Chat Restriction and Honor Loss

Spear of Zeonia·Sep 8, 2018·1 votes·2,847 views

I lost my honor rank at least largely in part of the following game... But before posting the transcripts I'd like to add some context.

My original account, Sacred Salvation, was banned for being toxic. Sure. It was. I was. I was kind of a douchebag to anyone and everyone and I got perma-banned for telling someone to eat tidepods or something. I can't remember. It wasn't nice, but its not like I told someone I'm going to kill them or made any serious threats. I digress. The account got banned. I was a dick. Lesson learned (for the most part).

Fast forward to this game. I've played my norms, I got my champs, I start ranked, and I get placed in gold 4. I want gold 3 so I start the climb. I'm playing with high plats in my gold 3 promos (which is broken by the way, what the hell?!) and I am honor 2 rank 1 (again played levels 1-30 and 10 ranked games and a single checkpoint, thanks rito).

Here's the game specific context.

GAME 1:

Pre-game: The team is arguing over picks in pregame. I try to chill them out and someone asks what I mean by "climb" I explain I used to have my old account and I got banned. I point out my sister and I reported the toxic duo attacking her but she never gets a pop up saying they got punished. Lovely. Justice at its finest.

In-Game: One of our players, doesn't connect. Comes in like 3 minutes into the game or so. Greet him. I get ganked level 2 by shaco after he steals red. Damn. At this point I've been level 2 ganked top by hyper mobile/stealth junglers in like 7/10 of my last games so I'm annoyed but not tilted.

I end up getting return ganked. Bad play by me, hard to counter play a level 3 shaco with his invis and free flash, my ward just died, bad time. Happens. Someone else gets a kill, give them props. The two "diamond border" players start whining that its unwinnable at 7-13 in this elo... They're wrong, but okay. Rammus literally goes to the dragon and doesnt auto attack it or smite it and gets people killed. Mocking that we have such a good chance at winning while he ints. He states he lost because of his rune being incorrect. That's why he is throwing the game. The ADC on our team is in agreement and they start intentionally trying to let towers and objectives fall while not farming well and over all just trying to keep appearances so the terrible banning system thinks they're white knights....

Now that 2/5s of the team is trying to lose and its not 15 minutes into the game and I'm in my series and they're plat 2 while I'm gold 4 I'm pretty rightly frustrated. I tell them that I think they are mentally weak for giving up for such petty reasons and tell them "if you're going to bitch then dont play... as in don't queue" I had to add that last part because these geniuses took it for "oh he wants me to sit in the base."

We lose. 5 man early surrender. No point in being with these people who don't even want to win.

Post game:

I explain that me being camped and calling someone mentally weak isn't TOXIC. Toxicity is racist, verbal abuse, going after people. Doing things people ask you to stop doing nicely. Those are toxic. THEY were toxic for intentionally throwing when 3 other people wanted to win. Yet I got punished. You tell me how this game is proof that I'm some terrible person...

