So. There is no counterplay for melees at all. He's broken now. Try to play Irelia, against Garen. Try to play as Jax, against garen, Urgot, Ornn, Maokai, Fiora. Nothing works ;') That buff was Soooo freakin' usefull, we all needed that, right? Its like, he wasnt good already, lmao. Riot balance team, stop taking drugs.
Jar Jar binks l11 votesWrong u silvers and bronze players. GAREN is a Jaggernaut and he is not supposed to lose in 1v1.
Irelia beats Garen early and Jax beats him later on. Try to learn the game. And he has no counterplay? He just runs at u , there's 50000 things u can do
vyoda2 votes[{quoted}](name=DEMACIAA BABY,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZqmJmRuR,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-10-11T15:50:42.218+0000)
Wrong u silvers and bronze players. GAREN is a Jaggernaut and he is not supposed to lose in 1v1.
Irelia beats Garen early and Jax beats him later on. Try to learn the game. And he has no counterplay? He just runs at u , there's 50000 things u can do
Yep, totally. A melee champ with free Conqueror stacks running towards me, another melee champ. Soooo many things I can do
PB4UAME3 votesHe has no range, has a 1.5 second melee, highly telegraphed silence that first CC's himself for .5 seconds off a delay before actually going off, to the point where you can still CC him, dash, blink, flash, etc away while he's hitting you AFTER he already got in range and started the Q. If that isn't enough for you to do something against him, I don't know what to actually tell you. Every single champion in the fucking game has a CC or a mobility tool they can use there. Every. Single. One. Even Illaoi (who actually counters him pretty hard in lane, and statistically is still retaining a 2.2% winrate advantage in the match up this patch) who is the perhaps the one and only exception can still W away to an enemy target or land her E during Garen's self CC.
Zero Shingetsu1 votesHe has no range, has a 1.5 second melee, highly telegraphed silence that first CC's himself for .5 seconds off a delay before actually going off, to the point where you can still CC him, dash, blink, flash, etc away while he's hitting you AFTER he already got in range and started the Q. If that isn't enough for you to do something against him, I don't know what to actually tell you. Every single champion in the fucking game has a CC or a mobility tool they can use there. Every. Single. One. Even Illaoi (who actually counters him pretty hard in lane, and statistically is still retaining a 2.2% winrate advantage in the match up this patch) who is the perhaps the one and only exception can still W away to an enemy target or land her E during Garen's self CC.
You read it wrong. He doesn't CC himself, he clears slows off himself when he starts his Q. And gains bonus movement speed. Unless the rework changed this and the video I just watch covering it didn't tell me so.
Mihalikb4 votesHe refers to the fact that Q has a long hit animation that cannot be canceled. He does a little leap animation thing.
The only way to skip the animation is if you are spinning and while you are spinning you hit Q. This gives you the movement speed buff and lands the Q instantly after the Spin ends.
But for this to work he has to already be in melee range (so he literally just walked up to you).
Zero Shingetsu1 votesHe refers to the fact that Q has a long hit animation that cannot be canceled. He does a little leap animation thing.
The only way to skip the animation is if you are spinning and while you are spinning you hit Q. This gives you the movement speed buff and lands the Q instantly after the Spin ends.
But for this to work he has to already be in melee range (so he literally just walked up to you).
I'm 4-dan in kendō and have five years of active competitive experience in the sport. These are the reflexes I have.
I cannot reliably react fast enough to this animation to dash away from him before it lands. Even if I did, it still lands. He's sped up because of his Black Cleaver, I'm slowed because of his Iceborn Gauntlet, and I have 1.5 seconds of vulnerability to his E. It will still do something.
Mihalikb3 votesFor the 700th time. Garen does not build Iceborn Gauntlet. Ever. For any reason. Against anyone. Ever.
Also... Wtf see you doing 1v1ing Garen at minute 15 to 16...which is about the point where someone completes its 2nd item.
You should be doing this thing called... Team fighting as the landing phase is over.
Zero Shingetsu1 votesFor the 700th time. Garen does not build Iceborn Gauntlet. Ever. For any reason. Against anyone. Ever.
Also... Wtf see you doing 1v1ing Garen at minute 15 to 16...which is about the point where someone completes its 2nd item.
You should be doing this thing called... Team fighting as the landing phase is over.
