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The Akali heal nerf might be too much

kda akali··28 votes·16,784 views

https://i.gyazo.com/6ea758b5ed4a4e37a5bdd85d81623333.png

The shroud nerf is perfect because it makes her less frustrating. The nerf on the q's heal isn't a good change. Most Akali mains agree with the W change but most think that the Q changes aren't good.

The nerf is bad because it removes a core mechanic that Akali has always had. When you think of Akali you think of invisibility, mobility, and healing. She's always been the healing assassin.

The main problem people have with the healing is that it's too oppressive because she can heal back after trades. If Riot wanted to balance it better they should have nerfed the amount of healing that you get from it early game, or they should have nerfed the energy gotten from w so Akali can't just place it down to get a free after with q. If riot nerfed the early game healing then it wouldn't really affect trades and it would still give her survivability in the lategame.

73 Comments

iiGazeii29 votes

I think they should move the heal to her passive empowered auto. Instead of just healing whenever she's at high energy, she'd get a chance to heal when she hits champions with abilities by committing to fighting them. This would improve her trading and dueling power without just letting her heal up as well between fights or split push endlessly.

Weiner the Pooh12 votes

She had too much. A low cd heal, cc, insane mobility, and that stealth. For an assassin with high damage, theres no reason she needs a heal, stealth and insane mobility. There was too much survivability, something had to go. The heal was the easiest to remove.

BenLegend4432 votes

[{quoted}](name=Me Not Smart,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=R7z35fxF,comment-id=0009,timestamp=2019-01-29T03:13:37.334+0000)

She had too much. A low cd heal, cc, insane mobility, and that stealth. For an assassin with high damage, theres no reason she needs a heal, stealth and insane mobility. There was too much survivability, something had to go. The heal was the easiest to remove.

She's got pretty low damage for a assassin. Mages do hella more damage too.

Weiner the Pooh2 votes

Mages do hella more damage than everyone.

BenLegend4431 votes

[{quoted}](name=Me Not Smart,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=R7z35fxF,comment-id=000900020000,timestamp=2019-01-29T23:37:19.036+0000)

Mages do hella more damage than everyone.

Which is exactly why she needs sustain.

Weiner the Pooh1 votes

Have you ever played vs Akali as a melee? Its miserable trying to trade with her, just for her to out trade you, stealth, and then heal it all up on minions. If the heal was only on champs, that'd be fine, but her just healing off minions sucks to play against.

BenLegend4432 votes

[{quoted}](name=Me Not Smart,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=R7z35fxF,comment-id=00090002000000000000,timestamp=2019-01-30T14:41:17.554+0000)

Have you ever played vs Akali as a melee? Its miserable trying to trade with her, just for her to out trade you, stealth, and then heal it all up on minions. If the heal was only on champs, that'd be fine, but her just healing off minions sucks to play against.

I personally don't play melee mids other than Akali. I do play Karthus however, and my item 3165 makes her healing useless. One tick of my E(or 1 non-single target Q for that matter), nullifies her heal. I also have all AOE damage(except for R, but whatever), so her shroud is nothing to me. You managed to kill me? No problem, I'll still kill you. Even if Akali roams(Karthus can't, he's too slow), I'll just ult from halfway across the map and make up for it. I don't think Akali's a problem. Compared to Zed, she's relatively easy to deal with.

Weiner the Pooh1 votes

So it doesn't affect one champ? WOWIE! It must be useless then. However Akali is not just a mid laner, she can easily go top, where she is more likely to encounter melee characters, who literally can not trade with her. Most have a hard time trading to begin with, and her heal makes it even harder.

Just because a few ranged characters have no problem with her heal doesnt mean its fine. But i guess it makes sense you think that, almost nobody, including a lot at Riot don't care how things affect melee characters.

BenLegend4433 votes

[{quoted}](name=Me Not Smart,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=R7z35fxF,comment-id=0009000200000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-02-01T20:40:44.868+0000)

So it doesn't affect one champ? WOWIE! It must be useless then. However Akali is not just a mid laner, she can easily go top, where she is more likely to encounter melee characters, who literally can not trade with her. Most have a hard time trading to begin with, and her heal makes it even harder.

Just because a few ranged characters have no problem with her heal doesnt mean its fine. But i guess it makes sense you think that, almost nobody, including a lot at Riot don't care how things affect melee characters.

Ok, so she goes top. Most top laners are fighters and tanks(except for Quinn, but assassins are supposed to shit on marksmen). Tanks can just straight up tank all the damage. Fighters can do that too, but to a limited extent. For top lane, I play Yorick and Camille. They're both tanky enough that Akali can't kill them easily. Yorick's also got his own heal, that doubles when he's low. Camille also has her own heals too, from Tactical Sweep. The shroud is a problem for them however, but we're talking about the heal here. Akali dives me? I smack her with a Last Rites or Precision Protocol and there's a quarter of her health. Yorick's R and Camille's R also makes Akali's anybody's life a pain considering it makes them do % of max health damage. I think it's only other assassins that have problems, cuz I don't when I play fighters.

thankarezos2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Me Not Smart,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=R7z35fxF,comment-id=0009,timestamp=2019-01-29T03:13:37.334+0000)

She had too much. A low cd heal, cc, insane mobility, and that stealth. For an assassin with high damage, theres no reason she needs a heal, stealth and insane mobility. There was too much survivability, something had to go. The heal was the easiest to remove.

just like any other assasin. look kha for example

Dasdi969 votes

Honestly I agree, they need to compensate her somewhat.

