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The Beginning of the End of AP Shaco

WarHero54·6/18/2017, 6:49:02 AM·17 votes·2,368 views

I believe with the simple change of physical damage to E has hugely crippled AP shaco's item build. Yes you keep ap ratios in E, however there is one important aspect that shaco cannot utilize now that it is physical damage and not magic damage. With this Change ANY items that proc with magic damage will not work in an AP shaco's overall kit, thus its a HUGE nerf to AP shaco. I can no longer rely on Morellonomicon as it would really help me mid game when certain champions have good healing sustainability. Also Shaco's boxes do not proc anything in general so you can't rely on that. Originally you only had 2 ways of relying on magic damage to proc with other things E and shaco's clone explosion ( even more originally 3 but Q does no damage anymore). Another Factor is that Void staff will not be as effective for his kit as it will only help with W and shaco clone explosion/boxes. This really destroys AP shaco item builds and the overall damage because of this change. I don't think pure AP shaco builds can recover from this, might be more productive to go hybrid with lethality focus

29 Comments

General Esdeath 6/18/2017, 5:07:56 PM2 votes

Weren't Shaco mains crying that AD Shaco was dead or something after the rework?

Unreformed Shaco6/18/2017, 7:41:14 AM2 votes

I posted about this the other day..

The problem with AP Shaco is simple.

His damage is all based around execute phase, but he cannot get a target to that phase by himself anymore.

His passive scales off his AD, which AP Shaco does not build. His Q no longer applies Ludens and scales with AD, which AP shaco does not build. His W only damages retards, since the fear range and attack range are the same length, and they are feared away. It also doesn't prioritize champions, making it very easy to let minions soak it. Alternatively you can just two shot it, 3 at most. His E does a chunk of damage. It also has execute. It scales from both tAD and AP, which makes it hit hard, PROVIDED the target is on low health, otherwise it hits no harder than any other mage skill. His R, the clone itself only scales from AD (auto attacks), which AP Shaco doesn't build. The explosion takes up to 18 seconds to deal damage, and the range is tiny.

He doesn't have the damage to get them low enough to execute, making him a worthless pick.

Sir Fuzzi6/18/2017, 7:04:07 AM2 votes

I swear to God, they reworked him with the strong intent to make AD a non-option...?

WarHero546/18/2017, 8:58:01 AM1 votes

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cdi2-m5TSzU Even Shaclone thinks this is an overall nerf and will kill AP shaco.

NAY Wrecksauce6/18/2017, 1:48:22 PM1 votes

Goodbye pinkward

Jerry SeinfeId6/18/2017, 4:47:34 PM1 votes

I've only ever played him ap, the build i use relies so much on artificial damage in the form of item 3146 &item 3100 tho. The main issue i can see about the change is that you no longer gain any damage from your base AD. At lvl 1 you get more damage in 2 shiv poison from your base ad than your ap most likely. And while you get some base dmg on the spell itself idk if it will make up for it. Meanwhile it changes nothing for AD considering he gets 50% harder scaling. i'm guessing it's to get rid of bruiser shacman.

I also don't understand why the bonus damage from deceive had to move to his passive.

depending on the matchup i'll be able to 1v1 the toplaner but later on i'll have to put in alot more effort than he/she has to. late game i'll mostly be able to 1 shot a squishy, unless i'm behind. IDK what these changes are gonna do to him. i like the 50% dmg increase compared to the 3-8% missing health dmg tbh.

SanKakU6/18/2017, 6:07:52 PM1 votes

I don't see a patch note for that, and it's not like this on the live client obviously, is that on PBE?

53016/18/2017, 6:22:33 PM1 votes

Pink Ward said something along the lines of "this change isn't as bad as people make it seem" on a YouTube video. It's on his YouTube channel, and I think someone linked it to the Shaco subreddit. I don't think I can link it here with my phone, so I'm just going to say some things that were on his video. He compared AP Shaco to AP Tryndamere and some form of Jayce from a long time ago when he had magic damage on a few spells

Autrah Fang6/18/2017, 10:22:40 PM1 votes

Evelynn welcome to the club (E changed to physical a while back)

FatedSaviour6/19/2017, 12:44:30 AM1 votes

dont forget about ludens

WarHero546/19/2017, 6:13:00 PM1 votes

All I know is that Riot cant balance a champion that has both AP and ad scaling. I hope shaco just becomes a AP assassin, but with this change, watch the next time they touch shaco, it will be shaco's boxes doing physical damage instead. Wouldn't be a bad idea cause then at least you can finally focus on armor shredding build with boxes backing your damage up.

WarHero546/19/2017, 9:24:31 PM1 votes

They could at least make boxes proc magic damage items so AP shaco still has a chance.

alfavhunter6/21/2017, 1:05:35 AM1 votes

this change will result in a nerf to bruiser shaco

it will result in a nerf to ap and ad shaco if the target builds more than 30 bonus armor

for ap shaco it results in a situational buff of preventing a full damage shut down by building mr items as his E will do physical damage now

this is a nerf to ap and ad shaco vs tanks

this is a nerf to lethality shaco as he has less bonus ad to make his E match old E damage ratios

overall the only build that can see a situational buff from this change is ap shaco, but it also forces certain items out of the ap build like ludens as an example

unless they plan on making some uber QoL changes to hix boxes this will result in a very noticeable net nerf for shaco

sure its 'not as bad' as some claim its a relatively small nerf in most cases, but taking into account shaco was more effective as a bruiser than an assassin the nerf is uncalled for

Xion The XIV6/21/2017, 2:45:45 AM1 votes

I don't know even a few years ago I maybe saw 2/30 shaco's build AP. All the other ones were AD/Crit builds to just nuke an adc. But idk I hardly ever saw anyone build AP shaco before.

WarHero546/28/2017, 5:19:56 PM1 votes

Welp Patch is out now, nothing was tweeked in PBE they just slapped it on, despite all the feedback.......... RIP AP Shaco.

WarHero547/10/2017, 12:35:09 AM1 votes

In Game of Thrones terms: Shaco is Theon Greyjoy and Riot is Ramsay Bolton. Tortured (Nerfed) him a while ago only to get this amazing moment were he thinks the Girls that come to give him a little pleasure (Assassin Rework) would give him something to finally be happy about or feel some sort of pleasure and Ramsey (Riot) insists on him to indulge..... Only then for it to be a ruse and excuse to castrate (take away Q damage all together) him and nothing but more torture (nerfs) till hes broken and no longer Theon (assassin) but Reek (bruiser). A shell of his former self.

WarHero546/18/2017, 7:22:05 AM1 votes

I've always played Shaco as AP since season 2. This is the only change that is really hard to adapt to as going pure AP items without on hit or magic proc items is very inefficient. A big part of how AP shaco does well in game is getting items that proc from magic damage. It really helps with adapting to the enemy's comp and the lack of base damage he has.

WarHero546/18/2017, 7:56:52 AM1 votes

I warned everyone on the forums ever since the nerfs after his rework that riot was going to make shaco either an AD or AP focus champ as they cannot balance any champs right that have both kind of scaling and can be played as either. Looks like they chose AD over AP. RIP I've hated majority of changes to champs that riot has done. This one takes the cake for me.