Nerf Riven

RegiinaPhalange·Feb 26, 2019·76 votes·19,389 views

U.GG LoL Riven Build & Runes Guide Top Jungle Mid Bot Support S9

High skilled champion with 15% pick rate.

54% win rate

Soooo...somehow everyone can play riven, "SHOCKING" "Intense high skilled champion"

120 Comments

RagnaveilFeb 26, 201946 votes

If Riven mains want their animation canceling, then fine, but let us take some damage off in return then.

ModAcademy KaynFeb 27, 201912 votes

Animation canceling is already in her power budget, if anything, getting rid of it would prompt them to buff her damage. Riven's only strong because of Conqueror synergizing like a mad man with her, and possibly item 3161 .

VolatileAkaliFeb 27, 20199 votes

She is too good at a lot of things, assassinations, long fights, team fights, skirmishes and 1v1's. The huge majority of champions aren't good at every type of fighting.

ModAcademy KaynFeb 27, 20192 votes

She's not that good at Teamfights, she gets bodied like every other Melee, and unless you're stacked on top of each other, she can still only focus one person down.

VolatileAkaliFeb 27, 20196 votes

Sure, but as an AoE heavy champion, you can do a lot of dmg to a few people in team fights. Unlike other melees, she has an extremely good shield that scales with AD, which most champions don't have a shield that scales with their main damage especially AD champions.

Skeletons GraveFeb 26, 201931 votes

why does riven have AD ratios on her utility skills (stun and shield) while all other ad melee champs have AP ratios on theirs?

AlzonFeb 26, 201920 votes

Or HP ratios, or no ratios at all

wolviusFeb 26, 201913 votes

{quoted}

Or HP ratios, or no ratios at all

Or nerfed to the ground ratios https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-DkCeGMMN0CY/XGYYOPbOjoI/AAAAAAABO1o/Cdl4to_pHFwI5ttVlHpbn2vXC8MvNxb2gCLcBGAs/s1600/urgotw1.png ######and base

General Esdeath Feb 27, 20198 votes

[{quoted}](name=Skeletons Grave,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=QHHT6cgu,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2019-02-26T23:24:20.451+0000)

why does riven have AD ratios on her utility skills (stun and shield) while all other ad melee champs have AP ratios on theirs?

Because if she didn't she'd only have Q for damage so...

Automated RivenFeb 27, 20197 votes

{quoted}

Because if she didn't she'd only have Q for damage so...

Q barely does damage. Same with w. A q does less then an auto and a w does a tiny bit more. Rivens autos are the vast majority of her damage. Her 1shot combos rely on landing a q/w/auto and her ulti at the same time. Most of them use at least two autos and two q's.

RagnaveilFeb 27, 20193 votes

Hence why the ratios are skyhigh. She's pretty much like Rek'Sai. Ratio increases to compensate mediocre gameplay, then one (or more) change(s) gets implemented and breaks them. Same thing happened with Vik during pre-Worlds/Beginning of Worlds last year.

Automated RivenFeb 27, 20191 votes

{quoted}

Hence why the ratios are skyhigh. She's pretty much like Rek'Sai. Ratio increases to compensate mediocre gameplay, then one (or more) change(s) gets implemented and breaks them. Same thing happened with Vik during pre-Worlds/Beginning of Worlds last year.

Her ratios aren't that high tho. Her W is 1.0 ratio and each q at Max rank is .8, 2.4 if you hit all three. Basically the equivalent of 3 non empowered autos if you use all three Q's to hit the target.

Rivens almost the entirety of rivens damage comes from her empowered autos. For example, if riven autos you three times and casts q 3 times she will do more or less double the damage too you with auto attacks. Her stun is the same damage as an empowered auto later in the game. And since all your autos should be empowered her q×3 and her w give you like 2.5 bonus autos worth of damage.

Her DPS is tied with landing empowered autos and using her 3 aa resets to get them off quicker, while also using her mobility to avoid damage/lockdown.

Hitting her kit ratios will barely, if at all, effect riven.

RagnaveilFeb 27, 20191 votes

Then what would you do to nerf her but not kill her?

Automated RivenFeb 27, 20192 votes

{quoted}

Then what would you do to nerf her but not kill her?

Hit conquerer and spear. Neither is good for the game. Conquerer is already getting gutted from what I understand. And spear needs the passive removed. It's complete aids. And it's not just riven that it's aids on. After that then we can assess the situation again. Otherwise if riven absolutely had to get nerfed, because the problem served to be her instead of the items. I would suggest hitting the initial passive damage. Lower early and same late. And potentially trading some damage for her fast q speed back. Making her roughly similar or slightly lower strength as the cost of requiring the skill to pull it off again.

It's not the easiest thing to balance but TBH I think she is only OP right now, or really strong anyhow, because of the Conquerer/DD/spear combo. Which is 3 items which really never should have existed anyhow.

kingDeDeDariusFeb 27, 20192 votes

And passive, and R....I mean, you could make the same silly argument that tryn only has auto attack damage and E damage...

