Will Yasuo get re-buffed ?!?! (or at least reverted to his old state)

Impulsive Feeder··6 votes·1,925 views

Before the nerf Yasuo was originally a slightly overpowered champ. Now after the nerf he is literally the worst champ in the game.

With the lowest win rate in ranked it is now offically safe to say that Urgot is better then Yasuo (no kidding, check lolking)

RITO PLS.... Trash tier doesn't even begin to describe the cesspool yasuo is in right now. -__-

Of course I am abit biased cos I bought the project skin and now never use it.... :( but it still doesn't change the fact that he is beaten in every mid lane match up now...

Any thoughts on how to fix him?

27 Comments

Worgslarg5 votes

He was fine. His laning phase was ok, his lategame damage was right for a melee hypercarry. And they just decided to nerf him into oblivion. He. Was. Not. OP.

Impulsive Feeder1 votes

well, he kinda didn't offer any counter play to highly skill shot reliant champs like ziggs (unless ur a boss at landing skill shots) cos of that e. But yeah he wasn't really in need of a nerf....

Worgslarg1 votes

Wind wall, in and of itself, is counterplay. Good game design has characters with different abilities, so if you're up against a brand for example, you should know not to group up. If you're facing a yasuo, you should know that he can block abilities, and play accordingly. If you do not need to adapt to your matchup in terms of playstyle, then the game designers have failed.

Sozan51 votes

I would agree with that, if not for the fact that Yasuo wall lasts 4 seconds and is big enough that you can't just walk around it. Also, it blocks projectiles from every direction and goes off immidiately (making Yasuo completely immune to projectiles in the first 0,25s which is also important). Braum wall is a better example of anti-projectile wall with counterplay:

  1. He blocks them only from 1 direction.
  2. He can be moved, should you have abilities to do that.
  3. His wall is way smaller so you can adjust your position to bypass it.
  4. He still takes damage, albeit reduced one.

Yasuo on the other hand, places Wind Wall and you're screwed for 4 seconds - he could just as well have auto-polymorph of all projectile based champions, as they are rendered completely useless.

Agidyne4 votes

Revert his last nerfs and he is fucking fine.

Creamy Seaman3 votes

Yasuo PRESSED R AFTER WUKONG ULT! ENEMY DOUBLE KILL! Yasuo MASHES EVERY BUTTON ON HIS KEYBOARD! ENEMY PENTAKILL!

Impulsive Feeder2 votes

that only happens after you feed him... and strictly speaking if u feed any champ they WILL end up reking your whole team...

Creamy Seaman1 votes

hmmmm....that's weird. He only had item 3087 and item 3074 30 minutes into the game. :/

hOrnn3 votes

yasuos fine.

Impulsive Feeder4 votes

no he's not... a balanced champ doesn't have a 42% winrate

Sozan52 votes

And yet he's still 3rd most banned champion in game.

Sorry to say, but he cannot be buffed for as long as he retains his kit. It doesn't allow for much counterplay and it's frustrating to play against.

He needs a rework, not a buff. Things that are okay in his kit right now:

  • Shield passive
  • Q damage/stacking
  • R damaging part

Not okay things in his kit:

  • 175 range (why? His weapon isn't especially long, nor is his model really big. Yi's katana and Trynda sword are just as long and he have 125 range. The other guys at 175 range have either spears/staffs (that are expected to have higher range - because they are significantly longer) or their models are just big)
  • Double crit passive (and it's on top of the already good shield passive)
  • Q stack timer (it simply lasts way too long pressuring the lane incredibly hard, especially after 6 - as getting hit with the knockup will most likely result in death. I think it should be dependant on his Q CD - for example: Stacks lasts Q CD + 4 seconds, meaning that you always have 4 seconds to cast another Q)
  • W (allows for even less counterplay than Braum's shield and it's way too forgiving as well)
  • E (makes it easy to dodge skillshots (just by randomly clicking on minion whenever you see enemy do something) and gives him way too much mobility, at least as far as laning phase goes - wouldn't be as much of a problem if Yasuo used energy or mana (energy would be perfect for him - like 40 energy per dash, but 20/25/30/35/40 is refunded if used on enemy champion))
  • R armor penetration (makes building the stat that should counter his damage extremely inefficient with his 50% bonus armor penetration)

I mean, I really like the idea behind Yasuo - a samurai/ronin that uses wind to fight his opponents. But right now his kit is the most 'toxic' (I always treat toxic as "not allowing enough counterplay options) one in League.