Situation: I've got a grand total of maybe eight Garen games my entire life (that's probably underguessing, but it's less than 20 for sure). My latest Garen game was over a year ago. 3616 mastery points after this game earned me around 900 (or was it 90?). I took Garen bot to support a Bronze I Yasuo against a Gold IV Ashe and a Bronze III Anivia. Note that I'm unranked, sitting at level 104, so my skill is limited.
Build:
KLEPTOMANCY, Magical Footwear, Future's Market, Approach Velocity, Celerity, Waterwalking
Result: 2/9/7, 44 CS, VICTORY in 30:09
Enemy Garen (Platinum IV, Level 229):
CONQUEROR, Triumph, Legend: Alacrity, Coup de Grace, Cheap Shot, Ravenous Hunter
5/10/7, 163 CS, DEFEAT in 30:09
Will try again with only one Gauntlet and report results.
Mihalikb1 votesThe things you built are terrible for support Garen. As are the Summoner spells you took.
If you want to play support Garen, and you want to slow you take Glacial Augment, Buscuit delivery, Boots, Time warp potion if you are playing against a ranged support or Approach Velocity if you are playing against an engage support like Leona. Secondaries you take Second Wind and Demolish to soak damage and help breaking tower.
Items you take Relic Shield build it into Remnant of the Aspect.
If your ADC is AD you build Black Cleaver, your armor shred helps him do more damage. If your ADC is AP and the enemy ADC is AD you build Deadman's Plate, if their ADC is AP you might have to build Spirit Visage.
Summoner spells you take Flash+Heal if you want to play defensive, Ghost+Barrier if you want to play offensive.
3rd item you build whatever you want from the recommended tank items. Typically the ones with HP on them. Or you build BC if your you completed your support item and your 2nd item and you have no BC yet.
Again, Garen is a fucking horrible support. Play it top or mid, even jungle. But don't play it as support, and don't build Gauntlet.
Zero Shingetsu1 votesFor the 700th time. Garen does not build Iceborn Gauntlet. Ever. For any reason. Against anyone. Ever.
Also... Wtf see you doing 1v1ing Garen at minute 15 to 16...which is about the point where someone completes its 2nd item.
You should be doing this thing called... Team fighting as the landing phase is over.
Situation: Garen mid against a Gold IV M7 Yasuo with 313,790 mastery points. Started boots, no potions, rushed Iceborn Gauntlet, didn't take a single AD-boosting item. Enemy Yasuo rushed Shiv.
Build:
GRASP OF THE UNDYING, Shield Bash, Second Wind, Revitalize, Celerity, Gathering Storm
Result: 6/3/16, 113 CS, VICTORY in 34:22 (enemy surrendered)
Lane Opponent (Gold IV, Level 234):
CONQUEROR, Triumph, Legend: Alacrity, Coup de Grace, Taste of Blood, Ravenous Hunter
5/16/6, 213 CS, DEFEAT in 34:22 (surrendered)
Mihalikb5 votesWhat do you mean "free Conqueror stacks"? Is Garen magically able to stack Conqueror off minions or am I missing something?
Garen's spin is the same damn thing as Darius bleed ticks, Yorick stacking from Zombies, Pantheon W, Mordekaiser passive ticks, Kled's free autos, Illaoi tentacle slaps, Urgot's machine gun+shotgun legs.
The Champs that stack Conqueror slower than Garen are Renekton, Fiora (who still beats him in lane) and Jax before level 6 or 7 (after which Jax stacks faster), Irelia and Riven.
Also things you could do, considering he has no slow or CC.
Use your slows or CCs if you have any, move away from him. Walk towards your tower. Get behind your minions and away from his, so he eats minion agro and minion body blocks. If you have dashes or leaps use them the opposite direction he is coming from.
Garen is G, you are Y.
Here is an illustration.
G------->Y------->
Zero Shingetsu1 votesWhat do you mean "free Conqueror stacks"? Is Garen magically able to stack Conqueror off minions or am I missing something?
Garen's spin is the same damn thing as Darius bleed ticks, Yorick stacking from Zombies, Pantheon W, Mordekaiser passive ticks, Kled's free autos, Illaoi tentacle slaps, Urgot's machine gun+shotgun legs.
The Champs that stack Conqueror slower than Garen are Renekton, Fiora (who still beats him in lane) and Jax before level 6 or 7 (after which Jax stacks faster), Irelia and Riven.