CHAT LOG: Game 1 Pre-Game Spear of Zeonia: If I learned anything from this climb Spear of Zeonia: its that we all need to chillax Spear of Zeonia: and not get up each other's asses xD Spear of Zeonia: after ghostblade I get tankier btw Spear of Zeonia: and I take aftershock Spear of Zeonia: Made a new account after getting banned Spear of Zeonia: someone bashed my sis, I verbally went at them Spear of Zeonia: insta ban, but that jerks that attacked got away free Spear of Zeonia: im in G4 Spear of Zeonia: lmao In-Game Spear of Zeonia: yoyo Spear of Zeonia: yay Spear of Zeonia: welcome back Spear of Zeonia: meh ninja Spear of Zeonia: assume shaco start blue Spear of Zeonia: ohh maybe Spear of Zeonia: our red Spear of Zeonia: camped Spear of Zeonia: like a fucking mother fucker Spear of Zeonia: wards dont help Spear of Zeonia: gjgj Spear of Zeonia: nah Spear of Zeonia: how am I trolling Spear of Zeonia: i got camped at level 2 Spear of Zeonia: lmao Spear of Zeonia: thats not trolling Spear of Zeonia: you salty pansys Spear of Zeonia: ? Spear of Zeonia: how Spear of Zeonia: you people are really weak then Spear of Zeonia: so taunt her Spear of Zeonia: wow Spear of Zeonia: whiney kid Spear of Zeonia: you didnt Spear of Zeonia: just report rammus Spear of Zeonia: inting and then negative attitude Spear of Zeonia: jesuys Spear of Zeonia: if all you are going to do is bitch then dont play Spear of Zeonia: you're not worth anything Spear of Zeonia: mentally weak Spear of Zeonia: as in don't queue Spear of Zeonia: get over yourself Spear of Zeonia: look at that a tank thats never with the team complaining that he cant cc Spear of Zeonia: your rune... Spear of Zeonia: WOPW Spear of Zeonia: reported Spear of Zeonia: as fuck Spear of Zeonia: for whining about a run Spear of Zeonia: and throwing Spear of Zeonia: fuck this Post-Game Spear of Zeonia: report rammus Spear of Zeonia: inting after whining about his rune Spear of Zeonia: said he wanted to ff at 15 Spear of Zeonia: and didnt try to play Spear of Zeonia: calling him mentally weak isnt fucking toxic Spear of Zeonia: being camped all game isnt toxic Spear of Zeonia: you people are metnally weak Spear of Zeonia: one death Spear of Zeonia: and you die inside Spear of Zeonia: have to ask mom Spear of Zeonia: and did Spear of Zeonia: dad Spear of Zeonia: for a hug Spear of Zeonia: fucking duo Spear of Zeonia: you two are cute Spear of Zeonia: I hope you enjoy f at 15 over and over Spear of Zeonia: and losing LP Spear of Zeonia: have fun losing LP <3

GAME 2:

Pretty simple. I got camped 2v1 by a lee, we lost. I was just mad. Note. I never said anything in ALL chat, just complained to the team. I will admit I was pretty verbal but I never attacked anyone on my team and the other team never heard me say anything to them. I didn't attack the enemy players and I didn't get mad at my team until the diamond border nunu (in my gold 4 non-promo game btw) starting intentionally feeding. His match history was a sting of losses with 1-2 kills and 7-12 deaths. He was trying to lose elo it seems.

I will admit this game is more understandable because I used swear words and was upset at the enemy jungler. However, I didn't aim the words AT the players themselves and I didn't sit there and bash the enemy team for doing it during the game. My post-game was unwarrented. I'll give you that.

CHAT LOG: In-Game Spear of Zeonia: care purple leblanc Spear of Zeonia: yay Spear of Zeonia: btw Spear of Zeonia: kled is aids Spear of Zeonia: I am a stegosaurous Spear of Zeonia: good or nah? Spear of Zeonia: i kept expecting a q Spear of Zeonia: shit soz Spear of Zeonia: camped Spear of Zeonia: all game Spear of Zeonia: sad Spear of Zeonia: lee was topside Spear of Zeonia: againn Spear of Zeonia: fuck this game Spear of Zeonia: no skill Spear of Zeonia: bitch ass character Spear of Zeonia: fucking lee top Spear of Zeonia: still Spear of Zeonia: we just fucking lost Spear of Zeonia: the 0 skill cuck won top with 6 ganks **** Spear of Zeonia: always out of position Spear of Zeonia: always doing nothing Spear of Zeonia: always dying Spear of Zeonia: I don't understand Spear of Zeonia: why did you buy that diamond account? Spear of Zeonia: sure glad we didnt camp keld Spear of Zeonia: and let me shut him down Spear of Zeonia: sure glad nunu is inting Spear of Zeonia: fucking report that kid Spear of Zeonia: report nunu Post-Game Spear of Zeonia: kled you're living proof its better to be lucky than good Spear of Zeonia: with all your camping you only barely won a 2v1 lane Spear of Zeonia: congrats on the nunu inting

*** I was referencing kled to my team. I was mad at the character not the player.

Conclusion:

As long as you are simply intentionally throwing games you won't get banned. If you ever get emotional it seems Riot deems it fair to take your ability to communicate in a team game away, take away over a month of game time farming a single honor checkpoint and making it so I no longer get rewards. More often in games I'm the glue that holds teams together. Where's all the chat logs from the games where I pulled the team together and helped us win a game?! Where's that at huh? Why did the int'ing duo from the first game not get punished even though they admitted to the losing but their k/d/a didn't look bad becaus they would draw us into fights and watch us die while dancing/sitting still?

