Xerath lore update
Goodbye Interesting character, hello usual power-mad villain
Also, on side note, how do you hurl a being of pure energy?
(Apologies for not being pictures, first post on the boards.)
73 Comments
lightdragoon8811 votesStill looks and sounds like the same Xerath to me.
Helmight24 votesOld Xerath wanted power and wanted to study magic, but he wasn't straight-up evil about it. His goals might have been questionable and he'd probably kick your ass if you tried to stop him, but nothing he did was explicitly evil.
New Xerath literally is described as being "a spectral being of pure, malevolent energy" instead of just being made of magic like Old Xerath. Additionally, why the fuck would he tell Azir to do the ritual when he planned on stealing it in the first place? Couldn't he have just done the ritual himself since he was the chief magus?
New Xerath is a stereotypical evil-for-the-sake-of-evil character. Old Xerath had the potential for harm, but also the potential for good. He was a relatable character. New Xerath isn't.
lightdragoon8821 votesNew Xerath literally is described as being "a spectral being of pure, malevolent energy" instead of just being made of magic like Old Xerath. Additionally, why the fuck would he tell Azir to do the ritual when he planned on stealing it in the first place? Couldn't he have just done the ritual himself since he was the chief magus?
New Xerath is a stereotypical evil-for-the-sake-of-evil character. Old Xerath had the potential for harm, but also the potential for good. He was a relatable character. New Xerath isn't.
Wrong on both of these.
http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?p=49831285#49831285
Cause:
RiotRunaan Hey, look! Stuff I wrote! :O Blast from the past. Xerath was actually the first character I wrote for entirely (Talon's judgment was my first), so this is a fun flashback. :)
So, no spoilers, but look at it this way: **the Shurima event is largely going to be Azir's story, from Azir's point of view. Events will be colored in a way that may paint Xerath as the "villain" in this scenario, but that doesn't necessarily tell you the whole side of his story. **
Imagine what the mages who imprisoned Xerath in his original lore thought of him: a guy who more or less betrayed his people, nuked their civilization, all for what? For [I]power[/I]? They didn't have all the information that you guys have from his Judgment, for example. To them, he was also a very clear-cut "villain."
We always wanted Xerath to have a sympathetic backstory, even if he does cross a moral event horizon at some point. Remember when you hated Severus Snape for most of the Harry Potter series, only to have "his side" revealed much, much later, and how game-changing that was? Keep in mind that a story isn't always told with 100% of the information front loaded. Just because it's not immediately there, spelled out, doesn't mean it doesn't exist within the character, or we've forgotten about it.
Xerath is more then just a " stereotypical evil-for-the-sake-of-evil character." We just don't have the whole story.
But that didn't stop so many people from jumping the gun a bit.
Earl Eulrich3 votesXerath is more then just a " stereotypical evil-for-the-sake-of-evil character." We just don't have the whole story.
But that didn't stop so many people from jumping the gun a bit.
Well...it´s impossible to stop sth. from happening when it already has been happened - so I´d rather call them out on what they´re doing asap before waiting for the promised day we get the "full story" cough And that lore-comic doesn´t look the slightest bit subjective, so why would anyone assume it would be written in Azirs favour/PoV? If they want to convey that they have to deliver it differently I´m afraid.
Helmight3 votesYep, I definitely replied a bit early. When it comes to champions I really like getting retcons, I usually go a bit ham on my initial thoughts :P.
Obviously there's more to Xerath and I'm glad RiotRunaan has said that he's not just plain evil. That's immensely heartening to hear. However, I am still concerned as to Riot's ability to actually write him convincingly, seeing as they've produced little in the way of actual content for a long while. Better than nothing, I guess.
It's also frustrating that we can't get a snapshot of the character anymore through their lore. Previously, you could at least understand a little bit about a champion through their lore and get a sense of why they act the way they do. Having to wait to get that information is a bit disappointing. I suppose we'll have to wait and see.
Khodexus2 votesExcept that the new story DOES say that he tricked Azir in order to do his ritual, which completely changes the context, no matter whose perspective you're looking at it through.
lightdragoon881 votesSo he tricks Azir to preform the ritual instead of doing it himself. And....?
