Boards›Player Behavior

Explain plz Riot

Chaos689··1 votes·772 views

You guys know how you can't earn hextech if you're restricted because Riot likes to make a chat ban into a 'prettymuch-everything-ban'? Well, I'm getting mocked by Riot's overkill counterproductive BS even though I AM NOT RESTRICTED. I was last restricted about 3 months ago when I lost it because of ranked trolls, and now I'm still getting punished? Even after I reformed? I am not toxic. I do not get reported. I report trolls and toxic people. I support my teammates. I help[ people. I congratulate people. I get honored 24/7. And I'm getting punished for an outburst from 3-4 somethign months ago, when I was a different player. Until riot figures out how to relate to its playerbase and NOT CUASE PEOPEL TO RAGE, then you can find me playing Skyrim. Have fun Riot, because your mismanagement is teh reason people quit this game. I loved league, and I still do. However, I HATED, and still HATE, Riot. Love League, Riot about Riot. This system nearly pusehd me over the edge to becoming toxic again and raging at EVERYONE until I got permad. And nopw you have to mock a reforemed, well-behaved player every game where I do well? Well, I guess when do play ill just feed or something so I dont have to get your mockign little "ineliigible for nonexistant BS" message. GLHF to anyone who trolls and gets away with no punshment (aka everyone who has a good record), I hope you enjoy gettting free reign of this game when every upstanding player wh9o has had an outburst in their past quits. I've seen more "I think im gonan quit" posts jsut from this system than from any other thign in any other game. Less people would quit if you... I cant even think of anything, that's hwo badly you've managed this game. It was amazing, now it's jsut a nest of enabled trolls.

35 Comments

MeilinII4 votes

Try reading the boards before you talk about things you don't understand: http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/player-behavior-moderation/293Fna7i-if-you-are-restricted-from-hextech-crafting-read-this

Chaos6891 votes

Yes because I scrolled down until 5 hours ago and found that. Ok. Also, I have waited the months and have not been validly reported, and have been honored many times. Riot said that you couldn't loot IF YOU ARE RESTRICTED. I AM NTO CURRENTLY RESTRICTED. It may be Riot usign abd wording, but that says to me tah I can loot, because I am nto restricted.

SmokedAlmonds1 votes

I agree that it is poor wording(more accurately that the FAQ answer is incomplete), but it does not mean that you can get loot if you restricted. Only that you cannot get it if you are restricted. It then says that once you are reformed you will be eligible again. It just doesn't define what reform is.

When exactly was your last punishment? Im curious cause they have used 3 months without punishment as a metric for reform several times in the past and I wonder if that is what they are using here but just havent said. So has it been a full 3 months or has it been "like 3 months" but not.

Chaos6891 votes

My last punishment was around 4ish months ago, then I totally reformed. Also, by that logic I could say that you are permabanned because I NEVER SAID THAT PICKING FLASH WASNT A REPORTABLE OFFENSE!

SmokedAlmonds1 votes

No, you couldn't say that. You could say something like you don't know if Ill be permabanned becuase riot never said picking flash wasn't a permaban offense. If there is a missing piece of information, you don't just get to fill in whatever you want and it becomes fact.

They listed a reason that you can't get hextech rewards. There is nothing to indicate that is the only time you won't get rewards. That FAQ is also a direct response to the question "can I get hextech rewards while restricted". It was a yes or no question. There needs to be something to define what that reform is, though. I'm not sure anyone who isn't banned considers people who just merely served their punishment is reformed. That reform has to be demonstrated, it is not just assumed.

If it really has been 4 months im curious if they are using something else other than time. Because you could still be getting infractions against you, just not enough to be punished. What was that punishment 4 months ago? It could also require you to either go through 3 months per punishment their.

Kei1432 votes

passive aggressiveness detection levels on a high side in this post.

If you do have a habit to speak like this in game, you probably are considered "reformed" in Riot's eyes.

Then again, no one right now knows what "reformed" really means.

