Boards›Gameplay

New mastery Expose Weakness should be swapped with Assassin

DragRiper··70 votes·3,526 views

As a low level play who loves playing support (just got out of bronze, Woo) I was thrilled that they added a new master to help a supportive player, but its location is in a place where full support builds (In the mastery tree) cant really reach, I personaly go 9 in the Cunning tree and 21 in the Resolve tree (there wasn't any reason to go down the Ferocity due to it being solely dps based , that was before Expose Weakness~). Expose Weakness being in the ferocity tree seams out of place and would be more fitting in the Cunning tree (it makes sense for a cunning person to expose a weakness...), and for Expose Weakness to fit into the cunning tree, assassin should be moved over to the ferocity tree. (I don't play too many assassins but I would expect they would go full dps and spec into, 21 in cunning and 9 in ferocity or the other way round), even though this would make the tier 2 masters in the ferocity tree seam plain (A 3% bones in a given situation or a 2/3% bonus with a trade--off).

Add a comment on your opinion if you think this should be changed too, ty for reading

35 Comments

Sire Hippington19 votes

Honestly, that would go totally against the point. Assasin was added to the low tier cunning tree so assasins, which are supposed to go cunning due stormraiders/thunderlords, have a masteries they actually like down there. Expose weaknesses was added to the ferocity tree so there are options for no-glasscannons. Especially for jungler and sup. The entier idea of adding new masteies to the trees is creating diversity, giving actually a reason to decide wethere you go 9/21/0 or 0/21/9 on your sup lulu for example, or even go crazy with 21/9/0 and AA-harras the shit out of them with fervor.

One could certainly argue that the execution of that idea still is rather terrible, but the idea of haveing actually meaningfull choices instead of a cookie-cutter solution is great, and haveing exposed weaknesses and assasin located where they are is a step into the right direction.

SpecterVonBaren2 votes

Perhaps the problem is merely that we need more options for those styles in those trees. Currently there's no real supportive ability in the Ferocity tree aside from the new Expose Weakness which makes which makes it seem pointless there since it's the only thing that would help a supportive oriented person.

Pikmints4 votes

It does feel like more a matter of execution at this point. Because there's no tier 2 Keystone supports would want in the Ferocity tree, it feels like supports options are limited to taking 6 points in that tree and 6 in another, or taking the more conventional route of going 18-12. Here's to hoping Riot adds more options to those lower tier Keystones in the future.

DeathBurst1 votes

Totally agree.

Spaceman5pff2 votes

So why is Windspeakers in the tree that Assassins want. Why do Assassins get Bandit.

Im sorry but your argument doesn't really hold up.

Ralanr5 votes

Because cunning is not only for assassins, but also has good options for supports.

Having exposed weakness in ferocity gives a choice for supports. Do they want to have their carry deal more damage and thus be more squishy, or do they want some more defense?

You shouldn't get everything you want in ONE tree. Sacrifices need to be made. Unless you want league of Thunderlords again.

destroyer BOT 162 votes

[{quoted}](name=Don Pavoni,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=cV1YXEEu,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2016-03-03T11:45:41.693+0000)

Honestly, that would go totally against the point. Assasin was added to the low tier cunning tree so assasins, which are supposed to go cunning due stormraiders/thunderlords, have a masteries they actually like down there. Expose weaknesses was added to the ferocity tree so there are options for no-glasscannons. Especially for jungler and sup. The entier idea of adding new masteies to the trees is creating diversity, giving actually a reason to decide wethere you go 9/21/0 or 0/21/9 on your sup lulu for example, or even go crazy with 21/9/0 and AA-harras the shit out of them with fervor.

One could certainly argue that the execution of that idea still is rather terrible, but the idea of haveing actually meaningfull choices instead of a cookie-cutter solution is great, and haveing exposed weaknesses and assasin located where they are is a step into the right direction.

upvoted for my boi Zed

EcchiOtakuTM2 votes

Assassins go into the ferocity tree anyways....This change would help supports and supportive midlaners who want to go resolve.

DeathBurst3 votes

You are partly right, but at the same time, supports are kinda forced to go at least 12 in Cunning for Bandit.

So as a support if you want Expose weakness, you can have to let go completely Resolve, or make a 6-18-6 page, which is not optimal in either case. Even for AP supports like sona/nami, i'm not sure i would go into Ferocity above Resolve...

Zarkkast8 votes

I play mostly support and jungle and I disagree.

I like my cookies as well as exposing enemies.

Jungle Lux God7 votes

The entire idea of these masteries was to give heroes that don't have legitimate options in that tier of keystones an option that they'd really want. Take out the new masteries from these trees for a second.

In Ferocity, you have Double-Edged sword, which makes you deal more damage, and Feast, which improves your sustain if you last hit. In Cunning, you have Runic Affinity, which increases neutral buff duration, and Secret Stash, which improves sustain by giving your champion biscuits.

Ferocity has no options for champions that don't want to deal extra damage and either don't want or can't use the sustain that Feast provides. For aggressive supports that want to run any of the Ferocity masteries, they have no good options for their tier 1 keystones. Likewise, Cunning has no options for solo laners that don't want the sustain that biscuits provide, so assassins don't have any good aggressive options in the tree.

Switch the masteries around, and suddenly there's a lot of overlap. Supports don't have the option of going into the Ferocity tree for a more aggressive playstyle while assassins get no options from the Cunning tree that they all love to spec into.

DragRiper5 votes

kek forgot, its 18 and 12 now :P

Doctor Jarvis4 votes

Regardless, its not the right call to go 0/12/18 on every support. Some champs WANT 18 in cunning, and then you have a choice you didn't have before; put the other 12 into Ferocity for Expose Weakness and Oppressor, or 12 in Resolve for Explorer and Insight. Without Expose in that tree theres no reason for X/18/X champs to go into ferocity.