Khodexus2 votesAnd that one simple phrase completely changes the context of Xerath's entire backstory and character. Before, he was some geeky mage who wanted to see if he could transcend into a being of pure magic and tragically lost everything he cared about in the process, becoming a monster. Now he's a manipulative backstabber who was always a monster.
It's completely different, and an enormous step backwards in terms of storytelling quality.
lightdragoon881 votesNo it doesn't.
Xerath is still the mage who wanted to surpass the limit of the mortal body, but he needed the Ascension ritual that only the Emperor can preform to do it. So he tricks Azir to do it.
Khodexus2 votesYeah, it really does. He was an innovator, in his original lore he INVENTED the ritual to ascend. In this he's just using some existing ritual, which completely removes the whole geeky experimenting-in-fields-never-before-tested aspect of his character. If he needed to trick Azir to ascend, then he's not the first person to pull it off, which makes him less unique. He didn't figure it out on his own, he just tricked someone else into doing something to grab power.
He no longer did it TO SEE IF HE COULD! Because he already knew it would work, which also means he already knew the consequences of the ritual, and thus can't be surprised and distraught over everything he 'loses' to make it a reality. Plus, I really don't see how his girlfriend can fit into the new lore, and that is such a tragic loss (in more ways than one).
lightdragoon881 votesYeah, it really does. He was an innovator, in his original lore he INVENTED the ritual to ascend.
Ok I am going to stop you right there. Xerath NEVER invented the ritual.
Khodexus2 votesOr you could hold a normal adult conversation and not be a ***...
The old lore doesn't say whether he invented the ritual he used or not. I even double checked, in case I misremembered. But I got the impression based on his lore and his judgment, that he was doing something no one had ever done before, and likely no one had done since. He was pushing the boundaries of magic, to become something greater, something that no one else had ever seen. So yes, it is highly implied that he invented most of the ritual he used to ascend, or at least perfected it/adapted it from whatever had already been invented. But it just seems more in character for him to have created it himself, not rely on the inventions of lesser mages.
Sneak Dog2 votesWeren't Nasus and Renekton and the whole rite of ascension legends more than known knowledge for Xerath and Azir in their time? This makes it entirely reasonable to think that Xerath had to first uncover how the rite even worked, doesn't it? Would hardly call it the work of lesser mages too, it is the rite of ascension, the most powerful magic they could probably imagine, it was Shurimas emergency plan.
However, it seems that Xerath wanted to become one with his beloved magic and Azir wanted to give Shurima every possible chance to improve and grow even more. The only issue was that Azir would probably never allow Xerath to undergo the rite, but probably wouldn't be able to start it without Xerath.
At least this event is better already than the Freljord. I think Xerath will be just fine character-wise, but I just hope he will be before or at the end of the Shurima event (unlike Trundle, whose new voice-over is nothing like old Trundle).
Khodexus2 votesIf it wasn't created by Xerath himself it was the work of 'lesser mages'. At least that's the way he thinks. I think Xerath already isn't 'just fine' character-wise. I just can't see how to reconcile the 'Xerath tricked Azir' version with the 'Tabia almost convinced him to stop' version, and of the two, I much prefer Tabia.
Sneak Dog1 votesHe isn't yet, but I think he will be once Riot releases his side of the story. I merely hope they'll do it during or at the end of the Shurima event instead of making us wait months if not more. They might pull another Freljord on us and just not follow through on their lore.
I'm not sure that's the way he thought pre-ascension. We're talking about a legendary ritual, probably the most powerful one they could imagine. The ritual probably wasn't even entirely clear. It's hard to think of the most powerful magic available as 'lesser'.
I do think the trickery part makes him mildly more evil than pre-retcon. However, this might a result of an ongoing squabble between Azir and Xerath that escalated. Xerath wanted to research more on the nature of magic, but all Azir cared about was how it would help Shurima. When Xerath discovered the ascension ritual, Azir probably wouldn't allow Xerath to undergo it even though he uncovered the entire ritual and it would fulfill his dream of becoming one with the magic.