Chaos6891 votes

Norly I'm passive aggressive. How could I possibly be offended? Did you read the post, specifically the part where I said that this system makes me ragey and toxic all over again? You act like this is my normal attitude. Read the post, and understand that most of us are human and get angry when they are arbitrarily denied things for their actions months ago when they were a less mature player and have reformed since then. I am almost always a close to model player. I do not need to be mocked by riot. I have good behavior. I am currently angry with Riot for their mismanagement that has negatively affected me. There, I spelled it out for you.

ModKnightsKemplar1 votes

I think your post proves that you aren't that reformed. Looks pretty toxic to me.

Chaos6891 votes

Read the thing I posted about 20 seconds ago plz. Edit: On a side note, could the community PLEASE stop picking through anyone who says "I am reformed", misinterpreting something, reading only the first sentence, then postnig "this looks pretty toxic to me hurr de durr!"?

ModKnightsKemplar1 votes

I did. You still made a rather toxic post.

Chaos6891 votes

Again, please read the OP. I SAID THAT THIS SYSTEM MAKES ME ANGRY. THAT IS WHY I COME OVER AS ANGRY. WOW LOOKIT THAT.

ModKnightsKemplar2 votes

There's angry, and there's toxic. You are being toxic.

Chaos6891 votes

BRO. Angry = being ticked off and ranting (like above) Toxic = telling people to kill themselves or uninstall or trolling or something like that.

ModKnightsKemplar2 votes

Let me re-define those to you for people like me. I'm not saying I represent all people, but I AM saying that I haven't downvoted your posts. Someone else did.

Angry = "having a strong feeling of being upset or annoyed." That's the Merriam Webster definition. It is a feeling. Lots of people feel anger all the time. I feel anger often playing this game. But anger is a feeling. It is not an action. That brings me to the next definition.

Toxic = acting on your angry feelings in a way that causes harm or offense to others. See, you seem to be confused on a certain point. You seem to think that you have to be trying to be offensive in order to bear the "toxic" label. That is untrue, in my opinion.

You, telling Riot they are "mismanaging" their game, when the majority of their playerbase LIKES that you can't get rewards, is toxic. It is an opinion that you state in order to be hurtful to Riot. You have the evidence, from the downvotes, in the opposite direction; it seems to me that this is evidence that Riot is doing a splendid job with their management. But you don't care about facts. You care about slandering Riot, because you are angry. And acting on that anger in this unproductive manner is toxic.

RedTao1 votes

They dont have a reformation process. They will never have one. Why else do you never hear about ANYONE saying that they were considered reformed after X amount of time? Because it has never happened. It will never happen. They just ban you so you can make another account and buy the same stuff you already bought.

MeilinII4 votes

Yes they do have a reformation process for people who actually REFORM. I have a friend who got a restriction in S4, reformed, and got a free skin last year when RIOT gave out a surprise for good players. I remember because I got my skin the day before, and he was sure he wouldn't get it. [slayer-jinx-catface]

RedTao1 votes

Prove it. Show the thing that said they were reformed. I have been playing this game for 3 years now, have yet to recieve anything free. Sorry if I seem skeptical but unless you can prove the instance happened, then your word is not something that can be trusted.

NiraBlade5 votes

They have a reformation process, it was invisible till now because there weren't visible consequences on your game and client - now with the Hextech limit there are. if you click here you'll find what i'm talking about. I'm quoting the part of interest for you:

WHAT IF I REFORM? IS IT POSSIBLE TO GO DOWN THE ESCALATION PATH? Yes! Players who show consistent reform or show positive behavior in their games will help heal their accounts reputation.

RedTao1 votes

You still cant see where you are as far as being considered being reformed. I have no reform card to see if Im reformed or not. I don't get this card when I log in. I dont know where my account is as far as it being "Healed" becuase they dont let you see those things. The only thing I know is that i've been banned and I'm still on the bad list. That's it. That's all I got from the hextech system. I dont know how to get back other than "Be good" Considering I thought I already was. Don't even know why I was banned before considering it was following the summoners code, so who even knows what being good is anymore. So as far as I can tell, it's still invisible. Because, again, I have yet to see anyone show that they've been able to successfully reform with anything to show for it. As far as I know, there's no reformation ability and that it's just a rumor to keep players content.

