Why is Garen not viable? Hes a massive tank who cant be killed and he does lots of crit dmg.. U have to choose between the two tho i guess.. But i dont get it why is he so bad? And how could he be good without being too op? What would u guys do to him if he had to be reworked? More cc? A gapcloser?
colesy3 votesgaren is fine. he bullies the absolute shit out of melee champions and pretty much becomes indestructible and extremely annoying after finishing one tank item.
WillHealForHonor3 votesBut why is he never used in pro games? what does he lack?
Sir Yamazuki1 votesBut why is he never used in pro games? what does he lack?
He was picked in one, I forgot what region, but he was completely ignored all game and lost. If he goes tank, he is absolutely useless and is nothing but a silence and execute, his tankiness is only useful if he's focused... but his non-ult threat is an auto attack silence on a long cool down compared to other similar abilities... so there is never a reason to ever hit Garen in a team fight. If you build damage on him, then he dies since he's immobile so he never gets to use that damage and dies instantly.
He does "okayish" in soloq, but only because in soloq people will sit there and focus someone even if they aren't a threat.
FirstSergeantBim1 votesNone of the pro players like him as much as the other champs. Simply a matter of preference. That's really all it comes down to. Recent buffs to The Black Cleaver, Zz'rot Portal and his R have made him God-tier. I wouldn't be surprised if we start to see him in professional play, although I hope that nobody actually picks him up. I like that he's underrated and I would hate to see Riot nerf him.
If you take a look at his kit, he has so much potential to become incredibly tanky while also having the same potential to do incredible damage. People like to downplay his silence, but it's actually one of the most useful hard CC's in this game. When you're silenced you can't flash, can't use abilities and you can't even use Thresh's lantern. All you can do is run around and hope you don't die. That silence is some of the best peel in this game. Furthermore, since most of his damage is mobile you are able to keep up your damage almost 100% of the time. Nobody can out-run you and it takes more than one (usually 3-4 if you build right) champions to lock you down because the passive resistances, damage reduction and CC reduction on your W is just so fucking good.
He doesn't really have any glaring weaknesses since Patch 5.8. I really like to run him in the top lane or in the jungle and use Smite with TP or Flash. Challenging Smite/Cinderhulk, The Black Cleaver, Boots of Swiftness and Zz'Rot Portal are all so incredibly good on him. He powerspikes hard after I get those first four fairly cheap items. When I pick up Alacrity I can consistently keep over 600 MS while I'm running by a turret due to the Zz'Rot Portal passive and some other MS boosts. Due to the passive on his W, he can get a total of 171 armor and magic resistance FROM ONLY TWO ITEMS, two points in the defensive tree and scaling seals/glyphs. That doesn't even count his base armor and MR or the damage/cc reduction on his W active. No other champion can boast these kind of stats.
I'm really happy with Garen. Riot's new itemization has really allowed him to become one of a kind.
WillHealForHonor1 voteswhy wouldnt u go ie or ghost blade on him
FirstSergeantBim1 votesI don't know. I don't think there's any good reason not to use those items if you need more damage instead of more durability. I don't use those items as core because they are purely offensive items, they're expensive and my core build offers a better mix of damage, durability and utility. Once I'm finished with my first four items I might buy an IE or a Ghostblade though.
Red Frostraven1 votesBut why is he never used in pro games? what does he lack?
He lacks mobility.
Pro games are all about movement; teleporting and pulling, manipulating the positions of friendly and enemy champions to maximize damage outputs and minimize casualities.
A garen can't catch a pro player, because they know when they can't counter Garen, and won't let him get a single hit. They will switch lanes and get jungler help to deny him farm.
WillHealForHonor1 votesSo am i right when ur implying that hes op but pros can laneswap him too death.. i tried him todays vs a VAYNE theres was nothing to do.. i had 8 farm when he had 40
IndianHippie1 votesgaren is fine. he bullies the absolute shit out of melee champions and pretty much becomes indestructible and extremely annoying after finishing one tank item.
Except for Volibear. Volibear absolutely bullies him in the lane. Even at level 18 i was able to finish off garen, thresh and someone else with just some help from my support
Rand0mH3r0X3 votesOh - My - God. Lets just rework League of Legends so that you specifically win every game. Your rank increases by 100LP evertime you move your champion and 1000LP when you talk in /all chat. Riot pays your trip to the LCS and you win by a landslide.
