Why Shiv over Phantom Dancer?

Mustii·3/7/2015, 7:46:05 PM·1 votes·1,277 views

I just wanna know why people build shiv over phantom dancer on adcs. I started playing adc alot recently and prefer PD over Shiv, but i see everyone else building shiv. PD only costs 300 more gold but it gives you 15% more crit chance so the only thing good about shiv is its passive and honestly i dont understand why people pick 100 AOE mgc dmg over 15% more crit strike and 10% more attack speed. Im only bronze 2 so I know I am most likely stupid for buying pd over shiv because when i see high elo players playing adc they always build shiv or on any adc guides the build shiv. So can anyone please explain why people pick shiv over pd? Feel free to criticize.

16 Comments

SpongebobIsLife3/7/2015, 8:09:05 PM2 votes

Well, have to realize that the damage from statikk shiv is really strong early on. 250 extra damage to targets with barely 1.2k health is a lot. Also, it helps with pushing the lanes. PD is much stronger late game, due to the fact that people probably have mr, and a lot more health. But, if im like really ahead, ill go ahead and get PD over static, but generally static is better in the early game.

FebruAhri3/7/2015, 7:59:43 PM2 votes

with IE shiv does 250 damage on a crit though

Sailor Mint3/7/2015, 7:57:20 PM2 votes

Wave clear.
Burst damage.
PD is only better if don't have to move.

Kitten of Evil3/7/2015, 8:11:34 PM1 votes

One reason to buy Shiv is because you're playing Yasuo

Mustii3/7/2015, 11:13:38 PM1 votes

Thanks for all of your opinions guys. I've decided to go shiv first and trade it for a pd late game if im playing burst champions like Lucian Graves and ill go straight for pd when im playing champions who have alot of range, rely on auto attacks, are really good for 1v1s or need the pd passive to kite and chase down better like Caitlyn Jinx Tristana Vayne etc.

Miku Lv993/8/2015, 10:35:28 AM1 votes

They get shiv when they think the mid game will be very important. If you can use it to help push waves faster and take more objectives midgame, then it's worth it. The static part of it isn't that good endgame though, since the 100 damage doesn't really scale, so pd is easily the better endgame item, though.

Angry Monster3/8/2015, 10:41:02 AM1 votes

Reasons

1 wave clear. The shiv proc can make clearing under tower easier early on.

2 mixing damage. If you have a more AD team you can bypass some of the AR with the magic damage that crits.

3 cost. Shiv is cheaper and sometime you need that power spike right then and not later.

Quepha3/8/2015, 11:44:48 AM1 votes

let's compare the passive to 15% crit with some napkin math 15% crit is about equal to two pairs of brawler's gloves, 800 gold of stats statikk's passive is a 100 damage burst which we can equate to 10x long swords, 3600 gold of course, statikk is a burst and not on EVERY attack, so we have to divide that value by the total number of attacks that occur from burst to burst.

i don't know how often the burst is used vs how often a normal attack is used so i'll just find the breakpoint where they're equal: 3600/800 = 4.5 so, the statikk shiv will be ahead in terms of gold value until him and his phantom dancer counterpart have fired off their FIFTH attack, meaning their team probably has the advantage in a fight for almost a good five seconds of solid firing, and considering how much of team fights is just dancing around and taking pot shots when you're safe + the assistance with wave clearing + i only calculated the damage on a single target + the BARE MINIMUM rate of statikk shiv procs is 1 in 10 if you don't move at all between attacks i'd say that statikk is just a better choice most of the time to phantom dancer. phantom dancer seems to use a fair bit of its item budget on that passive, but it isn't really as useful outside of lane phase and you definitely won't finish PD before that's over, ranged adcs who tend to build big ticket damage items like PD don't really care about the passive, and the melee champions who WOULD care about unit collision probably care EVEN MORE about the slight range and aoe from the statikk passive (also they spend way more time moving around and get more procs vs non procs on their attacks)

ABlueQuaker3/8/2015, 11:48:38 AM1 votes

I actually try to get Trinity Force wherever it's at least moderately viable, but other than that I get PD.

I only ever get Shiv on Top Lane splitpushers.

Sukishoo3/7/2015, 7:59:05 PM1 votes

People usually build Shiv because they can't properly last hit, that's when it became popular. PD has a much better passive when you're chasing down your opponents.

Frost the Reaper3/7/2015, 7:59:12 PM1 votes

It really depends on the champion.

Example here is the two most current meta picks: Graves AND Jinx

Now for Graves he really wants a shiv because He's a burst ADC, not a Sustain ADC. Not only does the AoE 100 Magic damage happen, but it can also critically strike, making his Dash + Buck Shot + Auto just hit that much harder, but gives him better clear times.

Jinx on the other hand can benefit equally from either item, but in this case I'll give her PD. with PD she gets more attack speed with her mini-gun, which makes her siege more potent. Add that to even more rockets per second just makes her even more powerful.

It can also be play preferences, and as stated above, with Jinx i build both.