Concerning this reddit post http://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/2lipg6/jungle_pathing_changed_yet_again_pbe/ I didn't like it when you gave junglers 4 pots instead of 5. Now we get 2 pots. Thats pretty bad Riot.
Winged Hussars6 votesI've got a few things to say about the new jungle to quell any of your fears, from playing on the PBE. For one, yes, it's harder, but only before the first upgrade. The new jungle items allow tank junglers and damage junglers to have the same amount of sustain in the jungle unlike spirit stone being biased entirely for high-damage junglers. After about level 3, the jungle is about the same as season four with a few bonuses you can get from the monsters. But on the flip side, it gives a LOT more gold and experience.
The increase to the stat floor means that Lee isn't completely broken in level 2 invades (still annoying, but not impossible to deal with for a lot of champions) and contrary to what you might think, Diana of all people has come to the immediate forefront in terms of jungling power. She has the fastest clears as well as good sustain, hits six as fast as midlane if she tries... it's crazy. We'll have to see how the meta develops, but pretty much every jungler that is a REASONABLE pick right now can still jungle. Even Darius and Wukong can handle it if they take the right path.
It's a lot like S1 jungle, in a way, which is nice. Really, people who have been jungling for five years tend to like the changes.
ValyrianBlade1 votesThat's good to hear. Incoming Diana nerf then? :p
What about pre level 3? Will the support need to rotate to help the jungler reach 3?
My best jungler is hecarim, any idea how he manages in the new jungle? I find even in s4 jungle I have difficulty with the first clear (e.g. For purple: blue, wolves, red, wraiths, golems, then gank top or golems then wraiths and gank mid) where if I don't get a good leash to let me stay nearly full health from my w on the blue buff without a health pot then I use all 4 pots and am not full health to gank top. I do better however if I try to gank after double buffs + wolves (2 smites in 3 camps for level 3) then try a gank and can then smite the next camp again, but I would prefer to get 4 before ganking so I can get w-q-q-e rather than w-q-e-q.
I'm not really worried about the late game jungle for any jungler. I regularly solo Dragon as an adc late game, so it's apparent how easy the jungle gets. It's the first clear that's really hard.
ValyrianBlade5 votesIf everything I'm reading is true, here's a summary of why jungling is going to suck in season 5:
Buffs spawn later, so you either won't get a leash or your allies will be much later to Lane or go to Lane and come back to give you a leash. Buff alone isn't enough for level 2, meaning the jungler has to clear an extra camp at level 1, many junglers need 2 skills to clear camps effectively solo (why the leash is so popular). Combination of these 2: junglers won't get the instant level 2 head start and first to level 3 advantage any more, even though solo laners already reach 6 before them. Junglers will now be either similar level to or possibly lower than the duo Lane throughout laning phase. Result of this: with smaller gold income and a level disadvantage, junglers will only be successful when ganking a really out of position laner. Against any experienced player, ganks should be unviable - meaning junglers can't get kill/assist gold/xp, putting them even farther behind.
Camps are being made stronger, are spawning less frequently, and give more gold (but recall above buffs give less xp, not sure of other camps). Stronger camps combined with the level disadvantage might prevent early game jungling all together, requiring leaching from lanes (which your laners won't like) before being able to clear the jungle. Those few junglers with enough sustain and damage to actually still manage jungle clears despite fewer health pots won't be able to just farm the jungle as they'll need to wait for camps to spawn.
It appears that the conservation stacks are being removed, resulting in even less gold income.
The new vision objective will give junglers something to do when camps are down, but will again take away from time that could be used to earn gold.
Benefits: The new jungle items, with the improved smites and enchantments, sound much more useful. All junglers will suck equally (at least until someone finds out the 2 or 3 that can Excel in such a poor and rough environment) so it won't always be Lee sin vs kha'zix (even though honestly I see other junglers just as frequently).
I'm just really hoping it's either not as bad as it sounds or riot fixes the issues here. I'd much rather go against a lee sin in a jungle I can actually compete against the laners with than be a jungler where neither team's jungler can do anything at any stage of the game...
ThePurpleKnight1 votesIf everything I'm reading is true, here's a summary of why jungling is going to suck in season 5:
Buffs spawn later, so you either won't get a leash or your allies will be much later to Lane or go to Lane and come back to give you a leash. Buff alone isn't enough for level 2, meaning the jungler has to clear an extra camp at level 1, many junglers need 2 skills to clear camps effectively solo (why the leash is so popular). Combination of these 2: junglers won't get the instant level 2 head start and first to level 3 advantage any more, even though solo laners already reach 6 before them. Junglers will now be either similar level to or possibly lower than the duo Lane throughout laning phase. Result of this: with smaller gold income and a level disadvantage, junglers will only be successful when ganking a really out of position laner. Against any experienced player, ganks should be unviable - meaning junglers can't get kill/assist gold/xp, putting them even farther behind.
Camps are being made stronger, are spawning less frequently, and give more gold (but recall above buffs give less xp, not sure of other camps). Stronger camps combined with the level disadvantage might prevent early game jungling all together, requiring leaching from lanes (which your laners won't like) before being able to clear the jungle. Those few junglers with enough sustain and damage to actually still manage jungle clears despite fewer health pots won't be able to just farm the jungle as they'll need to wait for camps to spawn.
It appears that the conservation stacks are being removed, resulting in even less gold income.
