, when it has potential to look like a cool ability. R:Being his "main" ability, I think you could have done a little better. Its his main part of his kit. I dont have any suggestions as to how, but come on its an ultimate ability. Do something.

The animations (attacking, moving etc.) I have mixed feelings about. You did good on the normal attacking animation, I liked that. Moving looks a bit better, but like most of the kit, you could have done a bit more. When hes moving, the guy isnt intimidating to me.

And those of you who respond "kass looks so much better now not a blob of blue". You literally just described a MTU. Because this is what I see it as. Nasus for example. Looked just as bad as Kassadin live. He got a Voiceover, Completely redone abilities, Major model update, and to top it all off, got a legendary skin.

Please riot if you have ANY respect for ANY Kassadin fans, I would take this project back in and do a little bit more work on it. Kassadin DERSERVES IT. 3 years without a skin, Constant nerfs on abilities (Oh and I mean constant.), and has just been looking godawful for a long time.

Keisto3 votes

Thanks for the update, Fruity Sebbles.

I was wondering if you could disclose any details of a Cho'Gath rework+VU down the line?


Again, much appreciated, Afro

RiotIronStylus14 votes

Cho'gath is pretty massive in scope. Currently he's someone we'd like to fantasy slot, but it'll be entirely dependent on technical resources that are allocated to the team. Right now there's not enough animation bandwidth to do what we'd really want to do. That said, we may try experimenting with him on the Battlecast rig which might allow us to speed up development, that's not an immeidate priority right now but it's one I'd personally like to see us take on sooner than later.

Dankest of Meme4 votes

I have a quick question if you don't mind. Would Cho's "rework" be strictly visual or would his kit be changed. Personally I love his current kit however I was wondering how you guys felt about it. Thanks

DaCush4 votes

If you don't mind me asking. What do you mean by not enough animation bandwidth? I've never heard that term before and would love to know what you mean by that.

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