Also things you could do, considering he has no slow or CC.
Use your slows or CCs if you have any, move away from him. Walk towards your tower. Get behind your minions and away from his, so he eats minion agro and minion body blocks. If you have dashes or leaps use them the opposite direction he is coming from.
Garen is G, you are Y.
Here is an illustration.
G------->Y------->
He has a slow. It's called Phage. It triggers with his E now, I've heard. So that's dandy.
Mihalikb5 votesAre you just naming random items that either don't work on Garen or don't do what you think they do?
Phage gives a movement speed buff of doing any form of damage to anything. Gives you more movement speed if you land a killing blow on something.
Phage is built by almost every AD top laner as it builds into Trinity or BC.
Dude, just stop. Go watch a 10 minute how to play Garen video before you continue with your nonsense.
Zero Shingetsu1 votesAre you just naming random items that either don't work on Garen or don't do what you think they do?
Phage gives a movement speed buff of doing any form of damage to anything. Gives you more movement speed if you land a killing blow on something.
Phage is built by almost every AD top laner as it builds into Trinity or BC.
Dude, just stop. Go watch a 10 minute how to play Garen video before you continue with your nonsense.
Once again, I'd love to know how this doesn't work for Garen. Assuming he doesn't get the +60 from spinning a minion to death (I haven't sat around to measure it), basic attacking a minion from level 8 or so is sufficient to give him the boost. This plus his Q is enough to clear distance quite rapidly for a silence-to-E combo.
Later, when it becomes Black Cleaver, he's getting +20 movement speed every time his E procs, as well as shaving off armor with every spin. Q -> E -> R becomes a death sentence for anyone who hasn't piled on loads of health in the late game.
I implore you, instead, to "just stop". You're so desperate to make a stranger look foolish that you're ignoring the actual effects of the items in question and you're not applying strategic thought to how they might make Garen dangerous. You're just giving them half-seconds of thought and then telling me they don't work because they're not on Mobafire or wherever all the build guides are these days.
Mihalikb2 votesDude. You are describing standard Garen game play that has been standard Garen game play for...ever?
You understand that EVERY AD top laner uses Phage either as Trinity or as BC?
Mate again. You. Are. Talking. Out. Of. Your. Ass.
You clearly don't seem to understand how most items in this game work, you don't understand what champ does what, what counts as a slow or movement speed buff, what are gap closers etc.
And that's fine. If that's how you want to play the game and it's fun for you, go forth.
But if you feel like having opinions on what is and isn't balanced, understanding the very mechanics of the game is sort of a must.
Also, have you considered that as everyone disagrees with you, you might actually be the one who is wrong?
LightswornLance3 votesDon't reply to him this is the guy that runs cleanse on every champion instead of flash and plays qiyana support ignore him and move on.
Zero Shingetsu1 votesDon't reply to him this is the guy that runs cleanse on every champion instead of flash and plays qiyana support ignore him and move on.
You forgot the part where I have tremendous success, averaging a 71% lifetime winrate with Qiyana at support last I checked. I also die to Ignite once every 16 games or so. What do you do when you Flash out after being Ignited, hmm?
LightswornLance1 votesYou're also unranked and play only normals. I could play sylas support and get a 100% winrate if I only played normals at your mmr lol. If I flash out after being within the range for ignite to kill me I already messed up somewhere in the chain of events that previously happened. Why would I cleanse the damage from ignite when I could do one of the following Flash a skillshot in the fight Barrier a skillshot in the fight Heal before the ignite Flash away before even taking damage Use ignite myself and kill the enemy even if I die while doing it All of these are infinitely more effective than using cleanse to remove ignite. I'm sorry but your pre30 logic doesnt stand up to the tried and true logic.
Zero Shingetsu1 votesYou're also unranked and play only normals. I could play sylas support and get a 100% winrate if I only played normals at your mmr lol.
Good for you. I'm not as skilled as you, so I can't do that with automatic success at my MMR. Otherwise it, you know, wouldn't be my MMR. Yet I still manage to win with off-meta support picks at this MMR.
EDIT: Actually I'm not sure about that. I'm regularly paired with Gold and Platinum players and you seem to be Silver II. I may be more skilled than you. I'm not positive.
