dont ask junglers to not take your farm after you die

Genuwhine36·Sep 21, 2016·10 votes·1,154 views

for 1 you arent getting that farm anyways. For 2 you idiots steal jungle camps without a worry in the world why should we cater to you esp when you play bad? Jungling for lower elo players is just cringe.

I also find it funny that im always down voted by no brain low elo players that think they are right xD. You shouldnt actually get a vote unless you are diamond or higher. Its ok you guys are the same people that are the same elo every year and blame your team thinking you actually know how to play LOL

"but genuwhine in my bronze games my bronze friend said that its better that you get no farm and let the tower take damage and reset anyways BabyRage"

48 Comments

Kokiri StarSep 21, 20162 votes

if im dead usually that means the enemy laner got the kill = they have an advantage, don't push me up to their turret just because you wanted that 2cs.

Genuwhine36Sep 21, 20161 votes

I mean you must be use to the plat junglers because if you actually do it right the wave bounces off the tower and resets in the middle of the lane instead of losing gold for no reason and taking tower damage.

Mig89Sep 22, 20161 votes

Aren't you a plat jg?

AstôlfoSep 21, 20162 votes

Joke threads go into M&G.

DraygenBiscuitSep 21, 20161 votes

Ya but what if you want the lane to push back to your turret so you can safely farm on your return. By taking the farm you are guaranteeing the enemy safe farm under the turret instead, therefor make your laner, witch is already not doing well be out in the open to be killed by the enemy jungler witch will most likely be in the area by that point.

Also not all of us steal JG camps.

MarshbouySep 21, 20162 votes

unless you last hit like a normal person.

DraygenBiscuitSep 21, 20161 votes

{quoted}

unless you last hit like a normal person.

I don't really see how anything I said is relevant to your reply.

MarshbouySep 21, 20161 votes

if you last hit like a normal person then you shouldn't shove the wave.

DraygenBiscuitSep 21, 20161 votes

{quoted}

if you last hit like a normal person then you shouldn't shove the wave.

But the post is about Junglers who steal farm. All junglers ive seen who do this, spam their abilities to quickly get gold and then got back to their jungle camps. Therefore last hitting is irrelevant.

MarshbouySep 21, 20161 votes

like a normal person

im just going to leave this here. A proper jungler should only last hit unless the allied laner says otherwise.

Genuwhine36Sep 21, 20161 votes

Reasons you are bronze, you fall under false presets of how the game should be played from other bad players. The game is like a big chess match where variables actually apply. Neither of you know what a proper jungler is or how to be one.

MarshbouySep 21, 20162 votes

Funny. I was told this line

A proper jungler should only last hit unless the allied laner says otherwise.

by pantsaredragon. A challenger jungler main. I think he just slightly outranks you.

Genuwhine36Sep 21, 20161 votes

I could give a flying shit less what random na SOLO QUE player that builds RED SMITE on zac has to say to a silver player. Hes trash.

MarshbouySep 21, 20162 votes

http://www.lolking.net/summoner/na/22403576

this pants are dragon? in the top 200 for NA players? Yeah you can shove that "he's trash" up your arse.

Genuwhine36Sep 21, 20161 votes

Ask any good player hes trash his builds and everything he has no idea what hes doing. You are the typical silver that probably believes imaqtpie is good just because hes NA challenger and shit like that LOL

try watching silas kroeger if you want an actual jungler. Was top 6 after taking a break the entire season long with hardly any games and doesnt build and play like trash.

MarshbouySep 21, 20163 votes

I'm going to discredit everything you say and laugh very hard.

You are going to get angry at me and proceed to call me shit and silver over and over again.

Genuwhine36Sep 21, 20161 votes

Tfw you think discrediting is saying that someone is na challenger when they build like absolute trash and will never be on a competitive team when other points are given.

Your skill level is just another testament of how much you know and understand. If im arguing with a challenger that is actually bringing up in game facts I wouldnt just say you are a bad player since they use their brain. You on the other hand act like the other low elo players spamming your crap that you think is right since most of you are really young. But in a couple years when you are still silver/gold you can hit me up for a dynamic boost or some coaching ;)

MarshbouySep 21, 20163 votes

Congrats on doing EXACTLY what i predicted. you filled the stereotype completely. I am legitimately impressed.

Genuwhine36Sep 21, 20161 votes

Yep keep just saying what I "will do" instead of giving me facts to further prove you have no idea what you are talking about. So let me take guess then. 15, 200+ pounds, bullied in school?

RequiemsfireSep 22, 20161 votes

Imaqtiepie is also an ex LCS player though....

