Riot removed Veigars instant stun cage, gutting him. What is annie?

LockeTheHunter·4/7/2015, 1:20:49 PM·79 votes·6,506 views

Riot removed Veigars instant stun cage and put a delay on it, effectively gutting him. My question is, why the hell is Annie allowed to exist in her current state then? Not only does she have an instant stun on tibbers, she also has 2 more targeted stuns on Q/W!

"But Tibbers and W are skillshots!"

No, no they are not! It's impossible to miss tibbers since the cast time is instant, and in addition to it stunning you, it also bursts you and has a burn aura. And even if tibbers ISN'T up, you can just press W and get off a good AOE anyway.

136 Comments

SEKAI4/7/2015, 1:49:59 PM30 votes

In the League of Legends Balance meeting...

Riot Balance Team A: Annie's stun relies on her passive which needs like 4 casts to make it work, so it's okay.

Riot Balance Team B: Except it also works with cast spamming.

Riot Balance Team A: .....

Riot Balance Team A: Veigar's cage is OP anyways, he can 1 shot people while they are all stunned how is that okay for you guys?

Riot Balance Team B: Yeah but he has 0 mobility and that's IF he lands that thing in the first place, and what's Tenacity?

Riot CEO: ENOUGH with this foolish claim Team B, did you see how Veigar was playing in LCS? AS A SUPPORT? Wtf is that, he is a mage, not a support, and the reason why he became a support is because his stun is SOO GOOD! THAT'S WHY IT NEEDS A NERF!

Riot Balance Team B: (mutters) Yeah but if he is viable as a mage in the first place he wouldn't even end up a support wouldn't he?

Riot CEO: Did you say something?

Riot Balance Team B: No sir, as planned Veigar will be gutted next patch. Any plans for Annie?

Riot CEO: She better hope nobody is smart enough to play her as a support in pro scene, or otherwise we will have no choice but arrange some compensation for her effort.

Thryale4/7/2015, 3:05:04 PM13 votes

I think you've got it backwards. It's impossible to dodge tibbers, not miss. I've missed with tibbers countless times. But not once has anyone dodged it.

Malix Farwin4/7/2015, 4:22:41 PM12 votes

Here is the problem with your post and why i am baffled that it even got upvotes. The changes to veigar were very poor choices that the community as a whole did not like. However, you are suggesting a champ that doesn't need it go through a similar change. This isn't a veigar complaint thread you just want to nerf annie for no good reason other then you clearly dislike the champ. There are a ton of champs i dislike but i dont call for nerfs on them.

Sailor Mint4/7/2015, 2:01:07 PM12 votes

Event Horizon is a long range, low cooldown, basic spell. Tibbers is a shorter range, high cooldown, Ultimate spell.

Veigar seems to be performing well enough (49% win rate) and most recent concerns are about his laning pattern not having any options and being boring to play.

qetzel4/7/2015, 2:45:22 PM9 votes

I will preface this by saying that I think Veigar was difficult and problematic; that Veigar needed changes.

I also think that he needs more changes. Despite his more stable, higher win rate, he hasn't been fixed yet. He needs more changes, more buffs and maybe some compensatory nerfs to remove the surplus. If Riot does anything else they will probably over buff him.

Onto the post: Annie's existence doesn't actually matter anyway. Consider this analogy.

A person is suffering from two diseases. Neither of these diseases is fatal, but both are debilitating. One disease is easier to cure. Should we not cure the person of one disease because he has a second, harder to cure disease?

League of Legends has two burst mages with effectively targeted stuns that can be immediately followed by burst. Both play patterns are unhealthy. Veigar was easier to deal with - add a delay to his stun, then compensate. Annie is harder - she has several effectively targeted stuns and can't be compensated with larger AP gains. To fix her will take time. Should we keep Veigar in a problematic state just because Annie exists?

No.

YOLOswagLYFgg4204/7/2015, 5:43:29 PM7 votes

Just give Annie a timer on her passive. It's kind of ridiculous that she can have such good zone control against any short range or melee champ by not using an ability. It is frustrating and boring to have to play under tower because "If I go close, it's just tibbers stun insta gib" Make her have to burn atleast some mana to keep her passive going, instead of just holding on to it for literally 2 or 3 minutes at a time, basically forcing you to either call for a gank, take tons of damage, or lose tons of cs.

iainB854/7/2015, 6:42:09 PM5 votes

I made a thread about this weeks ago and got down voted.

Tibbers needs a throwing animation to it so people have a chance to react.

Every other champion but her now works this way for AoE stun abilities.

Kitten of Evil4/8/2015, 1:12:02 AM4 votes

They can't touch Annie. She's not 18 yet.

Mystery solved.

LadyRenly4/7/2015, 7:44:46 PM3 votes

You can't even compare the two. One is just an ability that can be thrown willy nilly, the other has a visual indicator when its active, is most deadly when used with an ultimate, and holding on to it immensely hinders your wave push potential

Rinky Dinky4/8/2015, 12:46:27 AM2 votes

That moment when you realize this entire threat is based off of anger at Annie, not sympathy for Veigar.

insaiyanbacca4/7/2015, 9:17:22 PM2 votes

veigar was not gutted his stun was im starting to think people dont know what it means he still does really good damage

tofutime4/7/2015, 2:50:00 PM2 votes

Can't wait until they give tibbers a visual indicator and make her throw it out like the new Zilean bombs. /s

Gigahappytown4/8/2015, 12:04:35 AM2 votes

Veigar rework after the 2 buffs made him stronger then before, people are just upset he takes a brain to use now. Veigars event horizion was atrociously strong and easily one of the best teamfight crowd control effects in the game.

And its funny, because now event horizion baleful strike and dark are all superior to their previous versions. But like bronzies thinking akali is still good, they will always think he got gutted.