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Tank Junglers in S5

Haiel··2 votes·5,641 views

I want to ask what has been done in S5 to reverse S4 decline of tank junglers. Because for now I dont see anything that can help them to recover their status as viable junglers in S5. The changes made to jungle dont bring anything that can help them. They will still be killed in their own jungle by Lees and alike. Their jungle will still be taken by other aggresive junglers. And still even with full tank build they will do no damage and die in 3s. And still their ganks will lack dmg to net a kill. And still they will be prone to counterganks.

So are we going again to be limited to the same set of junglers ie Lee, Rengar, Kha, J4 in S5. I can live with a risk of going tanky jungler early in a game but what are the rewards in late game if I cant survive anything while building full tank.

The new jungle items does not offer anything new to tanky junglers. Juggernaut is subpar to old SotAG and rest of items/runes/masteries have not been touched so I ask again what you have in store for those type of junglers.

I red some time ago when some rioter admited that their jungle changes in S4 were very bad yet still I dont see anything that tries to reverse those changes. Its even worse imo those changes are gutting tanky junglers even more while giving yet more power to bruiser/assasin jungelrs.

7 Comments

Talamare2 votes

I feel like they nerfed Tank junglers, The new juggernaut does nothing to help clear speeds and with the massive health increases we need it now more than ever!

Tho even honestly, Juggernaut comes in WAY too late for it to REALLY help... The improved aoe smite does help, but this doesn't really help tank junglers specifically. DPS-esque junglers can easily get it too

AtheosisX1 votes

Juggernaut needs something to make it competitive. Compare it to the other three enchants and it's flat out laughable. 500 health? No armor? No magic resist? It's hardly a good item for a tank as far as I'm concerned.

DJ Hatsune Miku1 votes

Their builds are cheap and stuff like glory's call or w/e are good for them. They trade damage for utility. Vi, j4, and kha cant even hope to peel like naut or mao and they have effect engage or pick potential. Even. If they get invaded most tanks don't need items to do their jobs so it's not a huge deal.

Haiel1 votes

Last time I played lol Vi and J4 have tremendous pickpotential and very good engage yet they pack lots of dmg. And peeling does not work if your adc is deleted instantly.

And tell me who you want in your team well farmed Vi that easly dives primary targets and deletes them instantly while ccing or a Naut that is underfarmed and dies from a fart. Yes he can peel but so can Vi by killing opponents just because dead>cced.

DJ Hatsune Miku1 votes

My main ADC is MF, so I would much prefer a Naut that can bodyguard to a Vi that can dive. Sure they get their Lucian, but if their Zed can't instagib me we've probably got all the damage we need just by virtue of MF's dps being crazy. A Vi who sits back and keeps Zed and Kha off me is appreciated but is wasting her potential, imo. If she dives I get dove and it's down to being a 4v4, where as Naut setting me up for a double on them is now a 3v5. See the difference? It's really a matter of team comp, and since most people play mobile adcs, diving teams are more favored. Not to mention Vi and the like are much better for solo queue because of her stomp potential.

I play a lot of Naut and tank junglers both in s3 and s4 and I plan to continue playing the big guy in s5 as well. His kind won't be meta, but that's alright. A lot of champs aren't meta, doesn't mean they're not viable.

Haiel1 votes

Nope you dont get it. Vi sitting back and peeling kills Zed and its 5v4. While Naut cant really peel against Zed, He cant Hook him because Zed shows up behind you, slow and root will not stop zed from erasing you and his ult have a slow travel speed so Zed will manage to put damage on you and return to R shadow. While Vi can ult Zed immedietly and follow up with Q netting you a kill.

So Vi can do exactly the same thing as Naut if she chooses so but she also has an option of diving opponents while Naut diving an opponent is laughable. Also Vi is better anti tank weapon since her W has shred and %hp dmg. I'm not trying to tell that Vi is op and Naut is up I'm just trying to say that "bruiser" junglers have flexibility tank junglers dont. Thay can peel and they can be tanky, but if the games goes well they can build dmg and burst ppl while diving. Tank junglers are linear they can only peel/initiate. But peeling is redundant this days when ppl are erased in a matter of seconds. VI for example can build Juggernaut or Warrior both with success while Naut can get only Juggernaut. I dont see him getting Devourer and farming jungle for stacks. He has only one path and one role and that sux. Combine it with early game when he is roflstomped by nearly anything and you got yourself into a hole for nothing.

DJ Hatsune Miku2 votes

Have you never played Naut? You can Q through your teammates. Zed will need to do at least a good portion of his combo to kill me as MF. If he goes in, Naut can Q on top of me and the giant hitbox, if timed, can hit him as he reappears. That, along with Naut's passive will lock Zed for about the duration of his death mark, which expodes and I'm at ~50%. I'm also lifestealing and murdering him as this happens. Vi can ult Zed potentially as he ults, which leads to him taking damage then finishing his combo and I'm dead, then he Ws out.

Vi is a one-trick pony. Her trick is making someone very, very dead and she's very good at that trick. So good in fact that it has kept her viable for a long time because the mixture of burst, tank, and % health make her good at her job no matter what. Her peel is sub-par and honestly if your positioning isn't shit you shouldnt' be getting instagibbed without going 1 for 1.

Let's also look at it this way. Your teamcomps are Ryze top, Talon mid, MF/Nami bot lane. IF you have Naut he can engage with ult and save Q/E/Passive for peeling or engage with Q and save R/E/Passive for peeling. Or hell, if he gets a good ult he can CC the entire team for a sizable amount of time, resulting in a massive advantage. With Vi she has to Q or R in and then she's in their backline. She can't peel. If she sits back to peel you get engaged on, which is typically not a good look. Sure Nami can ult for an engage but is it as reliable as someone going in hard with their face?

People said Naut got stopped and was worthless in S4 and I hit gold with him because of his insanely strong and varied ganking paths as well as great bodyguard potential. Vi just hopes to murder people before they flash/dash out, Naut doesn't have any of that shit, he'll drag you back for more. Most bruisers might have build flexibility but they don't have playstyle flexibility. J4 just goes in and murders people, Vi just goes in and murders people, Lee just goes in and murders people, the list goes on. They can go tanky, but they can't hope to hold a candle to the kind of 5v5 potential a well executed Mumu, Naut, or Sej have. A good Vi ult / Lee kick may get a key target dead, but you can't tell me a good mumu/sej ult hasn't completely aced your team 5 for 0, because I've had that happen more times than I think I deserve to admit.

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