Agidyne3 votes

And yet he's still 3rd most banned champion in game.

Sorry to say, but he cannot be buffed for as long as he retains his kit. It doesn't allow for much counterplay and it's frustrating to play against.

He needs a rework, not a buff. Things that are okay in his kit right now:

  • Shield passive
  • Q damage/stacking
  • R damaging part

Not okay things in his kit:

  • 175 range (why? His weapon isn't especially long, nor is his model really big. Yi's katana and Trynda sword are just as long and he have 125 range. The other guys at 175 range have either spears/staffs (that are expected to have higher range - because they are significantly longer) or their models are just big)
  • Double crit passive (and it's on top of the already good shield passive)
  • Q stack timer (it simply lasts way too long pressuring the lane incredibly hard, especially after 6 - as getting hit with the knockup will most likely result in death. I think it should be dependant on his Q CD - for example: Stacks lasts Q CD + 4 seconds, meaning that you always have 4 seconds to cast another Q)
  • W (allows for even less counterplay than Braum's shield and it's way too forgiving as well)
  • E (makes it easy to dodge skillshots (just by randomly clicking on minion whenever you see enemy do something) and gives him way too much mobility, at least as far as laning phase goes - wouldn't be as much of a problem if Yasuo used energy or mana (energy would be perfect for him - like 40 energy per dash, but 20/25/30/35/40 is refunded if used on enemy champion))
  • R armor penetration (makes building the stat that should counter his damage extremely inefficient with his 50% bonus armor penetration)

I mean, I really like the idea behind Yasuo - a samurai/ronin that uses wind to fight his opponents. But right now his kit is the most 'toxic' (I always treat toxic as "not allowing enough counterplay options) one in League.

It's just funny how people think Yasuo lacks counterplay because they can't hit him with Targeted spells.

Where's the counterplay on Ryzes Q? Or Syndras undodgeable instastun, I mean, they could make that thing a point&click and you wouldn't notice.

What's the overall counterplay to ranged champions with escaping tools? Get hit by whatever they throw at you, then when you finally catch them try to get to them again because they press E or something?

Have people ever considered picking a fucking meele champ against Yasuo? I see the words "no counterplay" and "toxic" thrown around and I always wonder if people ever took Wukong mid to try and deal with him.

Sozan51 votes

Oh, but of course he does have counterpicks (however, counterpick =/= counterplay). I always try to pick Darius mid against Yasuo and it's just a stomp. I never said he is OP. He is extremely frustrating to play against if you don't counterpick him.

Ryze, while also lacking significant counterplay options, still have more than Yasuo. For example he can (and usually will) go oom if he tries to spam you with his spells. He also lacks mobility, so if you can catch him in bad position he can't just escape. And you can hit him with skillshots, which is nice too. And magic resist works against him.

Syndra stun shouldn't be able to push balls that didn't even appear yet, I agree with you on that. However, you can react to the cast animation of the Q itself and move out of the way (she can only stun people that are in straight line with the ball), which already is some counterplay. And building magic resist works against her, so that's cool.

Ranged champions with escape tools? Well, apart from the universal ones (that work against Yasuo too) - you can hit them with skillshots and thus stop them. Ashe R, Leona E, Blitz Q etc - those abilities work well against ranged champions with escape tools. Also, you can bait their escape tool and they won't have it again for some time. And of course buying Armor works against them. And they can run out of mana too.

Agidyne1 votes

You see, that's exactly what happens with Yasuo.

His passive shield is almost meaningless when you think about it if you are ranged, a single auto attack and he loses his shield.

His double crit chance is literally the core of his kit. If they ever change it, he needs to have A LOT of power added into something else, like, his Q needs to have like 300 base damage at level 9 to make up for the loss of damage.

His windwall has a very long cooldown up until level 14 or something. It is so easy to bait it out. Just pretend like you are going all in and throw something at him that has low cooldown. You can have a fair trade with him right after and unless he crits you 3 times with 20% crit chance, he won't do anything.

His R Armor-pen is almost a non-factor against squishies if you think about it. I mean, nearly every mage will get Zhonyas, giving them 50 armor.

Against Yasuo, it will only give them 25 armor after ult. That's it.

