Context for Ryze Nerfs and My ramblings about where I think Ryze should be nerfed
(This is my first post, sorry if it is hard to read/understand or if I have put it in the wrong section=p.
Main question(s) for Meddler: I completely agree Ryze needs a nerf, but could I have some context for the nerfs to Ryze's "E" on the PBE when the % damage masteries are already taking a hit? And I was under the impression nerfs to his "W" (giving it travel time), and possible nerfs to his ult were being looked into what happened to those/will we see them in the near future?
Background: I've played close to 200 games on Ryze since his latest rework across my accounts, and have ~64% win rate on my main, so I am not so much complaining about the nerf itself, I agree Ryze is incredibly strong, but I would like the reason behind this part of his kit being nerfed.
My Thoughts on the state of Ryze Currently:
I want to be clear I am not saying that I am an expert on how to play Ryze(I actually suck compared to the skill level where Ryze really dominates) but I believe my opinion might be worth reading.
One keystone to rule them all:
- Ryze's damage scales with Mana.
- Ryze's spells have low cool downs but with relatively high mana costs, thus he needs a large mana pool to be able to use his abilities without quickly going OOM(out of mana) turning himself in to a moving ward.
*Both of these needs are fantastic because they work together. But when it comes to choosing a keystone they suddenly become clunky. Because no keystone scales with mana thus there is only one real effective choice, Stormraider's. While Thunderlord's and Deathfire touch have their benefits, and most certainly can be used on Ryze they only scale from the 400 or so ability power he builds to take advantage of his passive and the ap ratios on his kit. Thus if one is Ryze choosing them inherently puts you at a disadvantage when facing most other mages that build 600-1000 ap by end game and choose Thunderlord's or Deathfire. One must also understand that because Ryze is a short ranged mage he is inherently in range of other mages and ADCs when casting most of his damaging spells(E,W)(I am not including his Q in this list because it has a longer range and travel time can be cast at where the pursing mage/ADC will be thus extending its effective range when kiting backwards). Also because his q resets off of his "W" and "E" he spends most of his time when kiting backwards in range of the enemy Mage/ADC. Basically what I am trying to state is that this keystone while used in kiting and dodging mages and ADCs but finds its real use in kiting fighters and tanks. Because of "damage creep" most tanks now have a fair bit of damage on them even when built tanky
etc, combined with their cc they become a real threat to Ryze. With the previous nerf to Ryze's passive his ability to kite is already reduced. Now with the possible 20% nerf to the bonus damage on his "E" Ryze loses damage, combined that with the possible upcoming nerfs to the % damage masteries Ryze loses a fair bit of burst/damage, thus when fighting tanks and some beefy fighters it will be much harder to hit the 30% of max health in 2.5 seconds trigger to activate the keystone and make use of it where it shines.
(I am not saying that this is necessarily horrible but this keystone/ its monopoly on Ryze are important to consider when nerfing/buffing Ryze.)
Passive: Great, allows AP to work more fluidly within his build.
Q: The damage is high perhaps too high, especially when he has a nice spread of targets already affected by his "E". But I believe that for the range Ryze has he can be afforded the right to have more damage packed into a spell. But if the spell loses damage Cassiopeia, who has far more reliable damage(point and click versus skill shot that can be intercepted by a different enemy not affected by Ryze's "E") blows Ryze out of the water in terms of damage at any point of the game. End game she has 6 items and no need for boots, Ryze has a central need for boots because he needs to kite, thus is stuck at 5 items. Mid game and early game are decently in favor of Cassiopeia in terms of single target damage. However I think that this is great, Ryze shouldn't be great at every aspect of the game. I believe what separates Ryze is his waveclear style damage, and his team-style mobility brought by his ult. Thus I think that if a nerf should be brought to this spell it should be something like this "some amount damage done reduced to secondary champions hit by Ryze's "Q", damage to minions and monsters is unchanged." That way Ryze suffers a nerf to his damage output, but doesn't suffer in his waveclear, and has incentive to hit a champion, more exactly the champion he wants to damage with his q. That way hitting the skill shot is important rather than spreading his "e" and hitting a minion with his "Q" to then damage the enemy champion.
**W: **Great, but really has no counter play besides scripting or well timed fiora players parrying it. I liked that you guys were investigating giving it a travel time, and I think that is untimely the fix because it allows players to quickly flash or re-position before getting hit by it. The only concern I have with this change is making the travel time too slow which would allow for easy dodging of the ability by champions such as
(Camille ult too perhaps).
**E: **Central to what makes him special, gives him that his waveclear, but can be overpowered when spreading into the entire enemy team to then send a q dealing ~1200 damage to hit the entire enemy team, but I think my proposed nerf to the "Q" would sort this issue out without removing anything central to his kit/ punishing players who pride themselves in their mechanical ability to hit skill shots.
**R: **0.0 This one is tough, it is really really strong when skilled players use it, as shown by Bjergsen. I believe that the range level 1 is well "meh" not great not horrible, but it really only shines in juking the enemy into walking into you or escaping over a wall while in zonyas. Thus level 1 doesn't really cause any problems with the ult being overpowered. But level 2 it becomes incredibly strong, leading to quick rotations bringing the wave of minions with the team allowing them to push lanes where they didn't have a pushing wave, or allowing the team to quickly rush baron as Bjersen show cased so cleanly. I am less sure about how to nerf this, perhaps set a max number of allied champions that can take the portal, or set a max to the number of minions that can come. I am really not sure how to "balance" this ult, it has very little to change, and can't be gutted as it is now central to Ryze's identity as a champion. Changing it to only allow ryze simply provides a worse TF ult. decreasing the range limits the possibilities it can be used for, which in turn dissuades players from leveling it over "Q" or "E".
The passive shielding/movement speed from his Runes: His runes are central to his identity as well and I think that the way they were worked into his kit was fantastic, it increased his ability to survive and kite the enemy. It may need some sort of nerf if the other areas of his kit are left as they are, but I believe his "R" and his bouncing "Q" should be changed instead. Because it allows Ryze to survive while decently damaging tanks exist.
"Mr. Gorbachev tear down this wall"...of text=) tl;dr (I really recommend reading the entire thing if you are thinking of leaving an angry comment)
I believe proposed nerfs to Ryze's bonus "Q" damage on targets affected by his "E" in combination with proposed nerfs to the %damage masteries will leave Ryze in an awkward state fighting tanks when the only Keystone that is really effective on Ryze with is Stormraider's Surge.
But as stated before I am no expert on Ryze, nor am I skilled at all playing him compared to the pro-scene, so please keep that in mind when reading/commenting. =)
Also forgive the punctuation, I've never been good at it. And congratulations if you made it this far.=) [zombie-brand-clap]
