Maokai could use CSing buffs

Jdap··2 votes·1,351 views

Note: I think Maokai in general is fine, and doesn't desperately need any extra damage, CC, or tanking power vs. other champions. However, his laning phase can be rather frustrating just because of his poor CSing.

Here is a quick list of all the little issues Maokai has with CSing that all add up to be a rather big issue:

  • Although his attack speed is rather high, a lot of the attack animation is in the windup, meaning its still slow for CSing.

  • His Q at melee range is delayed just enough (0.35s) that it doesn't combo after an auto or W fast enough to combo properly.

  • His Q travels rather slowly to its max range, and combined with its low damage, can make it tough to CS with.

  • Maokai has a pretty big model, low movespeed, and low (125) auto range. He is prone to creep block which exacerbates the problems with his slow autos and Q.

  • His W does very low damage (50-150+40%AP), and despite its speed it can be hard to CS minions being piled on by your minions. if youre behind, at some points in the game an auto plus level 1 W cant last hit casters under turret after one turret shot.

  • His sapling E is legendarily hard to CS with, and in addition to awkward timing it does very low damage when out of brush.

  • Since Maxing E or W second both have benefits, you either have a W that is terrible for CSing or an E that offers weak waveclear and champion damage, even when placed in brush.

  • Maokai loves catalyst, mana, CDR, and hence items like righteous glory, since in fights you want to be casting spells and utilizing your passive as much as possible. A Bami's Cinder is nice on Maokai but you often need items like T2 boots, bramble vest, catalyst, righteous to be functional in teamfights.

Maokai is not the best laner, especially with things like ignite Cassiopeia, Teemo, Lucian, Tryndamere, Riven etc. being standard fare in top lane. When you are being pressured and potentially zoned by these threats and the possibility of ganks, you can miss so much CS simply because Maokais tools are too slow, low range, and low damage.

Does he deserve to have such bad CSing? I personally don't think so; he isn't exactly 100% pick/ban and his CSing could be helped while not affecting any other aspects about him.

Lots of other (recent!) champions have CSing assistance; Kai'Sa Q deals double damage to minions below 30% health, Kled Q does 50% more damage to minions, Irelia Q and Aatrox W both do double damage to Minions. Even Urgot W does far more damage to minions than champions early.

Do other tanks need CSing help? Not as much; Sion has his instant W shield pop and a Q that can be snap cast, Ornn Q and W come out fast and can be combo'd with his autos easily, Cho'Gath has an auto reset and all his abilities do a lot of damage to minions. Mundo needs no explanation.

Here are a few suggestions for what could be done to help Maokai, while limiting impact on the rest of his gameplay. These are not suggestions in tandem, one could be employed without the others:

  • Have his W do double damage to minions. In addition, a slight damage buff at all levels (+5/10) would go a long way in helping him CS.
  • Have his Q do a % (~25%) more damage to minions.
  • Reduce the 0.35s delay on his Q and decrease the projectile speed appropriately, so that it combos better with autos.

Although they can be awkward, Maokais autos and his saplings are rather iconic and as such I don't think they should be sped up to help him CS.

2 Comments

Noor Sakata1 votes

Yeah , they should make his Basic attacks land faster on minions , but probably it's slow because you know , his Passive heal

MrFawknSunshine1 votes

well there is a simple solution to this. and its the flex runes for Adaptive damage.

you should be able to choose if you want it to give you ad or ap.

as maokai if you could chose the +9% AS as your 1st rune or go adaptive and chose to get +6 ad this would help alot in last hitting with autos. he already has one of the highest base ADs and AS in game due to the fact that he was a jungler that found fame in top lane.

and prior to runes reforge the most common rune set up on maokai in top was 9 AS marks 3 ap quints, 9 armor seals, and cdr blues.

i typically ran the 9 as marks, 3 armor quints 9 hp per lvl seals and combo of mr per lvl blues and cdr

getting a doran's sheild or rings does help with last hitting. doran's ring does this two ways by giving him more ap to make his spells do more damage, and mana regen plus the passive of bonus damage to minions of +5 physical damage on autos.

i also find myself going minion de materializer to secure early farm and get bonus damage towards minions to making csing easier.

i have nearly 1million mastery on maokai. been a OTP for going on 4 seasons

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