I've played Veigar since day one. Literally since League of Legends has been around. I've put him through his paces... through normals before ranked... into ranked as a niche nuker champion.
He was never the very best, but he was fun to play and sometimes quite hilarious
and now he's shit.
Why nerf his DFG combo AND his E? You double nerfed him. DOUBLE NERFED. Great job Riot.
Voluug135 votesBecause his E had no ''counterplay'', only counterpick or counterbuild, but its OK to call 
Zed's ''counterplay''.
Basically, Riot bias.
DrCabes2 votesDon't forget 
Also if I'm not mistaken it had a small cast time. They could have easily just increased that to something around 0.33 - 0.5 to allow more counter-play for people smart enough to recognize the cast animation without having to broadcast where it's actually being cast. Still would be a nerf but it wouldn't have killed him like the actual nerf did.
SirPacifista1 votesIt was actually quite easy to counter him, just google "how to counter Veigar" Counterplay was never a problem against Veigar, i mean did anyone see him in LCS as a big mid champ?
Nilok3 votesI'm wondering how they though they could sell this as a "buff", unless they honestly didn't know, which could be worse.
I'm going to keep my eyes on the Ryze remake, if it too suffers from being underpowered like Tristana, Veigar, or Bard when it is released, I'm may start thinking something is wrong in the Balance Team itself.
DanofDemacia3 votesget over it
lB2kGRlc8y3 votesWait in line for your next champ to be ran over by a train, Ill be waiting to see how you cope
GanksLikeGaston2 votesWait in line for your next champ to be ran over by a train, Ill be waiting to see how you cope
Get over it. I mained Elise: gutted. Talon is my favorite champ: lost his main form of being able to deal with people he was supposed to counter. Zac: gutted and fell out of favor for 2 years. Eve: gutted and left to rot for 2 years before riot decided to change her, then regutted. Shit happens, nut up and move on.
DanofDemacia1 votesWait in line for your next champ to be ran over by a train, Ill be waiting to see how you cope
I mean they already completely changed ahris playstyle. Its not the same but for me I don't use her anymore. I got over it
SirPacifista2 votesShould that really come from a Silver 5 player, who is raging because its not about their favorite champion?
I would say, Leave. And get over it that people want the old Veigr back. (and that more than 50% of all player in league are far better than you, get over it ;D)
DanofDemacia1 votesShould that really come from a Silver 5 player, who is raging because its not about their favorite champion?
I would say, Leave. And get over it that people want the old Veigr back. (and that more than 50% of all player in league are far better than you, get over it ;D)
Lol what does my rank have to do with it. And if your that into my account I've only been playing for like 6 months and only played 30 ranked games so :P hop off son.
ZerglingOne3 votesMade Q a skill shot. Nerfed Increased Q's CD. Nerfed Made E almost impossible to land on a living opponent. Nerfed Lowered R AP ratio. Nerfed Because of E being almost impossible to land, W is now impossible to land. Nerfed by proxy Removed almost all flat mana regeneration from the game. Nerfed
He is stronger on ARAM than he was before though. OH BOY.
SirPacifista1 votesSad but true, (#sarkasm on) Riot gave him great compensations for the DFG (#sarkasm off)
Curling Veigar2 voteshopefuly he get buffd this patch
Saianna1 votesbuff.. as buff numbers? I don't think it would make him anti-mage as he used to be.. Just next generic OK'ish mage out there with pick rate somewhere between 000,1 and 0,002%.
DrCabes2 votesI would trade is enemy ap ratio for an increase to his own ap in a heartbeat. That extra ap is just overkill for ap champs while hurting his ability against everyone else. He gets beat by every other ap champ right now anyway, so I wouldn't call him an anti-mage, unless he can get his old E back, which he won't.
Saianna1 votesThat's like going backwards with his Anti-MAGE class, don't you think? Veigar should be dealing "extra damage" against those who build AP.
If you were to sacrifice his enemy AP to increase stats of other abilities, then you could also rename him for Generic mage #4075.
