Boards›Gameplay

Surrendering becoming an issue

YouKnowMe88··18 votes·1,878 views

First of all, I totally understand if the match is a 3v5 or something and you really absolutely don't see a way around it, but surrendering is becoming a huge freaking problem and the go-to when matches start becoming hard. I try to explain that matches CAN and DO get turned around every day. I've been in several where the enemy team messes up and we take the lead. But man the amount of times I have and I'm sure most of you have been in matches that your team mates want to spam surrender is ridiculous. Seriously people, how about grow a pair, team up and recalculate our plays instead of throwing in the towel when it gets difficult. That's part of the fun, isn't it? But instead it seems like the league community is way to adjusted to "surr @ 20", it really ruins the match that could potentially turn around for the better.

Last match for example, the enemy Rumble was getting a little fed, but I as sup Alistar was also getting some decent kills in. I mean who doesn't want a fed alistar on their team? And rumble was the only issue, but our top lane Darius which was new to the game fed him. Well in my point of view? SO FREAKING WHAT if he fed rumble a little, how about grouping and focusing? How about teaching the darius a thing or two? Give him some tips, or matter fact, how about we help darius win his lane? But no the league community just wants to surrender game after game after game until "Hey I won one" 10 defeats later. Seriously grow a pair guys. It's really shameful how the community turned out to be.

Also, what are peoples opinions on adding a game mode minus surrender, it could be called "Death match" or something, but a mode that would encourage people to stop chickening out so quickly, and give the players that believe the match could be turned around a chance to prove it.

p.s. I also wasn't CSing or Ksing my adc either, those were legit kills that either happened due to my defending my adc or saving her behind, so none of that "sup shouldn't get kills" bs because that's all that is, BS

42 Comments

Twëek14 votes

Part of learning how to play is learning how to play from behind. It's a totally different game when you have a gold deficit, but there are often still ways to win. You've already committed the time to playing a game - why not let it go the extra ten or so minutes to see if you can turn it around? I can't even count how many games I've played where failed surrender votes go through and we end up managing to pull out a win.

YouKnowMe881 votes

Agreed 100%

Kazaashi9 votes

People don't realise that you cannot get better at what you do not practice. If you don't try to win games you are behind, then you never will get better. I, personally, find it WAY more satisfying to win a game where we came back from behind.

Its not hard either. Just ward your jungle and catch people out when the mess up thier rotations. It happens every game because people at my level of play are dumb and make mistakes.

YouKnowMe881 votes

Yeah I try to get people to realize that. And yeah it has helped by explaining it to them but the majority of the time they're just ready to quit. Especially if I see we are winning on objectives but idk. It'll never end xD

KidSpectre6 votes

The worst part is when your team surrenders AN EVEN GAME! No, it is NOT gg just because of one bad teamfight in the mid game or the Kat got a little fed. Nothing irks me more than when people give up before the game is even close to lost.

Salidfingers4 votes

{quoted}

The worst part is when your team surrenders AN EVEN GAME! No, it is NOT gg just because of one bad teamfight in the mid game or the Kat got a little fed. Nothing irks me more than when people give up before the game is even close to lost.

I have a friend like that. I don't like playing with him because of it.

Example:

We had one game where we had 20:7 we lost a 5v3 and for 5 mins he was going GG game over there catching up if we keep playing like this.

I was STFU this is only 1 mistake and then he wanted to afk, because he rather get into a new game and not waste his time in a losing game.

All i can do is ...

ChargeItDownMid5 votes

[deleted]

The Paulrus3 votes

{quoted}

People are starting to realize that it is okay to surrender matches and you will actually climb the ladder faster if you are good at picking matches to surrender. Every minute wasted on a lost match is a minute not spent on actually climbing the ladder so as long as you are good enough to win more games than you lose, it is worth your time to ff early in lost games.

What he said. It's true. If you win 60% of your games and you can get 10 games in a day if you surrender the losses early, and 8 if you don't, you're much better off forfeiting early in the lost games. It's not so much defeatism as math and statistics.

That being said, I'm one of those people who's more than willing to surrender because of a few key reasons. Usually by 20 minutes, if there's a deficit, there's already people being toxic and I'm out for that. Also, usually half of the reason we're at a deficit is because of poor communication within the team. That's not going to change on a dime. Finally, the people who are doing badly and feeding are the least receptive to any kind of advice, constructive or otherwise. They're too busy blaming everyone else (the jungler, the support, the enemy jungler, their ping, their opponent's "broken" champion, etc.) to look at themselves as the cause of their problems. Also, sometimes you just get countered completely depending on your teamcomp and the game is over at champ select. This is especially true in ARAM.