I'm not sure why a human dilemma part would be left out in the final version (Tabia), I think the human elements in champions backgrounds are one of Riots strongest points in story-telling (at least were).
Khodexus1 votesWhatever the 'future' will bring, right now I'm feeling extremely disheartened by what they've done with the lore, not just of Xerath, but of Cassiopeia, Sivir, and Amumu too. I was excited for Azir when he was first anounced, for about 2 minutes, until I realized that he's not the minion-mancer they claim him to be, so even THAT feels like just another disappointment from Riot.
Sneak Dog1 votesImagine me. I've got this problem with Trundle, but I have (should have) the full new story that sets his character already. It just sets a new character instead of Trundle.I can't properly invest in this new lore because I can't trust Riot to not abuse my investment. At least there's hope for Xerath.
lightdragoon881 votesHow is what I say not what a normal adult conversation is like?
Anyway, you have an "impression" and "thought" but no actual fact.
Heck the fact that Tabia knew what Xerath was doing means that she also knew what the Ritual was, so it wasn't so original.
Khodexus2 votesAnd the fact that you have no more 'fact' to base your opinion on than mine does not give you the right to 'stop me right there'.
Or it could simply mean that she has eyes. She could see his magic tearing him apart. She'd known him a long time, probably better than anyone else, and she knew or at least strongly suspected what his goal was. Occam's razor here. The simplest explanation is that he is exactly what he seemed, someone who wanted to do things his own way, rather than follow in the footsteps of weaker foolish mages who came before, who could not 'understand' his vision.
lightdragoon881 votesMy fact is "the story is not over" and "he trick Azir instead of performing it himself"
Your "fact" is "He was a good guy who invented the ritual himself"
...I think my fact actually have proof while your is only opinion with nothing to back it up.
....I think we are done here. Nice adult talk.
Khodexus2 votesI agree with this. Old Xerath just wanted to see if he COULD become a being of ascended magic. He didn't know he was going to destroy stuff and kill his girlfriend in the process. New Xerath PLANNED to be a douche in order to do the ritual. He's completely different, and completely uninteresting compared to the old Xerath...
Sneak Dog9 votesFrom a man whose life got literally consumed by his obsession for magic to a villain who betrayed his emporer for his obsession of magic. Similar, but suddenly Xerath is only a villain, instead of also a man. This weakened his story.
Also, the whole city being swallowed by the desert seems a bit... underwhelming in this medium (edit: I mean it seems a sidepoint, it doesn't really convey very well).
SummonerRP3 votesFaker On (Epic) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MLFoxrnRJ6c
TerraRising7 votesObviously, it's a part of the whole puzzle, told through the point of view of someone loyal to Azir.
It could be that Xerath was, literally, the Jafar of the Shurima Empire... (The Ascension VO would suggest as much)
or, it could be that Xerath was trying to stop Azir from taking the Ascended's power for himself.
We won't know more until the rest is released, but at least it's SOMETHING from the Narrative team besides empty apologies and unwanted excuses.
Nahara6 votesI dunno about you all, but I kinda have more respect for 
now and am actually thinking about buying him because of this update.
I really like the idea that he was so heroic, he was unflinchingly willing to sacrifice himself to protect the world from Xerath's power; saving his people and eventually succumbing to madness while trying to contain Xerath feels like a greater tragedy than him eventually going mad because he dealt with a lot of evil people on a daily basis.
AnonTwo2 votesSo being a tragic hero isn't good enough without a generic heroic act?
He protected the gate's to his brother's library and went mad. The only thing he didn't do is sac a sarcophagus. He was even a protector in both stories.
Meep Man6 votesSo basically, you are telling me...
Azir is actually a good guy, just kinda greedy. He is actually not all that bad of a guy.
Nasus is Azir's servant hero type guy along with Renekton. He is, however, still sane since he was not trapped in a tomb for... a long time.
Renekton is actually a good guy gone mad, being extremely angry at Nasus for selfish reasons and insanity. He probably doesn't remember the part where he TOLD Nasus to seal him in with Xerath.
Xerath is a power happy priest that wants to behold the power of a god. He successfully did so, but was trapped in a sarcophagus, slightly weakening his power to moderate levels. He was then thrown into a tomb with Renekton where probably horrific events occurred for an EXTREMELY long time.
