Is it even possible to get an S as Support

DucOfAudubon·Aug 29, 2016·3 votes·822 views

Seriously, though, I don't know exactly how they determine what score you get, but however they do it obviously screws supports.

I just played a game as Morgana, went 3/0/26, got my adc fed as hell too, had more gold than the other team's highest by 2.6k, dropped more wards than anyone else, and I still only got an S-.

If I didn't deserve an S that game, I don't know what does.

It's really frustrating me at this point, I'm trying to get Mastery Level 7 but it's basically impossible. It seems to me that the grading system depends way too much on CS, doesn't even consider ward placement, or anything that a Support does. Not only is that unfair, but it doesn't even teach good supporting behavior.

14 Comments

GibberwattAug 29, 20162 votes

I have achieved s+ on supp Anivia Blitzcrank TahmKench Zilean and Morgana . I am not sure how you didn't get an s on your 3/0/26, but it could have been that you were getting mildly carried, and were just pirating assists, idk. I prefer to think of it as I am responsible for setting up all the kills - if my adc is going in, the enemy had better be 50% or less, or, if Im tahm, I had better be ready to save my adc's butt.

AmelieAug 29, 20162 votes

Yes. I have mastery 7 on Morgana. I found that I needed to take some extra CS to bump up my score to S for her. Also participate in dragon, turret, baron, and rift herald kills (even one auto attack will count, within a time limit).

It may not be "good supporting behavior" but that's not what the system considers. It's comparing your raw stats to other Morgana players, so you need to have higher average numbers overall.

archerno1Aug 29, 20161 votes

Yes it is. I get S on Morgana constantly. Its not about dropping more wards than anyone else, but dropping enough wards. If you buy sightstone, you need to place 1 ward per minute. So if game is 30 mins, if u place under 25, u are doing bad.

DucOfAudubonAug 29, 20161 votes

This also means that the grading doesn't at all scale. It's equally difficult to get an S playing against Diamonds as it is against Bronzies. Whereas with any other role, the grading of course scales, as it's clearly easier to get kills/cs playing against lower elos than higher ones.

UberAffeAug 29, 20161 votes

Pretty sure it takes your mmr into account for grading

archerno1Aug 29, 20161 votes

{quoted}

This also means that the grading doesn't at all scale. It's equally difficult to get an S playing against Diamonds as it is against Bronzies. Whereas with any other role, the grading of course scales, as it's clearly easier to get kills/cs playing against lower elos than higher ones.

How is rank related? Its simple, u placed 17 wards in 31 min. With Yellow trinket u could have placed 16. Buying sightstone was waste of gold. U placed 50% less wards than you should have. I dont know how was your gold generation and did u utilize your Spellthiefs fully.

DucOfAudubonAug 29, 20161 votes

First of all, the point I just made was that it DIDN'T scale. That is, rank ISN'T related, unlike with every other role, where the ability of the people you're playing against clearly IS related.

Secondly, I got sightstone at ~7 minutes, and placed 18 wards. At ~1 ward/minute, that brings us up to around 25 minutes, at which point the game was basically a siege at their base. Should I have been placing wards uselessly in their base to get an S?

archerno1Aug 29, 20161 votes

{quoted}

First of all, the point I just made was that it DIDN'T scale. That is, rank ISN'T related, unlike with every other role, where the ability of the people you're playing against clearly IS related.

Secondly, I got sightstone at ~7 minutes, and placed 18 wards. At ~1 ward/minute, that brings us up to around 25 minutes, at which point the game was basically a siege at their base. Should I have been placing wards uselessly in their base to get an S?

And yellow trinket? U should have placed 4 wards before.

http://matchhistory.eune.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/EUN1/1487425232/200976052?tab=overview

This is example of S game.

Mysticman89Aug 29, 20162 votes

It is a confirmed fact that MMR is not a factor in grading (for any role).

Higher elo players tends to have good habits/skills that lead to them getting S's more often than low elo players, but low elo players still manage them sometimes, presumably because the fact that they themselves are bad is sortof canceled out by the fact their opponents are also bad.

If you're a diamond playing against bronzies, you'll probably end up with near perfect cs and a godlike kda so sure an S would be easier, but if you're a bronze playing against bronzies, you'll not get anything particularly special for kills/cs since you'll be making mistakes and not capitilizing on their mistakes, plus you'll simply miss lots of cs even if the other laner isn't actively denying you. It's certainly easier to get an S when you're stomping people at a lower elo than you, but usually people end up roughly where they belong so things become more 'fair'.

In any case, KDA and cs aren't the only factors. Kill participation, wards placed, wards cleared, objective participation, etc are all factors as well, and theres probably more. You're not graded relative to your teammates, you're graded relative to all other players (regardless of elo) using the same champion in the same role, and so if you're not getting an S, you're simply doing it worse than others have managed.

I'm a mid plat support main, and I pretty much always get at least an S- when playing janna, and I usually play champs in the support role when it's time for me to earn my weekly S rank for a chest. As a support main, I tend to find support is the easiest role to get S in, simply because I'm good at the role. People who main a non-support role will likely find they're best at getting an S rank in whatever role they do main, and I suspect a lot of people who main non-sup (and perhaps not jg) aren't used to the warding/sweeping habits required to be a good sup.

DucOfAudubonAug 29, 20161 votes

While it may be based against all elos for all roles, the difficulty in achieving scores are not.

If you're, say, Silver I playing against Bronze V, then if you're adc, you will have no trouble getting all the cs you need to get an S, all the kills you need to get an S, anything like that. However, you'll have not much of an easier time placing all the wards you'd need to get an S as support, because ward placement isn't dependent on your opponent's relative skill, at least as much as kills and cs is.

Basically, if you're a silver adc against a silver adc, your grade is competing against other Silvers vs. Silvers as well as Plats vs. Plats. But, if you're a Silver Support, and the way you get an S is largely independent of the skill of the other team (warding), then you are a Silver Support vs. No One competing against a Plat support vs. No One.

I'm not saying that the other team's skill doesn't effect warding at all, but it does affect it much less than, say, it affects csing or kills.

Mysticman89Aug 29, 20162 votes

This is a fair point, but that should mean that bronze/silvers have less excuse to do poorly in a grading front, since there is very little stopping them from doing so.

If I try to adc versus a challenger adc, I'm pretty likely going to get zoned out of the majority of cs and largely get destroyed, and I can grumble it wasn't fair since I simply don't have the mechanical skills to compete with what they can (and inevitably will) do to me.

With warding though, theres no particular mechanical barriers, so I very well could ward like a challenger. And in low elo in particular, people won't have the map awareness to notice you off warding, so you probably could ward like a challenger even easier than a challenger could (where leaving for literally 1 second to ward is something that enemy laners would notice and potentially act on).

That's just on the placing side though, clearing wards is another factor that is prone to be easier at lower elos. People will place their wards predictably, and usually won't put much effort into protecting them, so you can fairly quickly bolster your grade in that regard.