Chaos6891 votes

Exactly. if I wanted to be spiteful id say that riot is telling me that the way I am currently behaving is bad and so I shoudl go back to blowing up every other game.

RedTao1 votes

Honestly I don't see why they want to keep it hidden. So the trolls KNOW that they have to STAY nice for a certain amount of time? Why are they worried about trolls knowing how long they have to be good for? Isn't being good what it's all about? What's the worst that would happen? They know they have to be good for another x amount of months to be able to say something hateful? Are they not still being good during that time because they have something to work towards? AND that they know where that thing they're working towards is? Otherwise you get your first chat ban, been weeks later without using chat box and you ask "I've been good for X amount of time, how much longer until I can use the loot system?" To which the answer is "Eventually. We cant tell you. We cant show you. You just have to take our word for it."

MeilinII1 votes

Why on earth would I have access to info that involves someone elses account? Frankly, I don't know if they got confirmation of their reform, I just know they got a free gift that non-reformed accounts did not get, and the toxic half of this forum was bitching non-stop about how we got free stuff that they didn't. NiraBlade has linked you to part of the documentation proving that it can happen though. Here's a link to back him up, where a RIOTer posted specifically in regards to Hextech Crafting: http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/player-behavior-moderation/293Fna7i-if-you-are-restricted-from-hextech-crafting-read-this

RedTao1 votes

So, again, there's no proof of anyone actually getting reformed. It's just riots word that there is one and that they cant show us. Im sorry, but coming from the army, it's hard to be able to take people seriously when they say "We have something for this, we just cant show you". You tell anyone this, without any proof that anyone was reformed, and you're just left with an empty promise with nothing to show for it.

MeilinII1 votes

You're being in the military is irrelevant to the discussion, so I don't know why you bring it up. Especially considering how being in the military often means taking 'it's classified but this is what you have to do' as an answer.

Frankly, if you have such a low opinion of a company that you can't trust their word documented on their own support sites, why are you using their product?

RedTao1 votes

Me being from the military is me saying where I got my experience from. I can almost guarentee you that if you spoke with anyone in the military you could get a similar response to the one I gave. Military isn't all about being classified, but there are some things we dont like talking about. Like medics cant talk about peoples health because it breaks hipaa, or intel guys not being able to talk about stuff because you need a secret clearance. While I can understand IF you need to keep something secret, that's a seperate matter all together. But when people from Riot say that they have something that can help people but they dont show it because they dont want to, that's where the skeptisism comes in.

I can have whatever opinion I can about a company, but if I'm using their product then that's my decision. The same arguement can be made about your country. You dont like your country, why are you in it?

You just are.

MeilinII1 votes

Who said I don't like my county? Your argument makes no sense. And frankly, you are assuming what country I'm in. XD

Riot isn't keeping it secret because they don't want to. They've said before they keep it secret so that people don't go raging, work off JUST long enough to go down a tier, and then start raging again. In other words, by keeping people in the dark they keep trolls from working the system. The only reason they're considering making it more visible is so people can understand why they can't use Hextech, which is a major feature from now on.

RedTao1 votes

Sorry. Making comparisons has never been my strong suit. I was trying to make a contrast on how similar both things can be. You can have all the impressions about something you want while still having a reason to be/do something. Like not liking your medication but it's something you have to take or you hate your boss but you need the money.

I just know that I tend to work better knowing where the goal is. If I dont know where that goal is, I don't have any motivation to find it. Especially, from what I can see, does not exist. If they're so worried that toxic people will use this to just be toxic again, then just make the requirement that much higher. It's better than never knowing where you are or if the system just doesn't exist. Otherwise you have people like me who doubts the thing exists and that it's Riots way of getting you banned just so you can start another account and spend money on the things you already spent on. I understand that they're worried about the trolls, but what has hiding the system done for them? The trolls are still here, they still do their thing and if they get banned, they just start new accounts. Riot already made it so it takes half the time to get to level 30, so it's not a hassle to get to a decent level anymore. It certainly doesn't help their cause when their behavioral specialists are all bots that say the same generic responses that don't solve most, if not all, of my questions for the past month. So when I have that to deal with, it's not too far out of my way to think that this reformation system they like to talk about but cant show anyone is just something else they made up.