I can understand the post game of the 2nd game being unwarranted by me, but its simply bad manners, its not banworthy. I never threatened anyone, no racism, no player directed hatred or anger, nothing personal or broadly discriminatory. I just want to know what you guys do with the bans? Do you give higher weight to those that are higher rank? Do you have me pre-disposed to bans and punishment due to a previous ban? If that's the case shouldn't someone like Tyler1 lose his account forever too? I never understood how someone like Tyler because of his popularity gets his stuff back but us normal people are left to rot. Why does it take so long to get a single checkpoint but now I will most likely never get another one this year? I played levels 1-30 and got a single freaking checkpoint and constantly got 2-3 honors because I carried the games AND because I was more often than not, an instructive teammate.

I just want this game to be fair and ban the people ACTUALLY being toxic. The ones losing on purpose or throwing when the game looks slightly bad. We're not all Korean Challengers here. Its NA solo queue in plat and gold. People make mistakes and the losing team can win easily. I've had it happen in my last 10 games a few times actually. So I'd prefer if the people losing on purpose get banned and the people telling ME to kill MYSELF didn't if I had to pick one or the other. One is a waste of my life the other is just words I can ignore with the ignore function (which league players don't use, just try to get people perma banned, lol). Thanks.

Edit: I think I should clarify, my ALL chat is off by default. I know I can get heated and I try to not say anything to start fights. These are the only real arguments I can think of in the last 30+ games where I had issues with people and both games have an intentional feeder. Must be my weakpoint. I can't MUTE them intentionally losing. Not sure what I can do here besides just get reported by the inters and be punished for doing toxic. Seems to be the Automated systems preference.

37 Comments

AeroWaffleSep 8, 20184 votes

I see a fair amount of insulting in both games.

Constantly badgering people to report is also bad. Just report them. Don't pressure people to alienate someone. Their report is theirs to use.

Spear of ZeoniaSep 8, 20181 votes

Fair enough. The insulting didn't NEED to be said, but I don't believe the lightness of the insults are warranting punishment. Still, I'll just avoid it from now on regardless. As for the asking for the reports I actually agree now that I've looked into it more. However, at the time, the intent is to have the intentionally feeding players removed as quickly as possible from the player base as they will only facilitate losses to anyone unlucky enough to have them on their team. I'm mad, but I'm also looking out for the others because NO ONE wants to have the inting players on their side.

ChermorgSep 8, 20183 votes

More reports do not do that. Reports don't change anything past one. One report does the same as 9.

Spear of ZeoniaSep 8, 20181 votes

Proof? If true would like to share it with others.

CharDeeMcDennizSep 8, 20183 votes

it's been said many times by board mods/advisors and by riot

Spear of ZeoniaSep 8, 20181 votes

Neat. Bad system, but nice to know.

ChermorgSep 8, 20183 votes

I'm on my phone so don't have access to my links where a Rioters has confirmed it, but it's simply logic.

No valid justice system is based on number of reports.

Spear of ZeoniaSep 8, 20181 votes

Not true? The more reports the more likely the crime is legitimate and the more confirmation there is for a legitimate conviction?

CharDeeMcDennizSep 8, 20185 votes

or 4 guys in a premade decide they dont like the 1 guy and gang up on him....

Spear of ZeoniaSep 8, 20181 votes

Wow! Its almost like.... Context should matter and riot should actually have someone look into these before dishing out these trash punishments that are way too harsh for the 'crimes'.

Hmm... Too bad context doesn't matter and riot uses AI to determine everything now. But its 0 tolerance so if the AI rules against you, you're done for.

CharDeeMcDennizSep 8, 20184 votes

i love it when punished people complain about the rules like they DIDN'T click "I Agree" on the ToS when they signed up...