The new vision objective will give junglers something to do when camps are down, but will again take away from time that could be used to earn gold.
Benefits: The new jungle items, with the improved smites and enchantments, sound much more useful. All junglers will suck equally (at least until someone finds out the 2 or 3 that can Excel in such a poor and rough environment) so it won't always be Lee sin vs kha'zix (even though honestly I see other junglers just as frequently).
I'm just really hoping it's either not as bad as it sounds or riot fixes the issues here. I'd much rather go against a lee sin in a jungle I can actually compete against the laners with than be a jungler where neither team's jungler can do anything at any stage of the game...
It's just a further nerf of the same shit nerfed for preseason 4, less exp, have to gank to not fall behind past 7, make sure Skarner sucks ass so that Knight of Right can't jungle without falling 5 lvls behind.
They need to increase the exp of camps, not decrease it, and they should be making the spawn times earlier so that laners stop missing those first 2 CS.
They also need to buff Skarner http://imgur.com/ouo9V1J It's an easy fix! He is not a tank, he is a fighter, durable DPS, a duelist of sorts! Bring back passive and base damages.
The only good thing to come out of the jungle is the new items, not having to pay 2200 gold for PVE stats is nice, 700 for PVE, upgrade to 2000 later for PVP.
Pinker 101 voteshave to gank to not fall behind past 7
oh no, im a jungler and i have to actually help my team to be viable :( sad day...................
and they should be making the spawn times earlier so that laners stop missing those first 2 CS.
You miss at most 1, and that's if you don't have a ranged skillshot
WeG1 voteshave to gank to not fall behind past 7
oh no, im a jungler and i have to actually help my team to be viable :( sad day...................
and they should be making the spawn times earlier so that laners stop missing those first 2 CS.
You miss at most 1, and that's if you don't have a ranged skillshot
Was gonna say, Talon can perfectly walk to lane after leashing and never miss a CS. Actually everyone with a ranged skillshot can not miss any CS. Therefore, leashing isn't only expected, it's detrimental to your team not to do it.
ThePurpleKnight1 voteshave to gank to not fall behind past 7
oh no, im a jungler and i have to actually help my team to be viable :( sad day...................
and they should be making the spawn times earlier so that laners stop missing those first 2 CS.
You miss at most 1, and that's if you don't have a ranged skillshot
you miss 1 if your jungler is competent and actually in the pit when it spawns, for me in silver elo, I have to wait for my jungler to walk out of the bush and attack it to draw aggro before leashing, meaning I miss 2. Also do note I take the long way around cause my champs are weaker than the enemies champs early, I play shit like Nidalee and Riven. I'd get stomped if I ran through river bush.
As well, your team doesn't always give you good gank opportunities, they push up and die a bunch. Try ganking that as Nunu.
Drunk Rummate3 votesits mostly the lack of spirit stone thats going to be rough. any jungler without extremely low (or no) mana costs is going to really suffer without a spirit stone.
On that note, guess who doesnt need mana to jungle?
ValyrianBlade1 votesWith blue buff you'll be okay for the first clear I hope. After that, you'd probably need to take the jungle item that gives a shorter cd smite with full damage on target, 50% aoe damage, and restores 15% of missing health and MANA.
Of course, it's a huge disadvantage to need that when the other jungler can take any of the other smites and use them to help them out duel you or improve their ganks or counter jungle...
Quort1 votesits mostly the lack of spirit stone thats going to be rough. any jungler without extremely low (or no) mana costs is going to really suffer without a spirit stone.
On that note, guess who doesnt need mana to jungle?
Nor do 
and 
! I can't wait to use them in the new jungle! :3
Outback Renekton1 votesNor do
KMannnnn12 votesWell, junglers also now have a lot of special bonuses to take advantage of through the small buffs, like the gromp poison armor, so there should be less overall potion reliance.
But I will say that most of the jungle changes don't really seem to benefit junglers for early clears, especially making red and blue spawn later. In their attempts to make lvl 2-3 ganking less viable, they essentially made it an impossibility, because now the laners they'll be ganking will likely be a full 1-2 levels ahead of them. High impact early game junglers are problematic, to be sure, but if they can't reliably make that early impact, then they'll just fade into obscurity.
Padagi1 votesThe whole problem with this is you can either have it one way or the other. Most likely both aren't going to be EXACTLY the same power.
Early gankers will still be able to gank early but it will be much riskier. Which is the point. They REALLY have to do this to get any changes out of the jungle.
If they make the changes and just let it be the same as S4, surprise... The jungle will play out just like the jungle. Who cares if early game junglers fade into obscurity? That is somewhat the point of the changes is to see early game junglers succeed less often.
Sir Bulldog2 votesWelcome to the league of
Junkο2 votesRIP Tanky junglers
Ragingfangs1 votesDon't worry friends I see what is happening Rito is enforcing the Leauge of Ranged Champions so every other lane and the junglers jobs will be made so much harder that everyone has to do a 5 man bot push
THE LEAUGE OF RANGED CHAMPIONS WILL PROVAIL
Vertanium1 votesWell now they REALLY have to buff tank junglers, or else you will be 0/3 without anyone even seeing you yet. I honestly don't know why they want to make the camps harder, especially if they still advocate midlaners taking jungle farm if the lane is pushed or something.
Long Dong Wukong1 votesAll they're doing is effectively kicking out about 50% of the current junglers and making Lee Sin even better.
That's about it.