Khâmul7 votes

The healing assassin? on top of the shroud where she can't be targeted? she had an overloaded kit

CM0NEY6 votes

They are moving in the right direction with Akali. These changes are in the same vein of what they are trying with Irelia. Removing the problematic parts of their kit so they can add power into the fundamental part of their kits. I expect buffs will be coming shortly.

VolatileAkali4 votes

Healing was and is fundamental, your delusional to not think so.

Ghostlypoke1 votes

{quoted}

Healing was and is fundamental, your delusional to not think so.

first nerf ehh dude have you even been following the nerfs to her Q and Ws that really shows you dont know much [slayer-jinx-unamused]

shadowhunter44441 votes

Healing has always been fundamental to Akali. There's a reason she builds gunblade as soon as possible every game. What they have done is take away her healing in the laning phase when it is vital, especially against champions with easy poke

Linna Excel4 votes

So she's losing her shourd, she's losing her heal, gunblade is bad on her ATM, and her winrate is already kind of low. I think she's going to be in the gutter if this goes through. If they do get rid of the heal, I think it's time to call the rework a failure from a gameplay perspective and riot needs to get her reworked again early next year.

Weiner the Pooh5 votes

How is gunblade bad on her? Its her core item in every build, and is always rushed. Also shes not losing her shroud, it only doesn't work under tower, which is logical. Yasuo W doesn't stop turrets, Fiora's W doesn't ignore turrets, Jax's E doesn't, nothing ignores turret like hers did.

Linna Excel1 votes

I'm looking at the winrate of the item. Part of me is wondering if everyone is buying it because it was core on old akali. I wish there were 2-3 more items people would occasionally rush first just so I'd have something to compare it with. As is, I can't say that the item is helping her ATM. I mean TF is rushed 1% of the time and has a 52% win rate, but that's a pretty small sample size. LB isn't rushed but also is a good win rate. It is possible she needs to rush one of those items as her first core item instead of gunblade.

At the least from an analytical standpoint, gunblade is terrible if only because it's inseparable from her.

From a game-balance standpoint, it's terrible because Akali is parasitic on gunblade. There's no variance. I'm not sure a champion should be dependent on getting a single item, first, every game.

Weiner the Pooh1 votes

There are champs completely reliant on rushing a certain item. Fiora with Hydra, Kled with Hydra, any ADC and stormrazor. Certain champs have certain items they need.

Moonscourge1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Me Not Smart,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=R7z35fxF,comment-id=0004000000000000,timestamp=2019-01-30T00:45:55.303+0000)

There are champs completely reliant on rushing a certain item. Fiora with Hydra, Kled with Hydra, any ADC and stormrazor. Certain champs have certain items they need.

Except that they want the Tiamat, not the Hydra. 1350g. Akali NEEDS an item that costs more than twice that.

shadowhunter44441 votes

Akali has always been a sustain assassin. With them removing the heal from her q, gunblade becomes even more important for that. You can't play Akali without gunblade, you'll just die constantly. That doesn't make either Akali or gunblade bad, it just means that her early build path is somewhat linear. This is hardly unique in this game.

MankeyMadness1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Me Not Smart,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=R7z35fxF,comment-id=00040000,timestamp=2019-01-29T03:15:53.407+0000)

How is gunblade bad on her? Its her core item in every build, and is always rushed. Also shes not losing her shroud, it only doesn't work under tower, which is logical. Yasuo W doesn't stop turrets, Fiora's W doesn't ignore turrets, Jax's E doesn't, nothing ignores turret like hers did.

Yasuo R doesn't out him in tower aggro range even if hes outside of his own auto range of the target. Yet this is entirely fine?

Profirix4 votes

I hate the champion but a CDR nerf and the removal of heal on Q on top of the tower visibility changes is going WAY too far.

DoktorKaiser4 votes

No, it's time to go back to the balancing roots of season 1 and 2. If something is overloaded as fuck and makes players miserable then gut it to the ground and work from that. Should also be applied to Yasuo, Camille, Zoe, KaiSa and Pyke, straight up remove parts of their kits and work from there.

TheFlame981 votes

I agree with that.

