Why is Trollmas a thing?

Proxhawk·Dec 4, 2019·7 votes·8,193 views

So around this time of year i guess trollmas is a thing? so here is my take on it. it ruins games. doesn't help the spirit of the season and just breeds more toxicness in a community. guys is it just me or did online gaming used to not be this toxic? hell, even social media for that matter used to be a lot less toxic. it seems like the days of actually being a decent human online are gone. I don't understand trolls and never will. the only way I see it, is to try your best every game and try to win and enjoy the game. if someone tries and falls short i can understand that (even if i do get frustrated from time to time) but someone who trolls intentionally ruining the game for 1-4 others (depending on the amount of trolls on a team) it just doesn't make sense to me. the way i see trolls are people that are afraid to try and compete because they are afraid of losing/ failing. if so its actually really sad. but i hate working a 12 hour shift at work and than wait for my kids to go to sleep to hop on and play a game only to have 15-60 minutes taken out of my very short time at night that i actually do get to a very tilting game. This is a huge problem with this game and honestly i love the game i have been playing it for years but as i see the community only getting worse and the lack of riot trying to actually do anything about it is starting to nag at me to put this game down for good and find other hobbies that i would get the same amount of enjoyment with little to none of the many many frustrations that league has. I'm sorry if this is turning into a rant but i really feel like something needs to be done to fix this and honestly it needs to go a little more extreme measures or it will only get worse. does anyone agree? or have some different insight?

57 Comments

NelsieLisnenDec 4, 20194 votes

Here lemme break it down for you. I had a Soraka top today vs a god dang Illaoi. Normals. She keeps feeding her, on and on, until Illaoi is a monster, completely takes top prio, takes Herald with her Yi and pushes 2 towers mid, I think around 10 minutes. So, I call for an ff since "Soraka is trolling anyway". And she roughly responds "dude why u tryhard, I'm just having fun no wrong in that". I tried to explain to her that having fun on the expense of everybody that is just trying to improve and play well isn't "not trolling". Needless to say it didn't change a thing. And it's simple. Those people, regardless of what excuses they use, simply enjoy disrespecting and annoying other people, their brain is just wired that way and that's what they grew up to be.

"If I have fun, then everything's fine"

In real life games don't work that way. In any team game or sport, even when played casually, anyone that knowingly cripples their team or refuses to at least try is treated as they deserve, a jerkwad. Online however, you can't really single out the troll and force them to either conform or f off. Which is why people who lack the spine to be a-holes in real life usually flock the games we play.

ProxhawkDec 5, 20191 votes

Very well put

AekhalosDec 4, 20193 votes

We can't do much sadly. The amount of children with no brain education is increasing every year. The 'past 2000' generation is the most utterly disgusting thing ever.. I do not have the words when I imagine a guy fucking the game of 4 people because he sucks and that is his way of having fun.. Like: " my way of fun is you to have none haha !" Every Day that passes, I have more and more an anger towards people because I can't stand of stupid and frustrating the common people is. And Riot does not care, Lol is going to be the next fortnite with only bad educated children paying for the prestige skins.

ProxhawkDec 4, 20192 votes

Honestly that has been a thought in my head of the younger generation making an appearance online and the common trait amping many of them is little to no respect for others especially on a game where your and their true identity is masked

Kei143Dec 4, 20192 votes

What's your definition of a troll?

ProxhawkDec 4, 20195 votes

{quoted}

What's your definition of a troll?

someone who doesn't try to win a game and/or intentionally goes to ruin the game for others. (i mean i know trying can be an unknown variable trying a new build or new to a champ or maybe new to a role or just having a bad game are normal procedures of the game and i can't get mad at someone for it) i mean its hard to narrow down trolling because there are many forms of it but the type that a mute button won't fix just irritate me.

Kei143Dec 4, 20194 votes

Can you describe the troll's actions and how often do you see them in your games?

ProxhawkDec 4, 20191 votes

Honestly more and more lately it used to be maybe 1 every 10 game or so now it seems like I'm getting 4 in a span of 10 games. but it changes from time to time but its been more and more lately.

rujitraDec 4, 20193 votes

How do you know if someone isn't trying? How do you know they're intentionally trying to ruin the game for you?

You can't. Really, you can say whatever you want and it'll be wrong. You can think that they may be doing that - but you do not have any proof.

This is the issue Riot runs into as well. What do you define as "not trying to win"? Anything that you tell me here can be defined as that I can come up with some situation where it will be punishing innocent players. You end up with a system that punishes players for being bad, or having a bad game/day. That's not acceptable.