Against a heavy armor stacking champion, it is meaningfull, but not against mages. I mean, you can negate like 150 armor out of a Rammus if you press R at the right time but you will negate 30, 40 at most against anyone else.

He does have counterplay, it's the exact same as Riven. Wait for her core stuff to be on cooldown(Broken Wings, Valor) in this case and you have a free kill. She is hyper aggressive so she will use them at the same time sooner or later.

In lane, there's easy ways of dealing with Yasuo, regardless of them being good or not.

As a mage, just negate his shield with a single AA and engage on him while his windwall is down. BUT KEEP YOUR RANGE. As an adc, just do the same thing early on. As a bruiser, I shouldn't even have to explain to you what to do. As a tank, I don't know why you would take a tank mid, but if you do, just bend over and accept the fact that you can do nothing.

Sozan51 votes

If the double crit chance passive will ever be removed he will need some power added into something else. Adding 200 damage to 1,6s cd skill would break him completely, but I could see him getting buffs to his shield passive.

Windwall isn't easy to bait out if Yasuo have any idea what he's doing.

Okay, so you think that 25 armor penetration is a non-factor? Anyway, that's not my point here... It's exactly about the tanks. They build armor to counter his high damage output but it isn't effective. Also, you don't need to "press R at the right time" - you press it anytime someone is in mid-air and you get the armor penetration for 15 seconds regardless of who you hit with the ultimate.

Hm... So wait till Yasuo core skills are on cooldown yes? So... when he uses E and Q you have a whopping 0,5-0,1s to react for E to come off cd and maximum of 5 seconds cd on Q that is reduced down to 1,33s at level 9 (if you have attack speed items, which you should). The only skill you can count on being on CD is his Wind Wall (as even his ultimate have low cd) and if it's on CD it usually means that one of your major skills is also on cooldown, thus making you lose the trade anyway (depends on champion a lot of course, but Yasuo will use his W to block a meaningful skill most of the time - I am not including mistakes, as those can happen on both sides).

Agidyne1 votes

Literally removing his 2x passive just to buff his shield is a terrible idea considering his shield was a lot stronger on release than now.

Windwall is the easiest spell to bait out in the game.

It seriously fucking is.

Let's say you are Annie.

Throw a Q at him, he either windwalls it or he takes the damage to the face. He can't dodge it, that's for sure.

If he takes damage too many times you have a clean kill at lvl6 with Tibbers.

If he does not, then you have like 20 seconds to bully him out with spells. 20 seconds is a long ass time in the lane.

If he is bad to the point of block your AAs to make sure he doesn't lose his passive shield, then you simply go in on him and he can't do a thing.

Annie is just a mere example. Malzahar works too, he can't dodge Aids, you can grind him down that way.

Many other mages are trickier, Syndra just has to Q-E him. Most people can't dodge a ball spawning right on top of them.

Vel'koz E is actually bugged against his windwall. The projectile disapears mid air and so does the mark on the ground, yet, if you stand there, you will recieve damage and get knocked up.

Zyra works too.

Etc.

Knight SoIaire 1 votes

he has a counterplay poke him, stun him or just focus him, he is squishy so once stunned he usualy dies before he can wind wall

Sozan51 votes

Poking him is less effective than poking most of the other champions, as he both have his dodge to negate the poke damage and a shield to protect him from a lot of the poke damage even if he gets him.

Stunning him is also less effective as he have E to dodge skillshot based CC, and his windwall to stop projectile based CC. You need a very specific ability in order to catch him and stun him (Fiddle Q comes to mind).

But yes, CCing him and killing him is a valid strategy. It was also valid for old AP Yi - did it make his kit any less toxic? No.

Agidyne1 votes

Poking him is less effective than poking most of the other champions, as he both have his dodge to negate the poke damage and a shield to protect him from a lot of the poke damage even if he gets him.

Stunning him is also less effective as he have E to dodge skillshot based CC, and his windwall to stop projectile based CC. You need a very specific ability in order to catch him and stun him (Fiddle Q comes to mind).

But yes, CCing him and killing him is a valid strategy. It was also valid for old AP Yi - did it make his kit any less toxic? No.

AP Yi was toxic because he would literally poke you out with Qs while cleaning the wave and sustain back any type of damage that you would throw on him.

That's why he was toxic, it's not the fact that you couldn't CC him and kill him. It was the fact that he simply promoted passive play and was rewarded for it.

