Give Elise the new Jayce treatment?

Gigglestick·6/10/2015, 9:44:46 AM·98 votes·4,618 views

As someone who played Elise a lot when she was better (season 3, first part of season 4ish~), I miss her being a strong presence in the jungle. I know the point was to nerf champions like her that were so good at snowballing lanes and themselves early on in the game, but with the new jungle champions like Lee Sin and Nidalee (welcome to the jungle, girl) were still popular pics for that reason. When the jungle items were changed (pre-cinderhulk), it was a good thing for Elise - she didn't need to take Mercury Treads to get the tenacity she wanted. Cinderhulk changed that, but gave her, and the other tanks, some added health to get more tanky into late game.

Now, with all the tanks steaming through the jungle, and being able to gank early, while scaling SO hard into late game, there's really not a place for Elise. She is still pretty scary early on, but her scaling is so terrible that late game you're either a) too squishy to remain in a fight after assassinating someone with your AP, which doesn't scale well. Or you're b) a tanky single target stun bot, which is outclassed by better stuns from tanks like Sejuani.

My suggestion is to give Elise a tad more late game scaling on her Q or her W or both, by taking points away from her ult, and moving them over to those abilities. Like Jayce, her ult only adds a small scaling of magic damage on hit, and gives her more spiderlings - different than Nidalee's ult, which gives her very apparent power spikes on her cougar form damage. So her spiderlings and attack's magic damage in spider form still scale through the game, but she still gets a bit more presence later on as a more tanky/ap bruiser champion.

Maybe it's wishful thinking because I want my queen back in a good spot on the rift, but I'm not seeing it as anything game breaking. Comments are appreciated :)

69 Comments

Abyssphere6/10/2015, 3:54:17 PM25 votes

I think levels in Elise's ult does a lot more for her than Jayce. For one thing her on-hit magic damage is persistent in spider form, whereas Jayce is "on first attack", and for another gaining access to another spiderling is important. I don't think she needs the Jayce treatment because "you get a slightly higher base in your Qs at level 6" doesn't solve her problems, if anything it re-introduces some of her old ones (they nerfed her bases for a reason).

What she needs is item scaling, nothing else. The #1 problem with Elise is that she has no end game - every completed item sets her further and further behind all of her enemies because they buy items they have synergy with whereas Elise buys items for no purpose other than "not dying too easily". At level 18 Elise is a Cocoon bot and outside of that is basically just a walking bunch of tank items. That's what needs fixing and having slightly higher bases on her damaging abilities at level 18 won't do that.

Until Elise is changed so that "I completed an item" feels even a fraction as good as it does on every other champion, she'll be trash. They need to make it so she can build AP without dying constantly or they need to give her synergy with tank stats. Anything else is a band aid.

Awoof6/10/2015, 12:23:18 PM16 votes

"with all these tanks there is really not a place for Elise" Considering both her Qs that should make it apparent there is a problem.

5512026/10/2015, 9:21:31 PM5 votes

And give her a real passive too Elise Her current passive: "HUMAN FORM : When Elise's spells hit an enemy, she readies a Spider Swarm Spiderling. SPIDER FORM : Elise summons Spider Swarm Spiderlings to attack nearby foes. The maximum number of Spiderlings increases with the level of Spider Form Spider Form." This could be a passive of her ult.

DrNova6/10/2015, 4:14:29 PM4 votes

They dont WANT Elise to be viable. Enough said.

Hard Penetrator6/10/2015, 7:21:34 PM3 votes

I think it is reasonable idea. Elise was really weak for quite a while and it is sad to see overnerfed champions at their weakest state for too long. Plus she is unpopular but interesting pick with unique kit and play pattern.

Yosuke Apperu6/10/2015, 2:44:07 PM2 votes

Then kha'zix is going to want the "jayce" treatment XD

Kingsgrave6/10/2015, 1:35:17 PM2 votes

Either give her the Jayce treatment or the Nidalee treatment

Either 6 ranks per ability or her Spider form abilities go up only with R ranks

AFK Push6/10/2015, 6:13:21 PM2 votes

Well Jayce is already geared more towards the late game than elise, so I wouldn't compare the two based off of that alone. If we buffed her the same way as him she might be considered strong in every phase of the game, so instead she should get a stronger mid game so she has a larger opportunity to carry etc.

Old Man Teeto6/10/2015, 12:32:52 PM2 votes

While I hold by my opinion that Elise is fine and just has huge glaring itemization issues (She needs a SPIRIT STONE in the jungle not the crap we have now for her) I think this would be one of the better ways of adjusting her as it never** felt **good to level her ultimate.

Final Boss Naut6/11/2015, 12:47:10 PM2 votes

elise is one of my favorite champions, i hope rito gives her some love soon so she can match up against "League of Tanks (TM)"

AhhShucks6/10/2015, 3:32:54 PM2 votes

Honestly, all of the transforming instead of ulting champions should work the way they just changed Jayce.

TLDR: give Nid a 6th rank in spear.

Rabid Husky6/10/2015, 10:02:21 PM1 votes

consider this if they did it to elise theyd have to do it to nidalee now do you really want nid to get MORE power?