Yuumi E max or Q max

ClockworkStrider·Sep 30, 2019·6 votes·8,849 views

I recently started to main Yuumi. Although most guides and streamers suggest to max Q, I find that maxing E feels a lot better in lane since the heal gets enormous especially after I get redemption, and the enemy can easily hide behind minions to avoid my Q. In mid game I can go on to who ever on my team that is snowballing.

Can some other Yuumi mains and adc's (crit adc and non-crit adc) weigh in on this? Specifically, are there situations or elos where one is better or if maxing one leads to better lanning or team fighting?

48 Comments

Metal JannaSep 30, 20194 votes

I always max E on Yuumi unless my carry is already stomping and all he needs is more catch. They've been nerfing Q over and over lately so it's either rush E or rush W.

Pika FoxSep 30, 20194 votes

Q. Your Q is good poke and keeps the enemy in range, and its essential to get its CD lower ASAP.

E scales with AP, and the healing isnt really the biggest draw. Yuumi isnt a healer. Your job is to keep the big immobile bruiser ontop of someone. (You should be looking to ditch your adc asap, as you give nothing to each other and are just a free double kill)

W is maxed second. Again, E scales with AP, W gives you AP, and more importantly, it gives your stats to the slow bruiser that scales REALLY well with those stats but they cant buy because they need more defensive investment.

If you get hard counterpicked and need to play more defensively, max E second and grab guardian. But this is suboptimal and not something you should be actively looking to do.

ClockworkStriderOct 1, 20191 votes

Thanks! Do you have any tips on landing the Q? I find the turn radius of the projectile mess me up when the enemy make sharp turns

Pika FoxOct 1, 20191 votes

{quoted}

Thanks! Do you have any tips on landing the Q? I find the turn radius of the projectile mess me up when the enemy make sharp turns

Try to predict movement and plan backup strats for where its going to go ahead of time. Other than that, it heavily relies on your partner working with you to land it.

MalrothDragoniaSep 30, 20193 votes

it's mostly stylistic, Q max is good bc Yuumi's poke is very strong, and helps secure kills, but if you're a person who likes a more heal-focused play-style, Yuumi E-max is fine, at higher levels no healer is able to really out-heal proper aggression, which is why that's what you'll see more often. In solo-q it's fine, and I think many ppl underestimate how strong her heal gets when her target is low

The KombinatorSep 30, 20191 votes

{quoted}

it's mostly stylistic, Q max is good bc Yuumi's poke is very strong, and helps secure kills, but if you're a person who likes a more heal-focused play-style, Yuumi E-max is fine, at higher levels no healer is able to really out-heal proper aggression, which is why that's what you'll see more often. In solo-q it's fine, and I think many ppl underestimate how strong her heal gets when her target is low

Most heal are more like about sustaining in lane phase, and poke fight, and not about saving your a** from an all-in. Yuumi can make a choice. Her base heal is really low, but it scales a lot the lower the teammate's health is. Keeping both stacks until teammate is on low can seriously surprise the enemy. It's great for saving someone, but not much for sustain.

Against all-in enemy you should go for E to counter it. Your adc gona be on low health in no time.

Against poker you should go with Q. They get your adc on low health slowly, and your sustain heal is nearly bad as your Q.

Against enemy enchanter it's up to choice. Both works.

The only support with strong heal, that can save from all-in is Soraka. Lulu's ult might be counted as heal though it's a bit different.

preternaturalSep 30, 20192 votes

i wanted to max E on her when she was new, but all the cool kids were maxxing Q and making luden's pop on her Q so i did that instead. at the end of the day though, when all her balance changes are completed, she will probably be an E max champion like janna or leona. so yeah go ahead and max E, you aren't wrong for doing so as far as i'm concerned though it might be worthwhile to observe matchups in the interim, so there's no point in maxing E if your opponent is just gonna be uninteractive and your lvl 1 E would have healed their dmg anyway, just a thought but whatever.