WillHealForHonor2 votesrandomrage.com
Jiberamu2 voteseasy to kite the only people that know how to abuse a garen player is anyone higher than diamond, otherwise until then garens fine
WillHealForHonor2 votesso give him a gapcloser.. but then hes too op i guess.. i think rito should make a new champ with crit spin.. that would be fun
Renaille2 votesso give him a gapcloser.. but then hes too op i guess.. i think rito should make a new champ with crit spin.. that would be fun
Give him that and he still has no damage.
WillHealForHonor1 voteswhat is holding rito back then.. :P but then again champs like teemo needs a rework before garen..
Matezoide2 votesHis damage is fine (Though E takes a while to ramp up). He just doesnt do a lot because everyone builds 2 damage items at most and rarely manages to reach the enemy's squishies, but his actual scallings are surprinsigly good.
WillHealForHonor1 votesu could peel with him with the silence and the armor shred for ur adc i guess.. if u cant reach the carries i mean
Jiberamu1 voteshis q? removes all debuffs? Theres just no reason to play garen because there are other champions that are better for competitive, garen just doesnt fit because you know what hes going to do and provides no cc
FirstSergeantBim1 votesAnd Shyvana provides so much CC and you totally can't tell what she's going to do. Oh and Hecarim has way better mobility, damage and CC. Except that's not true, but they've both been really popular. Garen scales better than both of them and has much better itemization options. There is no good reason to believe Garen isn't a god-tier champ. Open your mind man, just because the pros don't play a champ doesn't mean shit.
Mister Beane2 votesDear JamenFar,
I think Garen is pretty healthy as is and really wouldn't want to change much on him. I also feel Garen is a viable laner, boasting a ( very low skill floor and a ) very high skill cap. Just off the top of my head ( feel free to ask me to think about it if you'd like me to actually go into detail regarding a rework ) if I were to change Garen I'd simply alter his passive ( Garen starts with 0.5% Health regeneration that vanishes for 5 seconds if damaged by enemy champions, towers and large/epic monsters; gaining an additional 0.5% health regen/keeping his regen if attacked by a large monster at level 6, gaining 0.5% health regen at level 11 and again 16 with the ability for his passive to not be canceled by epic monsters ( for a maximum of 2.0% health regen ) to make him a viable jungler. I also feel that you'd do much better with a 
and 
than you would trying to score critical hits. Your late-game goal as Garen is to act as a dive-buddy: you wait for somebody else on your team to engage and rush in, focusing a carry ( reducing their armor and doing lots of damage ) before ulting them and leaving the rest to your team.
Best regards, Mr. Beane.
WillHealForHonor1 votesimo a champ is on ly healthy if hes, or has been recently a viable pick for the pros.. garen will never be picked so imo he must be bad..
Mister Beane1 votesDear JamenFar,
Ask and you shall receive. Here is footage from within the last week of Saint Vicious ( also known as saintvicious ) using Garen in the jungle and possibly making me eat my own words about Jungle-Garen not being viable. He currently is ( if memory serves me right ) the jungler for Team Curse or Gravity Gaming of NA. This game in question is a ranked ( challenger ) game where his counterpart is a Volibear. Please give this a view and let me know what you think.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DqYsl2_exic
Best regards, Mr. Beane.
FirstSergeantBim1 votesYou can't be doing that man. Nobody can know about Garen. I don't want to see Rito nerf him into the ground like they did to Sion and I don't want to see all the FotM kiddies pick him up because he was in the LCS. FML, my gare-bear is gonna get rekt.
Mister Beane1 votesDear Bim,
Sorry. >.> I didn't even think that I was exposing him; I'll be sure to think before doing these types of posts in the future. Also, can we not say "Gare-bar" please? That's one of the things my dad and I call my brother in-law when I wanna troll him; usually when he is around his daughter because he can't respond back with his usually cussing rant.
Best regards, Mr. Beane.
Rand0mH3r0X2 votesGaren seriously is the easiest champion to play. He doesn't need anything other than sunfire to dominate a game. If you want damage, build a IE. If you want surviability, build Thornmail. Why would he need a rework? Ignorance makes me upset.
u assume to many things that u know nothing about.. go flame somewhere else..