Just some food for thought.

BluePolarizer1 votes

a 60% win rate is the win rate of a mid-high gold climbing in low-mid silver. I was having a 60% overall win rate (70%-80% on my mains but you don't always get your mains) in that elo. Unless you think you are 1+ tier above your elo, you aren't gonna get that as an overall win rate.

UberAffe5 votes

Personally I think of it as admitting defeat instead of surrendering. The importance of that difference is this: Surrendering means that there may be chance to come back but the rest of my team all hates each others guts. Admitting defeat means that my team and I are simply not as skilled or coordinated as the enemy.

I will admit defeat when it happens and hit yes but I will not surrender to an enemy that hasn't proven themselves better.

AetherKingdom4 votes

not every game is winnable.

YouKnowMe882 votes

You're right. I agree

Penta Penguin4 votes

BUT ONLY WINNING IS FUN, I SHOULD WIN EVERY GAME, COMPETITION IS NOT FUN, I JUST WANT THE DOPAMINE FROM SEEING MY POINTS GO UP AND GETTING THE GOLD RANK SKIN!

AetherKingdom1 votes

I don't know if winning is the only fun thing, but a 5-50 game where they have 9 towers 4 drags and baron while you have nothing is not fun.

DanofDemacia3 votes

If I don't feel like playing and fighting for the win I have the right to surrender dude. If I don't think my team has what it takes to turn this around then I'm done simple as that.

YouKnowMe883 votes

Are you one of those who'll spam surrender and be toxic doing so also?

DanofDemacia3 votes

{quoted}

Are you one of those who'll spam surrender and be toxic doing so also?

I'm not gonna lie yes I am x) the toxicness I'm trying to work on but the surrendering not so much. I'm not gonna waste my time on an incompetent team.

YouKnowMe882 votes

Well I'm glad you're working on the toxic part, but tbh you're not helping those teams any man and i'm sure you're probably part of the reason why you lose.. Idk though, I hope the best in your future matches. Thanks for being honest! :)

Penta Penguin1 votes

Perma-ban this clown

BluePolarizer1 votes

and that's why you are low silver. there's a small percentage of games that should be surrendered, but from what I see, silvers spam surrender whenever they aren't personally carrying even when its very winnable.

ChargeItDownMid1 votes

[deleted]

BluePolarizer1 votes

silvers surrender winnable games. Only surrender games that are unwinnable. The amount of unwinnable games is small.

DanofDemacia1 votes

{quoted}

and that's why you are low silver. there's a small percentage of games that should be surrendered, but from what I see, silvers spam surrender whenever they aren't personally carrying even when its very winnable.

or because ive only played 30 ranked games and havent played ranked in like 2.5 months and ive only gone up son.

Ehkrickor3 votes

I totally think that people need to stick it out more but there is a limit. When rumble is up two kills on darius and the other lanes are kinda frozen no need to try and surrender.... But when you up against a team where Katarina and MasterYi both have 9+ kills at 20 when the surrender option pops up yeah...

BluePolarizer1 votes

I've lost games as 17-2 Yi because Yi gets blown up easily late game even if he builds bruiser, and I'm a gold 1 Yi main. If Yi builds glass he falls off even harder.

The Yetii Rider3 votes

"That's part of the fun, isn't it?"

No. No it is not. That's why people surrender, because this is a game and losing is not fun. Having your loss dragged out because the enemy can't finish you off but knowing that you're basically losing every team fight and they're split pushing with no answer for another 10 minutes is not fun.

Penta Penguin1 votes

You really shouldn't be playing multiplayer games, how about Cookie Clicker where you have no baddie team-mates to stop you from getting your points?

COWmanLord3 votes

If anything causes a team to lose it will be a baron throw. I once had a game where my team was very behind and our jungler had already sent up 2 surrender votes, but the enemy team was determined to get baron. Right at the 23 minute mark I decided to ward it. Not because I expected it, but more of a "you never know" situation . From that ward we saw the enemy team going for the early baron. We go in with the people who were there and lose the fight (we got aced, but they only had 1 alive so they could not take baron). We came out behind, but at least we stopped them from getting baron. This is where hey made their mistake. The enemy team IMMEDIATELY rushed for baron right after spawning. This time we were more in position and won the fight getting 4 kills and losing 3. Still couldn't take baron, but we won the fight. Things calm down for a few mins until the enemy team makes their 3rd baron attempt in 10 mins. This time we get a great fight and ace their team without losing anyone. We got baron and began to push. We graab a few inhibs and that gives us the power to end the game shortly after. In the end game chat we could see that the enemy team had descended into a brutal flame war between a couple different teammates and that heavily affected them.