Wh1teWu1fSep 21, 20161 votes

There is I think a problem with this statement in that if the laner has no idea how to control a wave to begin with, then maybe you should be pushing a wave rather than just last hitting. Although, if you yourself (not you specifically, just in general) don't understand when you should/shouldn't push a wave, then last hitting is probably the safest bet for the most part.

MarshbouySep 21, 20161 votes

TBH you should always shove the wave into enemy turrets to deny them CS, but some laners will flip their shit about it and tilt if you shove the wave. A good laner should say "shove wave" to deny the enemy CS, but not every laner is good Xd

Wh1teWu1fSep 21, 20161 votes

If the wave is closer to your tower, wouldn't it be better to freeze it though? Since usually the enemy laner will get back to lane before you can push it under tower and ensure it will bounce back. (Perhaps I'm mistaken since I'm a support player who usually tries pushing, but lack of damage makes that shit tough >.>)

MarshbouySep 21, 20161 votes

It's complicated and out of the reach of most players knowledge of the game.

Wh1teWu1fSep 21, 20161 votes

Yeah, small nuances are pretty tough to grasp, but that's why fundamentals are what's used to climb a majority of the time I believe. These only really come into a large importance at high leagues (high diamond-challenger).

P.S. I also just realized that we flipped back and forth between pushing and freezing a wave since you started out with pants' quote that a laner should only last hit and then you said they should always shove, while I originally said there are probably times to shove, but you should mainly freeze... I guess that goes to show how complex it can get haha!

MarshbouySep 22, 20161 votes

Yeah. It's pretty complicated and it's a bit too much for a "climb out of bronze" video. Have a good day/night!

JRobin31Sep 22, 20161 votes

I agree that players seem to have a difficult time understanding basic wave management. But it's actually not that difficult:

_**Push the wave to enemy tower.

Anything else is most likely a macro game mistake.**_

Some of you are like "but, but sometimes you should leave it and sometimes you should last hit it and sometimes you should blah blah blah" Well guess what? All those actions require players to understand wave mechanics. And don't get me wrong, junglers should learn wave mechanics too, but for whatever reason many players find it difficult to determine the precisely technically correct thing to do in game.

On the other hand, pushing to enemy tower is almost always the best thing to do and almost never the wrong thing to do. Any other action on the wave is potentially the worst possible action that can be taken.

Why is this? Very simple. Minions are the primary source of experience and gold in the game. Securing that gold and experience is vital to your team's success and is your team's primary objective in early game. Denying gold and experience to the enemy is equally vital. Any action that fails to secure vital gold and experience in the early game is almost always a mistake.

Some of you are like "but but, you should listen to the laner". Well guess what? Laners don't always know the best way to manage waves either. For some reason wave mechanics are so hard that even laners have trouble doing the precisely technically correct thing to their own creep waves!

I know it sounds ridiculous and some of you are saying "well let's just ask some high ELO players and do what they say". Well guess? That's right, even high ELO players have trouble with wave mechanics! Apparently wave mechanics are so difficult that even high ELO players have trouble doing the precisely technically correct thing!

In end what low ELO players need is something that solves the majority of wave management issues without ever being too bad a thing to do. The answer is simple:

Farm that wave of all of its gold and experience. Your team needs it the enemy team needs it. Letting it go to waste is definitely the wrong thing to do in early game.

Genuwhine36Sep 21, 20163 votes

The funny thing is most players dont manipulate the wave or know how to anyways. Even at the top level people like dardoch has said his team cant even do that and they are challenger.

While in a normal competitive situation where your toplaner will freeze the wave and make use of it all its better to take some of the farm and freeze it for your laner. in SOLO QUE to just take the farm and push the wave into the enemy tower making the wave bounce back to middle of the lane instead of everyone losing mass amounts of farm. The SOLO QUE laner esp low elo will just shove the wave without a thought in their head. So its actually irrelevant and gets annoying when they bitch about it.

DraygenBiscuitSep 21, 20161 votes

{quoted}

The funny thing is most players dont manipulate the wave or know how to anyways. Even at the top level people like dardoch has said his team cant even do that and they are challenger.

While in a normal competitive situation where your toplaner will freeze the wave and make use of it all its better to take some of the farm and freeze it for your laner. in SOLO QUE to just take the farm and push the wave into the enemy tower making the wave bounce back to middle of the lane instead of everyone losing mass amounts of farm. The SOLO QUE laner esp low elo will just shove the wave without a thought in their head. So its actually irrelevant and gets annoying when they bitch about it.

Exactly! Your laner has already shown themself to be incompetent, so when you push, you not only give free farm to the enemy, but you essentially also give them your laner as a free meal. Unless you really hate the guy, and are doing it for revenge, that's kinda harsh lol. If it was just about the gold, I would agree with you and I would see no issue, but you are setting them up for failure.

