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Support Secondary new ranked lobby problem

Koharix··86 votes·12,372 views

I am a Jungle main and that is almost all I do, I rarely lane making my CSing skills less than average for my Rank. This leads to me opting to support as my secondary (even before the new lobby system). Before the new system I would get my call of jg over 66% of the time, support about 25% and rarely would I get stuck as any other roll (top, mid, adc).

I was ok with this, I am a good jungler and not a bad support. So since the new system I set my preferences as Jungle primary, Support Secondary. This leads me to being the support roll over 90% of the time. For example the past 8 consecutive games I have been playing as support. Now I figure the majority of players prefer carry rolls such as mid and top, causing few to choose support as either preference.

This is a problem for me. I am opting to start placing mid as my secondary just so that I can jungle despite my subpar mid play. I know this is a bit of a rage post but I truly feel their is a problem with this system when well over 50% of the time you do not get your primary.

97 Comments

Supreme Senpai6925 votes

This makes me mad because I'm support primary and mid secondary, and I NEVER get support. When I ask in the chat, the ones who do get support queue'd that to be their secondary.

Heckin Support9 votes

[{quoted}](name=Revan Senpai,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=dn2dxlJP,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2016-01-18T00:53:35.769+0000)

This makes me mad because I'm support primary and mid secondary, and I NEVER get support. When I ask in the chat, the ones who do get support queue'd that to be their secondary.

^This, even the support mains are struggling. I always have support as my main option and I only get it about 30% of the time.

Firesyde3 votes

I see this as well. Out of 7 games/selection screens under the new lobby system, with Support primary and ADC secondary, I've only received a support one time. I've lost four in a row as an ADC and it's frustrating as hell. I can play support at my ELO, but not ADC.

ChaoticPinecone1 votes

Go top or mid secondary. At the very least, you can play a supporty champion (Tahm/Malphite/Poppy//Naut/Lulu/Lux/Ori/Morg/Karma/Zyra) in a different role. Ive even seen Leona and Braum top work well.

Doesnt solve the problem, but at least its a bandaid fix.

lordofthegoombas2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Revan Senpai,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=dn2dxlJP,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2016-01-18T00:53:35.769+0000)

This makes me mad because I'm support primary and mid secondary, and I NEVER get support. When I ask in the chat, the ones who do get support queue'd that to be their secondary.

Same, I put support primary fill secondary, don't get a lot of support and it makes me sad. :P

R2D201 votes

you have to learn the "secret" role rules. Simply put fill if you are a support main.

Supreme Senpai691 votes

But I can't ADC or top that well. If I get put into those roles, I might cost my team the game.

R2D201 votes

If it's normals that's a great way to get some practice ;)

FantasySniper22 votes

I do the same.

I get jung like 40% of the time.

The system should try looking for your primary role first instead of both at the same time, because right now there's no difference between them.

Koharix15 votes

I agree. A minimum threshold of X percentage of games should be your primary roll (perhaps 30-60% should be guaranteed your primary). Of course this will cause longer queue times as there will be less people like us playing support 90% of the time. But I think that change would be worth it for fairness & balance.

iHerring1 votes

Maybe we can work out a swap. I keep queuing as sup/fill and getting jungle. I'm considering a change to sup/mid or sup/top since my impression is they are the 2 most called roles.

SSJTribe1 votes

That's strange, in my experience (only about 10 games mind you,) I got my main role 8 times, and my second role only twice.

iHerring1 votes

I've been queuing as sup/top for the last few games, 100% sup!

AbyssionKnight6 votes

That's funny, since as a mainly support player, I have the opposite problem.

I list myself as Support first, adc secondary, yet I keep getting into rooms where I'm expected to play adc instead of support.

Maybe in some weird lala land of logic, Riot's match making checks your primary. If primary is taken, they prioritize your secondary over other people who have that role as their primary in order to ensure you find a game. That would then force that person onto their secondary, and so on. It would reduce wait times, but it would essentially prioritize giving you your secondary position over your main, which is super weird logic.

Nicorus 5 votes

This is a pretty big problem in concept of the new scheme. Based off of wait times for Team Builder the most popular roles were Top and Mid tied for the role of most popular, then jungle then ADC and lastly Support. Because of Top and Mid being both solo lanes, and quite a bit of overlap in terms of game play and style these roles will often have the most players seeking these positions as primary or secondary. That said if you choose your role to be Top/mid you are more likely to get TOP more often. However if you choose a role such as Top/Support you are much more likely to get the role of support. So that being said, You are more likely to get the role of less popularity between your primary and secondary selections. You are more likely to get the role of Jungle if you select your secondary to be either Top or Mid.

chipndip15 votes

This is actually a complaint about the new queue that I agree on. I think it doesn't put enough priority on peoples' primary picks.

Occams Raiser4 votes

I saw this problem coming a mile away when they took team builder away.

Miku Lv993 votes

It's because most people don't put support as any of their roles. So anyone that puts either of theirs as support has a much higher chance of getting it than other roles. It's because it just had to find a support to complete a team yet again.