I take 2 things from this story.

  1. Teamwork is the true way to win.

  2. NEVER UNDERESTIMATE THE POWER OF THE BARON THROW

AndyChrono1 votes

{quoted}

If anything causes a team to lose it will be a baron throw. I once had a game where my team was very behind and our jungler had already sent up 2 surrender votes, but the enemy team was determined to get baron. Right at the 23 minute mark I decided to ward it. Not because I expected it, but more of a "you never know" situation . From that ward we saw the enemy team going for the early baron. We go in with the people who were there and lose the fight (we got aced, but they only had 1 alive so they could not take baron). We came out behind, but at least we stopped them from getting baron. This is where hey made their mistake. The enemy team IMMEDIATELY rushed for baron right after spawning. This time we were more in position and won the fight getting 4 kills and losing 3. Still couldn't take baron, but we won the fight. Things calm down for a few mins until the enemy team makes their 3rd baron attempt in 10 mins. This time we get a great fight and ace their team without losing anyone. We got baron and began to push. We graab a few inhibs and that gives us the power to end the game shortly after. In the end game chat we could see that the enemy team had descended into a brutal flame war between a couple different teammates and that heavily affected them.

I take 2 things from this story.

  1. Teamwork is the true way to win.

  2. NEVER UNDERESTIMATE THE POWER OF THE BARON THROW

The enemy team attempting Baron is definitely one of the best chances to get back into the game. Think of Baron as your 6th team member who is constantly attacking them and also applying the debuff to reduce their MR/Armor. This can essentially equalize (perhaps even reverse) any lead the enemy team has and let you guys fight more evenly.

I had this game in my Ranked 5's last week.

http://matchhistory.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/NA1/1796249869/48870114?tab=overview

We were getting destroyed in the laning phase. Although we managed to get 1st Blood, from about ~6:30 to ~28:30 the enemy team racked up 11 consecutive kills on us. Every lane was losing in CS and Kills, and we were down on towers and dragons as well to the tune of a ~5k gold deficit at which point we debated whether or not to surrender.

The only thing we had going for us, was the fact that we had excellent wave clear with Malzahar and Sivir and that the enemy team had really crappy siege potential. This allowed us to constantly clear the waves with minimal damage to our towers to prolong the game. Eventually, the enemy team felt that they had enough of a lead that they could just dive us under the 2nd tier mid turret.... to which we quickly reminded them of the fact that you don't dive Malzahar. 3 kills and a tower later, we were back into the game. Unfortunately we made some bad rotations and Hecarim caught us out and we promptly gave back what we had gained.

At this point though, the enemy team was getting impatient and decided to use the power of Baron Nashor to enlist some empowered minions to help siege down our base. Suffice to say, with Baron hurting their HP bars and reducing their Armor/MR, we crushed them at Baron with a perfect Ace. We then easily took Baron ourselves and quickly pushed in 2 lanes and took 2 inhibs. As we sieged up the last standing inhibitor, with 2 lanes of super-minions coming in, the enemy team was forced to make a desperation engage which failed and we took the game.

Lost R2 votes

I posted a thread about this last week, about defeatism in the League. People are too eager to give up or unwilling to fight back in the face of real adversity. Whenever my lane opponent becomes an issue, I call for assistance and warn that they're going to become a problem. Doesn't always work; I've found more often than not the rest of the team won't heed your warning, especially if you're top, but that's a whole other problem.

And don't worry about scoring kills as a support. I regularly stack up kills that rival my allies as support, on top of the staggering number of assists. As long as the ADC is getting the assist, he's still getting gold.

iamthegoatofwar1 votes

warning about your laner becoming a problem in top lane does nothing in yolo que. I like playing top lane for that reason but it's a double edged sword if i remember the term correctly.

