Black cleaver and how it effects top laners

Exalted Kayle·8/1/2017, 7:20:15 PM·10 votes·1,256 views

Wouldn't it be simpler to not allow ranged champions to use black cleaver than nerfing it into the ground and completely hurting champions like darius garen riven and the like? And if so could we ever see the nerfed changes reverted and just making cleaver melee only like tiamat.

Edit: And also couldnt we just rework darius as its very unfun to be slowed into the past and kited, i understand thats his weakness but i'd rather have less tankyness on darius but more mobility. -- Theres no planned cleavers nerfs right now im talking about old nerfs, secondly the only champions i see Affecting this nerf reset and making cleaver melee only is the champions that shouldnt be using it in the first place IMO.

27 Comments

Radiant Wukong8/1/2017, 7:21:43 PM3 votes

They're nerfing the cleaver? My Wukong though!

Dominick Destine8/1/2017, 10:37:44 PM2 votes

English is not my native language.

I would ask all native english speakers for what reason "affect" and "effect" are confused so often..... it is a very curious phenomenon as someone that never took a single formal english class.

Aeszarck8/1/2017, 8:57:01 PM2 votes

Did you mean "affects"?

xToxicOsirisx8/1/2017, 11:04:58 PM2 votes

How many adcs are actually using cleaver? atm I can only think of 1 and thats MissFortune .

Asayake 5150glow8/1/2017, 10:31:21 PM1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Cancer Darius,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=VAAQ1eqh,comment-id=,timestamp=2017-08-01T19:20:15.115+0000)

Wouldn't it be simpler to not allow ranged champions to use black cleaver than nerfing it into the ground and completely hurting champions like darius garen riven and the like? And if so could we ever see the nerfed changes reverted and just making cleaver melee only like tiamat.

Edit: And also couldnt we just rework darius as its very unfun to be slowed into the past and kited, i understand thats his weakness but i'd rather have less tankyness on darius but more mobility. -- Theres no planned cleavers nerfs right now im talking about old nerfs, secondly the only champions i see Affecting this nerf reset and making cleaver melee only is the champions that shouldnt be using it in the first place IMO.

Why not just change Cleaver's shred to %bonus armor? The ADC's abusing it mainly use it to do more damage to squishies as well, but ranged should get a safer tankfighting option (less damage but more survivability).

MagicFlyingLlama8/1/2017, 7:34:06 PM1 votes

I too approve of darius nerfs. At least for treeline.

Darius turns treeline into a 4v3.

JackMcSnipeyz8/2/2017, 12:12:20 PM1 votes

How do you decide who should and who shouldnt use black cleaver? just because it's core on most melee champs doesnt mean it's exclusive to them. Should IE be ranged only? Why cant urgot, MF and whoever else is building BC not use it? nothing about it screams "this is a melee item".

And for the love of god, dont touch darius, he's cancerous (heh) enough as it is for any melee champ who cant even get close to farm, he doesnt need mobility unless you wanna change his role from a juggernaut to a hyper carry or something.

NodirjonSattarov8/2/2017, 1:45:29 AM1 votes

they can give BC the old Guinsoo treatment where ranged has to stack it 2 times as much to get its effects. this includes jayce because 90% of the time he's in ranged form

TurquoiseYoshi8/1/2017, 8:29:16 PM1 votes

So we're giving a big nerf to Gnar, and mild nerfs to Urgot, Jayce, Lucian, and Graves. Nothing about how Renekton and Jarvan in pro play are buying Cleaver and Hydra every game. Nothing about how Cleaver crowds out options for the melees that you mention by being so much better than any other damage option. Nothing about how Cleaver pretty much forces assassins into buying it at 4th item because of its passives. Just get rid of it for ranged and that will fix all of its problems.

Spoofghoul8/2/2017, 12:04:59 PM1 votes

armor went up so pen had to go down to equalize it's effectiveness

in all honesty cleaver should scale with base ad like steraks does

30% base ad.

because it's awkward for anyone not utilizing full ad ratio's

and it's still awkward to use this alongside the sheen items and steraks combined