Yasuo is quite different, he doesn't promote any type of passive play, he wants to in your face. ALL THE TIME.

Kinda like Riven.

ValyrianBlade1 votes

I agree entirely with this.

His kit is just toxic. You can say you can deal with him in Lane in certain ways, but Lane =/= game. The adc can't touch Yasuo (or any of his team for that matter) when he throws up wind wall which is a gigantic advantage. His double crit chance is just plain unfair. His armour pen further removes counter play.

On top of that he is highly mobile, and has lots of utility to go with his damage. I don't see how this champion can survive at lower levels of play without being completely OP at higher levels, hence the poor win rate.

Most importantly, he's just NOT FUN to play against. The shield, the ult, the wind wall, the mobility, the crit chance... Even when I'm killing him at will I don't enjoy playing against him.

Get rid of the double crit, and make his ult less reliable, and adjust his cooldowns. Then maybe you can give him some power and make him a fair champion.

I'll reiterate, a low win rate does not make a champion bad, it might just mean bad players pick him (read: players at too low a skill level to play him effectively pick him).

Worgslarg1 votes

Double crit passive (and it's on top of the already good shield passive)

While I agree that damage should be shifted to his Q and R instead of his autos, his shield passive is weak enough to be near worthless. His shield strength and flow generation have both been heavily nerfed.

Sozan51 votes

It's not a bad passive at all.

It have a cooldown based on distance traveled, but generally it will take less than 14 seconds to charge it up, as long as you don't stand in one place for no reason. By walking alone it takes 13,5s to charge it, but every E increases the flow by a bit more than 10% - so it's rather unlikely you will take too long charging it. Malphite have 10/8/6s of not taking damage and Vi have 18/13/8s flat cd. Mind you that Yasuo's movement speed will increase as the time progresses (Boots and Statikk usually. Results in 408 movement speed, so it will take 11s later on without using his E) and his shield refreshes when he ults.

For the amount of shield - it's still rather high. For other passive shields to reach his power you would need: Level 1 - 60 points of shield - Vi and Malph would need 600 health, which is perfectly doable if you buy some high health item Level 6 - 90 points of shield - 900 health needed, both Vi and Malph have it without items Level 11 - 160 points of shield - 1600 health needed, Vi and Malph should have it by now (unless they skipped on Health items) Level 18 - 470 points of shield - 4700 health needed - it's rather unlikely that either Vi or Malph will build that much health.

So, as far as numbers go - it's easily seen that shield starts somewhat strong then loses a bit of power, but it comes back and is good in late game. Though, a good thing to remember is that shields scale with defensive stats, so the ones on Malph and Vi will probably still be somewhat stronger, even though the amount is lower (which is why the shield number is okay).

The downside of his shield is of course the low duration (only 1s), but it's still a decent passive, and certainly not "near worthless".

And if the double crit chance passive would be gone, this one could be buffed a bit of course.

Agidyne1 votes

Still not a core component to his kit.

I, as a regular Yasuo player that enjoys Yasuo for what he is, an extremely high damage Assassin that blows shit up but also gets blown up extremely quick., would rather have my shield removed and the -10% crit damage removed than having my 2x crit chance gone just to have my shield up slightly more often.

I would hate having this extremely fun assassin be turned into a regular bruiser for the sake of it.

Agent20901 votes

I hate playing against Yasuo. Just seeing him on the other team makes me want to just leave the game. He's seriously no fun to play against.

Wehrmacht Bunny1 votes

yasuos fine.

You've clearly never played Yasuo.

Yasuo PRESSED R AFTER WUKONG ULT! ENEMY DOUBLE KILL! Yasuo MASHES EVERY BUTTON ON HIS KEYBOARD! ENEMY PENTAKILL!

Same with you. You think he can just instantly pick up a penta? If it was the easy, he would have th highest PKA, yet he has one of the lowest.

And yet he's still 3rd most banned champion in game.

He's banned because A) People don't want a feeder on their team. People who play Yasuo usually feed the enemy team. B) In low ELO some people think he's OP just because some Pros banned him.

Before people call him OP or Perfectly fine, they need to go check out his KDA and his W/L Ratio. He has one of the worst KDA and W/L.

xDingwithsalad1 votes

Yasuo is garbage, I hope they buff him

ILoveTiramisu1 votes

he is literally high risk high reward champion.

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