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My least favorite toxic behavior (Long)

DeadlyQuestion··13 votes·1,382 views

I personally don't troll and am absolutely never toxic; not that I'm better than anyone else, I get just as frustrated and angry when I do bad or when I get a team that seems to make the same mistakes over and over, I just don't express it because it doesn't help me feel better and it never helps the game go smoother. So on the other hand, when players say horrible shit in chat, I either (rarely) try to mitigate and make them feel better by trying to say something passive and hopeful, or I just mute the entire team so I don't have to be exposed to the negativity. AFKs and griefing by feeding kills is even more annoying, it brings a hopelessness that robs me of my desire to play, but I do my best to try and use potential honors and the offender getting reported to make me feel better (not out of spite, I just hope the system eventually works to help weed out the toxicity).

However, there is one player behavior that infuriates me so intensely that sometimes I have to idle and try to calm myself down, and that's when allies intentionally move to steal farm or buffs out of spite, even more so when they don't need it. If they can obviously use the buff/farm and they ping, I generally don't even question it and give it to them. I am so against toxicity that I will hurt my own farm by handing over what is being asked for in order to prevent potential saltiness.

But when you obviously don't need, like a Vel'Koz support in one of my games that took our jungler's red buff 3 times (twice burst stealing it from under him), "Because he deserved it" (in my opinion, the jungler did nothing wrong), it's such a shitty, negative thing to do that I wasn't even upset when the jungler decided to afk. In another one of my games, our jungler was so upset that I said "You're behind, don't worry about ganking top, just farm up." (and that is verbatim, and it was the only thing I said for the entire game) that twice he waited for me to go to a minion wave, chased me, and burned his flash over a wall just to burst down the wave, without pinging his intention to clear it. He burned his valuable, high-cooldown summoner spell TWICE just to prevent me from farming, out of spite, even though I would have GLADLY given it to him had I known where he was going. This has happened to my team four times tonight and it is such a shitty thing to do that I considered quitting League for as long as it took for me to forget how terrible the game makes me feel (last time was almost 8 months between the end of season 2 and beginning of season 3). Which, I get it, not only is this the internet but since I am telling the most toxic gaming community since Halo that I considered quitting, I am subjecting myself to hateful-for-fun taunting to go through with it because as a Bronze I am not a valuable anyway, but that's not the point. The player of a competition, even in an unranked normal, shouldn't have to feel like quitting because of misbehavior that is practically legal and allowed to go on.

Any competition between skills is a sport, I've accepted this. So, if any of you enjoy physical sports like baseball, football, or whatever, how irritating would it be to you as a fan when your favorite player decides to retire because their teammates are allowed to get away with hindering the player out of spite? Maybe that's a bad example, but I really don't know how else to express my frustration at this kind of thing, especially because it isn't "against the rules" and can't really be enforced.

My QQ is over, proceed to spam TL;DR

13 Comments

bad arcade kitty3 votes

you sound as an insuferrable fa***t if you said me that i was behind in such a mentor tone and i was in a mood to throw a fit, i could insult you for the whole game afterwards for any little mistake and possibly even, for instance, intentionally let you die when you waited my help in a 1v1 or 1v2 situation, giving away your death and my possible kill or assist (in a such case i usually prevent that i won't help a certain player, but they sometimes don't believe i'm serious) and it would be your fault, guess i know when im behind as well and what i should do i know too

Fate in Thyself10 votes

And you're just proving his point even further when you say that. If someone said that to me as a Jungler, I would be happy. Cause the faster you get back in the game, the better. Letting teammates die intentionally... You're a prime example of toxic.

NoobLearninGame2 votes

{quoted}

And you're just proving his point even further when you say that. If someone said that to me as a Jungler, I would be happy. Cause the faster you get back in the game, the better. Letting teammates die intentionally... You're a prime example of toxic.

I have seen how people can be insulting (as a relatively inexperienced jungler) when they tell you to farm jungle. At the same time not having any pressure at that point to gank can be a bit relieving. At that point unless you see a really good opportunity it's probably smart to farm after a fail gank, or whatever else might have happened.

Although sometimes things happen that might not be your fault, and you'll have someone (maybe the guy at fault) trying to boss you around. This can lead to others having a negative attitude towards you, and not assisting when you attempt to gank, or taking JG cs/buffs they don't need as much as you, and other issues.

I've at least 1 JG champion that I'm pretty confident with now, so I've not had this type of issue nearly as frequently as when I was learning JG basics.

DeadlyQuestion4 votes

I agree with you; I have experienced plenty of insulting comments with the point being you need to farm, which is why I tried to word what I said to be supportive. I don't think that particular jungle's reaction to my comment in common at all, though, which is completely beside my original point; I wasn't saying something to the effect of "You can't say anything in chat without people taking it offensively."