Rand0mH3r0X1 votesu assume to many things that u know nothing about.. go flame somewhere else..
That would be unethical, wouldn't it?
I'm sorry for coming off harsh on you.
Really, Garen is viable. Bushwack Garen is the most annoying Top Laner. If ranged APC crawls it's way into top lane, then just hide in the bush for regen. When they throw pokes, dodge them. Attack enemy APC or bruiser between waves and pokes. Garen is very influential in an good player's hands. Use him to split the enemy team and focus out specific enemies. That's something he's really good at. Charging enemy carries is usually not the best decision sometimes as separating the enemy tank far away from the enemy team.
Rinky Dinky2 votesGaren is fine...
WillHealForHonor2 voteswhy isnt he in pro games..
Rinky Dinky3 votesI'm just gonna let the downvotes speak for themselves.
Do some research and try to smarten up a bit
WillHealForHonor2 votesim new to these forums how can i see up and down votes
hawkman58792 votesHe has no cc and, obviously, no gp closers. He can't peel if he goes full tank and doesn't live long enough/deal enough dmg to be viable as a pure dmg dealer. It is mainly that he has no cc though, same reason you don't see champions like fiora and trynd in competitive settings. Unless they do a Sion level rework to him not much will change about him. Most they could do would be to let his e slow enemy targets while they are being hit by it.
FirstSergeantBim1 votesSo then that silence on his Q... must not be CC. Interesting.
lightdragoon881 votesYou really have to build him up to be a threat and until level 11 or 16, his passive doesn't really help him that much in lane, especially if the enemy is ranged.
WillHealForHonor2 votesHow could he then be changed to be balanced so he could be used in pro games for example
Hinro Honato1 votesWhy would you want him in a pro game?
WillHealForHonor1 votesthe thing imo people see him as troll.. like gp, teemo and so on.. its not like others who are never picked in pro games but still good in soloq like akali or irelia..
Hinro Honato1 votesUm in the right matchups garen absolutely wrecks soloq.
lightdragoon881 votesMmmmm....make his W a bit better I guess.
Matezoide1 votesIsnt it amazing how Garen got huge buffs recently (Passive, Ult CD, Ult bug fix) and he is still mediocre, overral?
He is hilarious in ARAM tho
WillHealForHonor1 voteshow is he buffed.. i know the passive buffs but not the rest.. i feel like hes op in aram as well.. meteos jungles with him in solo queue.. couldn he be a good split pusher..
Matezoide1 votesHis Ult just received a major Cooldown reduction for level 1 and 2.
Also, it used to cancel if his target left his camp of vision during the cast time. Now it doesnt.
Renaille1 votesIf Garen builds tank, he is useless other than his silence.
BluePolarizer1 votesYou can't build pure tank. You have to have damage to threaten the carries since you have weak CC. I would build something like this:
Good mix of tankiness and damage.
Marthian1 votesHe is viable. He counters Riven, Nasus, and who knows what else.
BastionKross1 votesGaren is actually quite effective, but people don't build him correctly. Unlike a lot of other bruisers, you can't load Garen down with four or five defensive items and expect him to churn out the damage. In fact, due to the passive on his W, you should be building one less defensive item on Garen compared to other bruisers since it makes up the difference.
Garen isn't meant to be a tank. If you try to build him like a tank, he'll do no damage. The most he can do to peel and protect his squishies is silence someone, and his initiation is very poor. Garen is an anti-carry, which means instead of being the tank for your squishies, you jump the front line and start beating the hell out of theirs. If you build correctly, a flash-Q-E-R will absolutely delete just about any fed marksman or mage. The difference between playing him like this and an assassin is that assassins get blown up if focused while attacking the enemy carry. Garen, however, will not falter.
Your typical build should look something like this:
and or 
A mix of offense and defense, but leaning toward offense.
FirstSergeantBim1 votesI really like to use 
.
If you run scaling armor/magic resistance runes, then he can hit 109 armor and magic resistance from one "defensive" item at level 18. Since Zz'Rot is so easy to build early game and since it provides so much tankiness (and utility) it allows you to gauge whether or not you'll need to buy another defensive item easily and still remain safe and durable until then. Since there are so many %HP spells and items out there, it really works in Garen's favor to use healthless items. Besides, you're running around the map so fast with the swifties and the portal that nobody can catch you and nobody can run away from you.