ProxhawkDec 4, 20195 votes

I understand where you are coming from but there are situations you can tell like i said the trying part can be hard to discern but lets say your whole team is grouping mid to siege but you have a support in your own jg killing wolves and won't communicate with the team or refuses to help the team or somthing ( i know this is a really bad analogy but i hope you get what I'm trying to say with it) i mean you can tell someone that is actually trying to win the game and help the team win and you can tell the ones that are there to intentionally ruin the game for others. and i think riot needs to pay attention to tendencies i mean if it happens in a short amount of time and gets reports for the same thing i think it should be addressed pretty hard on.

rujitraDec 4, 20191 votes

These are your opinions. Maybe they needed 100 or so more gold to get an item that they felt was more important than the current siege. Maybe they disagreed with the siege because they felt it was risky/dangerous. There are many reasons they can differ in opinion from you, and even if they turn out incorrect that does not mean they're invalid.

Furthermore, how do you define "help the team win"? Is it that they have to do whatever you tell them? Who gets to decide who gets to be the "boss"? There is no team captain. There is no team boss.

Lastly, Riot does watch tendencies. You see this person in one, maybe a couple games. You do not have any idea what their "tendencies" are.

ProxhawkDec 4, 20193 votes

see here is where i can disagree. (also I've already said it was a bad analogy because there are times where it is understandable to do that but there are times where its not. and the game flow or situation can dictate whether its a smart move or someone being a troll) But there is a point where it is completely obvious someone is being a troll. there is a point where it is undeniable that someone is Intentionally ruining the game for others. you can tell when those happen. and I'm not saying there is a "boss" that decides i am using a very vague term. on the tendencies you are right and i see your point. i have only had one game with the person so i may not know the tendencies of a person but sometimes checking a bit of their match history may actually show that there were tendencies.

rujitraDec 4, 20192 votes

If it's "completely obvious", you should be able to articulate what it is that is making it obvious.

You are saying that anyone who "doesn't help the team" - well who gets to define what "helping the team" is? A boss? There isn't one. Other players are allowed to differ in opinion from you. Period. Full stop. End of discussion.

Lastly, no, you cannot determine someone's gameplay through their match history unless you're going to go watch dozens of replays in their entirety - which I know you aren't.

BladeSteelDec 4, 20194 votes

{quoted}

If it's "completely obvious", you should be able to articulate what it is that is making it obvious.

You are saying that anyone who "doesn't help the team" - well who gets to define what "helping the team" is? A boss? There isn't one. Other players are allowed to differ in opinion from you. Period. Full stop. End of discussion.

Lastly, no, you cannot determine someone's gameplay through their match history unless you're going to go watch dozens of replays in their entirety - which I know you aren't.

Except Riot doesn't watch dozens of gameplay. You can get banned for ONE game of inting or trolling. You, however, say noone can tell. I guess Riot should unban all those players then.

rujitraDec 4, 20193 votes

For people running it down, sure.

But the OP is not complaining about people running it down. The OP is saying that players should be punished for one game when that one game is not indicative of trolling. Those players will be punished based off trends over games, and may be displayed with one or more games in client in their ban card.

BladeSteelDec 4, 20193 votes

[deleted]

Sinful SuccubusDec 4, 20193 votes

--Removed--

obviously you've never heard of smurfs

Kei143Dec 4, 20194 votes

Showing 1 game as example doesn't mean the review wasn't over many games to analyze tenancies.

Sure, they can punish for 1 game, but that's because they've already established the baseline skill of that player and know they are capable of much more.

BladeSteelDec 4, 20191 votes

{quoted}

Showing 1 game as example doesn't mean the review wasn't over many games to analyze tenancies.

Sure, they can punish for 1 game, but that's because they've already established the baseline skill of that player and know they are capable of much more.

So you're saying that they punish players for playing poorly. Ok

Kei143Dec 4, 20192 votes

I guess you are misunderstanding me.

If someone's tendency is they don't know how to play mid game (e.g. they just wave clear down mid and chip at the enemy mid tower and back of then when there's no wave), then the system will take note of that behavior.

If they push down mid without any vision, get ambushed and die, that would be a bad player. The system won't punish such player as it recognizes the player is just trying to do what he always does.

So not sure why you are trying to replace what said with something else.

ProxhawkDec 4, 20194 votes

Ok dude. Obviously you aren’t trying to communicate. I have heard about you. Have a nice day. End of discussion.

Chainman3Dec 4, 20192 votes

Do you really want to know?

ProxhawkDec 4, 20192 votes

as long as you are being honest I'm open to hear what you have to say.

