JUNGLERS - THE WORST ALLIES?

andyjobo·Aug 17, 2014·1 votes·824 views

How do you respond to a Jungler who refuses to support your lane?

We've all had that game where you're in over your head - either because your opponent counter-picked you or is flat out a better player than you - and you politely ask your Jungler for some help, only to get "Fuck you, noob!" as a response. I have literally begged Junglers to come to my lane, just to help provide pressure against an opponent who pushes relentlessly, and literally never saw him near my lane all game. HELP?!

I contend that Jungle is probably the most important role in League, and yet it's played by idiots because it is perceived as "simple". How many times has skirmish changed directions because your jungler knew where he had to be and when? But then when you ask for help, they act like arrogant fuck-wits and then INTENTIONALLY never visit your lane to help. Sigh...

6 Comments

Akaoni NanashiAug 17, 20145 votes

I would consider my best role to be Jungle. and as a jungler there are many things that i consider before i even think about ganking a lane. things like: how much CC is there on my team? Am i Master Yi trying to gank a Siver/Soraka bot lane? if so, there is no hard CC in that situation and the gank will probably at best burn a flash. how much CC is there on the enemy laner? am i ganking a Level 6 Malzahar or fiddle or Leona/Varus? if so has their CC been blown? How fed/behind are my teammates/Opponents? how high of a priority is the gank, am i stopping a Nasus early so as to deny the late game tower smasher? Am i looking to help bring down a tower? Where was the Opponent Jungler last seen?

as a jungler i'm trying to use all this information to prioritise ganking, farming, counter jungling, and buying items. if your bot for instance, and your lane is in trouble, and you ask for a gank, i might come bot, if i'm close and the other lanes are pushed. but what if i could help take both the mid and to T1 towers? i'm going to do that, and i would hope that in the mean time you would play safe, maybe let your T1 go but not hand the enemy a double kill as well. you will get help, but it might not happen on your timescale. i've had games where i've fed 3 kills top lane, but asked the jungler to gank OTHER lanes, and we end up denying 4 opponents objectives while letting on have a tower or two.

the most important thing to remember is that you're part of a team, and you will succeed or fail as a team. you must trust you team to do whats best, and if they don't then move on. but never yell at them, never curse at them, for that only makes a bad situation worse. some games are not winnable, and i mean that. you will not win every game, and you should not expect to. you and teammates will make mistakes, but instead of focusing on them, try to minimise the mistakes that are made and move on, either to try to win the game or to play another.

also, never, NEVER, EVER type "sigh". its the most lazy, passive aggressive statement you can make, and it is never going to help a situation, and it makes you look like a spoiled child.

AthenasVendettaAug 17, 20141 votes

There is much more to it than that... But good variables none the less. The core questions to the jungler when ganking or asked is positioning of the team and enemy team. Skills up/down and summoners up or down. This being said, I will never deny a gank to a lane why because it does not help the team cohesion. This being said I might just suddenly appear to give you breathing room creating a known threat where most adcs , and supports will back up.

But like you said, The main thing is what CAN we do?

Say you are losing lane due to a difference in cs, not a large amount but its gaining with time. Or simply you are frustrated because they managed to lock you or your support down and have a slight kill lead.

My thought starts with:

Who am I playing? (Vi, Lee, Elise, Evelynn, Maokai, Yi, Tryndamere?) What are my options? (Top of the jungle, try to race across map, Lower jungle, look for a weakness or mistake) How far are they pushed? (Under tower, 3/4 pushed, 1/2, 1/4, under tower) Where did I last see the enemy jungler and mid? where was the last time I was jungle at what stage would you be in rotation, where is the mid, could he be ganking as well?) What sort of vision control do we have? ( Complete control of objectives and river, and tris, contested with blind spots, none) Do we have a chance to lock them down? (If ganking are we goin to be able to lock down a champion with cc and guarantee a kill and assists?) what are the advantage of ganking hard versus a flash burner? (Am I giving you breathing room? We looking for the tower? Or are we going to get a Dragon with the control we produce?) Finally, what is our and my next goal? (We rotating mid to take tower and maybe a kill? Or we trying to take top? maybe a early baron is able?)

And the questions repeat.

SunfieldAug 17, 20143 votes

Jungler by no means is required to gank your lane. Junglers job consists of 3 lanes, 2 buffs, dragon and baron.

So if there is anything else i need to do with a higher chance of success, you bet I wont visit your lane once. Intentionaly. Because junglers take care of the entire map, not your own lane

OTH RadarAug 17, 20142 votes

As a jungler, there is one thing I wish I could tell every league of legends player more than anything else in the world:

IT IS NOT MY JOB TO WIN YOUR LANE.

Yes, I am here to help, and yes I will take advantage when the enemy is pushing towards our tower and is in a bad position. But if you're not CSing, you're making poor decisions, and your lane is suffering because of it (or even if you're simply outskilled) it is not my job to win your lane.

Often I will go help a winning lane to increase pressure on that side of the map and take a tower. When a lane is already winning really hard, it can be crippling for a jungler to come in and create even more pressure. If you are losing a lane I will only come help if I see it being the best thing for the team as a whole. If I'm concerned they'll be able to win a 2 v 3 under tower because you're 4 levels behind and you can't hit a skillshot, you can be damn sure I'm going to steer clear of that lane so they don't pick up a kill on me, as well. If I die defending a failing lane, I will not be able to put pressure in important places on the map, I will be useless for buff control, and I will lose experience.

You do have a point, because bottom lane should be highly pressured by a jungler since Dragon is your first major objective, but regardless, and I'll say it one more time:

IT IS NOT MY JOB TO WIN YOUR LANE.

MonoblairAug 18, 20142 votes

Keep in mind that it's sometimes better for jungler to keep snowball lanes snowballed than for all lanes to do decent. Id rather have a fizz/zed/akali/talon snowball and win the game due to that than have all my lanes do a little better then the other teams lanes and just have a slight lead.

Kazellion2Aug 18, 20141 votes

Also if there's not a strong roaming champ you're freeing up it's not always a terrible thing to let a tier 1 tower go in a bad lane matchup.

As a counterpoint to the original post very very often as a jungler you'll come to a lane and then the laner wont engage the enemy at all and waste your time completely sitting back last hitting from max range(time is the big factor in jungling, time spent ganking vs time spent keeping up with farm).

Someone asking for help is rarely a deciding factor on a jungler helping that persons lane, a jungler may "hold" your lane while you back when asked or make the most of an oportunity(if you let them know summoners on cooldown etc) but you yourself wanting help is a very low variable in the descision of where to be as a jungler.