Koharix2 votes

I agree. No doubt the problem is that support is the least common roll. But those who do play it as a secondary shouldn't be punished in having to support the majority of all ranked games.

MrBuffington3 votes

The same thing was happening to me today (I'm a former fill/support 'main' who's trying to learn to jungle, so I listed jungle as my primary), and never jungled once today, which sucks on one hand, but on the other hand, I have a new found love for Bard

ValyrianBlade3 votes

I feel like this is how the system works:

It searches for both roles regardless of which is primary and which is secondary, and fills out a team that can fill each role. It then checks who had primary roles or secondary roles, and will give as many people their primary as possible while still filling every role.

Meaning if your secondary is the "bottleneck" that's needed to start a queue, you'll ALWAYS get your secondary, even though you'd prefer to wait for your primary.

I agree that this is problematic. There's just so much disadvantage with this new system. It only helps the following very limited classes of people:

  1. Those who literally only want to play 2 roles and don't care between them (or prefer the less popular of the two)
  2. Support-only players (as they'll always get support)

I think this system is a creative approach to trying to make League better, but it ultimately fails. As any approach would have, because we're just covering the symptoms and not solving the problem: Support is simply not fun to play for most players. Even when I have an excellent laning phase as a support, I find laning fun but often find the game miserable as it moves on since I become less and less useful. Most players want to have a visible impact on the game. Sure, your CC and utility helps your team, but it isn't super evident. You might carry as a support by setting up loads of free kills, but ultimately it's still your teammates doing the damage and killing the turrets/inhibitors/nexus.

Something needs to change. Find a way to increase gold income on supports. Find a way to give supports a better late game. Find a way to make support a more desirable role.

Support has been the least popular role since, forever? That should be a signal that something is wrong.

Kinjishi2 votes

"2) Support-only players (as they'll always get support)" Calling BS. As a support main, I only get my role about 33% of the time. Like OP, I'm getting my secondary role (Top or ADC) most of the time.

Widder881 votes

Solution: Make more jungle camps and/or shorter spawn times, so double jungle would be a better option. You could still play champions like Soraka and Janna as support who can't do something else, but a second jungler and roaming supports would be a good alternative.

A Miss Fortune2 votes

So far I've 100% of the time locked in with Bot as my Primary and Support as my Secondary. I've only supported twice so far. It may just be my luck though?

Voidbringers2 votes

Hmm... I'm really curious to know how the new matchmaking system works too. Personally, it's been working really well for me, but then again, I have only done normal draft. I did 18 games as primary mid and secondary support; I got mid 11/18 of those games. I also did 6 games as primary support and secondary mid. Surprisingly, I did actually get mid 1/6 of those games.

Totally random guess here but maybe the formula is something like this: win rate in role + consecutive times you've had to do X role (Riot wants us to play different roles?) + what roles are needed right now to speed up queues.

Oxbridge2 votes

You guys need to queue up with support mains...like me! Hehe.

Bhagswag2 votes

i just put Primary as fill so I don't get disappointed. :D

PiVoRx2 votes

This is what everyone's been afraid off when Riot forced people to play 2 roles. Majority of players play only one role and even champion and now in order to climb ladder you need to be good in at least two.

Thats just bullshit and ridiculous that Riot forces us to play like they want.

And I agree with OP. Im also jungle main and support when im forced to, and most of the time I get supp cause there are more junglers than supports queueing.

Maximum Morde2 votes

Before, you needed to be passable at almost all five, unless you dodged every time you didn't get what you wanted. Now you only have to be passable at two, unless you dodge when you don't get your primary. I fail to see how this situation got worse.

ShutUpAndDance1 votes

It is worse for people who want to not play support every once in a while when they list it as their secondary choice. I pick primary mid and secondary support every game and out of my last fourtyish games I got midlane only once.

Dominick Destine2 votes

The exact same thing happened to me.

I made almost the exact same thread.

And came to the exact same conclusion as you;

This is a problem for me. I am opting to start placing mid as my secondary just so that I can jungle despite my subpar mid play

I am a pretty good jungler and enjoy supporting... just not 9 games out of 10, my secondary should be about 3 , maybe 4 matches out of 10, not 9.

The system is broken as hell.

Sohleks2 votes

This is exactly why this contrived system should just go.

It creates this exact strange scenario-behavior, discouraging even willing players from wanting to pick support secondary, because they get tired of being auto relegated to fill the needs of the system so it can actually create games it desperately needs to satisfy the popular roles.

Support or fill off role players get automatically relegated repeatedly to what the system needs which'll usually always be the same... Compared to before it ends up worse for these players that we need. All because we have to cater to the most stubborn players in the old system.

We built a new system that fails to reward adaptable players because everyone is role selecting assuredly, while increasing queue times for everyone across the board, even those filling ironically. I can hardly understand that part.

The fairest and most effective way to deal with queue time and role disparity-skill problems is to make players sort it out themselves just like the old system.

Iron Rubric2 votes

What I would suggest, have a hidden number on everyone.