There are other ways to fix him. But imo his stun has to be reworked completely. Maybe instead of "cage" change it into just wall that moves forward (something like Azirs R). Or make it into "black hole" that:
That way he'll gain just as strong tool as pre-nerfed cage, but giving some ways to both be used as offensive, defensive & as support. Triple win
SirPacifista1 votesbuff.. as buff numbers? I don't think it would make him anti-mage as he used to be.. Just next generic OK'ish mage out there with pick rate somewhere between 000,1 and 0,002%.
No... they could nerf a number, if they reduce the delay from his E from 0.5 to 0 it would definitly show this dwarf whos the boss. So jeah eliminate this fuckers Delay to give him what he deserves!!!
Critmaster Garen2 voteshis q did get buffed though. the fact that he gains twice the amount of ap per cast is pretty big for him. not to mention, that it gained a lot of range. which means he can farm a lot safer in lane.
before his rework, he absolutely relied on stunning his opponent with his e, before he could go in and poke safely. now, the e is less reliable, but he has it easier to poke with q from a distance.
and his e kindof needed it, considering that it was as strong as an ultimate. (stunning multiple champions for up to 2.5 seconds IS as strong as a lot of ultimates in this game). now that they added enough counterplay to his abilites, they have made room for buffs, if necessary.
IceKingChernobog5 voteshis Q isn't the problem is his other abilities, His event horizon has a horrible delay before actually activating and you'll never land your W against anyone unlessed their stunned, but since his stun is useless so is his W. His ult feels like a glorified Q now.
Critmaster Garen2 voteshis Q isn't the problem is his other abilities, His event horizon has a horrible delay before actually activating and you'll never land your W against anyone unlessed their stunned, but since his stun is useless so is his W. His ult feels like a glorified Q now.
the delay on event horizon is fine considering its range and area. its not more than on brands w. and you can still land his e, and have a lot of impact in teamfights. its just a bit more difficult.
DrCabes5 votesI agree his E is still useful for team fights and objectives, but it's borderline completely useless in lane. You compare the area to Brands W, but Brand's W does aoe damage in the full area and he can still land other spells without hitting his W. Roughtly 1/3 - 1/2 of Veigar's burst is his W, which can't land without a stun. Trapping someone in Veigar's E almost never helps him land a W.
For all the talk about Veigar's E being an aoe stun people seem to forget it's just a thin ring.
SirPacifista3 votesIt WAS fine the last 4 years, now it was nerfed like hell. Did you realize its the only stun ingame which does ZERO damage and is the only ability on Veigar that makes him viable?
DrCabes6 votesThe problem though is that Veigar can only poke if the other laner walks in front of the creep wave. Whether you see his Q change as a buff or a nerf depends on what you valued more playing him, farming or poke/kill pressure.
Given that you can't land your E in lane anymore I see it as more of a nerf then a buff because Veigar has no harass in lane anymore (unless the other laner stands in front of the creep wave). If you could still land an E, W in lane I would see it as more of a neutral change.
Critmaster Garen1 votesThe problem though is that Veigar can only poke if the other laner walks in front of the creep wave. Whether you see his Q change as a buff or a nerf depends on what you valued more playing him, farming or poke/kill pressure.
Given that you can't land your E in lane anymore I see it as more of a nerf then a buff because Veigar has no harass in lane anymore (unless the other laner stands in front of the creep wave). If you could still land an E, W in lane I would see it as more of a neutral change.
oh come on. thats just a matter of positioning. every mage with skillshots has that problem. and its not blocked by the first creep, so your opponent needs 2 minions to hide behind.
DrCabes5 votesno other mid laner has their skillshots blocked by minions. Two minions yes, whether they're right next to each other or behind each other doesn't matter. It's very easy to sit behind them and poke veigar with your skill shot that isn't blocked.
