Double Standard

Void Kaiju·Jul 17, 2017·4 votes·394 views

Recently had a comment deleted, not upset since I unnecessarily brought up the other person's rank and I was planning to delete it myself when I logged back in. What isn't cool is that the person I had replied to is being generally uncivil and rude and continues to have free reign over their discussion thread whilst all they are doing is telling people who disagree with them that they are ignorant and being generally passive-aggressive in all of their replies to people who aren't simply saying "I agree." They are poisoning the comments of a discussion that they started without consequence. I entered that thread with every intention of a civil discussion but the poster evidently did not, and I childishly got sucked in to it.

If you're going to be moderating the comments in the gameplay boards to ensure that they are remaining "civil" then it shouldn't just be when somebody's rank is brought up (which I frankly think is ridiculous, especially given the context of my reply and the fact the board is about GAMEPLAY, but I don't write the rules.) Constant passive aggression or aggressive refusal to acknowledge any dissenting opinion is what actually destroys the quality of posts on the boards yet routinely isn't dealt with. It's good that with the addition of Wardens the threads aren't a free-for-all anymore but sometimes it's good to look at the spirit of the law and not just the word of it. Especially if you're going down the twisty path of moral policing.

You don't even need to delete their comments, just drop a response on posts like these letting the author know they ought to reel it in a bit.

7 Comments

SecondChanceHeroJul 18, 20171 votes

Post me a link to the thread, I'll have a look see. If it seems out of hand I'll go fetch a proper authority.

You have to keep in mind our wardens are still new to the gig and we have so few of them (we pretty desperately need more volunteers).

Always remember that if you feel strongly about inappropriate boards activity that the boards discord exists as a means to help you find a solution to that problem. Don't be afraid to use it.

Void KaijuJul 19, 20171 votes

Honestly I wouldn't want the thread it was in to be shut down or the poster to get a warning, the behavior is common enough, but not conducive to proper discussion. It just feels that if my reply was worth deleting then a lot of the posters activity was worth deleting as well for the purpose of "civility". Unnecessary digs being thrown into responses are common not just in the thread in question, but all across the gameplay boards. I see many popular boards users doing it and have seen behavior like it in the past. The only real difference was that mine was directed at their rank and most of them are directed towards the intelligence/ability to understand.

Morally I'd rather nothing be done about the thread because trying to enforce rather than just encourage friendliness will just kill any discussion. Since you asked though it's here: https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/KhUJZEqE-if-adcs-are-supposed-to-be-the-kingsqueens-of-sustained-damage-over-time-they-shouldnt-burst I'm curious about your opinion, if not of their behaviour in the overall thread then in the way they responded to me. Their reply was laced with sarcasm and unecessary jabs to belittle my opinion, which seems to me just as bad as the fact that I then used his rank to similar effect (at the end of an indepth response instead of spread out within.)

If it wasn't a relatively minor thing I would probably choose to go on to the discord and strike up a conversation, but this definitely isn't the hill I want to die on.

SecondChanceHeroJul 19, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Honestly I wouldn't want the thread it was in to be shut down or the poster to get a warning, the behavior is common enough, but not conducive to proper discussion. It just feels that if my reply was worth deleting then a lot of the posters activity was worth deleting as well for the purpose of "civility". Unnecessary digs being thrown into responses are common not just in the thread in question, but all across the gameplay boards. I see many popular boards users doing it and have seen behavior like it in the past. The only real difference was that mine was directed at their rank and most of them are directed towards the intelligence/ability to understand.

Morally I'd rather nothing be done about the thread because trying to enforce rather than just encourage friendliness will just kill any discussion. Since you asked though it's here: https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/KhUJZEqE-if-adcs-are-supposed-to-be-the-kingsqueens-of-sustained-damage-over-time-they-shouldnt-burst I'm curious about your opinion, if not of their behaviour in the overall thread then in the way they responded to me. Their reply was laced with sarcasm and unecessary jabs to belittle my opinion, which seems to me just as bad as the fact that I then used his rank to similar effect (at the end of an indepth response instead of spread out within.)

