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Sion and the Soul Furnace Nerf Discussion.

Misticaltom·4/11/2015, 5:11:35 AM·79 votes·8,705 views

> Sion > Soul Furnace [W] - Shield now 6/7/8/9/10% of max health and can be activated again after 3 seconds (changed from 10% at all ranks and 2 seconds) >

Sion's Soul Furnace is currently being tested for a Nerf. This nerf increases the lock-out duration for reactivation while additionally weaking Early-shield health.

Sion is rather strong right now, but I do not believe this to be an acceptable solution. Among over a Hundred champions, Sion possesses an entirely Readable kit. His Decimating Smash creates a huge AoE Warning on the ground with a 1-2 Second Charge up, complete with additional sound and Animations for when it hits that 1 Second mark and can now knock you up. It has a Range of 600

Sion's Soul Furnace is designed to be cast as a Follow up for Decimating Smash, and the two abilities naturally sync up together. Soul Furnace has a range of 550 and lasts 6 Seconds, can be detonated 2 seconds into the Shield charge for an early detonation, trading the Shield for Damage. Similar to Decimating Smash, Soul Furnace has a distinct Animation and Charge up Sound, making it a clear and obvious threat.

You can literally see Sion's weaknesses in his Champion Spotlight. Before we saw him in the Professional Scene, people loved to bad mouth Sion and his absurdly easy counter-play. What makes Sion Sion is how he's an unstoppable Juggernaut, something that takes time and commitment to take down, not someone you can simply ignore. The additional Second added to Sion's Shield exploding Duration will Cripple Sion Jungling, as the Shield can only Sustain 1 Minion Auto per rank. Meaning you can take 2 Hit's at Rank 1 before it dies, and 3 at Rank 2, and 4 at rank 3. This means that Until Sion has a level 2 Shield, he can't even use the Damage portion of the shield if he doesn't first CC the Monster he uses it on.

That's current Sion, now Sion's going to need an additional Rank(level 3) just to clear his Gromp through his Shield. We've not even spoken about the % nerf, and Sion has a low base health, so you're heavy-nerfing that early shield. It is now useless at Rank 1. That's what you just did to it. There is no reason for Sion to take Soul Furnace, the move he wants to take to begin stacking Health, until level 3, and it's going to be a wasted point until level 4, or 5 if you take multiple points into any other Skill that may need them, like Decimating Smash.

There are plenty of other ways you can Nerf Sion.

You could change his Decimating Smash's Slow to increase per level, so it's not always 50%. You could change the Damage on Sion's Shield to scaling rather than the Explosion Duration or Shield Health. You could nerf the Range on Soul Furnace from 550 to 500. I mean, Annie's spell and attack ranges are 650, so if Annie gets caught in Sion's Shield it's her fault right? So why do we have to make the shield so much less.....Siony.

But what does everyone else think? Do you find the shield abusive when you're fighting Sion? In lane or in Jungle? Do you play Sion? What do you think of these changes? Comment below, let everybody know.

111 Comments

Hasztalan24/11/2015, 6:12:35 AM32 votes

I dunno why are they nerfing him in the first place. He is still an overly-over rated garbage champ who does nothing.

Kieferr4/11/2015, 3:50:58 PM31 votes

Not only is the shield weak to the point that it can be completely negated by a few autos, but I need 3 SECONDS to get the damage off! Sion opponents now never have to worry about it as a threat! Sion activates shield? You now have 3 generous seconds to wear it off and BAM it's gone, no more damage from him anymore! Considering his q can also be interripted by an enemy, and his e a skillshot, his laning just got exponentially worse due to the fact that his w is his most reliable and highest source of damage. If riot is really going through with this ridiculous Nerf, at least increase sion's base HP or increase the % damage it does to compensate. This is pathetic... What a gutting. Now he's as bad as s5 ryze and kass.

SmknWdl4/11/2015, 8:06:50 PM30 votes

SION. IS. PERFECTLY. BALANCED. Sorry but seriously it's true. There is no need for a nerf, and there are much more important things to deal with (invispears, firewall crash, making akali less choppy to play)

Nublord4/11/2015, 8:31:34 AM28 votes

Another nerf for Sion and this time a hard one? What they are trying to do here? Sona level rework?

Lajinn54/11/2015, 5:53:59 PM13 votes

That will hurt jungling Sions quite a lot. Usually the two second shield gives you enough time to detonate right before its broken by jungle creeps, the extra second will hurt alot.

Yandere Carry4/11/2015, 9:31:20 AM11 votes

these are some valid points.

Shadow Gilgamesh4/11/2015, 5:29:02 AM8 votes

He still seems to be really strong, even after repeated nerfs to other abilities, so I guess it's fine that they're finally trying something with his W.

