2019 Rank system.

The Loop·Aug 2, 2018·2 votes·1,566 views

/dev: Position Ranks in 2019 - Nexus

This rank system is in Starcraft 2, each one of their races are independently ranked. It helps players get team up with other people that are on the same level as them. I'm Gold in Starcraft 2 and i don't get teamed up with trolls or people who just leave the game. I love their rank system. I don't see why people hate this rank system. I can't wait for this to go live. I hate getting pair up with people who don't know how to play a role they get. I feel like in the higher elo(s) people know how to play every role. The lower elo doesn't know how to do that. I hope with this upcoming rank system I will get pair up with less trolls/afks/feeder.

Here is something that would be nice to add to the game:

I would like to see my MMR after a match and how far its dropping/rising depending on how well i do in a match.

9 Comments

TormentulaAug 2, 20184 votes

Starcraft is different since its an RTS, you won't notice these issues as frequently. I don't play SC so I won't say much more about the system there.

In league this system overcomplicates things, you can main 1 role, and boost your other roles off of it, which defeats the purpose of having seperate skill expression. The overall total rank is held back especially if you can't play other roles.

Additionally if you get an off-role, there's several behavioral issues like "o i got mid, eh i'll just try akali for the first time, won't hurt much if i lose anyway." which hurts the rest of the playerbase more. So this seperation system may give some opportunities to learn other things, but it also influences care free play which the other players have to put up with.

Not to mention MMR will still remain the same so you're not really a gold soraka, you're still in diamond but with a gold v diamond skill level, so it doesn't actually change anything for different scenarios other then "do what you want more freely cause less punishment."

Add in issues like role swap checking.. overcomplicated mechanics behind how the ranking system works..

overall this system is unnecessary, nobody asked for it, and it has too many problems with too many fixes required which leads to more problems. This is what our skin payments are going to, hiring and approving whoever had this idea instead of making the game better. I joke about this a lot but literally, this was kassadin's animation budget.

Put it this way, if I get autofilled support I'm playing Elise. Riot is letting me, I'm not losing much for attempting it, just a heads up warning if you get me in my games when I'm autofilled. Now think about this system.

Ranked is fine. Promos are dumb and need reworked/removed, but ranked works the way it should (minus that winstreak = intentional bad player matchup to even you out)

The LoopAug 2, 20183 votes

The off-role behavioral issues i can see. Now if riot throws away AutoFill i feel like this system would be even better. But I don't see that happening cuz people will bitch about que times.. You can't make everyone happy. I feel like people just need to learn the whole game and not just one or 2 roles.

The swap checking I would have to imagine riot would of thought of something to solve this. If not i'm sure they will come up with something before it goes live.

ChargeItDownMidAug 2, 20183 votes

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TormentulaAug 2, 20182 votes

{quoted} Also, where do people keep getting the winstreak = intentionally bad player matchup thing? That is mathematically impossible to do with the current queue times.

Because thats literally a confirmed mechanic riot stated.

Basically if you go on a winstreak, instead of getting matched with players that are climbing just like you, it tries to give you players that are dropping to your MMR.

For example, if you're plat 3 after a 10 game winstreak, its trying to give you a diamond 5 dropping to plat 3 instead of another person who's plat 3 after a 10 game winstreak. They implemented it so players don't climb too fast, but its kinda bullshit since if you're that good, you should climb fast without the game intentionally trying screwing you, whether it succeeds or not. This is the main reason why players bitch about the rank system, and its 100% a good reason why promos suck so much since if you win streak to them, promos could be those bad matchup games, then it dominoe effects your MMR, LP/rank, overall this is just an awful design flaw idk what other company even has this.

A perfect ranked system for 5v5 would probably just be current ranked without this. Promos being removed (or atleast LP earned while in promos carrying over) sounds like a more reasonable way to go about it, but that system has to go if league wants to not be a laughing stock of competitive gaming's matchmaking.

