I'm not too upset about AD itemization but you gotta do at least something about it, Riot

KANYE OBAMA GOD··1 votes·558 views

Most people on the boards are just crying about how AD itemization is so much better and the only armor they can get is Zhonya's. While I think it's being a bit blown out of proportion at how the itemization for APs isn't as good as ADs, there is something wrong when item 3157 gives 45 armor but item 3142item 3147item 3156 all together gives 40 armor pen.

The counter argument to this is "Zhonya's is one item and that's three so u dum" but most AP people get Zhonya's as a 3rd or 4th item, much later into the game than an assassin who has 2 of those 3 items already (one of which also doubles as a decent defensive item). So when you get a Zhonya's and your rabadon's, luden's, morello, sorc shoes, and idk void staff/rylai's or something like that, your Zhonya's is reduced to 1/3 of a cloth armor or, 5 armor. Let's say that they have an enemy Talon with item 3147 item 3142 item 3156 item 3111 item 3071 item 3072. The Talon has an effective ~51 MR after a item 3135 and then it's further reduced by 15 from item 3020 to 36.

Also, you gotta factor Talon and the mage in question both have their base armors and magic resists, but I'm too lazy for that.

The assassin gets 36 MR but the mage gets 5 armor in a normal build due to how easy it is for assassins to access armor pen. That's my only problem but I play ADCs a lot so my point is instantly invalid cause "assassins QQ".

In all seriousness though, Riot should do at least some tweaking to items to fix these issues, and I know, mages get upwards of 700 ap and will still do crap tons of damage through the Talon's magic resist but I mean, they'll still probably get one-shot by him before the Xerath/Vel/other random mage that everyone uses as a generic example can blow his load back at him.

P.S. civilized discussion pls P.P.S. prove stuff that I said wrong, I'll be happy not upset, that's why it's called a discussion!

2 Comments

Xrusa1 votes

Also need to factor in AD champs potentially taking ArmPen reds and the mastery, which at level 1 is (I believe) +15 armor pen, so really it's more like building Youmuu and you've nearly countered Zhonya's armor. Not to say the active of Zhonya isn't great and helpful, but it's still a bit hard to deal with sometimes when compared to the flat magic pen options vs a maw. Also goes the other way, 8 magic pen from reds, 3+0.3 per level from mastery (if you choose it over CDR), but the difference is that sorc shoes aren't that good anymore when Ionian's give you so much more use since they reduce the cooldown of summ spells on top of it all. I think there should be another flat pen item for mages, or at least tone down the pen on youmuu.

67chrome1 votes

Most people on the boards are just crying about how AD itemization is so much better and the only armor they can get is Zhonya's.

With your rant on armor pen: I think you're missing the point of why AD itemization is better at the moment.

Last season you could also easily get 55%+30 armor penetration with a core build of item 3071 item 3035 , where 50%+50 exactly doubles all physical damage (assuming targets have 50% damage reduction/100 armor). Since running armor seals has always been a good idea and even Sona gets 75 armor @18: you were looking at armor pen essentially matching critical strike chance and being the major secondary multiplier for AD Casters from seasons 3+

40 armor penetration with 3 items is quite frankly abysmal by comparison, and it's not really the AD casters that are running rampant with the itemization changes.

Rather: it's important to look at Zhonya's for what it is: a defensive AP item that doesn't really hurt your damage output.

On the AD side: item 3156 item 3155 item 3053item 3139 are all causing issues because they don't really hurt damage scaling and the DPS loss for persuing them isn't particularly high, where the boost to defensive stats is pretty substantial given how the game's balanced. You're getting a tremendous deal on defense.

Especially seeing as a lot of bruisers and mages are set up with the goal of juust barely bringing a marksman from 100%-->0% with their full QWER combo, focusing more on removing an opponent and the timing of their damage over just getting the most DPS possible. It's a pretty steep uphill climb when you get to the 100%-->0% zone to really improve your damage by much with how potent being able to do that has historically been.

There's a world of difference between bringing a target from 100%-->0% with a combo vs. 100%-->10%, though, and where previously bouncing between those zones was a main point of balance and interaction: with current itemization it's not even close.

AD itemization offers such amazing anti-burst mechanics you're looking at the game taking a radical shift from 100%-->0% now being 100%-->50%, rendering any mage that needs to heavily commit pretty much obsolete. Due to having things like 10 armor pen on a big AD item there isn't a particularly large DPS trade-off for the substantial level of defense you can currently get with AD itemization.

So the best mages ATM are ones with enough poke to reliably chip a target down to a 50% HP state where an OHKO is even possible.

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