However, since if the shield pops, you don't get to burst people with it, it feels like these nerfs should be either/or, not both. Either make the shield easier to pop with the lowering of HP percentage OR increase the time till he can burst so you have a chance to get away or have longer to pop the shield, doing both seems REALLY heavy handed for the ability neither AD or AP Sion will max first

Zarxis4/11/2015, 7:39:39 PM4 votes

I'm fine with the scaling nerf, but the lockout nerf combined with that is too much, in my opinion.

TheDevice4/11/2015, 7:02:49 PM4 votes

if they don't want AP sion.. Remove the bonus AP damage/scaling. DONE.

This can't possibly be for that reason. I refuse to believe that's the case.

It's probably because he's a good jungler for people who learn how to play him... All the while leaving lee sin to do whatever he wants (top, bot, jungle, etc).

This is just an aggravation nerf just to piss people off lol. So many better junglers. I mean Nasus can get away with going top lane or jingling so why should sion?

There's absolutely no reason for this nerf. It's just to piss people off. Nobody can give valid reasoning behind it.

Nebuul4/12/2015, 6:16:25 AM4 votes

I have been maining Sion this season, primarily as s jungler, and I'm really bummed about this change. Sion jungle is only good because of very tight timing with w on the first clear. The loss of health combined with the 3 second wait will really hurt him.

Sion is, I know, a very strong champion. I don't think this us the right way to deal with him.

macromite4/12/2015, 3:18:08 PM4 votes

I personally feel that if they want to nerf sion, instead they should just buff his counters. A nerf like this will only make the game less fun for the sion mains and do nothing else, and the nerf isn't really a big thing. I am thinking the reason sion is so oppressive is that people are stupid, or peopel don't dare pick his counters to go to top lane. so rito, make it so more people will want to play the things that beat down the goliath, unless ou really are just a bunch of evil jerks that nerf champions for no reason but to remove diversity in the game.

kasfas4/11/2015, 11:47:24 PM3 votes

Ok the first 2 nerfs were understandable, but this is rediculous! What is RITO thinking? He may have a high win rate, but he's very hard to play, and land all his abilities. Have people even learned how to play around him, i mean come on. sigh If this happens i will be very sad for my favourite champion... But please rito, don't wreck him anymore than this if you must. item 3070 Sion item 3070

Drukyul4/12/2015, 12:08:00 AM3 votes

This is starting to feel like Zac all over again.

wRZcGiWq624/12/2015, 1:30:26 AM2 votes

I think they should nerf the shield a little bit but make the Q 1 second faster. I mean honestly who sits there for 2 seconds in basically a LARGE RED MOVE THE FK OUTTA THE WAY sign and gets hit? It is arguably the most easily dodged skill in the game. He's tanky as hell so maybe cutting it down to 1 second and doing the shield/ removing a slight amount of scaling would be good.

Cyber Mxlly4/12/2015, 3:59:26 AM2 votes

"lets ruin sion EVEN more" ....

YOU BEEN WARNED4/13/2015, 8:11:53 AM2 votes

fucking b

No more Sion nerfs!!!!!!

Jungle Lux God4/11/2015, 7:28:55 PM2 votes

While I understand your reasoning for why you think it an inappropriate nerf, I personally think that it is a fairly appropriate nerf.

The health scaling reduction at early levels it appropriate because it makes Sion weaker when he doesn't max W first. Just about every top lane Sion will max RQEW, and before his most recent changes he maxed REQW. His W was always really bad to max first because you didn't get a whole lot out of it because the % HP scaling was generally stronger than the rank-up rewards, and even then it was actually really strong.

The recast duration increase is appropriate because it still allows Sion to still have its current damage while still enabling his opponents to play around it. Even though Sion's Soul Furnace has plenty of readability, its short recast time allows you to still get plenty of reliable damage out.

These change I think are appropriate because they give Sion rank-up incentives to W that he didn't have before, especially in the top lane, while also leaving is amazing late-game completely untouched, and as long as Sion still has his late-game he's still going to be really good.

Variks the Loyal4/11/2015, 7:14:07 AM2 votes

I think they're doing this nerf because they're tired of people building AP Sion. Like they said in a recent patch, they want more axe smashing, less "roaring at minions".

I can sympathize. They seemed to have a fantasy of a Sion who builds AD and was tanky. In the spotlight, they made Ravenous Hydra seem like his most core item. And he has quotes for lots of AD items, even Infinity Edge (This will cleave a thousand heads!).

But, if they want to dissuade against AP play, this isn't the way to do it. What I would do is, A) nerf/remove the AP scaling on Blood Furnace, and B) make it so that when E hits a minion, it becomes physical damage instead of magic damage. Still scales with AP, but no longer benefits from Magic Penetration.

They could also remove E's armor shred. That bonus seems pointless to me, I never get to use it.