Chainman3Dec 4, 20193 votes

Then let me start with a story.

https://matchhistory.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/NA1/3223338022/209420279?tab=overview

This game is what this story refers to. So Kayn in this game decided to camp top, while his bot lane got steamrolled and despite that he tried to carry the game. By the end of the game mf and mundo flamed him for "being a bad jungler and the reason for the loss. To the point where regardless of how well he did in the game they decided its okay to blame him for the loss. Long story short he was wrongfully accused him. So imagine theres a duo in your game you camp one of the duo's lanes and when the other feeds they BOTH blame you. Its tilting and sure its just one game. He got over it and moved to the next game.

https://matchhistory.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/NA1/3223430569/209420279?tab=overview

This mf flames him for taking jungle camps and then decides shes gonna afk because the team defends him. Long story short he ends up carrying the game 4v5 with amazing peel and support from his team.

https://matchhistory.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/NA1/3223285878/209420279?tab=overview

Another game. He gets a jayce who runs it down because the jungler isnt doing what jayce wants him to do.

Lastly games where you have a teammate crying and saying absurd things like "body block malphtie ult for me". These things add up on a person's mind even if its not in the same day. And the one of the better ways trolls find to relieve the stress from prior games where teammates made dumb comments or did absurd things and blamed others or just completely ruined the game with their playstyle is by trolling. Now im not saying this justifies it but what i am saying is in my eyes i cant fully blame the troll but the experience he had with others.

Some players arent willing to learn. Some players arent willing to look for answers. Some players arent willing to listen to others. Some players always want to be the carry. And this gets rather annoying. Even on the boards just recently ive seen a post about having QSS remove zed's and fizz's ultimate because the champions "do too much dmg". Where these champions have multiple disadvantages they choose to focus on the advantages and disregard the champion's weakness, but then when lets say i bring up lux and her range, utility and 1 shot potential the most common response is "but if she gets caught shes dead because shes immobile". Can you see how that can get annoying to correct every time you see it and people still refuse to admit when theyre playing incorrectly and would rather hate on a single champion. All these things add up to the point where teammates dont feel like teammates anymore, and instead it feels like a competition the entire time. Which leads to more frustration and stress until the player hits a breaking point and relieves this stress by paying it forward to others' games. This cycle continues over and over until toxicity takes over the community.

ProxhawkDec 4, 20194 votes

I can understand that and is some really good insight but isn't it still wrong to take it out on innocent parties because you were impacted by someone? and i feel for the guy i think jg is one of the hardest positions to play in solo que becuase there are always players that will blame the jg for everything. Don't get me wrong i used to too but then i got out of that silver and below mindset (not saying all silvers and below think this way but it definitely is a common theme) but for me words don't bother me as much because ill just mute the person and it helps me alot. but its the gameplay trolling that i can't stand because you can't mute it or such.

Chainman3Dec 4, 20193 votes

You're right it is wrong to take it out on other players. The issue with that is how do you know which players are the innocent ones and which ones will treat you the same way until they do? You never really know a person until they're really pressured and show their trueselves.

And i agree with you that muting the other players helps, but what do you when they get angry with you and start taking jungle camps and not helping you with objectives, not rotating over to help you take scuttle, losing lanes where they have a considerable advantage (summoners or kill advantage), what happens when their gameplay changes to tilt you and teamwork breaks down. Can you just say, well time to take a break? Come back next time have the same thing happen again, and keep repeating the process of taking breaks. Sooner or later itll get to you. Even if the games arent consecutive they can still be rather annoying to deal with and you cant leave them because the system will punish you.

ProxhawkDec 4, 20191 votes

I’ll be honest if that stuff happens I get angry I may say a few things when I part with the game but I will finish the game and than get off and find something else to do so I don’t dwell on it I’ve actually given the game a few months break because of issues of that sort happening more and more common. Don’t get me wrong it’s insanely hard for me to just get off and not que again but in my experience I usually play worse after a tilt and I decide it’s better for me to get away. Didn’t always used to be like that. But I have never entered a game with the intention to troll it just isn’t fun, funny or constructive at all. But, I can see where others would turn to trolling to cope but isn’t that just as bad as being a intentional feeder?

Chainman3Dec 4, 20192 votes

I’ll be honest if that stuff happens I get angry I may say a few things when I part with the game but I will finish the game and than get off and find something else to do so I don’t dwell on it

This is my exact point. So why would anyone trying to have fun want to play when the chance you'll be tilted is as high or higher than the chance of you having fun. Its a game, our main goal should be to have fun and yet all it does is feel stressful and tilting majority of the time.

Honestly id say this is worse than an intentional feeder because hes making his intentions clear in a round about way by not screwing himself over but screwing his teammates over instead. Which is even more infuriating.