RocketRelm1 votes

There's other people in the thread that haven't even noticed and have ALSO cited "21/9" so it's Oranges I think.

Deadly Mittens5 votes

As an offensive poke support, the offense tree always felt weird to take, as feast isn't great on support, and double-edged is dubious outside assassins. Now, I can enjoy many tools in the tree without feeling like I have a wasted tier.

Doctor Jarvis2 votes

How do you put 21 in one particular tree? Im actually a little impressed. But more to the point, no, I don't think they should be swapped because champs who would want double edged sword also want assassin, and if they were in the same tier there's almost no reason to take double edged over it.

Irelia Bot3 votes

[{quoted}](name=Doctor Jarvis,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=cV1YXEEu,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2016-03-03T07:57:58.747+0000)

How do you put 21 in one particular tree? Im actually a little impressed.

you do some stuff and bam you can use Flash and smite endlessly every half a second.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiRGVXVa14k

Got to love throwback Thursdays.

The Yetii Rider2 votes

The point is so that supports will actually have to make decisions instead of mindlessly going 0/18/12 or 0/12/18 for Bond of Stone.

Supports having no reason to go Ferocity (even burst supports like Zyra and Sona) makes the support role as a whole tankier, and that can lead to some balance issues where masteries that tanks NEED get nerfed because supports are using them.

Enticing supports to take Ferocity (thus making them squishier by removing Resolve) is a much better way to balance.

Kynami1 votes

I'll take 8% improved heals, shields, and regen or +45 flat health along with +50% always on base regen with 200% regen at 25% threshold thanks. It helps you SURVIVE those jerks packing ignites or early cheese down there. Also just general efficiency because you aren't stuck popping as many biscuits or heals to bring your HP back up to a reasonable threshold.

You can't do damage or peel when dead or so low that you may as well be dead if you walk within ~900 range of an enemy. With how stupid burst is this season there is a freaking reason everyone and their cousin in support is taking at least 12 in resolve generally.

And if you don't take those wonderful sustain/recovery options you are bound to be shoved out of lane by those who do, because they can trade and recover while you just... do not short of backing. At which point you end up behind, doubly so if they killed you.

Ralanr2 votes

9 in cunning and 21 in resolve?

What? You can't do that. They max at 18.

Aziriously2 votes

It's intended for more offensive supports - ones that wouldn't often max out their points in the resolve tree. It's where it should be.

SociopathFriend2 votes

Wait- I thought Expose Weakness was meant for Tanks? Made sense in my mind- most tanks have an AoE ability of some sort so you turn that on and boom- your entire team starts dealing more damage around you. I suppose a Support that isn't a tank could use that but wouldn't they honestly be better off with mana regen?

TotalJerk2 votes

The whole purpose of it being there is to encourage supports to go down the ferocity tree. There's almost nothing going for that tree on a support, otherwise.

BottleCapster1 votes

Technically its designed to give supports some incentive to put their remaining 12 points into ferocity. Aggressive supports can make pretty good use of Oppressor, so Its not all that bad. Truth be told, even though I do feel like Assassin's could use A ferocity trait that they'd actually care about, I think EW Is actually a good step in the right direction for diversifying the support mastery game.

TotalJerk1 votes

I feel like there a few assassins that can get more use out of Deathfire Touch in matchups where they can't risk constantly going for the the Thunderlord procs. Maybe Zed could take it against Annie?

ModWulf Helhammer1 votes

It's not for the average support, as that would be kinda broken to give increased damage on such an easy thing to get for someone made to harass for their team. It's made for tanks and other more damaging types of supports that are already specing into ferocity

willuwontu1 votes

them 21 points though, but seriously 6 6 18 that's the may to roll.

macromite1 votes

Terrible idea, assassin should stayin the cunning tree, and the reason why is so that if a support gets it they can't still just go 0/18/12. Don't make the tree's binary, make it so that everyone can get a little bit out of all the trees.

Chuck Charles1 votes

9 or 21.. guys. its 12/18 now. just an fyi.

Magnum Mack1 votes

Been rocking Leona lately and I actually like this in the ferocity tree. I'm super aggressive for a support and I am considering setting Morgana up as 9/21 now. Currently I just get Expose Weakness in ferocity in dump the rest into the other 2 trees so like 6-21-3 or something like that. I dunno. this might work for me as a super aggressive support, especially with some adc's that struggle early on. I know champs like ashe and early game vayne or kog might like this on a support rather than some of the other options I see available.

It Hertz When IP1 votes

Do it. Her W procs Thunderlords by itself.

Karma Deified1 votes

I came here thinking this is a good idea, then remembered that expose weakness is a cunning trait not a ferocious trait. This should have already been taken care of.

BottleCapster1 votes

Expose weakness is a Ferocity Trait. Assassin is a Cunning Trait.

Karma Deified1 votes

I meant logically.

Alorrin011 votes

Is there a visible rebuff when expose weakness procs on opposing champions? As a support main, I'd love to see the duration to know when it needs to be reapplied. Maybe I'm just not watching opposing adc bar closely enough.

More from Gameplay

3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay764 comments
7,167
votes
3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay156 comments
3,510
votes
UPVOTE FOR URF
Gameplay606 comments
2,440
votes
Yes plz.
Gameplay456 comments
1,721
votes
3 Refunds per season, up vote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay114 comments
1,716
votes
When is ANYONE at riot going to address the awful new player experience?
Gameplay634 comments
1,383
votes