If I flash out after being within the range for ignite to kill me I already messed up somewhere in the chain of events that > previously happened. Why would I cleanse the damage from ignite when I could do one of the following Flash a skillshot in the fight Barrier a skillshot in the fight Heal before the ignite Flash away before even taking damage
All great points. What happens when your opponent baits Flash or Barrier and then Ignites you seconds later? Do you just leave lane and heal up after you're forced to burn a summoner? What happens when you have to Heal to avoid getting executed by Garen's ult, then he drops Q -> Auto -> Ignite on you?
What happens when Leona shields you in the face, then drops her ult?
What happens when Sejuani's Yasuo get you with enough stacks for Sejuani to land an E -> smack -> Ult combo?
What happens when Nasus hits you with Whither and Ghosts on you?
What happens when Ashe hits you with her ult from offscreen while you're fleeing through the jungle?
What happens when you turn the corner and step on Jinx's E, and she's waiting for you with her support?
What happens when you Flash away from Tristana and she vaults after you?
"Build Quicksilver."
Sometimes I do. Then I have two failsafes, and I'm safe from cheap Ignites to boot.
LightswornLance1 votesI've climbed two divisions in two days, I'll be plat by the end of the month. There is no "opponent baiting flash or barrier" when you use summoner spells you are going in all or nothing, ideally enemy dying. I can flash away before garen gets into ult range. Any human being can react fast enough to dodge or flash an ashe arrow, also she would need vision of me in that situation. Again I can flash away from leonas slow moving skill shot gap closer. I have eyes so I will never step on a jinx trap. I can flash a wall to get away nasus while withered and just run away. Now the tristana is in melee range of me and I two hit her? All I am getting from this is that you have an insanely slow reaction time and are unable to use your brain to predict so that therefor flash is useless for you.
Zero Shingetsu1 votesI've climbed two divisions in two days, I'll be plat by the end of the month. There is no "opponent baiting flash or barrier" when you use summoner spells you are going in all or nothing, ideally enemy dying.
With a mindset like this, it's little wonder you're still Silver. Summoner spells are the number one strategic tool at our disposal and you seem to use them like a "FIRE EVERYTHING!!!!" button. The rest of this exudes the arrogance of inexperience.
Any human being can dodge Ashe's arrow, but I specified an arrow from offscreen. One you don't see until you're in the thick of a fight and it pops in from the corner of your screen.
You can Flash away from Leona's hook, but I didn't say anything about a hook. I'm talking about when you're face-to-face with her in a teamfight and she turns a great play into a wipe because she Q'd you before you started your combo.
You have eyes, but I deliberately pointed out a situation in which Jinx's E was around a corner. Do you have vision over every single corner? Do you never chase a low ADC into the fog of war, ever? Have you that much restraint?
You can Flash to the wall, but a Ghosting Nasus will catch you in about 1.6 seconds.
You say you'd just fight back against Tristana, but if you'd have to Flash from her in the first place, you're already low. By the time you turn around she'll have already popped you with an auto and sent you to respawn.
I appreciate that you're climbing quickly, but by the look of it, I've been at this a lot longer than you. To cherrypick specific instances where your Flash would pay off when I presented several where it wouldn't is foolish. To assume "I'd just dodge it" is foolish. To assume your opponents aren't gong to be skilled enough to bait you into using your Flash early, or direct you into a dangerous spot, or simply predict your dodge vector and aim there to begin with, is foolish.
To err is human. You're going to make a mistake. Every single player at every skill level makes at least three mistakes every game. When you make those mistakes, or when your opponent simply outplays you for a brief moment, it's better to have a fallback you can flee or even pursue an escaping kill with than to swear at your teammates because your *Perfect Flash™* was clearly spoiled by their incompetence.
I bring Cleanse because I use summoners as a strategic tool. Cleanse is my wakizashi. My triarius. The way a samurai wielded his sidearm or a commander deployed a wall of spears to cover his retreat, I have Cleanse. You have nothing because you blew it all trying to get a kill, which is very much a newbie mistake. There's far more to this game than kills, and exhausting all your resources for a single takedown is a huge mistake.