Pool Party PixSep 30, 20196 votes

{quoted}

i wanted to max E on her when she was new, but all the cool kids were maxxing Q and making luden's pop on her Q so i did that instead. at the end of the day though, when all her balance changes are completed, she will probably be an E max champion like janna or leona. so yeah go ahead and max E, you aren't wrong for doing so as far as i'm concerned though it might be worthwhile to observe matchups in the interim, so there's no point in maxing E if your opponent is just gonna be uninteractive and your lvl 1 E would have healed their dmg anyway, just a thought but whatever.

I'm pretty sure you should be maxing w on Leona.

preternaturalSep 30, 20191 votes

[{quoted}](name=Pool Party Pix,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=RcFGVyo8,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2019-09-30T17:13:54.989+0000)

I'm pretty sure you should be maxing w on Leona.

that's right, i'm confusing her with someone and i don't even know who. braum? :/ must be braum

BladeSteelSep 30, 20193 votes

Probably thresh. Pretty sure braum maxes q

Pika FoxSep 30, 20192 votes

{quoted}

Probably thresh. Pretty sure braum maxes q

Thresh can also go Q max if you are confident on landing good early Qs.

BladeSteelSep 30, 20191 votes

Yeh, but of the tank supports he maxes e more than the others

Pika FoxSep 30, 20191 votes

{quoted}

Yeh, but of the tank supports he maxes e more than the others

Eh, amumu. Pretty sure tantrum is e. For the few times you wanna amumu support.

BladeSteelSep 30, 20192 votes

En I wouldn’t go e on support amumu, q is better as support. E is maxed for jg clear.

Minimac2000Sep 30, 20197 votes

{quoted}

i wanted to max E on her when she was new, but all the cool kids were maxxing Q and making luden's pop on her Q so i did that instead. at the end of the day though, when all her balance changes are completed, she will probably be an E max champion like janna or leona. so yeah go ahead and max E, you aren't wrong for doing so as far as i'm concerned though it might be worthwhile to observe matchups in the interim, so there's no point in maxing E if your opponent is just gonna be uninteractive and your lvl 1 E would have healed their dmg anyway, just a thought but whatever.

But.... leona maxes w. This isn't even debatable. Every leona maxes w>e>q

preternaturalSep 30, 20191 votes

{quoted}

But.... leona maxes w. This isn't even debatable. Every leona maxes w>e>q

ok keyboard john, thread ain't even long you can read it ya know.

Minimac2000Sep 30, 20195 votes

{quoted}

ok keyboard john, thread ain't even long you can read it ya know.

""She will probably be an e max champion like janna OR LEONA""

preternaturalSep 30, 20191 votes

{quoted}

""She will probably be an e max champion like janna OR LEONA""

fiddle maxes E, same for rakan if you're so inclined. could be any champion but ofc you don't actually read the thread after being instructed to so you don't actually know where the convo is going. soraka was E max before that was gutted too. karma is E max if you want it to be. but i digress you didn't actually read THE THREAD, did you.

ShadowParkerSep 30, 20191 votes

You’re pretty clearly in the wrong.

Just accept it and move on.

preternaturalSep 30, 20191 votes

[deleted]

ShadowParkerSep 30, 20191 votes

Instead of saying “Ah yeah I apologized in another comment” you’re calling people “Mongs”.

Get some help man

preternaturalSep 30, 20192 votes

{quoted}

Instead of saying “Ah yeah I apologized in another comment” you’re calling people “Mongs”.

Get some help man

read the thread instead of joining bandwagons. would be good if that occurred wouldn't it. [sg-poppy]

Minimac2000Oct 1, 20191 votes

{quoted}

fiddle maxes E, same for rakan if you're so inclined. could be any champion but ofc you don't actually read the thread after being instructed to so you don't actually know where the convo is going. soraka was E max before that was gutted too. karma is E max if you want it to be. but i digress you didn't actually read THE THREAD, did you.

ofc I read the thread, the person I replied to wrote those exact words IN THE THREAD lol

preternaturalOct 1, 20191 votes

{quoted}

ofc I read the thread, the person I replied to wrote those exact words IN THE THREAD lol

thresh is fiddle and rakan huh, interesting eyes you got. noted though

AbiwonKenabiOct 1, 20191 votes

Here's the thing...E is a different ability for literally every Champion.