General Esdeath Feb 28, 20192 votes

{quoted}

And passive, and R....I mean, you could make the same silly argument that tryn only has auto attack damage and E damage...

And Trynd builds for that exact reason, and look at the state he's in

RïvêńFeb 26, 201918 votes

You can find similar winrates and PR's on a lot of toplaners who use Conqueror or Spear, everyone expected Riven to become too strong after new Conq and Spear combo...

It's not that the champ with 49-51% WR for years is broken, it's that Riot released another broken Rune iteration and decided to keep the too strong Essence Flare.

Edit: https://lolalytics.com/ranked/worldwide/platinum/plus/home/

rayzoFeb 28, 20191 votes

{quoted}

You can find similar winrates and PR's on a lot of toplaners who use Conqueror or Spear, everyone expected Riven to become too strong after new Conq and Spear combo...

It's not that the champ with 49-51% WR for years is broken, it's that Riot released another broken Rune iteration and decided to keep the too strong Essence Flare.

Edit: https://lolalytics.com/ranked/worldwide/platinum/plus/home/

lmfao a riven main saying all this, not surprised

RïvêńFeb 28, 20191 votes

[{quoted}](name=Raymønd Åmantius,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=QHHT6cgu,comment-id=00050001,timestamp=2019-02-28T21:39:15.794+0000)

lmfao a riven main saying all this, not surprised

Hey, I'm being civil here and looking at facts, and facts show that it's NOT just Riven that's too strong right now, sure she may be super toxic to go against, or super fun to, I've heard both of those from people, just depends on who you like to play and how much you like dealing with people who can combo you, E.G I've seen Fiora mains say the matchup is fun, but seen Sion mains say it's a shit show, which is correct.

Toxic =/= OP

rayzoFeb 28, 20192 votes

{quoted}

Hey, I'm being civil here and looking at facts, and facts show that it's NOT just Riven that's too strong right now, sure she may be super toxic to go against, or super fun to, I've heard both of those from people, just depends on who you like to play and how much you like dealing with people who can combo you, E.G I've seen Fiora mains say the matchup is fun, but seen Sion mains say it's a shit show, which is correct.

Toxic =/= OP

54% winrate with a 15% pick rate is definitely OP. I don't care what you say, the facts tell us otherwise.

INoble KnightIFeb 27, 201912 votes

Singed had a lower winrate/pickrate and he was hotfixed after a fucking day.

USG FailsawceFeb 27, 20198 votes

god forbid less popular champs get to have some glory days.. all i ever see is

Riven Yasuo LeeSin Vayne Lucian

riot doesn't play favorites tho.. heavens no.

Brain Errör 404Feb 26, 20199 votes

You can't really nerf Riven without dumpstering her. Riot's gonna have to look at this new conqueror rn.

ŚhunpoFeb 27, 20199 votes

No, revert Conqueror and remove Spear of Shojin. There, problem solved.

Festive BearFeb 27, 20197 votes

[{quoted}](name=Seth L9,realm=OCE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=QHHT6cgu,comment-id=000e,timestamp=2019-02-27T02:52:08.611+0000)

No, revert Conqueror and remove Spear of Shojin. There, problem solved.

Just the spear, just this damn spear

New conqueror forces you to fight, not sit back and get free true damage

ŚhunpoFeb 27, 20198 votes

[{quoted}](name=Festive Bear,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=QHHT6cgu,comment-id=000e0000,timestamp=2019-02-27T04:53:27.545+0000)

Just the spear, just this damn spear

New conqueror forces you to fight, not sit back and get free true damage

New Conqueror is equally as gross. If anything they should just bring back old Fervor.

BrightWîngsFeb 27, 20194 votes

old conqueror made top lane boring as fuck was just who ever hits the wave first gets wave control and from that point it just consisted of bouncing waves. who ever had conq up the other just had to sit back and wait for the wave to push into them because fighting them is damn near suicide.

ŚhunpoFeb 27, 20192 votes

{quoted}

old conqueror made top lane boring as fuck was just who ever hits the wave first gets wave control and from that point it just consisted of bouncing waves. who ever had conq up the other just had to sit back and wait for the wave to push into them because fighting them is damn near suicide.

