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Sick of bad Vaynes, or so i thought (warning: math incoming)

lightmagician60··3 votes·998 views

so many people play Vayne, yet no one plays her right... i dunno where this damn AS Vayne build came from but it does nothing.. if it works it's cause of the support or the enemy team is worse... Normal ADCs rush BT or iE first, Vaynes get BOTRK first... want the math?

---Normal ADC Vayne (maxed Sliver Bolts) Base AD at Lv11 (82) + 80 AD from BT or iE Base AS at Lv11 (0.88) you max Sliver Bolts, 60 on 3rd hit in 3 basics you deal 222 total, in 3.36 secs DPS = (222 / 3.36) = 66.07

---AS Vayne (maxed Sliver Bolts) Base AD at Lv11 (82) + 25 AD from BOTRK AS at Lv11 with BOTRK (1.15) you max Sliver Bolts, 60 on 3rd hit in 3 basics you deal total, 167 in 2.55 secs DPS = (167 / 2.55) = 65.49

thats if you last long enough... BOTRK builds from Blidgewater whitch.... needless to say would lose when compared to BF sword. and yes you'd deal a bit more with the HP rate. also AD vayne ties(??) without even building right

----Normal ADC Vayne (maxed Tumble) Base AD at Lv11 (82) + 80 AD from BT or iE Base AS at Lv11 (0.88) maxed Tumble, Basic +50% AD (162+81) giving the same 3.36 secs the other used, you deal total 972 (Basic, Tumble, Basic, Basic, Tumble) 5 auto attacks would you like me you could Sliver bolts too? Lv11 you'd have 3 points on Sliver bolts (40 true damage) in 6 basics, you'd deal 1214 in little more then 4.48 1214 / 4.48 = 270.98

FYI: at max rank tumble has a 2 second CD, thats why i counted it as much as i did

for kicks and giggles lets do the AS vayne with tumble max and Sliver bolt at 3

Base AD at Lv11 (82) + 25 AD from BOTRK AS at Lv11 with BOTRK (1.15) maxed Tumble, Basic +50% AD (107+53.5) Sliver bolts ranks 3 (40 true damage) in 6 Basics, you'd deal 829 damage in little more then 3.40 (Shoot, Tumble, Shoot, Shoot, Shoot, Tumble) 829 / 3.40 = 243.82

so to cover all based here.. lets go back to first 2, and do them with a rank 3 tumble

---Normal ADC Vayne Base AD at Lv11 (82) + 80 AD from BT or iE Base AS at Lv11 (0.88) you max Sliver Bolts, 60 on 3rd hit ranks 3 Tumble, basic+40% AD (162+64.2) in 6 basics you deal 1220 total, in litte more then 4.48 secs DPS = (1220 / 4.48) = 272.32

---AS Vayne Base AD at Lv11 (82) + 25 AD from BOTRK AS at Lv11 with BOTRK (1.15) you max Sliver Bolts, 60 on 3rd hit ranks 3 Tumble, basic+40% AD (107+42.8) in 6 basics you deal total, 847 in 2.55 secs DPS = (847 / 2.55) = 332.15

Wow, .. in 1 way it works in the end, sadly you kinda lose long before then.. cause BF beats Blidgewater... so yes this works. if you turtle, too bad you have 25 AD vs 45 AD early on.. and the means you get zoned and you no farm to get this far.

i only play aggro support, so yeah that makes sense why vayne never works when i support... i came here maybe to math some sense into people, but i ended up learning something.. still posting this cause why not.. maybe this will help someone else

5 Comments

Cindikle7 votes

This doesn't seem to factor in armor(making true damage from AS stronger)

Nor her AD steroid in her ult (again, favoring AS). Although it also favors a lower CD on Q. But still favors AS more.

And it doesn't factor in BotRK's active damage or %hp damage. You're missing a lot of information.

Both builds are perfectly viable on her. You just need to know the situation of when to build each one. If the enemy team has a bunch of squishies, BT is probably the better choice unless you want the active on BotRK. If the enemy has Leona support, J4 jungle and Darius top. You're going to want the true damage and active.

You also have to remember that Vayne is more about the late game. Yes she can get kills early on. But don't expect her to be a good matchup as an aggressive support.

It sounds more like the Vaynes you play with know her weakness and understand their job is to farm early game. Kills are nice, but they're risky.

DrCyanide2 votes

The reason Vayne rushes BotRK is for the late game. Vayne relies on her True Damage third hits. What counters True Damage? More health. What counters more health? BotRK. By building this one item no one will be able to fully itemize against her.

Lets assume this Level 11 Vayne is going against a Level 11 Jinx. Without health runes or items, Jinx has 1237 HP. For simplicity, we'll assume the exchange starts with both ADC's at full health, and I'll ignore Jinx's other items/attacks because they don't effect how much damage Vayne is doing. Additionally I'll be skipping armor values, because I hate to do the math on that...

Max Silver Bolts, Bloodthirster's 80 AD vs BotRK:

.............................Blood Vayne.....BotRK Vayne Total AD...............162...................107 HP after 1 auto....1075.................1039 HP after 2 auto....913...................857 HP after 3 auto....751...................690 HP after True.......631...................575 Total Damage......606..................662 DPS.....................180.35..............259.60

DPS figured with the time you used above.

Let me know if I screwed up somewhere.

FHMarshy1 votes

Botrk % hp shred goes wayy better with silver bolts than any other Item. ALSO blidge is 150g cheaper than BF, and can be bought with sub parts.

Imagine a vayne denied in lane, it's practically impossible for him to actually get BF the same time the opponent does.

Any ADC, before buying LW, would basically do only little damage to a full on tank but Vayne with silver bolts and botrk can actually shred them armour or not

Mandang01 votes

Also don't forget that tumble works as an auto attack reset, so pure attack speed isn't as useful as you might expect.

I have no problem with Bork first, but Bork+Shiv is a bit much imo.

Drunk Rummate1 votes

you've got a good point, though judging it based over 6 autos is naturally going to favor the higher AD item since it doesn't factor in BotRK attack speed.

i pretty much always mindlessly build botrk on vayne when i play her, and i take attack speed runes. i've noticed that on every ADC if i build botrk first i feel ridiculously weak compared to IE start, so i'll give this a try sometime and see how it feels.

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