The point of my post got completely ignored by the original commenter we're replying to. He's focusing on one instance where he feels I'm at fault, but it was the only instance I was the victim of a form of spiteful stealing. Regardless of who the victim was, the fact that there's no real way to fairly sanction the behavior (thus making it perfectly okay to do) is just a huge morale crusher for me when it happens. Hurting your team intentionally for any reason is just... I have been sitting here for five minutes trying to describe it accurately and I can't, the shittiness of it is just beyond words to me.

I get why it happens. To them, it's a meaningless game played for fun, and when they aren't having fun, it's not worth playing anymore. Because they don't have real consequences, they either don't consciously realize, or else don't care, that they're affecting other people with their behavior. If we were playing a physical sport in a friend's backyard, or a board/card game, or you're on a high school/college team, your behavior would get you banned from playing with them, and then who else are you going to easily play with? In League, there are millions ready to play, generally completely unaware of your behavior.. and if there somehow were consequences, and if you haven't spent much/any money on the game, making a new account is barely an inconvenience. You don't have to rely on anyone for long term unless you're making a 5-man team. And honestly, I can't think of a way to prevent such a mindset without affecting queue times.

DeadlyQuestion5 votes

If you actually read that whole post, then thank you, even though your comment kind of just affirmed how toxic this community can be. My reply is long, but I'll sum it up with a TL;DR first:

-Tone can't be conveyed through text. Maybe both of you thought the same thing about my comment, but he made a huge mistake that cost me a stronger enemy, and my intention was just to reassure him I wasn't upset and that the match wasn't hopeless because it was still early in the game.

-Griefing for any reason is unjustifiable; being toxic in response to toxic behavior is unacceptable, and my comment you also took offense to wasn't toxic even if it would have upset you. In this particular case there was no reason for his, or your prospective, retaliation, especially because I would have apologized and clarified had he made any indication he didn't appreciate the comment.

Long version: Your interpretation of my quote, and probably his interpretation as well, is just an example that tone can't be conveyed through text, but the difference between you and him is that he knew what happened: He (our jungler) came up to gank and fed my top enemy a kill; I didn't abandon him, I provided as much damage as I could since I wasn't being focused, and had to burn my flash to escape after he died. The jungler just took a full combo+ult+ignite from a level 7 riven when he was only level 5... and then complained that he was too far behind to gank anyone, although no one said a thing to him.

So, instead of raging at him for coming up and being useless (which is what you would have done, probably, considering what you said in your reply), my sole intention of my comment was, If you personally think you're too behind to gank, then ignore anyone who says you need to gank to reassure him that at least one person was going to support his lack of presence in favor of mid-to-late game power.

You say "i know when i'm behind as well and what i should do," but again, considering what you said in your reply to my post over that completely non-toxic comment (regardless of the tone you think it had, it had nothing offensive in it compared to the typical response to that situation), you're probably the first one to rage at an ally for making the same mistakes over and over again/for giving the enemy an advantage. Maybe he did know what he was doing (like you said you would know and don't need to be told), but I can practically guarantee you're exposed to players that either don't know what they're doing, or SEEM like they don't know what they're doing, and are exposed so often that you have to assume it's at LEAST a 50/50 chance when they make a serious mistake (like going in to gank without your ult, to a bruiser 2 levels over you with her ult), and if that's the case, then pretending like you figure he knew what he needed to do is bullshit.

"...and it would be your fault" Griefing for any reason is unjustifiable; being toxic in retaliation for any behavior is completely unacceptable. A very extreme example of what you're suggesting, is if you stabbed someone to death for insulting your mother: you're going to jail without question. Even if my comment was intended in the mentory way you took it, his behavior wasn't my fault in the least bit, because I know that most people would have taken my comment positively. What he did is completely inexcusable.

DJ Hatsune Miku3 votes

This is so infuriating because it's the worst kind of trolling. I'd rather you afk than follow me around spamming emotes and taking farm or whatever. What's worse is if I'm jungling, and I jungle exclusively as tanks so this is even worse, and one lane gets ganked, dies, and rages hard and starts just farming my jungle and taking buffs as if I owe it to him because I don't gank as much as Lee when I'm Nautilus or Sion. I legit don't understand this kind of behavior... But I'm also someone who never asks for ganks/expects them/calls out my jungler for not ganking when I see their Xin walk into my lane 4 times. If he's wasting his time trying to get something going and I'm playing safe it's more a win for me than a loss. I usually only comment on it to say the jungler was top or w/e and that we should get drag. Since I seem to really only get ganked when I top.. Damn lane is cursed.