And this current Conqueror is even worse in terms of all-inning and it can be abused by mages. So, your point?

kingDeDeDariusFeb 27, 20192 votes

Funny thing though, it ISN'T abused by mages, because it's anti-synergies with 95% of the mage roster and in an anti-synergistic rune tree. By the time they proc it, all their spells are on cool down. Absolutely useless, plus the other runes in that tree are actual garbage for mages most of the time

ŚhunpoFeb 27, 20191 votes

{quoted}

Funny thing though, it ISN'T abused by mages, because it's anti-synergies with 95% of the mage roster and in an anti-synergistic rune tree. By the time they proc it, all their spells are on cool down. Absolutely useless, plus the other runes in that tree are actual garbage for mages most of the time

Cassiopeia Azir Ryze Sylas

HammermancerFeb 27, 20193 votes

[{quoted}](name=Seth L9,realm=OCE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=QHHT6cgu,comment-id=000e0001000000000000,timestamp=2019-02-27T17:10:32.320+0000)

Ryze might be viable

Azir Cassiopeia dont use it because its suboptimal

Sylas is a (currently overtuned)fighter, the rune was made for champs like him. He needs nerfs and the rune isn't why

DingDongDangerFeb 27, 20198 votes

She's super tilting to fight. Leaps everywhere and when you do hit her you just get stunned and then she gets a shield immediately after and constantly escapes with 1 hit left because of it.

BoilTheOilFeb 27, 20196 votes

People complain about yasuo but not riven its kinda weird

Storn SaroeFeb 27, 201910 votes

Its because for the last two years or so she has had no changes, sat at a below average win rate, and not been competitively viable. She has hard lane counters, is relatively poor at team fighting, and wasn't even one of the best abusers of old conqueror. The problem happened when essence reaver (now spear) became popular and have now updated conqueror (probably the bigger problem) where she abuses them better than anyone else, and allows her to scale into late game far better then she had ever done prior.

IPromiseTomorrowFeb 27, 20193 votes

Yas is more commonly seen is the biggest reason why more people want him to get nerfed. He's met everyone the most often.

TimeToDieSuckersFeb 27, 20195 votes

It doesn't matter what made riven OP, whether its spear, conqueror or anything. If she's OP and they aren't removing spear or nerfing conqueror then she needs nerfs.

Also..obviously players get better every year and what was once high skill cap years ago, will obviously only get easier every year.

Spear is annoying, but either way even when she doesn't build spear her winrate hardly budges at all. As far as I can tell in korea riven still has 54% winrate and doesn't build spear.

RagnaveilFeb 27, 20192 votes

Yeah, and the huge issue is, they are only balancing Riven around her mains. Thats it. Its about time that special treatment dies.

ShleelpboyFeb 27, 20194 votes

Negative nerf yasuo #NerfYasuo

ShussFeb 27, 20194 votes

Or just remove conqueror. Ever since that rune was introduce.. the game became so stupid.

TrollsShouldDieFeb 27, 20194 votes

Yes, it takes an enormous amount of skill to mash buttons without any fear of running out of mana, group stunning the entire enemy team and negating all damage with a shield that gets bigger by stacking damage. Clearly all the highest skilled players just all happen to play Riven.

TheDärkExileFeb 27, 20194 votes

Spear and Conqueror lowered her skill cap drastically (Even hashinshin managed to not int without basic knowledge) but nerfing her isn't the way to fix this because it will kill other playstyles and force ppl to build conq/spear or lose the game. (I personally like klepto/thunderlords more)

The way to fix this would be reverting conqueror (or just removing the healing or changing how it interacts with her Q)

We'll see what riot has to say, 9.5 we're expecting conq nerfs and maybe some changes to spear

Princess BunheadFeb 27, 20193 votes

I'm more in the "let's remove "Awakened Dragon/Essence Flare" passive from Spear of Shojin, and take it from there. Might still be in need of nerfs, along with Jax...

haaaaaaalpFeb 27, 20193 votes

[{quoted}](name=Princess Bunhead,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=QHHT6cgu,comment-id=0016,timestamp=2019-02-27T08:55:55.336+0000)

I'm more in the "let's remove "Awakened Dragon/Essence Flare" passive from Spear of Shojin, and take it from there. Might still be in need of nerfs, along with Jax...

Why rework an entire item just to keep riven and Jax balanced? Nerf the champions who are broken with the item and let everyone else keep it.

Princess BunheadFeb 27, 20195 votes

Because the whole concept of that passive is cancerous/unhealthy as fuck. There's no good way to balance it, other than make it into something else entirely.

kingDeDeDariusFeb 27, 20193 votes

Essence flare deserves to be removed by its own merits. It's a terrible mechanic that shouldn't exist

TheDärkExileFeb 27, 20191 votes

Why completely ruin a rune (pre rework klepto) because Ezreal abuses it

Oh wait

HammermancerFeb 27, 20192 votes

{quoted}

Why completely ruin a rune (pre rework klepto) because abuses it

Oh wait

Well i mean, ezreal can't be altered, everything must be nerfed around ezreal

kingDeDeDariusFeb 27, 20192 votes

Agree, essence flare had no place in the game

Hexs FortuneFeb 27, 20192 votes

The frustrating thing is Riot is the reason behind Riven being so strong, yet they take their sweet time nerfing her back in to proper order.

MandarillFeb 28, 20192 votes

Daily reminder that Hashinshin won four ranked games on Riven despite never touching her once before. He even went on to say that Riven mechanics were ezpz.