It also makes zoning Veigar very easy since he only has one spell that can hurt you and it's very easy to avoid, while evryone else has 3, some maybe only 2 but that's still a lot more then Veigar has so he loses every trade unless the other laner has less range and walks in front of the creep line, but why would they do that anyway.
I do agree that the new Q is necessary for him now since he would get destroyed evey time walks up with the old one for this reason. Right now he has to sit back, farm, and poke when he's gifted the opportunity. The same can't be said for other mid laners.
Critmaster Garen1 votesno other mid laner has their skillshots blocked by minions. Two minions yes, whether they're right next to each other or behind each other doesn't matter. It's very easy to sit behind them and poke veigar with your skill shot that isn't blocked.
It also makes zoning Veigar very easy since he only has one spell that can hurt you and it's very easy to avoid, while evryone else has 3, some maybe only 2 but that's still a lot more then Veigar has so he loses every trade unless the other laner has less range and walks in front of the creep line, but why would they do that anyway.
I do agree that the new Q is necessary for him now since he would get destroyed evey time walks up with the old one for this reason. Right now he has to sit back, farm, and poke when he's gifted the opportunity. The same can't be said for other mid laners.
straight line skillshots that are not blocked by minions are exceptionally rare.
lux q works similar to how veigars q works. brands q gets blocked by a single minion. so does even nidalees spear.
veigars w works similar to the aoe abilities of most mages these days. it has decent range and a bit of delay to give the opponent a chance to react. its actually very similar to brands w. i think he is the closest you can compare the new veigar to. and compared to brand, veigar actually has the better kit:
q: a straight line skillshot, that deals damage and penetrates 2 minions versus one, that gets blocked by 1. w: delayed long ranged aoe abilites on both champions e: a delayed aoe stun vs an on target damage ability with very little damage r: a single target point and click nuke, vs a bouncing point and click projectile, with less individual damage but more damage if it hits more than 1 champion
veigars e is definitely more powerful than brands. and one could argue, that the single target nuke on his r can be more useful than brands relatively unreliable bouncing projectile. as it deals less damage overall, but has a higher chance to kill a particular champion. the other 2 abilities are similar. (not the same, but similar).
his e is the only stun in the game that doesnt deal damage, but its also the only aoe stun i can think of, that is a regular ability.
lB2kGRlc8y3 votesearly on you're better off taking solo kills with it, since syncing up minion heath pools while dealing with an assassin or practically any mid mage is bound to get you chunked over and over. Late game it can take out 2 casters minis at a time, but late game AP farming on veigar was stupid easy anyways, so it didn't really double his ap income. What it did do was make it so he didn't have to be in poke distance of every champion while trying to land his Qs, which I can honestly say was a buff, just not enough to offset his W's newfound unreliability and the fact that it can be body blocked in lane fights.
SirPacifista1 votesHis Q also gets blocked by 2 minions, which makes it quite bad to try to harass comeone who can position himself.
You also can not reliably use your W anymore, since everybody will run out of it.
Ohh did i mention you can NOT stun anybody anymore? And that they will either blink/flash out or kill you from within his E?
I truly believe that he was much much better before, even the LCS scene said that he is now really useless (especially Dabox, Challenger) He now nearly only depends on the mistakes of the enemy, not really on his skill to outplay someone (which doesnt exist anymore since his stun became garbage)
Silents4292 votesI bet the same people complaining about Veigar didn't say a word when Warwick got
Devourer Nerfed Dueling Enhancement nerfed (The smite) His ult damage reduced Ult cooldown increased W duration lowered
And no compensation or anything in return unlike Veigar.
Where the most people can do is complain because they have to actually try landing abilities now. I also question where you found enjoyment in a champion that literally could do 1 thing at all.
Saianna2 votesI was opposing WW nerfs! They were unneccessary as I knew jungle item would be nerfed anyway.
SirPacifista1 votesI believe you dont understand this whole post. Veigar never received compensation, only a horrifiying nerf (even his q is not reliable anymore).
