Hey guys, been reading a few guides and found in a few places that claim running Crit damage Marks and Quints has incredible damage(instead of AD). Just wondering if any of you pro Jhin players out there have experimented with this and could share some experiences before I invest 10,455 Ip on the runes haha.
Elite4Runner2 votesI'm assuming that you are wanting to see which is more effective at level 1
Well, lets look at a full set of flat AD Marks and Quints
Attack Damage Marks = .95 x 9 = 8.5 Quints = 2.25 x 3 = 6.75 8.5 + 6.75 AD = 15.25 AD
At level 1 Jhin has 53 base AD And his passive automatically increases his total AD by 2% (assuming that he has no other form of attack speed or critical strike chance)
1.02 x (53 + 15.25) = 69.615 Total AD
So we need to beat this in order to determine which is more effective.
Critical Strike Chance Marks = .93 x 9 = 8.37 Quints = 1.86 x 3 = 5.58 8.37 + 5.58 AD = 13.95 Critical Strike Chance
Jhin's passive increases his total AD by +2% (base) and +4% per 10% critical strike chance To my knowledge, this is rounded down, so this would only increase his overall AD by a total of 6%
1.06 x 53 = 56.18 Total AD
However, keep in mind that any additional AD purchased will be increased at a faster rate.
Lets also look at the other part of Jhin's passive. His attack speed scaling.
Attack Speed Marks = 1.7 x 9 = 15.3 Quints = 4.5 x 3 = 13.5 15.3 + 13.5 = 18.8% Bonus Attack Speed
Just like with crit, I believe the bonus only scales per 10%, so it still only increases his overall AD by an additional 2.5%
1.045 x 53 = 55.38 Total AD
Based on these 3 calculations, at level 1, the flat AD runes give the greatest total AD.
However,
As I mentioned, your overall AD does have a better ability to scale with Critical Strike Chance and Bonus Attack Speed.
At level 1 you can not increase your Critical Strike chance any further without purchasing
400 gold
+10% critical strike chance.
That is an additional 4% total AD 1.1 x 53 = 58.3 Total AD
However, You do have the ability to increase your bonus attack speed without purchasing any items in game. With as few as 2 points in the Fury mastery you can boost your bonus attack speed up over 20%
1.07 x 53 = 56.71 Total AD
And you can then invest your gold into an AD item
350 gold
+10 AD
1.07 x (53 + 10) = 67.41 Total AD
Or
300 gold
+12% bonus attack speed
1.095 x 53 = 58.035 Total AD
However, ..
If you were to purchase a long sword with your AD runes you would have
1.02 x (53 + 15.25 + 10) = 79.815 Total AD
So, if you are looking for the best way to get the most AD at level 1, AD runes are probably the best option.
If you are looking for a slightly lower option that scales better, critical strike chance might be easier, but I personally think it is a little awkward, especially if you want to try and get 100% critical strike chance that game, without going over the cap, it's pretty much impossible.
I kind of like the attack speed route (even though I know that most people don't) because it also gives him mobility, and you CAN exceed the 2.5 attack speed cap and continue to increase his passive.
If you have even read this far, I kinda just wanted to try and go through the math.
I'm a little bored lol.
And if my math is wrong anywhere, I'm sorry.
I would like to note however, that considering how insanely complicated this passive is,
The AD scaling has not been changed since he hit live servers.
That is quite impressive if you really think about it.
blame jungler1 votesHello Elite, Thank you VERY much for your post. I did manage to read all of it and it was VERY interesting to read. However I was asking about crit DAMAGE not crit chance runes. As apparently with ER, IE, and Cannon you can get close to critting all the time, add on the 100% crit 4th attack and how much extra damage it does, I was curious to see how the extra 33.45% extra crit damage from runes fairs at most/all stages of the game in comparison to flat AD. (not including last hitting, as that can be fixed with practice)
blame jungler1 votesEspecially seeing as it would counter the 25% crit damage reduction on his passive.
Elite4Runner1 votesHello Elite, Thank you VERY much for your post. I did manage to read all of it and it was VERY interesting to read. However I was asking about crit DAMAGE not crit chance runes. As apparently with ER, IE, and Cannon you can get close to critting all the time, add on the 100% crit 4th attack and how much extra damage it does, I was curious to see how the extra 33.45% extra crit damage from runes fairs at most/all stages of the game in comparison to flat AD. (not including last hitting, as that can be fixed with practice)
Oooooh, I actually had never considered that lol.
Well, that is a great question for which I am not really sure how the math would work, but I'll try and figure it out.
My assumption would be that it would increase the base amount at which his normal critical strike damage would be applied like normal.
So he has 25% reduced critical strike damage, which means when his critical strike deals 150% of his total AD in physical damage , THEN applies bonus physical damage for 15 / 20 / 25% of the target's missing health.
So normally with AD runes, and the math we did before (lets go with the AD runes + Long Sword build) attacking a target with only his 4th shot who is at full health, he would deal, ..
1.5 x 79.815 = 107.72 physical damage, then 16.158 in bonus physical damage.
107.72 + 16.16 = 123.88 Total damage
With an increase in critical strike damage of 33.45% his critical strike damage reduction would be completely negated, and he would get a bonus of
75% + 33.45% = 108.45% critical strike damage.
Which means his critical strikes would deal 216.9% of his total AD
With the Longsword and his base AD
1.02 x (53 + 10) = 64.26 Total AD
2.169 x 64.26 = 139.38 physical strike damage, then 20.907 in bonus physical damage.
139.38 + 20.91 = 160.29 Total damage
The difference is 36.41 damage.