Extreme Troller2 votes

i always want to surrender at the first kill. Game is not fun after the first kill imo

Sincerly,

http://www.auplod.com/u/plouda52fae.jpeg

JimmyNtheKudos2 votes

I just had a game where we surrendered at 23 mins, while we still had all our inner turrets. We were down kills and dragons, but we had three late game scaling champions. We just needed to defend and farm and make it to late game. XD

Vegas Dad1 votes

{quoted}

I just had a game where we surrendered at 23 mins, while we still had all our inner turrets. We were down kills and dragons, but we had three late game scaling champions. We just needed to defend and farm and make it to late game. XD

Once you understand the game better you will realize "sitting in your base farming up" is code talk for falling further and further behind every second as the enemy team gather the cumulative gold of the entire map. So while you might scale better your not scaling at a higher rate than the enemy is out scaling your income.

The exception to the rule is if you are at the point where both teams are nearing or already at full builds , so if the enemy are is corki at full build he is t getting any stronger and your add will be closing the gap as well as possibly outscaling as well.

FourVsFive1 votes

I think IP is the solution. As after the 20min mark you do not get much IP per min. So make it so you get bonus IP for lasting long as the losing team.

Simply make it every min past the 20min mark you gain +1ip per min. So if game lasts 40min and you lose, you gain +20 bonus IP.

AndyChrono1 votes

Stuff like this is why if possible, I try to do my promo series with my friend instead of solo. That way we can veto every single surrender vote in case the early game goes bad. Nothing sucks more than getting "surrender at 20" while in promos. Damnit I don't care how hopeless it seems at 15 mins, I'm sticking to it until the end!

ChaosThief1 votes

Many players fail to forget that humans are not perfect; they will make an error at some point. This error in judgement could happen at a vital time and turn the game around should they not be wary and careful.

HUMAN PLAYERS MAKE MISTAKES. THEY WILL SLIP UP AT SOME POINT AND IT WILL COST THEM. ALL YOU HAVE TO DO IS BE PATIENT AND TRY TO CATCH UP MEANWHILE.

Vegas Dad1 votes

God how i loathe desperate types like the OP.

I play thousands of ranked games each season, I have a VERY good idea when a game is not going to turn around.

That said let me profile the typical baddie who doesnt beleive in surrender. They never ever carry games, so every game they drag out hoping somoene will carry them to the finish line. The op is like i got a few kills as support we are good.....just demonstrates the lack of understanding of this game. Honestly i dont care if support gets some kills, but the absolute fact is that every kill your support gets makes is harder and harder to win the game period it is not even debatable it is the nature of league.

It is simply more of not wanting to waste more time on what is 97% a lost cause. Sure we all know it is possbile we might turn it around and win but honestly I don't want to bother betting on a long shot with my time, sometimes i honestly just feel some of my teammates don't even deserve to win and by turning the game around to allow them a win i am just contributing to the problem with the current ranking system.

IT isnt about a challenge or it being hard, it is about understanding that your team is clearly inferior players to the enemy team and all you are hoping for is some monumental string of mistakes to gift you a win, that rarely to never happens. Game is entertainment and it is my time as well as my teammates, my time is valuable i might not want to try to win the lottery dragging out a game that has a sub 1% chance of a comeback, THAT IS WHY WE HAVE THE OPTION TO VOTE. If you disagree vote no, if you agree vote yes majority rules seems fair.

BluePolarizer1 votes

there are only 2 types of unwinnable games in my opinion:

enemy has absolute vision control over your jungle pre-20 minutes, you can't reestablish it and all non-inhib turrets are down. your team is arguing.

LittleBlast1 votes

I remember one game when i was playing teemo, was like 5/17 or something, and our equally bad thresh defended 2v5 till vayne respawned and got a penta and won.

Krigjer1 votes

When morale is down, it's hard to resist surrendering.

That said, I often surrender prematurely if someone (or everyone) on my team is arguing over petty things, blaming each other, not focusing on teamwork...

Even if I think we can win, I'd much rather vote yes and get out of this type of atmosphere as soon as I can.

Facade451 votes

I don't think it's a serious issue. In EUW and KR, I think it's more common. Also, sometimes a person may feel it's not fun when they're getting camped and starting to feed (poor dyrus). Perhaps, they just want to have fun and feel the match up is not fun at all. I think the community is shameful because of toxicity of chat. Not that.

But it seems your complaining about spamming surrenders, not the surrender itself. Just take the bar and move it so you don't see it. Done. Maybe Mute them.

Also, That death match mode is interesting but if someone has to quit for a good reason or wifi stops. then it's gg.

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