And to WW, i think not every Veigar player plays WW. I mean did you write something about Tristana, Zilian or Sion? Dont tell us that WE have to defend champions we dont play.
So dont rage because we arent defending your champion, that is your job not our.
Silents4291 votesI seem to recall a few buffs his way, power shifts and overall changes to allow him to still function.
Yes. Veigar got nerfed. His instant large AOE stun with an ult that could 1 shot just about anything in the game was retarded to deal with, but unlike Warwick they have been trying to put his power in other places, they HAVE buffed abilities on Veigar.
And to WW, i think not every Veigar player plays WW. I mean did you write something about Tristana, Zilian or Sion? Dont tell us that WE have to defend champions we dont play.
Sion rework was amazing so no. Tristana rework was fine so no. Zillian rework was fine so also no.
And bringing Warwick into this stems from the fact that people are quiet when others get nerfed but act like when there main is touched it is the worst nerf in the entire game, and people can't comprehend how "Olaf'd" he got and how he was gutted and won't ever work in this meta and Riot is just tossing them aside when that hasn't even happened to Veigar.
It is about defending champions because only calling saying anything when your main is touched lost you much say in telling us about Veigar. I mean clearly you didn't mine the Warwick changes at the time, and well honestly, when Veigar got changed I was pissed playing against a good one a few times still, But I never encouraged the other changes just changing the instant stun, and I expressed that. Never even played him.
SirPacifista1 votesHis instant large AOE stun with an ult that could 1 shot just about anything in the game was retarded
His stun had to be placed, and would rarly stun more than 2 people
And his ult DID NOT 1 shot anyone 99% of the time. If it did then the enemy was miserable, if they build 5 times rabadons its their fault. And dont say it was impossible to counter Veigar, you only need to use google once.
And dont get me wrong, but i dont think that we should stop posting about changing Veigar, only because it didnt work with ww. And what if WW was nerfed? Write that in the right discussion not here. Is it hypocritical that we dont care about ww? I dont think so, there are more than 100 champion, we cant care for everyone.
Silents4291 votesHis stun had to be placed, and would rarly stun more than 2 people
First as if that means it wasn't a problem.
And his ult DID NOT 1 shot anyone 99% of the time. If it did then the enemy was miserable, if they build 5 times rabadons its their fault. And dont say it was impossible to counter Veigar, you only need to use google once.
Odd. Never mentioned anything about being impossible to counter, Go ahead and read posts made before he got changed, tons of Veigar mains talking about the 1 shotting ult from hell, (It did 1 shot) whether they had AP or not.
And dont get me wrong, but i dont think that we should stop posting about changing Veigar, only because it didnt work with ww.
It was never done with Warwick. And rightfully so, no one not even me wanted to know he existed for awhile, the problem is that the nerfs went way to far and no one wants to bring it up. But people will go on and on about how Veigar was SOOOOOO over nerfed.
And what if WW was nerfed? Write that in the right discussion not here. Is it hypocritical that we dont care about ww? I dont think so, there are more than 100 champion, we cant care for everyone.
No but the principle of the matter is people are under the impression that anything for Veigar that isn't a buff is them Olafing him, they pretend to understand game balance or anything fair when the reality is just mains being pissed that there mains got changed, and what they say should hold little water. And thankfully Riot knows that the minority is the loudest when it comes to the community.
Best Darius KR1 votesAnd no compensation or anything in return unlike Veigar.
Good point! It's a good thing that Warwick didn't get "compensated" aswell!
Silents4291 votesGood point! It's a good thing that Warwick didn't get "compensated" aswell!
Cute. You put compensate in quotations to imply he wasn't compensated despite him getting compensation.
At least they did attempt to shift his power and aren't doing tweaking him.
Trídent1 votesWhat do you mean. Veigar is op and is very good and needs to be nerfed.
as a caster minion
Best Darius KR1 votesand now he's shit.
Straight to the point eh?
Curling Veigar1 votesI feel as if his ult isn't very 'primordial'- that being said I want this skill to change the most