LightswornLance1 votesStill silver? I started playing ranked 2 weeks ago and I'm already a higher rank than you ever have been. "I've been at this alot longer than you." Yeah and you are still silver, literally you are so ashamed of your inability to play that you dont even play ranked anymore. Why do you think that your wisdom is better than the knowledge of literal pro players. If cleanse was so good of a summoner spell you'd think it would be used in every match. Except its not. You say that I'm exhausting my resources for a takedown, you literally don't even have the resources, because your taking cleanse instead of flash. A summoner spell burned for a kill is always worth it pre 20 minutes and sometimes after. Using my flash to dodge a lux bind and then proceeding to dump all my abilities directly in her face and get a solokill is definitely a good use of a summoner. Flashing away from her bind and getting away from a gank I should've died to and denying my enemies 450 gold. Now thats useful, you know whats not useful, cleansing her bind and dying anyway. Cleanse is objectively worse than flash in every way possible, unless you're a low skill player.
You would be a weak general, rather than making plays and flashing for an epic game winning 5 man qiyana ultimate you cleanse a cc and die anyway.
Zero Shingetsu1 votesStill silver? I started playing ranked 2 weeks ago and I'm already a higher rank than you ever have been.
Do your research. The one time I played ranked past placements (Season 3) I carried myself from Bronze V to Gold IV on Support Rammus and Support Rammus alone. In half a season.
Yeah and you are still silver, literally you are so ashamed of your inability to play that you dont even play ranked anymore.
I don't play ranked because after season 3 I started playing games professionally. LCS isn't worth my time when I make much more reliable money playing better games. If LCS changes its payment structure, maybe I'll consider it... but they'd better balance the game first. I'm not throwing time and effort into a game this wildly out of balance, and I'm not wasting a bunch of ranked players' time if I don't intend to try. Until a whole lot changes, League is a hobby and barely that.
You say that I'm exhausting my resources for a takedown, you literally don't even have the resources, because your taking cleanse instead of flash.
My offensive resources come in the form of mind games. Luring my opponent out of position, using my dashes effectively, baiting my opponent into a fight he can't win. I use summoners tactically, and retreat is a tactical option. Additionally, I can waltz right through things like Veigar's ring and secure kills where you wouldn't be able to with Flash.
Now thats useful, you know whats not useful, cleansing her bind and dying anyway. Cleanse is objectively worse than flash in every way possible, unless you're a low skill player.
Stating absolutes is yet another mark of inexperience. You're making sweeping assumptions based purely on what websites are saying, not accounting for the fact that every player is different. If you happened to catch someone like me on a day when they were feeling serious, you'd probably get trampled because you'd assume he was unskilled based on substandard summoner picks. In truth, anything you're not familiar with should be assumed to be even more dangerous than the norm in a competitive situation.
You would be a weak general, rather than making plays and flashing for an epic game winning 5 man qiyana ultimate you cleanse a cc and die anyway.
Given that I make a whole lot of money leading a team in an extremely strategic game, where actual squad-executed ploys and gambits are employed... Given that my family has been a military family since the 15th century or so... Given that I've read more than once the Art of War, the Silver Sparrow Art of War, Sun Bin's Art of War, that I've memorized the essence of the Thirty-Six Stratagems, that I delivered a dissertation on the Book of Five Rings in high school... You know, I find this incredibly unlikely. Particularly when the criteria for your assumption amounts to "you use cleanse lolol".
Zero Shingetsu1 votesAbsolutely true. I COULD beat him with Ornn, but only if I play pretty much perfectly. This new Garen? What are some of these changes even? What is this "nearest enemy" BS, how often is that NOT going to be the guy he's locked down with his slow? In other words he's always gonna be applying bonus damage, and being near minions won't help you in most cases. Unless said Garen is just all over the damn place when he spins. I haven't fought him with Ornn yet, but I don't see it going much better than before, and it may well go worse.
Moody P12 voteswhat slow
Mihalikb3 votesYou see when Garen Qs and silences your champ, you get an electric feedback through your keyboard which then slows the reaction time of your brain by 30%.
Alternatively, when Garen spins he ends up warping the space time continuum and he starts moving 30% faster then everyone else stuck in normal spacetime.
LightswornLance3 votesOh now I understand.
Zero Shingetsu1 votes[{quoted}](name=Moody P,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZqmJmRuR,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2019-10-11T16:34:27.476+0000)
what slow
The slow he pretty much automatically gets with Every Garen Build Ever (if you're not building Rylai to be weird, you're building Iceborn). Except the ones that build Black Cleaver, which is what I call a "Bullet Time Slow". When your spin procs on-hit effects, it means everything around you is slower than you are for the duration of the spin. Effectively, this is a slow. Learn the jargon.