Reminds me of The Road to El Dorado.
Electro5222 votes
Renekton, in his original lore, was a good guy, not "actually". He was a gatekeeper for a Library that Nasus taught at. Every time someone came along with evil intentions, Renekton would sense it, and send them on their merry way. Over time, those evil intentions got to him, and he went insane.
I'm pretty sure, though, that his lore will be changed as well, because in this, Renekton is still sane when he drags Xerath into the tomb.
Decrit3 votesMaaaybe he went insane due to the powerful xerath influence and all the time he was sealed? I mean, it is a way more plausible way than the orignal, where the influence of evil he gets is weirdly explained for what happens to him ( without any else noticing ).
Yup, i really dig this new Renek lore: has more sense while keeping the same profile, and also has a more heroic/deep/badass background
TrueWest6 votesPlease, let's not take something and extrapolate it to the point that we don't like; solely to continue a hate train. Wait until something is finished before judging it.
Xenohaz4 votesIf they didn't want us to judge it, they wouldn't have released it unfinished.
SecretAgentHulk2 votesIt's called a teaser. Throwing a bone to the people complaining about how the lore team has been silent so long and has only broken that silence to remove lore.
AnonTwo2 votesI think people are tired of "teasers" and just want the story already.
There's no confidence in the lore after the freljord event, a collection of teasers that also didn't go anywhere.
SecretAgentHulk2 votesI guess there is no pleasing the community at large. Although I was not around yet when the Freljord happened.
Donovan Du Bois5 votesHere are more lore changes for the next patch from the PBE.
"Amumu Amumu is a diminutive, animated cadaver who wanders the world, trying to discover his true identity. He rose from an ancient Shuriman tomb bound in corpse wrappings with no knowledge of his past, consumed with an uncontrollable sadness.
Ezreal The intrepid young adventurer Ezreal has explored some of the most remote and abandoned locations on Runeterra. During an expedition to the buried ruins of ancient Shurima, he recovered an amulet of incredible mystical power. Likely constructed to be worn by one of the Ascended, the enormous talisman nonetheless fit snugly upon his arm, amplifying his raw sorcerous skill to such an extent that he's gained the reputation of a hero, much to his embarrassment.
Cassiopeia Cassiopeia is a terrifying creature - half woman, half snake - whose slightest glance brings death. The youngest daughter of one of Noxus' most influential families, she was once a beautiful and cunning temptress capable of manipulating the hardest heart. Transformed by the venom of an ancient Shuriman tomb guardian, she continues to serve Noxian interests as she always has, just in a more... visceral way.
Nasus To some, Nasus is a demigod who walks among the ruins of an ancient civilization; to others, he is nothing more than a myth. Legend speaks of his dominion over death and time. Millennia ago, he stood at the apex of Shuriman society as curator and guardian. He now roams the arid wastes, seeking to release his brother Renekton from the grip of madness.
Rammus The mysteries that surround Rammus are numerous. How did a simple creature of the desert suddenly become able to reason? How did he craft his vaunted suit of armor? What is he searching for as he crosses the Shuriman desert? One thing is for certain: trying to stop the inexorable Rammus is a fool's mission.
Renekton Renekton was once a staunch gatekeeper of ancient Shurima, but in the centuries since the fall of that once-glorious empire, he has been consumed by madness. Now, he is little more than a rage-fueled beast who seeks to kill his brother Nasus, who he believes is to blame for his current state of mind.
Sivir Known as the Battle Mistress, Sivir is a mercenary with a ruthless reputation. Combining unflinching bravery with endless ambition, she has garnered great fame and fortune. Faced with the revelation of her mysterious heritage, Sivir must weigh her desire to continue on her own path, or accept the burden of a greater legacy.
Skarner Skarner, the crystalline guardian, defends the entrance to a realm deep beneath the Shuriman wastes. The few who survive trespassing his domain describe a creature of terrifying intelligence, anger, and precision. What this merciless creature protects, no one knows.