If it wasn't a relatively minor thing I would probably choose to go on to the discord and strike up a conversation, but this definitely isn't the hill I want to die on.

Well I took a look and read the thread, or at least the majority of it, there's already quite a bit of content and the OP of the thread is rather verbose so it took some time.

Seems to me like the OP is very passionate about what he's discussing. Moreover he's got solid evidence and some numbers and a fairly good grasp of game theory to go along with it, a rarity for a player of his rank (assuming he's not posting on a smurf). I'd venture to say (since the comments are deleted and I'm no warden so I can't look at them) that you got into a bit of a tiff with the OP about some of his opinions and went to play the rank card which would justifiably upset him.

I'd agree with you it seems pretty insignificant and you've been pretty adult about it. The OP's attitude is pretty arrogant and condescending and that can certainly rub people the wrong way but it's not like he's calling people nasty names or slurs or anything, or even just flat out resorting to insults, all of his responses (that I've been able to read through this far) include actual debate on his topic and further the discussion (or at least repeat points he's already addressed). I don't particularly find him a pleasant person but I also don't feel like he's acting wildly inappropriate either.

It's the kind of thread and temperament from an OP that would have me watching the thread closely (if I were a warden) and trying to nip any problems in the bud before they get blown out of proportion and it seems to be what happened with the wardens who were handling it. In some cases it's their job to prune a conversation like a bush or a rose to help it blossom and I feel they did attempt that.

If I had to venture a reason for your comment's deletion and not his I would say it's likely because your comment was the one that could have potentially lead to a derailing argument, while his actions in that thread (while prickly, shall we say?) are still spurring proper discussion focused on the subject of his OP.

But that's just one fools take on the matter and if you want a warden's opinion you'll have to ask a warden. I don't speak for any of them, but I am familiar with all of them the Arbiters and the archivists for many many years so I feel like I have a rough idea what most are thinking when it comes to certain matters and I feel safe saying that my opinion here is likely to be shared by at least some of them.

I also agree about civility in these matters and fought long and hard to make sure that's a matter of importance for our volunteers and that trimming both sides of an altercation is required to solve it properly. They are still learning how to do that better and should be gaining additional tools and volunteers to help stay in front of those issues in the future.

Void KaijuJul 19, 20171 votes

What got me "into a tiff" with him was just his overall tone and the fact he finished his reply with "try to be at least a little informed next time", effectively belittling me sarcastically saying things like "nice analogy" and telling me I'm flat out ignorant in response to a pretty civil way of disagreeing with his point. Had he just used his numbers and "facts" I wouldn't have been upset, but he felt the need to defend his argument by not only responding to my points but also throwing in digs. Just as, if not more, inappropriate than me calling him out on his rank.

SecondChanceHeroJul 20, 20171 votes

{quoted}

What got me "into a tiff" with him was just his overall tone and the fact he finished his reply with "try to be at least a little informed next time", effectively belittling me sarcastically saying things like "nice analogy" and telling me I'm flat out ignorant in response to a pretty civil way of disagreeing with his point. Had he just used his numbers and "facts" I wouldn't have been upset, but he felt the need to defend his argument by not only responding to my points but also throwing in digs. Just as, if not more, inappropriate than me calling him out on his rank.

He certainly wasn't very nice and I don't much care for his behavior but at the same time it's a pretty human thing to do and I know I've done it on occasion, given offense with condescension.

In the end, since he wasn't really being nasty (just arrogant as hell), I feel like you handled it very well. Things can get heated when people discuss topics they are passionate about and sometimes that means taking the lumps along with the good. It certainly didn't deter you from contributing to the discussion in a positive manner and you set a right proper example aside from the single miscue.

I can understand why it aggravated you though, I'm sure it would aggravate most people.

FantasySniperJul 19, 20171 votes

This isn't anything new. Even way back with the old forum there have been people downright trolling with forced ignorance and a constant state of aggression, but nothing's ever been done about them.

Void KaijuJul 19, 20171 votes

I'm aware, but since it involved me this time I felt like making a post about it. With the advent of Archivists and Wardens on the boards, moderation policies are probably going to need to undergo some more rapid changes in order to compensate.