Taliyah in Season 7

Pokuta··3 votes·563 views

A little context, I play Taliyah A LOT. She is easily my best middle lane champion, my win rate with her in ranked being 69% (43 wins; 19 losses). So I love her but I do have to admit something about her: she is strong. She is pick or banned in pro play but in solo queue only a select few play her. In order to make sure her game play is balanced and playable she needs to be hit softly. Her cooldowns I think are a problem, her Q has a 3 second cooldown at rank 5, her W having a good cd, and her E has a 8 second cooldown at rank 5. I think her Q needs to have a 4 second cooldown at rank 5 and her E cooldown needs to be upped. Both of their cooldowns start during the cast. Her Q takes about 2 seconds to fire all 5 rocks, meaning only a 1 second cooldown in reality, and her e takes 4 seconds to detonate, meaning only a 4 second cooldown. And most people who play Taliyah get 30-40% cooldown reduction. Her Q at 40% cd reduction is 1.8 seconds. Her E at 40% cd reduction is 4.8 seconds.

I know my thoughts above were disorganized so I'll compile them into a list if you are confused: Q: Has a 3 second cooldown at rank 5, starting at time of cast. Takes 2 seconds to fire all 5 rocks. Real cooldown is 1 second (with 40% cd it is up after every cast) E: Has a 8 second cooldown at rank 5, starting at time of cast. Takes 4 seconds to detonate. Real cooldown is 4 seconds. (with 40% cd it is up after .8 seconds)

So if I were to nerf Taliyah's cooldowns I would do it like this in true patch notes style:

Taliyah _Q and E cooldowns start after spell. E cooldown changed. _

Taliyah has been used to success by those who take the time to learn her. In order to maintain her presence on the rift, her cooldowns will be hit to provide a small window of opening that opponents didn't have before, while also having her maintaining low cooldowns.

Q - Threaded Volley Cooldown now starts after all 5 rocks are fired.

E - Unraveled Earth Cooldown changed from 16-14-12-10-8 to 14-12-10-8-6 Cooldown starts after all rocks detonate.

> I understand this would be a small nerf, but only a select few play her. If I am misled by her player base then I'd nerf her Q and E damage from subsequent hits. Have people take 45% - 50% reduced damage after being hit by one rock from her Q (live value is 40% reduced damage). E would get same treatment. Right now E does 15% reduced damage based on her initial cast for each rock someone is hit by, and people only get hit by 4. The total reduced damage is 55% when the value should be 60%.

4 Comments

Rainfall2 votes

an apc champion to be viable needs to deal damage. champions with non-damage dealing ults deal most of their damage from their abilities. 1.if viktor deals 1000 damage with all of her abilities. 2.talyah deals 80% of that damage with all her abilities. 3.but while 40% of viktor's damage came from his R. 4.0% of talyah's damage came from her R. 5.So in 12 seconds talyah can deal the same damage again. 6.while viktor can only deal 60% of the damage he just dealt because his R is on cooldown.

Pokuta1 votes

Yeah I understand that she needs damage in her Q W E due to her non damaging ult. But she is a control mage with too much control. There is almost no opening on her in team fights.

A typical Taliyah build in solo queue is Morello, Liandry's Torment, and Void Staff. And then typical rune pages have 10% scaling CDR blues. With only 30% cooldown reduction she has her abilities almost always up after cast. And in fights you place your E in front of you to deter the enemy from engaging (while you fire your Q at them) because one seismic shove guarantees a dead/very weak enemy champion.

My point with the post is her cooldowns are too good mid game and late game. She has great kite and good engage. Her weaknesses are not much mobility (would be none but her worked ground is good ms) and her non damaging ult.

Stalinium1 votes

It honestly sounds like you want to absolutely gut your own champion... I dunno why.

Maybe if her early game was nerfed in compensation for some scaling late that'd be fine (seriously, champion.gg her winrate vs. gametime charts... it's pathetic)

She's strong in pro play because of waveclear and ult. She's not strong in soloqueue because of lack of coordination. I'd really not see any more Shen-type balancing in the game, but perhaps that's just me

Pokuta1 votes

I am not trying to gut her, nor do I think that the theoretical nerfs would gut her.

Her E cooldown live is 16/14/12/10/8. And most people go 10% scaling CD in the rune page, plus her building cooldown in her items. So as an example, a Taliyah with 6 scaling CD blues in the rune page and a Morello has 24.32 CDR at level 8 and considering it is level 8, her E is leveled up twice. So her CD is 10.6 seconds live. But the cooldown begins at time of cast and takes 4 seconds to detonate. So the real cooldown is 6.6 seconds. Her Q cooldown live is 9/7.5/6/4.5/3. At level 8 with 24.32 CDR her Q sits at a cooldown of 3.4 seconds. But since the cooldown starts when she casts it (and it take approximately 2 seconds to cast all 5 rocks), her real cooldown is approximately 1.4 seconds.

Her E cooldown with my theoretical nerfs would be 14-12-10-8-6. Using the same scenario as above, her E CD at level 8 would be 9.9 seconds. But because I propose that the CD start when the spell ends, the value would actually be 9.9 seconds. Q cooldown with my nerfs would be 3.4 seconds.

One or the other needs to happen. The Q cooldown nerf I do believe is harsh, so maybe I agree with E getting hit and Q left alone so that she can do stuff during E's long down time.

I also understand that only a few people play her and those people have played her alot. But my gripe is pro players are playing her and she hasn't seen down time. Considering that pro play has a high influence on balancing, I wanted to put my thoughts out into the universe on what would be suitable nerfs that keep her viable.

Maybe it is her items that make her so problematic to me. With Liandry's being such a staple item on mages and her Q applying Liandry's burn 5 times, plus the penetration that it brings. Maybe those things getting nerfed would throw her in line.

More from Gameplay