NiraBlade1 votes

It wasn't never showed before because players didn't need it AND it was a dangerous information to share.

For example: "i'm banned for 14 days, I need to be extra careful on what i do from now and forever". Imagine this situation when players knows if they are no more watched by the system because they have finished of been reformed: "I'm banned for 14 days, I just need to stay good for some time and then I flame like hell"

Then you'll ask me: "wtf, but now will be the same" NOPE! Because there is a strong incentive to not behave like that: The Hextech Crafting will be blocked for months and you'll lose free chests from a season forever (no more than 4 chests per month). That's why the restrictions from Hextech Crafting are huge in terms of time.

Now there is a reason - which also is some sort of protection both for the company and for players that don't flame - to show this status. And Riot Neuro Cat has said that they are studing ways to implement some sort of "player status" to let you know where are you - in terms of the reformation process.

RedTao1 votes

It still doesn't answer my question, why is it dangerous to let people know how long they need to be good for? When the process of reformation has no standard or structure that can be shared with anyone, then why would there be any need to believe it exists? I remember there was a post at one time where if you wanted to go down a punishment tier you had to be good for 3 months. IF that was the case then that's fine. 3 months is still 3 months without "Flaming" anyone. 3 months is not "Just some time". That's a fairly long time. With that knowledge you know that there's an actual goal to reach and during that time, the habit of flaming people becomes weaker and weaker during that time. It takes 1 month of doing something to make that thing a habit. If it really took 3 months to drop a tier, then that's 3 times the amount of time to cement that new good behavior.

The hextech crafting in my opinion is more of a tool to KEEP players good and not so much to reform. Because, again, there's no end goal in sight. You know what the prize is at the finish line but Riot is hiding the finish line. This brings me back to asking if they say there's that "Finish line" to being reformed, where is it? "We cant tell you. Trust us, it's there. It's just at a certain amount of time that we cant tell you." If that undisclosed time is 3 months, people will lose their patience. People dont like going 2 months of still being on the bad list even if they developed the habit of muting everyone every game. Even worse they don't know that the finish line is 1 month away. When it gets to that point, it's natural to have doubts that the finish line even exists. So when you have people who've been 2-week banned and have no goal to work towards because as far as they know they're going to get permabanned before that happens, the incentive of the hextech crafting is gone because all it gives you is discounts. Why would you spend money on a game where you could be permabanned at any time without knowing if there's even a reformation state at all? As for what Neurocat posted, he's not saying anything new. We know what our status is just by not being able to get loot. The problem is when the time to become reformed is x amount of days/months that you begin to doubt it even exists. Them saying that they cant tell/show you how long it takes only aggrivates people into making new accounts and just doing what they've already been doing, considering Riot already took away any incentive to spend money on their product.

SmokedAlmonds1 votes

It is dangerous because someone's goal should always be 0 toxicity. Knowing where they are in the reform process does not change that at all. The only thing you can do with that information is know when you can be toxic and not get punished.

I definitely agree that they need to lay out at least some kind of indicator of what it takes to reform. But regardless of any indication, ceasing all negative behavior is what you are going to need to do to be considered reformed.

I also agree that It is more of something for good players rather than a tool to reform players. That is just sort of a secondary beneficial side effect since you can't reward good behavior without having it some of the poorly behaved wanting it. I also don't think this is a meaningful incentive. It is barely more than the free mystery gifts were. It just shiny box opening animations in between and you get them more frequently.

If someone is going to lose track on their reform from some ambiguity there wasn't much hope to begin with. People need to reform anyway in order to keep their account. If avoiding a permanent ban isn't reforming you, I don't see a random skin that you probably don't care about doing it either.