Yets42403 votesSpin doesn't proc on hits, and no one is building Rylai's (since DFG was removed at least, RIP APGaren) nor a fucking Iceborn (cause you know, he's manaless?) on Garen. I looked it up and could barely even find a literally 0.1% build rate sorting by all Elos, all regions, and combining normal and ranked games together for Iceborn, literally nothing for Rylais though, not even a 0.1% build rate. He does however have a 0.4% buildrate on Frozen Mallet under the same search parameters.
Zero Shingetsu1 votesSpin doesn't proc on hits
It does now.
nor a fucking Iceborn (cause you know, he's manaless?) on Garen. I looked it up and could barely even find a literally 0.1% build rate sorting by all Elos, all regions, and combining normal and ranked games together for Iceborn, literally nothing for Rylais though, not even a 0.1% build rate.
Then you're looking in the wrong place. I've seen Iceborn on Garen a number of times.
Mihalikb4 votesNo. It does not. If spin would trigger on hit effects, everyone would be building Blade of the Ruined King. It would melt everything in seconds with spin and has an actual point and click slow effect.
The Garen rework was specifically postponed from 9.18 to 9.20 because they decide not to allow him to trigger on hit effects with the E.
Because people were building BotRK and Titanic Hydra on him and melt the whole enemy team 1v5.
Zero Shingetsu1 votesNo. It does not. If spin would trigger on hit effects, everyone would be building Blade of the Ruined King. It would melt everything in seconds with spin and has an actual point and click slow effect.
The Garen rework was specifically postponed from 9.18 to 9.20 because they decide not to allow him to trigger on hit effects with the E.
Because people were building BotRK and Titanic Hydra on him and melt the whole enemy team 1v5.
Sounds good.
Black Cleaver still applies on E though.
Mihalikb4 votesAs it should and alway did? It's an armor shred.
SH Azykan1 votescleaver isnt an on-hit, it is on any physical damage (zed Q, Talon W, Mis Fortune Ult being prime examples of other cleaver users)
Zero Shingetsu1 votes[{quoted}](name=TPG Azykan,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZqmJmRuR,comment-id=00000000000100000000000000000001,timestamp=2019-10-11T23:16:36.988+0000)
cleaver isnt an on-hit, it is on any physical damage (zed Q, Talon W, Mis Fortune Ult being prime examples of other cleaver users)
Then even worse, it applies to E even without the on-hit addition to it.
SH Azykan1 votesbecause it is a source of physical damage? that's how the item works. it isn't on only auto attacks
Zero Shingetsu1 votes[{quoted}](name=TPG Azykan,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZqmJmRuR,comment-id=0000000000010000000000000000000100000000,timestamp=2019-10-12T02:20:41.513+0000)
because it is a source of physical damage? that's how the item works. it isn't on only auto attacks
I understand this. What I'm saying is that it's even dangerous on Garen without them adding the on-hit E thing.
SH Azykan1 votesIt has always worked that way though? And even so people are building trinity still just like before the rework in most cases. Because it synergizes with his kit better.
Zero Shingetsu1 votes[{quoted}](name=TPG Azykan,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZqmJmRuR,comment-id=000000000001000000000000000000010000000000000000,timestamp=2019-10-12T07:50:16.838+0000)
It has always worked that way though? And even so people are building trinity still just like before the rework in most cases. Because it synergizes with his kit better.
I dunno. I'm having the most success at Garen with Iceborn.
Yets42403 votesNo, it fucking doesn't, you clearly didn't even read the goddamn patch notes ffs.
Mihalikb5 votesRylai's and Iceborn Gauntlet? What? Are we playing the same game? Next you'll tell me Kassadin builds Stormrazor.
Dude. You are literally talking out of your backside.
The only items with a slow that Garen usually builds are Deadman's Plate (it's almost never built as first item except against Zed or possibly Gankplank) or Randuin's. Usually built as second or 3rd item against things like Tryndamere, Yasou or Jihn.
Zero Shingetsu1 votesRylai's and Iceborn Gauntlet? What? Are we playing the same game? Next you'll tell me Kassadin builds Stormrazor.
Dude. You are literally talking out of your backside.
Am I? Am I literally? I should market that talent, I can't think of a single person in the world who can do that.
The only items with a slow that Garen usually builds are Deadman's Plate (it's almost never built as first item except Zed or possibly Gankplank) or Randuin's. Usually built as second or 3rd item against things like Tryndamere, Yasou or Jihn.