Spear of ZeoniaSep 8, 20181 votes

[deleted]

CharDeeMcDennizSep 8, 20183 votes

[{quoted}](name=Spear of Zeonia,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=LzYslEOi,comment-id=0002000000000000000100000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-09-08T21:25:42.126+0000)

applauding and promoting the removal of merit-based rewards because of some VERY MINUSCULE rule breaking.

so you expect to break the rules and still be rewarded

LOL

[{quoted}](name=Spear of Zeonia,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=LzYslEOi,comment-id=0002000000000000000100000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-09-08T21:25:42.126+0000)

But people like you don't care. You really don't.

no, i really, really dont

Spear of ZeoniaSep 9, 20181 votes

{quoted}

so you expect to break the rules and still be rewarded

LOL

no, i really, really dont

I expect my MERIT to be rewarded when competing in a competitive game. If I were back in highschool and I called my wrestling opponent "mentally weak" I wouldn't even be punished. I would most likely not even have been looked down upon. I would not have my medal taken away. If I slammed the opponent and hurt them which is illegal in Ohio, then I would be punished according to the CONTEXT of the situation, up to match loss and disqualification.

Unlike riot's terrible system, real sports and real life have this thing where all of your hard work doesn't simply disappear in a cloud of smoke because you were a "meany head". The violation is taken into context and is issued a punishment as needed. Why should I play this amazing game ran by such a terrible company now that they stripped ANY motivation to move up? They literally cause their own toxicity. The toxic players will simply make new accounts, and care even less than before because they have less effort and emotion tied to their smurf accounts. This system is killing competitive games, killing the drive to play, killing the drive to better themselves, and only frustrates people who get banned for instances like mine which are so fucking benign that they should literally not be reportable offences. You people cry wolf so often that now real threats are treated on the same level as calling people "mentally weak".

Honestly this community is pathetic and deserves its shitty reputation. A lot of this white knight circle jerking is seriously disgusting. As long as you feel superior to everyone its fine though, eh?

CharDeeMcDennizSep 9, 20181 votes

[slayer-pantheon-popcorn]

i like the part where you compare video games to real life

ChermorgSep 8, 20183 votes

So if an entire group of friends reports someone to the police for stealing, the police should instantly arrest them? And if only one person does it they shouldn't even investigate?

No. All reports do is trigger an investigation of the behavior. More reports do not mean a behavior is more likely illegal, it just means more people decided to report it.

Spear of ZeoniaSep 8, 20182 votes

OR, the police have all the friends state the story and make sure they all match up, do their own investigations and make a judgement call based on all of the information instead of a single person's PoV and a program that looks for 'mean words'... More reports means its more likely, it doesn't mean due process doesn't ensue. I didn't say they'd be arrested, only that it would look more legitimate than if a single person reported. If its a premade or group of friends you have to be more wary due to the tendency of people to stick up for a friend even if they're lying.

Its almost like context matters... strange. Oh well. The intentional feeders got away free with no repercussions. Too bad programs don't understand context.

ChermorgSep 8, 20183 votes

Context doesn't matter. Someone pisses you off, too bad. Control yourself.

ModPrandineSep 9, 2018

[{quoted}](name=Spear of Zeonia,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=LzYslEOi,comment-id=0002000000000000,timestamp=2018-09-08T20:51:25.375+0000)

Proof? If true would like to share it with others.

From Riot Tantram (aka the guy who wrote the entire system):

4+ reports is the same as 1.

A report, or 9 reports, flag a game for review.

if (reports > 0) { reviewGame(); }

ChermorgSep 8, 20184 votes

Did you flaming and harassing them magically make them play like a Challenger?

Hint, no, it did not. But what it did do was tilt you further and make the game even less fun for your teammates.

Spear of ZeoniaSep 8, 20181 votes

Uhh.. Not sure what you're getting at here? No where did I say me telling them they were mentally weak would make me a better player. I was upset and expressing it. They were trying to lose and they DID what you get banned for TALKING ABOUT... However, in Riot's eyes. Being a bad person and performing negative actions is much less serious than people typing. The teamates were not having fun because the inting feeders were inting. My words did not affect that. The 2 reports from the duo is what got me in trouble. Not the others. The int feeders still haven't been punished by the way.

ChermorgSep 8, 20185 votes

You being upset does not give you the right to ruin the game for other players. You don't get to play the "I'm not having fun so I'm going to flame others so they don't have fun either" card.

Spear of ZeoniaSep 8, 20181 votes

You're missing the point.

I wasn't int'ing. I was playing. Look at the damn chat dude. I tried to explain that I wasn't feeding as 0/2 being camped and that I WANTED TO WIN. The other two were the ones that attacked ME and simultaneously fed to end the game faster....