Troll for Trump1 votes

I've been untoxic for over 3 months, really tired of seeing that message over and over again.

SmokedAlmonds1 votes

I don't think that message is a good idea either.

RedTao1 votes

Please keep in mind, this is my own personal experience and view of the world, not just the game.

Toxicity has always existed. Toxicity will always exist. Even where the best of intentions are meant, people will find toxicity as long as they choose to see something as toxic.

While having the dream that you want 0 toxicity in the game, it's not a goal that can be achieved. Too many people who go out of their way to get offended by others here. You have countless millions of people complaining about the amount of toxicity in the chat box in the game, but you almost never see these people use the mute button. The tool is there to keep toxicity away from you, people just dont like to use it. That then becomes a question of 'why does someone choose to subject themselves to toxicity?' They dont want toxicity to be anywhere near them but when they come across someone who's offending them in chat they dont mute them. They spur the conversation on and choose to keep the toxicity going. It takes 2 people to have a conversation. While it may be the toxic/troll who starts it, it's the players who talks back to these people who keep the toxicity going. So in that aspect, it's not just the toxic/trolls fault, it's the playerbase in general who choose not to mute the toxic player and choose to talk to the toxic player. Because why use mute when you can just spend that time on chat?

As far as the keeping your progress to being considered reformed secret, I would say that at least some sort of progress report would be substantial to the reformation process. This way you can know that there's indeed something taking into consideration what you've done right/wrong and if there's something like a percentage mark on where you are to being reformed (It doesn't even have to tell you what time you're looking at but the actual progress you're making) Maybe make it a weekly thing where the automated system can take things like quote a few things you did good that made your progress to being reformed go forward and maybe take a few quotes from games where it could have hindered your progress that way you could actually see that there were some things that you could have done better. This way not only do you see something of an end goal to get to, without giving that end time, you can also see that there's some sort of feedback to help guide you to reformation. Not just keep you in the dark and not tell you if what you're doing is even helping reforming you and that there may be never a time you could ever be reformed.

SmokedAlmonds1 votes

When I say 0 toxicity, I mean as a personal goal for your own behavior as someone trying to reform. I mean that goal would exist globally too. Just because you can't get to 0 doesn't mean you shouldn't reduce it where you can.

I definitely agree people should mute more often and faster, but mute has no bearing on whether or not someone should be punished. It isn't uncommon for people to dive into the mud with toxic people and get themselves punished along with them.

I am not saying there is nothing they can do to make the processes more transparent. Just that there are significant downsides to consider that often outweigh the benefits. Leaverbuster gives messages when your status improves and I thought the instant feedback system does when you drop a punishment tier but I'm not sure about that one.

Chaos6891 votes

Well yeah nobody should trust or like riot. They're a terrible company who mismanaged this game. I play because the gmae is amazing and I put too muc hfo my time, money, and life into it to waste it all.

More from Player Behavior

The indefinite banning of Tyler1
Player Behavior4,799 comments
2,942
votes
14 day ban because playing Nunu Support with Smite is "stealing other people's roles"...?
Player Behavior1,525 comments
1,086
votes
Riot should add monthly status cards
Player Behavior241 comments
843
votes
Reminder that we haven't gotten our Summoner report cards yet :/
Player Behavior145 comments
619
votes
I'm not "triggered" by you throwing insults.
Player Behavior361 comments
548
votes
Black Alistar, King Rammus!!!!
Player Behavior462 comments
503
votes

More by Chaos689

Yasuo tilting you? Try our patented Critaway (Patent Pending)
Gameplay74 comments
75
votes
Graves? Is that you?
Memes & Games10 comments
54
votes
Who's Yorick's favorite champion?
Memes & Games12 comments
42
votes
Riot in Patch 1.0.0.86 like:
Memes & Games6 comments
27
votes
Exactly what CAN we face? - a helpful guide for the casual user
Memes & Games31 comments
25
votes
Failed to Update?
Report a Bug9 comments
17
votes