You can't just say "supports max E" when E can be so incredibly different from Champion to Champion. Especially when one of your first two examples was Leona, who does not max E first, she maxes W and has for as long as I can remember.

I also don't think maxing E on Rakan is worth either, since its mainly used for mobility to get in and out with W engages. W is where the main focus of his kit lies.

I have never maxed E on Soraka in her current state. There have been times where I max Q for the poke and heals and W for the CD and heals, but never her silence, which I reserve for peel or engages. If she was ever an "E max champion" it was years ago before her big update when she was still a mana battery.

Reading the thread has not actually given us anymore information than what we started with, it doesn't explain why you mentioned Leona as an "E max Champion" when she isn't. After that statement the rest of your original post is entirely about Yuumi and observing matchups and maxing HER E, nothing further is stated for Leona. Telling us to "read the thread" isn't helping us understand you further. Maybe you sometimes max E on Leona? We don't know because you won't tell us and instead repeatedly order us to "read the thread".

preternaturalOct 1, 20191 votes

{quoted}

Here's the thing...E is a different ability for literally every Champion.

You can't just say "supports max E" when E can be so incredibly different from Champion to Champion. Especially when one of your first two examples was Leona, who does not max E first, she maxes W and has for as long as I can remember.

I also don't think maxing E on Rakan is worth either, since its mainly used for mobility to get in and out with W engages. W is where the main focus of his kit lies.

I have never maxed E on Soraka in her current state. There have been times where I max Q for the poke and heals and W for the CD and heals, but never her silence, which I reserve for peel or engages. If she was ever an "E max champion" it was years ago before her big update when she was still a mana battery.

Reading the thread has not actually given us anymore information than what we started with, it doesn't explain why you mentioned Leona as an "E max Champion" when she isn't. After that statement the rest of your original post is entirely about Yuumi and observing matchups and maxing HER E, nothing further is stated for Leona. Telling us to "read the thread" isn't helping us understand you further. Maybe you sometimes max E on Leona? We don't know because you won't tell us and instead repeatedly order us to "read the thread".

it's a design choice of rito lol. utility on champions is mostly present on W or E, dmg needs are fulfilled by Q pending the conceptualisation, and R simply aids in executing the other 3 or 2 pending the specific champion. sometimes the champion needs no extra execution aid so the R get's opened up for other purposes like tahm and shen. this is all over the game.

AbiwonKenabiOct 1, 20191 votes

That's fine but its just a general rule. Riven's Q is also her main mobility, Thresh's E is hard CC. There are abilities that break the rules all the time, so a blanket statement "supports max E" is never going to work.

preternaturalOct 2, 20191 votes

{quoted}

That's fine but its just a general rule. Riven's Q is also her main mobility, Thresh's E is hard CC. There are abilities that break the rules all the time, so a blanket statement "supports max E" is never going to work.

riven's Q is how she meets her dmg requirement. that is in line with the design philosophy her stun and shield (utility) are on W and E. her R makes the others stronger, ergo aiding execution. all things i said

thresh Q = dmg requirement for the kit, it get's the other things in range W = lantern, utility E = displacement, utility, along with hidden power on his auto's R = aids execution of lantern delivery, slows down opponents to E easier, permits point blank targetting of Q on slowed targets alternatively his Q get's him in range of his R, ergo fulfilling the dmg requirement of his kit. once again, in line with the design philosophy.

add some sprinkles of negative utility by introducing cast times and you get a power budget. syndra has no cast time on anything for instance so she's secretly hyper mobile because she doesn't have to stand still to cast anything, so none of her spells have any negative utility attached to them aside from her auto attacks. xerath not so much and sundry you get it surely. you're halfway there already.

wanna try doing one for janna? her W having a cast time is another reason not to invest in it but hey why share knowledge lol.