The new rank system doesn't fix these issues (or address them in anyway), instead it just opens more trolling cases for the sake of "less anxiety" when at launch, it'll probably cause more especially for players dealing with autofilled teammates going katarina support. Understanding how the system works is hella overcomplicated too, explain this to every new player and ask them if they even want to play ranked, and while there is probably solutions to role swaps, there's still going to be flaws and glitch cases like "you were in the jungle roaming more then mid, so here's less LP for your jungling instead of awarding your mid LP". Imagine that support singed player who was winning an climbing only getting 5 LP at a time just because he was playing his role differently, or even 1 out of 10 games it does that, that would be fucking tilting.

ChargeItDownMidAug 2, 20181 votes

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TormentulaAug 2, 20181 votes

{quoted}

No actually, they confirmed multiple times they do not do what you described and it is nothing more than a rumor. It was never implemented and such a system would be completely impossible to implement with the current queue times.

Think about your system for a second. If you go on a winstreak and matchmaking is trying to only put you with players that are dropping out of your mmr, how are your queue times not skyrocketing? Matchmaking can't just pull players out of thin air, it would need to wait for the diamond 5 dropping into play three player to queue up in order to add them onto your team. Under your system, queue times would go up tenfold as you go on a long winning streak because matchmaking is waiting for specific players to put on your team. it is mathematically impossible for such a system to keep the queue times we currently have.

Literally on the support page.

Climbing the ladder

While MMR is the number we use to determine your opponents, your personal progress is represented by the Leagues system. Here are a few familiar situations to illustrate the difference between your League and your MMR:

You’re winning a lot, and the matchmaker is placing you against stronger opponents.

A Silver player pushing for Gold should expect to see higher-tier players in their games. It means you’re winning more than you’re losing, and it means the matchmaker is starting to suspect that you’re worthy of higher placement. If you’re on a big win streak, you may even start to see opponents several divisions above you.

^ This is an opposite effect where the system is trying to give you harder foes, you're higher. This makes sense and is fine.

Your opponent is losing a lot, and the matchmaker is placing them against lower-ranked opponents to find them an appropriate spot on the ladder.

This is where it evens out, because players of that MMR that are losing get matched with you, so while yes, you're moving up, you're also getting those moving down which hurts your success rate.

The team’s average MMR is the same, but **one team has five roughly-equal teammates **and the other team has a few very highly-ranked players and a few lower ones. This one is pretty rare outside of full-premade teams, but we make our best efforts to try and ensure that we still balance queue times into fair matches.

While this part does seem strange on understanding how it works, this is an interesting confirmation that teams are unbalanced sometimes.

While we know some matches may feel like stomps, we do try to make sure all teams have a 50 +/-1% chance of victory using all the information we have, because part of what makes League so competitive is getting to face similarly-skilled opponents.

They want teams to be 50% chance of winning. Thats fine, but this also punishes players who play really good, say somebody climbing from silver to plat with a 70% winrate, they even that out really hard with lower WR players to make the overall chance of winning 50% equal to their team. Sure in theory you'd be able to carry, but if you're 70%, the enemy is all 50%, and the game gives you 30-40% winrate players or players dropping in MMR in general, then thats just a hinderance to your own personal performance. This is literally where it gives you worse teammates of that MMR for the sake of holding you back for an equal chance of the opponent to win, which sometimes doesn't feel so equal. Also confirms the queue doesn't just randomly place you on one team out of the pool of 9, its intentionally putting you with your team.

As for queue times, its really not that different, sure the longer a queue goes the more desperate the system looks for teammates, but it will prioritize the players its looking for, so you likely will still get that kind of matchmaking with low queue times. Queue time management could make this less frequently an issue for sure, but its still there. I think you're underestimating the pool of the playerbase to let this kind of system work with queue times, in challenger its still really high, but diamond and below isn't that scarce of players to pull this kind of system off. 1% of league is still a really high number considering the total.

Riot will say the system doesn't "deliberately give you bad players", but in reality thats what the system does when you do really well in ranked, give you worse teammates to balance out the chances of winning against the opponent. I understand what their intention was, but I don't agree that the solution is holding a good player back by making it harder for his back to carry his way up. I'd rather see a 5v5 where 8 players are 50% winrate but both sides have a 70% for a more competitive "who is better at carrying"