ProxhawkDec 5, 20191 votes

Alas this is the price we all pay. I know for myself That these games are happening more often than they used to and more often than they should. But if I feel like my time is getting mostly wasted I’ll go do some other things instead and who knows if I will pick up league again

CaptainAntiHerozDec 4, 20192 votes

troll-mas? wtf........... bruh if you mean people are playing to win during a preseason it makes sense

1 its a game, if you're having fun thats what matters 2 its preseason so trolling vs trying new things that don't work out is up for discussion

ProxhawkDec 4, 20192 votes

trying new things and trying to play the game and not trying to ruin it for others is cool. trying to tilt and waste time of others is not.

CaptainAntiHerozDec 4, 20192 votes

{quoted}

trying new things and trying to play the game and not trying to ruin it for others is cool. trying to tilt and waste time of others is not.

can you prove intent?

BladeSteelDec 4, 20193 votes

{quoted}

can you prove intent?

Guess we shouldn’t ban anyone then.

CaptainAntiHerozDec 4, 20192 votes

{quoted}

Guess we shouldn’t ban anyone then.

If someone is clearly breaking the rules you would be able to prove it if you call someone tard then its harassment playing bad? proves nothing

BladeSteelDec 4, 20192 votes

{quoted}

If someone is clearly breaking the rules you would be able to prove it if you call someone tard then its harassment playing bad? proves nothing

ok? and can you prove intent on the person saying tard?

CaptainAntiHerozDec 4, 20192 votes

{quoted}

ok? and can you prove intent on the person saying tard?

don't need to because you can't say things like that to other people its in the rules

being bad isn't

BladeSteelDec 4, 20192 votes

{quoted}

don't need to because you can't say things like that to other people its in the rules

being bad isn't

Where was it said that being bad should be bannable? Quote it, I'm waiting.

CaptainAntiHerozDec 4, 20191 votes

{quoted}

Where was it said that being bad should be bannable? Quote it, I'm waiting.

calling people trolls? what other purpose is there?

BladeSteelDec 4, 20192 votes

{quoted}

calling people trolls? what other purpose is there?

Ah so you didn't actually read anything on this post, just decided that it "called people trolls" so meant that "bad people = trolls" I get it now.

CaptainAntiHerozDec 4, 20192 votes

{quoted}

Ah so you didn't actually read anything on this post, just decided that it "called people trolls" so meant that "bad people = trolls" I get it now.

we could go on about this all day

the original post talking about trolls is 1 bias and 2
"the way i see trolls are people that are afraid to try and compete because they are afraid of losing/ failing"

thats not trolling

BladeSteelDec 4, 20192 votes

{quoted}

we could go on about this all day

the original post talking about trolls is 1 bias and 2
"the way i see trolls are people that are afraid to try and compete because they are afraid of losing/ failing"

thats not trolling

Ah. so people who are afraid to try and compete are bad to you. Ok got it.

CaptainAntiHerozDec 4, 20192 votes

{quoted}

Ah. so people who are afraid to try and compete are bad to you. Ok got it.

thats not what i was saying

I'm saying thats not trolling and if you're gonna keep trying to I'm not gonna respond to it because its childish

ProxhawkDec 4, 20192 votes

Bias against trolls? Well trolling is a toxic action. So if I’m biased against it than I’d think that is a good thing. Let me ask you a question have you ever had a troll on your team ever? If you say yes than think of those trolls as examples. If you say no than I know you are lying. The only people I have ever seen defend a troll is either a troll themselves or ignorant.

CaptainAntiHerozDec 4, 20191 votes

{quoted}

Bias against trolls? Well trolling is a toxic action. So if I’m biased against it than I’d think that is a good thing. Let me ask you a question have you ever had a troll on your team ever? If you say yes than think of those trolls as examples. If you say no than I know you are lying. The only people I have ever seen defend a troll is either a troll themselves or ignorant.

i just had an Ekko build item 3083 item 3009

we won

you can't just say someone is trolling people have off games people could be learning etc etc

You are trying to classify someones actions based on one game there is no trollmas

ProxhawkDec 5, 20191 votes

Literally had a game where the guy said happy trollmas so it is a thing.

CaptainAntiHerozDec 5, 20191 votes

{quoted}

Literally had a game where the guy said happy trollmas so it is a thing.

its not a thing just because one person says it doesn't make it a thing thats like when 6 year olds say their friend told them the boogey man is real DOESN'T MAKE IT REAL

KingTheTyrantDec 4, 20192 votes

{quoted}

troll-mas? wtf........... bruh if you mean people are playing to win during a preseason it makes sense

1 its a game, if you're having fun thats what matters 2 its preseason so trolling vs trying new things that don't work out is up for discussion

Exactly my thought it is preseason. I am trying all kinds of champs in ranked. Somtimes I fail and may look like I am trolling but really I am just having a bad game.

ProxhawkDec 4, 20191 votes

There is a difference I know that pre season is a good time to try new things and see if it happens to be apart of the new meta I get that. But taking a fizz and going AD in the jg might be pushing it ya know.