Literal IRL TreeOct 1, 20191 votes

Yeah Leona and Janna max W actually.

preternaturalOct 1, 20191 votes

[{quoted}](name=Adequate Top,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=RcFGVyo8,comment-id=00000002,timestamp=2019-10-01T00:21:37.833+0000)

Yeah Leona and Janna max W actually.

no one maxes W on janna since scorch got nerfed way back when runes reforged was new. even Q max is better than W max tbh, E max still not beaten down by the nerfs rito put on it, alleged nerfs at least wit the "rebalancing." adding to that the minion aggro change for single target spells. yeah, literally no good reason to go W max outside of using it as intended as a secondary peeling tool or first wave of disengage tools.

leona is W max, the other E maxes i was thinking of are rakan and fiddle. some say to max W on rakan but it's never actually worth it, just keep the adc alive a little longer so they can do more dmg and maybe triumph. it's much more valuable than you "maybe" landing the knockup or the q heal. but yeah, there's plenty characters who will E max in support, ideally at least lord knows people only play karma in bottom to try to be the carry with her Q, and then it's sink or swim time.

Literal IRL TreeOct 1, 20191 votes

https://na.op.gg/champion/janna/statistics/support https://na.op.gg/summoner/userName=Klarce https://na.op.gg/summoner/userName=AllPr%C3%B8 https://na.op.gg/summoner/userName=Hurricane+Janna 3 of the 5 most played Jannas in d2+ max w first you were saying?

Edit, Rakan mains go 3 in q then max E, high elo Fiddles tend to max Q to not mess with the wave

preternaturalOct 1, 20191 votes

[{quoted}](name=Adequate Top,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=RcFGVyo8,comment-id=0000000200000000,timestamp=2019-10-01T15:46:04.775+0000)

https://na.op.gg/champion/janna/statistics/support https://na.op.gg/summoner/userName=Klarce https://na.op.gg/summoner/userName=AllPr%C3%B8 https://na.op.gg/summoner/userName=Hurricane+Janna 3 of the 5 most played Jannas in d2+ max w first you were saying?

Edit, Rakan mains go 3 in q then max E, high elo Fiddles tend to max Q to not mess with the wave

https://u.gg/lol/champions/janna/build?rank=challenger&region=euw1 in EUW you max E because your carries actually have hands. you see? can't do that in NA so you get locked into aggroing minions onto yourself because the dmg is supposedly more important.

Literal IRL TreeOct 1, 20191 votes

Imagine being an elitist for a region when the best of players confirm that the difference is minute, while the golds of the region go BUT EUW IS SO MUCH BETTER!!

preternaturalOct 2, 20191 votes

[{quoted}](name=Adequate Top,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=RcFGVyo8,comment-id=000000020000000000000000,timestamp=2019-10-01T23:40:44.486+0000)

Imagine being an elitist for a region when the best of players confirm that the difference is minute, while the golds of the region go BUT EUW IS SO MUCH BETTER!!

every major region maxes E on janna in challenger btw. EU NA and KR so really...

Literal IRL TreeOct 2, 20191 votes

Most go 3 in w then max out e, just go look up some mains lol.

Póppy ChuloSep 30, 20192 votes

Personally i max E/W at the same time. Athenes rush with ardent and redemption after give so much heal/shield power for E and aery and the bonus Ap from athenes+mana regen make W max so good.

l MrD lSep 30, 20191 votes

Mainly Q because its all round good

Poke damage slow and pick potentional which works well with ganks

You dont really need to max heal as youre able to win trades with Q max damage as well as the passive shiled which you should be abusing as much as possible

Heal is only good in one situation of just literally healing any damage taken but with teh shiled passive preventing this and your Q poking them down you should be the threat not them but dont forget that because of teh free point in W youre able to get an early second point in heal anyway and with it being a % missing HP heal its already strong

ClockworkStriderOct 1, 20191 votes

Thanks! Do you have any tips on landing the Q? The turn radius more than anything else always mess me up :/

Solidair3Sep 30, 20191 votes

I max Q and E equally, with priority going to Q.

If you MUST max one, I'd go with Q because E at least scales with missing HP so it isn't super necessary to max since it has its own internal scaling.

