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So I see everyone complaining about Death's dance, Phantom dancer and Knight's vow

Geshultz·7/3/2017, 8:09:26 PM·17 votes·1,429 views

Yet in 96% of games you'll likely never see all 3 items built or used on 1 champion.

http://www.leagueofgraphs.com/champions/items/all

Basically pickrate is % of 10 champions that build it per game overall.

has 2.8% pickrate with 6.2% pickrate and at pickrate of 2% pickrate

Meaning in only 2/1002.8/1006.2/100 = 34.72/100,000 or is 0.00003472% per 10 champions the item combination will be picked. Taking this with 7,103,897 games of those matches there are 10 champions meaning there is total of 71,038,970 champions picked. Meaning multiple top percentage by 10 gets to 0.0003472% of all champions will have it applied to them or 0.003472%*71,038,970 = 246647.3038 of all champions will be effected by it assuming that 1 champion is in each match is 246647.3038/7103897 = in all league only 0.034% of all games will have 3 item combination.

Even then the winrate of the items are not even that high with winrate of 58.2% with pickrate of 2.8% compared to with higher winrate at 59.6% and pickrate at 4.3%.

Next lets look at with pickrate of 6.2% and winrate of 56.2% compared to pickrate of 8.0% and winrate of 56.1%, or 6.9% pickrate and 54.5% winrate, or even pickrate of 5.5% and 56.6% winrate. Again nothing unusual about Phantom dancer's winrate either

Let's look at with pickrate of 2.0% and winrate of 58.4% compared to that has 6.2% pickrate and 55.3% winrate or even that has a 7.9% pickrate with 55.2% winrate. Again nothing out of the ordinary win rate wise as items with less pickrates will tend to have a higher winrate for same reason as champions with lower pickrates have higher winrates.

Summary the items are not broken regardless of how the try to spin it, and the fact that the items are not built in over 96%+ games shows how unrealistic the complaints are. Meaning that overall taking the math that of 7,103,897 matches *10 = 71,038,970 champions in that match only 24664 champions picked have had the combination used on them. Assuming that all 3 items are built and are built and used on same champions meaning that 1 per match is 246647/7,103,897 matches = in all league only 0.0347% of all games will have 3 item combination.

17 Comments

Sun Wu Ryuumoku7/3/2017, 11:27:34 PM5 votes

item 3504

doiminat0r36007/3/2017, 11:10:34 PM3 votes

People are complaining about Deaths dance on characters like Draven. - AD champions that hit a lot and heal a lot People are complaining about PD on champions like Draven. -- AD champions that benefit from AS (That's all of them mostly)

People are complaining about Knights vow on Tanks with extreme resistance. - Tanks

Not all 3 together, but just all 3.

Leonerdo7/4/2017, 12:11:21 AM2 votes

Well, your math is all wrong, but the comparisons against other similar items are all you really need.

BotRK is easily the most purchased lifesteal item. DD is bought slightly more than Bloodthrister and Ravenous Hydra, but a significant part of that difference is due to Riven and Draven, who rush it first item. (Koreans prefer the other options over DD, btw.) So anyone complaining about DD really should only be complaining about those two champions.

Knight's Vow is pretty obviously on par with other tank items, and is vastly out-picked by Locket.

Phantom Dancer though IS the one item out of the three that could be considered a top competitor with similar items. It's only slightly out-picked by Shiv (which Riot wants to nerf eventually). But even then, it'll only be a tiny bit better than the other Zeal upgrades on average.

So yeah, the items are not really a problem. Nonetheless, when you are against a fed Draven with DD, PD, and KV, it can be pretty ridiculous. Therefore some tiny nerfs may be warranted, but those nerfs should be focused on Draven (less lifesteal from his Q bonus damage maybe?), or on the specific Damage Reduction synergy that PD and KV have. (Because of how the math works out, PD and KV stack rather well, compared to if they just gave flat armor/MR.)

DoktorKaiser7/3/2017, 11:34:51 PM1 votes

The fact that most of the players are bronze and silver idiots who are building the same things they did 4 years ago doesnt mean that those items arent extremely gamebreaking and deserve a fucking nerf. Period.

Chess17/3/2017, 10:39:38 PM1 votes

Please pin this riot

zxinferxz7/4/2017, 6:27:03 PM1 votes

So if I got that correctly, you mean to tell me that the stats for all games, on a global scale, with all elos included, has awfully numbers on the meta stuff? Wow... It's almost as if some region's servers are more skilled than others.... It's almost as if people outside of ranked don't give a fuck about the meta and just build whatever.... It's almost as if... you're counting the bronze games, the silver games, and even the gold games, instead of only counting the plat+ games where people are most likely to know what a "meta" is, and how it works... It's almost as if I've played ranked in LAN in plat+ elo, and many people even in high plat are still too dumb to abuse the broken meta stuff, so you don't even need to ban Fiora or Zac anywhere as often as you normally would in a real region, because people are too dumb to notice these are broken, and they play ranked games just for giggles and fun! Instead of to win, so they don't abuse broken stuff... It's almost as if............... your stats are useless garbage that you're using as basis for an awful argument

Edit: Also, excuse me for asking, but did you imply that a champion would build a combination of these, himself? Or did you say that these aren't often found within the total inventories of 5 champions in games? If it's the first, then your argument is even worse than I thought, if it's the latter, then it's still a dumb argument, because you're then suggesting that DD is fine and properly balanced, just because it remains a niche item that is obscenely broken on the champs that can use it. Riven, Fiora, and Draven have a pretty decent skill floor, at least Riven does, and given the context behind your "stats", not many people are going to be playing Riven or Fiora or Draven, when the average player is a bronzelord. Are you also saying that PD is fine, because it's not being built in 100% of games? Given that, again, going by your "stats", you're cleverly ignoring the games where the ADC just can't properly use that item in their matchups. You're also saying that since KV has a low pick up rate, it means the item is fine, not that people are too stupid to understand why it's good, but that the item is fine, right? May I link you to a discussion that points out that DMP has a gold efficiency of 80%, not counting its passive, while KV has a gold efficiency of like 110%, also not counting its passive?

I almost forgot, your "stats" also cleverly ignore these games where the Leona builds titanic sunfire frozen heart, while still being in the support role, or these games where you have a support Teemo, you know, the low elo games

Tobias Brackner7/3/2017, 10:45:15 PM1 votes

Thank you for sharing this information! I'm hoping constant fact dispensal like this will go a long way to stop the QQ that happens on the boards.

Spoofghoul7/3/2017, 10:48:17 PM1 votes

I have an issue with all of the items you just mentioned :s

and a lot more items actually :S