Genuwhine36Sep 21, 20161 votes

What part of push the wave to the tower so that the wave resets since you are dead and will lose farm and get tower damage on yourself anyways dont you understand?

You are the primary example of why things like the boards dont work esp with a vote system. You're bronze whatever with a 30% win rate. You clearly just have no idea how to play let alone how waves should work ect otherwise you wouldnt be near bronze regardless of mechanics. Its not setting anyone up for failure but actually helping everyone in general. The reason people get mad is because they dont know what they are doing and have your mindset when they dont even know what will happen.

I know that im right since its done in high elo constantly and is the normal thing to do when your laner dies. Reasons I climb.

DraygenBiscuitSep 21, 20161 votes

{quoted}

What part of push the wave to the tower so that the wave resets since you are dead and will lose farm and get tower damage on yourself anyways dont you understand?

You are the primary example of why things like the boards dont work esp with a vote system. You're bronze whatever with a 30% win rate. You clearly just have no idea how to play let alone how waves should work ect otherwise you wouldnt be near bronze regardless of mechanics. Its not setting anyone up for failure but actually helping everyone in general. The reason people get mad is because they dont know what they are doing and have your mindset when they dont even know what will happen.

I know that im right since its done in high elo constantly and is the normal thing to do when your laner dies. Reasons I climb.

Firstly, stalking me and looking me up is kinda creepy, but whatever, do what you want. Secondly I haven't insulted you or your intelligence and have been respectful for the most part, and yet you feel the need to make this personal. All I am saying is that most laners will automatically go where the farm is without a second thought. If you put the farm beside the enemy turrent, they will probably die. That is all I am saying! It doesn't take a genius to understand that. I am pretty sure I could make my mother understand it in 5 minutes, and she doesn't even know anything about video games. It is a fairly easy concept that I Bronze Master 30% win rate support main conceived. Its really just common sense Ranking has nothing to do with it.

Genuwhine36Sep 21, 20161 votes

yeah dude its "stalking" to look up someones profile on op.gg like the millions of people do to see what kind of player they are working with LOL But now i see you are like age 14 and just have no idea how anything works so last comment for you.

and im TELLING you as an experienced player that knows how to play that you are wrong.

" It doesn't take a genius to understand that"

clearly it does because you dont understand that pushing the wave into the tower kills the creeps and resets the lane to the middle You think it sits at their tower taking no damage for some reason like a donk. Should never comment as a bronze/silver/gold/ ect player because you actually have 0 idea how this game works and its shown in your comments and play.

DraygenBiscuitSep 21, 20161 votes

{quoted}

yeah dude its "stalking" to look up someones profile on op.gg like the millions of people do to see what kind of player they are working with LOL

and im TELLING you as an experienced player that knows how to play that you are wrong.

" It doesn't take a genius to understand that"

clearly it does because you dont understand that pushing the wave into the tower kills the creeps and resets the lane to the middle You think it sits at their tower taking no damage for some reason like a donk. Should never comment as a bronze/silver/gold/ ect player because you actually have 0 idea how this game works and its shown in your comments and play.

Ok what you are saying is that if you have a laner witch is stupid and dies. Then if you push his lane, he will not immediately go in for the farm and die to the enemy? That is literally the only point I was trying to make. And a point you still have not mentioned. Also yes it is still creepy.

Genuwhine36Sep 21, 20161 votes

You cant even use the right "which" ........

I cant hardly understand what you are saying maybe enlgish not first language so I use smaller words.

Laner die, Enemy push wave and back, Laner still dead, Jungler by top and push wave into tower, Wave reset jungler get free farm, both lane come back, minions in middle of lane.

Comprende?

DraygenBiscuitSep 21, 20161 votes

{quoted}

You cant even use the right "which" ........

I cant hardly understand what you are saying maybe enlgish not first language so I use smaller words.

Laner die, Enemy push wave and back, Laner still dead, Jungler by top and push wave into tower, Wave reset jungler get free farm, both lane come back, minions in middle of lane.

Comprende?

Sigh I have posted 7 posts, trying to get you to respond to what I said, and yet you still just want to insult my intelligence. If becoming an asshole is what it takes to get to your level, I will proudly be a bronze the rest of my life. I don't know you. I will Never know you and frankly I don't care, but if you want people to respect your opinions, maybe you could start by respecting them.