Rylai is less common these days. But I still see Iceborn on every tenth Garen or so. It's a fairly reasonable take; it's extra burst on the Q and it sets up a slow that makes the E more accessible.
That said, most of the first half of that post was setting up for sarcasm. The real meat of Garen's "slow" is generally Black Cleaver.
Mihalikb5 votesNobody.ever.builds.gauntlet.on.Garen.
If they did and beat you somehow, then you need to re-examine your life choices.
Zero Shingetsu1 votesNobody.ever.builds.gauntlet.on.Garen.
If they did and beat you somehow, then you need to re-examine your life choices.
First off, examine my life choices because of League? I don't play League professionally, why should it have an impact on my life choices at all? That's far too dire.
Second, how so? Because he doesn't have mana? Is there some caveat I missed that says all the other effects of Iceborn only work if you spend mana or something? Please tell me how everything except the +500 mana is a detriment to Garen. The mana is exactly one quarter of the item's utility. Please tell me how the other 3/4 are bad for Garen. Please. I want to improve my game, I am desperate. I must have the knowings.
Mihalikb4 votesYou don't build Iceborn Gauntlet because the item has no AD or HP.
Garen's passive regen ratio is determined by his HP. So if you would want to build an item with a slow effect that also gives you useful tank stats (HP) and some AD, you would build Frozen Mallet (it is sometimes built against Ryze or Teemo) Frozen Mallet is almost never built because Steraks Gage with its shield, AD bonus, Tenacity bonus and huge chunk of HP is much better.
If you want to build a Sheen item for the on hit damage, you build Triforce, which gives you AD, AS, HP 5% movement speed, on hit damage and Phage movement speed, it is also built out of Phage and Sheen, two items that are really good on Garen, while Gauntlet is built out of Glacial Shroud which is a terrible useless item.
You triple extra wouldn't build it against Ornn because his flame breath is Magic Damage and his shatter effect does %HP damage, so best tank stats against Ornn are HP and MR.
So you would typically build BC and Mercury Threads. Then if you are behind and have to defend you build Steraks, if you have to split push or roam you build Deadman's Plate for the movement speed, slow and on hit damage.
Zero Shingetsu1 votesYou don't build Iceborn Gauntlet because the item has no AD or HP.
Garen's passive regen ratio is determined by his HP. So if you would want to build an item with a slow effect that also gives you useful tank stats (HP) and some AD, you would build Frozen Mallet (it is sometimes built against Ryze or Teemo) Frozen Mallet is almost never built because Steraks Gage with its shield, AD bonus, Tenacity bonus and huge chunk of HP is much better.
Sorry, I missed this before but... You do realize this means his passive doesn't depend on health at all, right? 5,000 HP or 500, he's still healing for X% of that total. Sure, more health means you'll keep at high health longer, but to say you should build HP because "his ratio is determined by his HP" is... a bit unnecessary.
Mihalikb1 votesThe more health you have, the more you heal per second.
How is this confusing for you?
Jesus, just in case some numbnuts like you comes along, Riot now also made his W scale off his health directly.
Zero Shingetsu1 votesThe more health you have, the more you heal per second.
How is this confusing for you?
Jesus, just in case some numbnuts like you comes along, Riot now also made his W scale off his health directly.
Are you still on this?
There's nothing confusing about it. I fully understand how it works. All I was trying to say is that it's redundant. The way you're wording it, it's as though it works like this:
MAX HP = 500 -> HEALING PER SECOND = 50 MAX HP = 1000 -> HEALING PER SECOND = 500
The way it actually works is more like...
MAX HP = 500 -> HEALING PER SECOND = 50 MAX HP = 1000 -> HEALING PER SECOND = 100
The healing doesn't scale with max HP. You heal for the same percentage regardless of how much max HP you have. You're going from one notch to a full bar in the same amount of time whether you have 1,000 or 8,000 max HP.
Yes, it's better to have more HP because with percentile healing, you'll stay beefy longer. But you're not actively gaining bonus healing with more HP. You're gaining bonus HP per second, but you're not gaining bonus healing percentage. You're not affecting the actual scaling of the ability any.
BeatzBoyFTW6 votesGaren? Slow? Huh?
LightswornLance2 votesGod is this really your average forums user? They literally dont even play the game and complain about everything.