I was trying to preserve the game for the last 3 of us that were on the team and wanted to win the ranked game.

I didn't even flame. I told the feeders that decided to ruin the game for us because THEY weren't having fun they were mentally weak. That's not some terrible evil thing to say. I didn't say they were hitler, I didn't say they should kill themselves, I didn't attack their looks or religion. I told them they were mentally weak. Get. Over. It. Its not even a big insult. They told me I was a "fucking waste of time and need to learn the game, feeding idiot"... But hey. I got MY rewards taken and they didn't.

ChermorgSep 8, 20184 votes

Yes, it is terrible to say, and the fact you think it's okay even after you were punished for it tells me we will likely see you here again soon enough complaining about another punishment.

You aren't some victim here. You are the asshole who flamed others. It doesn't matter why, flaming is never okay.

Double SniffSep 8, 20182 votes

He isn't saying that what he did is okay. He is saying since they did something that was equally against the rules, they too, should be judged as he did. Flaming isn't okay. Why are they getting away with it AND feeding??

mlm olo mlmSep 8, 20183 votes

Riots definition of toxic chat: any negativity.

Your definitions do not count at all.

Spear of ZeoniaSep 8, 20181 votes

This is not realistic. Its one thing to try to stop true, hurtful, extreme behavior. Its another thing to try to make every player a rainbow spewing unicorn of love and happiness. Its a competative game about killing things. People are gonna get heated and negative at some point. Its unfair that "I want you to kill youself and die %%%%%%" and "you're mentally weak" are considered anything remotely close to each other.

ModPeriscopeSep 8, 20184 votes

I don’t think he said they’re close, but ya they’re both negative. Those lines are punished differently from the latter one.

Spear of ZeoniaSep 8, 20181 votes

Firstly, They are very close. Both make you lose all merit based rewards in ranked, the only reason to play ranked. After you get hit with any punishment it takes WAY too long to get to honor 2 again so you're practically defaulted to not earning rewards unless you were "lucky" enough to be punished in January.

Secondly, Why are the second ones punishable at all?! Why are they justified in taking all merits away from a player?

The intentional feeders still will get their merit-based rewards. I wont. Because I called the intentional feeders mentally weak... Seriously? Is this what this community wants? Is this the common mindset of a League player? Merit doesn't matter, only virtue signalling and pretending to be a good person so long as the robot AI can't tell you're intentionally throwing?

mlm olo mlmSep 8, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Spear of Zeonia,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=LzYslEOi,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2018-09-08T18:40:30.812+0000)

This is not realistic. Its one thing to try to stop true, hurtful, extreme behavior. Its another thing to try to make every player a rainbow spewing unicorn of love and happiness. Its a competative game about killing things. People are gonna get heated and negative at some point. Its unfair that "I want you to kill youself and die %%%%%%" and "you're mentally weak" are considered anything remotely close to each other.

Just want to interject a bit. Neutral is good enough for Riot. Which is to say, not talking at all is good enough for Riot. Riot isn't trying to change people. Riot is trying to get rid of people.

Spear of ZeoniaSep 8, 20181 votes

Yes, not communicating in a team game is fine to riot. They don't care if you win/lose or compete. They want you to act in a certain way or be banned. They don't care about people. They care about virtue signalling and PRETENDING to care about people for appearances it seems.

As stated over and over and over, the people actually committing ACTION against the rules were NOT banned. They just got me to lose my seasonal rewards. Seems fair.

BlueBilberrySep 9, 20181 votes

You called your teammates "mentally weak"; tried to coerce others to join you in reporting another player (TWICE?), referred to something as being AIDS, called someone a "0 skill cuck", and you expect sympathy.

Sadly, you made the same mistake that a bunch of us do - typed in chat. Just mute all, resist the temptation to type in chat and play your own game. Reading the record as shown, I hate to say it, but I think you earned the ban.

Spear of ZeoniaSep 9, 20181 votes

[deleted]

BlueBilberrySep 9, 20182 votes

Interesting - obviously this comment you posted is an example of culture too - by your definition. Fascinating.

Spear of ZeoniaSep 9, 20181 votes

You didn't quote anything.