PartholonianSep 30, 20191 votes

Most of the guides were probably created before her Q slow was massively nerfed. A guide for how to play Yuumi this patch might as well just say "Don't".

Literal IRL TreeOct 1, 20191 votes

Please don't be that useless off-brand Soraka W, just max q for lane dominance since you are literally a free poke champ if you can hit it

Shiroe OkazakiOct 1, 20191 votes

OK IM AN ACTUAL YUUMI MAIN TAKE THIS INTO CONSIDERATION

start q e level q to rank 3 then my E>W>Q they've gutted her q so past 3 just feels like nothing. if you max e you get it maxed by lvl 9 or 10 i believe then w and q. go full supp Athenes>ardent>redemption and all that. if your doing decent in lane you can get a dark seal and upgrade it to mejais to push your lead. Bigger heals and share more damage. Aery with manaflow band, absolute focus, and scorch. secondary resolve with font of life and revitilise. you have super heals and riot hasn't touched them. space your heals out with athenes to maximise your healing. hope you see this and think of it!!

ClockworkStriderOct 1, 20191 votes

Thanks for the tip! Would skipping ardent and going redemption first or second be a good idea if you dont have any champions that could make use of the attack speed (ex: mf adc, mage mid, tank top, tank/ ability based champion jg)?

Shiroe OkazakiOct 2, 20191 votes

{quoted}

Thanks for the tip! Would skipping ardent and going redemption first or second be a good idea if you dont have any champions that could make use of the attack speed (ex: mf adc, mage mid, tank top, tank/ ability based champion jg)?

i haven't tried skipping it. thats something you would have to try cuz i haven't tried it lol. But athenes is always a must. most of your healing comes from that

Bionic AvianOct 1, 20191 votes

Yuumi Main here! Wanted to offer you some advice:

If you're getting way ahead - Q. Otherwise they've kind of turned it into a 1-point-wonder. Let me explain:

Her E has been super-buffed since her release. If you really want to make the best of her, max her E first.

Here's my line of reasoning:

They cut the mana cost on her E by half, making it less cumbersome to use Level 1. Personally, it's great to take 1st as you can use it to heal your jungle, AND mitigate some early poke from enemy lane-opponents.
If you max her E first, by the time you have an you'll be healing someone for 3/4 of their health bar. There's also the factor of having a potentially maxed dark seal playing into that as well.
With the nerfs to her Q, it's just much more worth it to go E-Max first. Honestly if you go for 3 points in Q intermittently while maxing E, switch to a W max. If you're way ahead you'll just be catapulting your carries with more adaptive stats.

I'd recommend going for the following: Max E> Max W> Max Q. You won't have much damage on your Q, but the point of her now is to be annoying little buff-machine, not a ghost that can poke out enemies all game.

Item wise: I'd say item 3174 rush would be good, item 1082 is also a good 1st back item. Just don't worry about upgrading your item 3098 . The gold you spend on that is better spent on your core.

ClockworkStriderOct 1, 20191 votes

Thanks for the tip! Does that mean that putting points in q won't make much of a difference when a fight breaks out? Is Q's main purpose just to charge your frost fang and slow someone chasing you or if you are chasing someone?

Bionic AvianOct 2, 20191 votes

Your Q Is good for being able to catch people out, but the later the game gets the more defensive stats people have and the less likely you'll be able to poke at the enemy's backline. If they have a squishy team it may benefit you to put a few points into it before maxing W, but otherwise it's just so heavily underwhelming now. The best that you get is some CDR on the skill for leveling it, otherwise it's just not as worthwhile since the slow is static across all levels. It still offers some good pick potential, but don't focus on weaving it in as much during fights unless you have nothing else to cast.

Your focus during a fight shouldn't be to Q anyone really. It should be to land a good ulti, heal your marksman and utilize your double combat-summoners to win it. Oh and don't forget that passive! Once you hit level 11, you can hop off of someone, get your passive and hop right back on. It's saved many lives in the games I've played as nobody really expects the extra chunk of a functional health pool to be a factor.

If you need anymore help feel free to ask! I'd love to help you out. [slayer-jinx-catface]