Xerath Powerful beyond reckoning, the ascended being known as Xerath was once a mortal of flesh and blood. He is now something vastly different - a being of writhing arcane energy. Having emerged from millennia-spanning imprisonment, he is now ready to unleash his power upon Runeterra, and utterly destroy any who oppose him."
These are not even full paragraphs! This is not even a joke, this is horrible and I am appalled that they think this is good enough.
MrBuffington5 votesI don't have an actual quote, but I read that these blurbs are supposed to just be what is seen in game; very short summaries meant to give players a sense of a character in a short amount of time. They will have more complete lore on the website/character pages and probably in the client (just not in game).
SecretAgentHulk3 votesThat is not the full lore; Riot has stated that it is placeholder or will link to a larger description of these champions' lore. (I don't know how it all works exactly, not least because I don't know where in the PBE this came from.) It's also kinda silly to think this is all there is when not only do these new pictures explicitly add more to Xerath's story than this paragraph, but also imply a lot about Nasus and Renekton when taken with their pre-Azir lore.
sp4413 votesYeah, I can see how you're using your freedom there. Lowering a character who fell folly to his own relentless pursuit of knowledge to Jaffar.
Clearly, this could only have happened if the IoW was completely retconned from the story altogether.
SecretAgentHulk1 votesEarlier today, in this thread: http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/miscellaneous/9xU70QEs-xerath-lore-update?comment=000300000000
RIGed2 votesstill doesnt explain why they had to remove the IoW or summoners
Mjolnir8022 votesWithout the IoW and Summoners, Renekton and Nasus are now free to duke it out on their own terms and when they see fit. Not forced to fight eachother under the pretense of the League of Legends and the watchful control of the Summoners. Two ageless demigods roaming the deserts with the sole purpose of fighting each other seems much more fulfilling than the same two ageless demigods being called upon by mortal mages to fight for their entertainment.
RIGed3 votesExcept its not for entertainment (according to lore, cuz the game is friggin great) its for settling political disputes between countries without war, think Achilles at the beginning of Troy. Which actually makes more sense now according to the new lore. Before Renekton was a crazy power hungry butcher and Nasus needed to kill him to protect his home world. Now Renekton just wants to kill Nasus because he went crazy after being imprisoned, whereas I'd think Nasus would only want to fight his brother to subdue him and try to reason with him. And given the power and influence of the IoW and Summoners they could help accomplish this
Mjolnir8021 votesMy main issue is that this political entity is somehow strong enough that they can control these demigods. If they have that sort of power, they should be able to stop any sort of faction conflict with little effort. Its this line of either the IoW and the summoners are too strong and stifle anything from ever occuring, or they are not strong enough to control all of these beasts, mages, and warriors that make up the League, at which point they are just a meaningless formality and an awkward plot mechanism.
In the grander scheme, I think it would be better if the many conflicts of Runeterra could occur on their own, in a more organic setting and with a more natural progression; not manipulated by the hands of a bunch of political puppet masters in an artificial environment.
AnonTwo2 votesThe problem is that despite IoW's overarching influence and power...it still allowed for these kinds of stories to happen! It's not like they can be everywhere at once...
The things that have happened during the IoW era: Wars between Noxus and Ionia (which also happened under their intervention, of course) A war between J4 and Swain over crystal scar Karthus re-dying (and having to be revived) during a skirmish between Kassadin and Malzahar
Champions can skirmish and fight outside the league. They can make changes outside it's influence. It's more that Riot doesn't want to do that.
And at the end of the day, is any of this more awkward than a story for a game that really has no attachment to the game itself? It's like a fan fiction at this point being written outside the context of the game.
There isn't a game in the world that exists with lore like this
Even fan mashups have lore written into the game. Typically another game, but still written into the game.
Earl Eulrich1 voteswould give you a thousand upvotes, unfortunately the boards still don´t work for non-NA users :/
But yea, there´s just nothing that couldn´t have happened with the IoW in place. There´s no single damn reason to seperate the game from its world, there´s no profit to be gained by doin that - but all immersion gets lost.
Khodexus2 votesThe one thing that couldn't have happened with the IoW in place was the total annihilation of Runeterra.
Eliminating the IoW might as well be the annihilation of Runeterra from a story perspective, it seems.
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