Boards›Gameplay

Nerf Garen Please

Joe Burrow·6/20/2016, 5:06:26 AM·4 votes·2,176 views

Alright so to get things started im gonna point out 2 things: I understand that Garen is not played in high-elo, and I also understand that he is not a very good team pick in general. Now with those 2 things said i still believe that he needs a rework and a fair nerf. Think about this: Riot mainly makes their nerfs based off of what is strong in high-elo, and what is commonly abused there, however, if nobody is going to play him at high-elo as it is, why not give some love to the lower levels. As a gold 2 duoing with a friend in gold 5, we vsed a Garen that was not fed at all. His score was 3-4 at the time about level 16, and building full tank including a titanic hydra. Pretty standard right? So, I was his target at this point in the game or "the villian". My friend got dealt a 1.1k damage ultimate from him while I am "the villian". Now, my friend was playing Master Yi so naturally he had a hexdrinker against a fairly strong ap team composition. Garen's ult does magic damage. So could you please tell me why it is allowed to have a champion that can build full tank and deal 1.1k magic damage through a hexdrinker. That's all I got, feel free to comment your opinions about whether Garen is OP or not.

44 Comments

redniwediS6/20/2016, 5:20:43 AM4 votes

Nerf? No. Garen's win rate, at least among people who have played him more than a little, has actually gone down already with the nerfs to his movement speed and favorite boots. He's really not in a good spot for a nerf without compensation buffs at the same time.

He has many, many problems, most of which are learned as you start climbing out of the very low MMR levels. That is why his win rate has not really changed at the lower levels, people just don't understand how to beat an immobile champion with no in combat sustain. By high gold you really should know how to face most champions in the game, or at least know how to learn it.

Now, if you are the villain that means two things; you can be dealt true damage by Garen's autoattacks, spin, and ult, and no one else on your team can take ANY true damage from Garen. If your friend did take true damage from Garen while not being the villain you managed to find a bug, and should report it. No one "allowed" it to happen.

It's more likely your friend was killed by magic damage, and hexdrinker was almost recharged at the time. If it recharged right after your friend died it could look like he took massive damage through hexdrinker, when in reality the shield was not ready. It's also possible your friend was the villain when he was ulted. The villain target changes every time Garen participates in killing a villain, so it could have moved to you right after your friend died.

If neither of those cases happened it is a bug. No blame needed, no venting required. Just make a bug report and please, for the love of all that is good read the proper bug report format before posting.

rG Thundrag6/27/2016, 1:04:34 AM4 votes

Garen is fairly trash at the moment since his last set of nerfs and his more popular items being nerfed as well item 3053 item 3742 item 3068 item 3009 .

They nerfed his early game in exchange for higher mid/late game strength but then proceeded to nerf the items that made him able to strive in combat at those stages of the game.

It'd be fairly simple to just un-nerf his movement speed nerfs or simply either buff his HP. Even increasing his early game spin damage would be reasonable considering at the moment its actually better to not even use spin to win pre-5 as its worse than autoing dps wise.

CerealBoxOfDoom6/20/2016, 5:10:12 AM2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Adam Healey,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=I1rtGnh4,comment-id=,timestamp=2016-06-20T05:06:26.368+0000)

Alright so to get things started im gonna point out 2 things: I understand that Garen is not played in high-elo, and I also understand that he is not a very good team pick in general. Now with those 2 things said i still believe that he needs a rework and a fair nerf. Think about this: Riot mainly makes their nerfs based off of what is strong in high-elo, and what is commonly abused there, however, if nobody is going to play him at high-elo as it is, why not give some love to the lower levels. As a gold 2 duoing with a friend in gold 5, we vsed a Garen that was not fed at all. His score was 3-4 at the time about level 16, and building full tank including a titanic hydra. Pretty standard right? So, I was his target at this point in the game or "the villian". My friend got dealt a 1.1k damage ultimate from him while I am "the villian". Now, my friend was playing Master Yi so naturally he had a hexdrinker against a fairly strong ap team composition. Garen's ult does magic damage. So could you please tell me why it is allowed to have a champion that can build full tank and deal 1.1k magic damage through a hexdrinker. That's all I got, feel free to comment your opinions about whether Garen is OP or not.

whats wrong with a 1.1k true damage ult

You have to have a lot of kills, it clearly tells you who the villain is, and then you also have to lose a bunch of hp for him to deal that much anyways. If you aren't built to fight garen don't go throw face at him then complain after you fail to strategize against something very literally broadcasted.

2LUCID6/25/2016, 5:05:00 AM1 votes

Garen absolutely needs a rework. He's almost worthless if he falls behind but granted the nature of lower-elos he seldom does, and further more he snowballs incredibly hard because of his absolutely stupid ult and spin to win. He's not "difficult" to play against but he is frustrating to play against particularly in the messy team fights of scrub league. I don't understand how a tank, he is a tank, he doesn't even have to build Black Cleaver to carry can do so much damage. Poor design. And don't worry Riot gutting Garbear will not offend the revered Diamond+ players

Crowe Stalker6/25/2016, 5:53:02 AM1 votes

Give Garen's Q the Volibear treatment: He only gets Bonus MS when charging towards enemies, not a free bonus. It's really annoying when he pops Q to escape bad trades.

Otherwise just nerf ult damage. He's not really OP if you know how to fight him but I think those two changes are the ones Riot would do best to look at when considering nerfs.

Critmaster Garen6/26/2016, 2:41:09 PM1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Adam Healey,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=I1rtGnh4,comment-id=,timestamp=2016-06-20T05:06:26.368+0000)

So could you please tell me why it is allowed to have a champion that can build full tank and deal 1.1k magic damage through a hexdrinker.

if the thing did 1.1k magic damage through a hexdrinker, then that garen wasted his ult there, since the yi was so low that he could have just killed him with an auto attack.

garens ult scales with % missing health and death recap doesnt cut off its overkill damage for some reason.

but overkill damage is worthless and irrelevant. it doesnt contribute to a fight in any shape or form. ive done the math a while back and the formula for garens ult didnt change. but depending on the enemies mr and max health, the most possible magic damage a garen ult can deal is actually around 800 damage. and that assumes a target who just stacks a shitton of hp and 0 mr.

the yi could have also used meditate and would probably still have survived the damage due to 70% damage reduction and the % missing health heal. he simply didnt react appropriately in the situation.

Spookÿ7/6/2016, 7:45:59 AM1 votes

I really wish more people would stop and think about this. I agree with you 200%. I've made numerous posts on the boards about this and none have agreed. It is unbelievably unfair that full tank champs like Garen continue to do so much fucking damage for no reason. Im pretty sure Riot put in a secret passive in recent patches...

For every 1000 HP a champion has, they will be awarded an extra 1000 AD and 1000 AP as compensation for them being unkillable

SithesisLord6/20/2016, 5:36:26 AM1 votes

deal 1.1k magic damage through a hexdrinker.

It does damage based on missing HP i think. Maybe that was what got him killed. Low HP around a Garen with his ult up.

Aiko Umesawa6/25/2016, 4:58:33 AM1 votes

Ok i agree with you somewhat. He is a juggernaut and can build full tank and still 2 shot the adc. and mid lane too. Did i forget his ult does true damage to the enemy rendered villan. Now that seems broken. His ult is the only thing needed nerf and may be the speed on his q. Otherwise this champion is fairly balanced.