Marjonxxxx1 votes

You know the drill, if it isn’t overpowered in proplay, it’s a okay

TheFlame984 votes

Akali was my main when i start playing LoL. After the first rework ,what included just W rework,it was ok. After the BIG rework,it was realy hard to adapt the new Akali,but i was happy bcz healing still exist in her Q but in another form,and that W was insane. But when i see this news,i was like ''another rework???Oh god, please no''. I see W will be reworked,NO MORE INVINCIBILITY IN TOWERS,that's ok,i don't use that to much,but no more healing from her Q,it's just like a applepie without apple,or a coffe with milk,but without milk,(you understand what i want to say). You guys are gona deep in s**t with that,go rework another cancer champs,like veigar,zyra,etc. etc. Akali had suffer to much,to many reworks,just let her like she was,and asasin with some healing skils. If that rework will come, i think im gona play DOTA INSTEAD OF LoL. summoner 4 [sg-janna]

yay pink3 votes

The age Akali is over.... the time of Vayne has come

BestPudgeNA3 votes

She will still be OP broken god tier. Although the Q nerf is actually the first real nerf she has been given so that's nice

Marjonxxxx1 votes

Except for the fact that her W cd has been increased from 12 to 21 seconds rank one due to many nerfs but that’s not a nerf noooo

NightwingScarab1 votes

OP broken god tier huh? -Winrates, playrates, and ban rates dropping constantly -hardly ever able to keep up with trades due to her squishiness and newfound lack of sustain -most teamfights, she can't even get her second dash off; she's just melted. If a bunch of people are complaining about it, maybe consider the fact that there might be an actual issue.

NLX Smn2 votes

Sometimes it feels like riot doesn‘t even know their game

Hanuchan2 votes

Agreed. I don't main or play Akali at all and I despise playing against her, but even I agree that meeting the healing is a bit much. Nerfing W is a good move though.

MoonLight281 votes

Part of the old Akali identity was her healing... if they take that away, what is left of my loved champ?? She will just have the same name, that nerf is really stupid and unnecesary, at least for me.

Marjonxxxx1 votes

The shroud is still here!....for now

UlyssesISR1 votes

Shroud nerf is getting cheers but somehow tower diving is still somehow allowed to be a thing.

Hmm, surely there is no conscious bias at all going on here..

shadowhunter44441 votes

...Are you advocating the removal of tower diving as a strategy in LoL?

UlyssesISR1 votes

{quoted}

...Are you advocating the removal of tower diving as a strategy in LoL?

I wouldn't be opposed to it. But that's not the point I was trying to make either.

People act like Akali was the only one who could hover under a tower and damage/kill other players is what I'm getting at.

Marjonxxxx1 votes

But certainly not one to dive under turret and get less damage than normal. Pantheon can block a turret shot too so people saying only akali can turret dive like that have not checked every champion yet

UlyssesISR1 votes

{quoted}

But certainly not one to dive under turret and get less damage than normal. Pantheon can block a turret shot too so people saying only akali can turret dive like that have not checked every champion yet

Yes exactly. I'v seen Yi's press Q just at the right time to avoid turret damage and still score kills.

People are full of crap on this forum.

Marjonxxxx1 votes

It’s easy to forget other champions with something similar I’ll admit, but some people are always whining about stupid things without checking facts.

Savant Akali1 votes

The biggest issue with them nerfing her passive is that it will destroy her early game. The only reason I'm able to fight most mid laners with akali is because of her heal off of the Q, you take that away and you will be auto'd to death. Even with her heal off her Q I find myself using pots and having to back before lv 4 depending on who it is I am facing (Ahri). This was a dumb nerf and they should of nerfed the scaling of the amount of healing from gunblade not her own passive. She was always known as the spellvamp assassin that I loved for years and now shes now a variation of Kat -.-

shadowhunter44441 votes

Ok, but let's not forget she's always been a variation of Kat. Akali was my first main back in 2013 and kept that position throughout my history with LoL. I originally picked her up because Kat, who I had enjoyed, had just gone off the free rotation and Akali had come on. I found her to be remarkably similar so I tried her, and found she was more fun. But she and Kat were still two sides of the same coin.

shadowhunter44441 votes

It's certainly a huge nerf, especially on the competitive scene, but she's still a ton of fun to play. She's still really strong if she can get ahead early, but that is almost impossible to do as she loses practically every matchup. I think they did need to scale back the healing on her q, and the w change is good, but she needs some way to win lane if she plays well. What I think they should have done is just give her the heal on her q if she slows champions with it (i.e. hits them with the outermost edge). That would get her some sustain without her being able to be dominant for free.

GabeKolve1 votes

U gotta remember items like hextech Gunblade make it so she can still heal off her Q.

Malix Farwin1 votes

The problem with her having a heal is that she is a manaless champion, with it she has no reason to back and can just sustain in lane. if she was mana based it would make sense but she is not.

Emılia1 votes

i was an OTP akali, she has became so useless in lane right now, i mean, the shroud nerf was a good decision and all, but her Q was a mistake, now when you match up against agressive champs like talon, ekko, yasuo, zed, you just cant outtrade them anymore, you can no longer farm from level 3-4 because she will just start to get bullied in lane, basically ending up with a loss at lane, maybe even losing a game. my point is that she is too weak at this point, and that her Q nerf was a huge mistake

CosOmak691 votes

you guys are buffing syndra and nerfing akali woow

Zeyphel1 votes

The thing is that she has too many tools to have a heal. She has an almost permanent movement speed boost just by spamming Q and using W, 3 Dashes and 1 Gap closer. Oh! aaaand ! She slows you! You know, just in case that she mmm... couldn't reach you with her 1000 movement tools.

Btw, Did I mention the "you do no damage to me" ability?

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