The more you get your primary role the more it drops and higher chance of you getting secondary.

Same other way around, more times you get secondary, the higher it goes giving you a better shot of getting primary choice.

Similar to mech warriors map voting, more times you loose vote, the higher your next vote is worth, stacking up to 8 times.

XxXSasquatchX0X1 votes

I feel like this is a great idea. Even if in the meantime while it finds the primary there is a slightly longer wait of a min or 2. I am usually not in a rush to get into a game but i would prefer getting what i choose instead of nearly no wait time. most of my games pop up with the ready thing in under 30 seconds.

KevinGregg2 votes

I too have experienced the pain many have expressed here. I'm o.k. supporting maybe 10% of the time to help the team if needed, but if I am going to be forced to play it every single game I am just going to put mid secondary, thus removing one of the few willing support players from the system.

Lord Barrelz1 votes

I'm In the same position. It's especially hard if you're trying to climb out of bronze.

FioraWillCarry2 votes

You guys haven't figured this out yet ? I main mid and I have been able to get it 90% of the time by locking in Top as my secondary role. I'm pretty sure you can get a non-mid role 100% of the time if you lock in mid as your secondary. Use a little common sense guys. We know from Teambuilder which roles were popular and which were not. It only took me like 3 games to figure out how to get my fave role nearly all the time.

K0zmonaut2 votes

sorry man support will never be a popular roll but trust me if you pick jungle as your primary and mid as your secondary you will be getting jungle

Stephenizgod2 votes

I pick Top primary and Support secondary, i always get Support... Like i lost it 3 times in a row to the same guy, thing is he picked Top and secondary... I am always Support, which is fine because i enjoy it but at my elo being a Support is hit or miss. You either have a respectful and decent Marksmen or you have a selfish arrogant ass Marksmen, seems about 20/80 which is why i stopped playing Support, now its all i get :(.

Anyways to address your problem, pick Jungle primary and Mid/Top secondary. You will probably get Jungle about 70-75% of the time, you should practice 1-2 champs in mid or top though just in case.

ArcticBeef2 votes

Out of the last 9 games I got my main once. It's so annoying that it makes me not even want to play ranked because I'm burnt out on supporting. Riot said it will be rare to not get your main, but it's the opposite. I was looking forward to this new system, but now I would rather have the old one back so I could play in the mid lane again.

BluePolarizer2 votes

Same shit. I'm jg/support main and I am now forced to play as jg/mid to even have a chance of getting jungle.

Clavis Nosco2 votes

It's maddening. Same boat: jungle main, support secondary. My wait time is usually milliseconds and I end up support 90% of the time. If someone dodges then my next queue I'm support 100% of the time it seems. I'm sick of support and as soon as I get AP rune page set up I'm doing mid secondary from now on. So instead of me being someone down to play support up to half of the time, I will be available to support 0% of the time. Less people willing to support now. Good job Riot. Why not just have the system not try to match the secondary until like a minute of match searching? Or use a counter like "user's last 5 games were secondary choice, give this user high priority for their primary" or something.

XxXSasquatchX0X2 votes

I agree with what you said at the end there about the counter. it should be able to tell what your last games were, i feel like that would help out. i would be down to wait another min or so to get primary as i am usually on my phone or youtube or something.

StinKode2 votes

Well i have a big problem it doesn't matter what i pick mid top even fill i never join ANY games wtf after 30 minutes in queue i give up

Darkospeed2 votes

Indeed support really has some issue : As a main MID LANER I always say mid main and support as secondary.

As the game goes on, I can understand that support is probably the role which people play the less. But this should not be a reason play to support all the time.

Into the 30+ ranked game i did so far i only get mid 3 times. Maybe i should say mid secondary I will get more chance...

Sexy Stud2 votes

I have a very similar percentage and it has basically converted me to a support main unwillingly. I like playing Braum and Janna, but I'm a jungle main. Out of my past 20 ranked games 2 have been jungle. Can someone fix this somehow? I dislike solo lanes but I have no choice but to play them if I want any reason to play my favorite role consistently in ranked.

Sneaky Bombchu1 votes

I put mid as my primary, support as my secondary and I always get support. It's like 1/10 games I'm mid. Even when I change it to jungle secondary, I just get jungle. I might just try putting support as primary and mid secondary, see how that works.

ShutUpAndDance2 votes

Same problem here. It is as if the game does not even TRY there for a second to get me my primary.

Krunkcleanup1 votes

I'm a Jungle main and support secondary as well. I have the exact same problem. I like support, but getting it 90% of the time just sucks. It's such a problem that i don't really want to play summoners rift games anymore. Riot should at least list the players primary and secondary preferences on the champion select screen, and allow players to switch roles - just like the aram interface. If it adds more time to the champ select process, so be it. I don't think players would mind that. Also, Duo queues could just hit a button and switch roles instantly instead of chatting it, speeding up the process, since players are already doing that anyway.

CaffeineEspresso1 votes

i just have to say something about the new queue. I picked top/jg as my roles almost all the time. But somehow i keep getting support. Help Please

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