DeadlyQuestion1 votes

I am practically the exact same way. The only time I ever feel the jungler was responsible for me losing lane is if I'm bot lane and the enemy jungler is camping. Otherwise, even if the enemy jungler is camping my lane as a mid/top, I expect absolutely no help from the jungler, holding the mentality that I should be able to win lane without help.

You said you legit don't understand their behavior: The theory I've come to accept (but I feel like there's something missing to it) is that it's just basic human defense mechanism of trying to defend yourself under attack; with maturity comes the ability to differentiate between attacks that are actually a threat, and take responsibility for your mistakes as you realize you're not actually in (in this case, social) danger. Whenever you're being made to feel like you're completely responsible for the loss of your team, your brain sees it as you being attacked and your first response is to defend yourself, even if you actually are completely at fault, because actually considering the social consequences for being at fault and realizing there are practically none after that game is usually beyond you when you're being "attacked." This game's player base is so infamous for being toxic that we're immediately conditioned to feel like the game is lost and that it's our fault at the slightest mistake, so even without prompting we shoot to defend ourselves immediately to remove blame so we don't have to face potential social sanctions (and again, with maturity, you realize there aren't any social sanctions and it removes that anxiety to defend yourself).

Honestly, I think they should completely disable free chat, and just have preset messages for circumstances that can't be accurately described through pings. In a general sense, after minions meet at ~1:55, the only time taking a moment to type in chat isn't somehow hindering your participation in the game is when you've died, and then players are generally not thrilled about their death and use chat mainly to rage out (and yes, there are exceptions, keyword here was "generally"). 50% of this game is communication, and 90% of that communication is pings. Free chat isn't needed, and causes more problems than it solves.

Åron2 votes

I really feel your pain here. It is a F2P online game, and with online games there will always be trolling, no matter how infuriating or annoying it is.

alcatrazEscapee1 votes

There is one behavior that somewhat relates to this. Thoughts?

If one of my teammates I an angry with / think is making bad decisions / raging, then I just won't follow his calls if I don't think they will end well for me. Example: your jungler ganks you top lane, when there's a huge minion wave, you and your jungler are both at half health, and the enemy is at full. If I'm sick of this person or if I don't think its a good decision, then I will just let him die. I'm not going to help him if he's going to be a douche to the rest of the team, or if I think its a lost cause.

I completely agree with you on your main post though. What makes me feel better is when you suceed in spite of a trolling enemy; in your example a teammate flashed to get your cs, and you just shot your QWE on the wave, instaclearing it and making your jungler look stupid. :D

DeadlyQuestion3 votes

What you're initially talking about is refusing to aid a champion making a bad call. Like if someone chases a low HP enemy into the jungle and there is 0 vision of the other enemy champions, I'm not following to aid you against a potential 2v5. I try to use my pings as a clear warning, V+click to G+slide up+click in that situation you initially described will completely remove all validity of complaints they could use to flame you.

The other one (refusing to help them in fights/letting them die because they're flaming/being toxic) Honestly, it really depends on how toxic they're being, I don't think I've ever died and specifically thought it was fully someone else's fault. Even if they were refusing to help, I always felt I could have avoided it. I am pretty sure it's still considered toxic behavior, but sometimes even unjustified retaliation isn't upsetting to me, like the Vel'koz who stole our jungler's red "because he deserved it." That jungler ragequit, which is still considered an unjustifiable response to toxic behavior, but I wasn't the least bit upset that he afk'd. There are retaliations like that, that have upset me. Awhile back I remember a Diana running away from the enemy chasing her, and she ran right to our Morgana that sat and spammed laugh while they caught up and killed Diana, and then killed Morgana who just continued to spam laugh. That one I remember deeply upset me. and I wasn't even involved.

It does make me feel better when they fail, but at the same time I feel they'll just continue trying to make up it (again, Vel'koz story). And in the case of when our jungler burned his flash twice, even if I had been able to clear the wave(s) first, the fact that he potentially hindered the entire team by putting flash on cooldown and hindering himself was what upset me. I didn't care about the farm. It partially upset me that he was doing it out of spite, and it greatly upset me he was willing to shoot the entire team in the back for pettiness.

Like I said in another post, I understand why they do this, it's because to them it's a meaningless game played for fun, and when they aren't having fun, it's not worth playing anymore.

Dangerous Man1 votes

Steal their farm also :)

DeadlyQuestion1 votes

The problem isn't that the farm was being stolen, it's that by unnecessarily putting flash on cooldown and hindering himself, he potentially hindered the entire team by allowing himself to be that much easier to kill. By now I can't really remember if he was actually caught out either time before Flash reset, but just that he was more or less willing to shoot the entire team in the back for pettiness was the problem.

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