Wh1teWu1fSep 21, 20161 votes

I think there is a slight misunderstanding in a way. He's saying that if you make sure (as the jungler) you push it under tower, then it will naturally bounce back. Obviously there are the bad junglers who simply push, but don't ensure it goes under tower and end up screwing their laner, but you can't say that pushing a wave at times is a bad idea just because people don't execute the strategy properly. Likewise, at times you should only last hit/freeze as the jungler (if the wave is closer to the allied tower for example) so that your ADC is set up extremely nicely (then if they screw it up, it's on them).

It's a case by case situation, but you can't say one thing is wrong just because people aren't good at doing it.

DraygenBiscuitSep 21, 20161 votes

{quoted}

I think there is a slight misunderstanding in a way. He's saying that if you make sure (as the jungler) you push it under tower, then it will naturally bounce back. Obviously there are the bad junglers who simply push, but don't ensure it goes under tower and end up screwing their laner, but you can't say that pushing a wave at times is a bad idea just because people don't execute the strategy properly. Likewise, at times you should only last hit/freeze as the jungler (if the wave is closer to the allied tower for example) so that your ADC is set up extremely nicely (then if they screw it up, it's on them).

It's a case by case situation, but you can't say one thing is wrong just because people aren't good at doing it.

No I understand him completely, and he is right. But he is pretending like there is no negative effects, of witch there could possibly be. He is ignoring the fact that it wont always go the way he thinks it will. I think if you are a laner, and you just want to farm, it is perfectly reasonable to ask you JG not to take your farm, just like its ok for a jg to ask the laner to steal their camps.

GaleWinUnleashedSep 21, 20161 votes

Nothing wrong with correctly last-hitting the minions so that the gold doesn't go to waste entirely, though.

DraygenBiscuitSep 21, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Nothing wrong with correctly last-hitting the minions so that the gold doesn't go to waste entirely, though.

Oh no, of course not. He had a good point, but it just had nothing to do with my comment, and yet it was a reply, so it just confused me.

Darkslayer85Sep 22, 20161 votes

They should last-hit, just not push the wave. Makes it hard to farm afterwards if they don't freeze correctly.

Genuwhine36Sep 22, 20161 votes

Why would that matter in an elo where they dont freeze the waves and instantly push the waves back into the enemy anyways. Plus the minions will be in the middle of the lane anyways lol.

Supreme Senpai69Sep 22, 20161 votes

Surely this is in memes and games..? No? This guy is real?

Nobody cares if you last hit the minions, we care when you push the wave, making us die again because we're in a hard matchup without jungler help. Though it can be annoying when you freely give out your position to the enemy, causing top/bot to be ganked freely or dragon to be started. I'm guessing you're not talking about this, but you just sound super salty in your post so I honestly don't know.

Genuwhine36Sep 22, 20161 votes

reasons my smurf is 4x higher elo than your main :D

You dont know because you main support and are really low elo :D read some other comments to get some insight little fella.

Supreme Senpai69Sep 22, 20161 votes

I just started playing a month ago so naturally. I don't know, you're right, so why make a thread basically telling everyone they suck? Why not explain? You just look super salty when you post things like that. I can't take it seriously and I'm not trying to be rude, you just legit seem like a troll. Which if you are like, good job. I guess.

Pawn of heartsSep 22, 20161 votes

so you saying is that.....

when you died you don't deserve any xp to try and catch up.
when you died the jungler have the right to take your income / salary.
when you died you have no right to ping the jungler to get the fk off your lane.
when you died and behind it is ok for jungler to push your fking lane.

#5.when you died and have teleport it is ok for the jungler to take all the goddamn farm.

p.s stfu

Wh1teWu1fSep 22, 20161 votes

I think point 2 requires some context, if you're dead, you aren't getting any of the gold anyways, and if you let your jungler farm it (since nobody else at that point in time will) then they can get ahead of the enemy jungler.

The idea of pushing the lane though isn't to push it away from your laner to fuck them, it's to have the wave hit the enemy's tower and inevitable and 100% bounce back to the center of the lane, actually helping the laner rather than hindering them. If the laner has TP, then 100% you are correct, the jungler shouldn't push the wave (although 2-3 minions worth of tax would be fine imo).

The problem that most people have is that some junglers don't actually make sure it goes under the tower which causes a minion wave to instead get frozen right outside of the enemies tower, or the jungler eats all of the farm when the laner had tp. While this is obviously frustrating, you can't say that the strategy is bad/stupid just because it was poorly executed. Similar to how you can't say X champ is bad just because someone is playing them poorly, right?

Mig89Sep 22, 20161 votes

Yes, He is a JG main XD

RequiemsfireSep 22, 20161 votes

I would ask them not to push the wave like some junglers tend to do because it puts it in a position for them to freeze the wave to their advantage zoning from cs with increased risk of being ganked unless the enemy is out of lane, since the wave will eventually reset and the turret costs them gold/exp for not being there.