[IMPORTANT] Riot Games Needs to Stop Permabanning Players For Being Toxic

King Moka IV··3 votes·2,587 views

Riot Games should not be banning players for being toxic - instead encourage the use of the mute button rather than punish players. I have some friends that will occasionally get fed up with players who are feeding and trash talk them. They have been playing League of Legends for 5 years and they get permabanned. League of Legends is banning valuable players who have invested tons of money and hours of their lives into their game, just because they talk shit in a video game. Like Dunkey said, "what's the fun in the video game if I can't talk shit".

On the other hand, intentional feeders who stay quiet in the chat are getting off scott-free and continue to ruin games for others. You can always mute a toxic player, but you more often than not, you cannot stop a troll from feeding if he's set on it.

I myself, got permabanned last night. I'll admit it, I get heated when I have incompetent players on my team, and I'm sure everyone does. It's just that some people decide to speak up and some people decide to stay quiet. But this isn't the first time I've been permabanned. I was permabanned 4 years ago, and I find it astonishing that the ban is for my entire life instead of extending it for a year or two years. Don't you think most people's behaviour would be changed by that (let alone all those people who will set the game aside after a year of inactivity). Unfortunately for me, I came back to realize that this was the exact same game I loved and hated so deeply. The gameplay and creativity gone into the game are incredible - really has potential to ruin someones life because of how fun it is. On the other hand, the riot games community has done so little for the actual players, and instead try to reward and benefit only competitive players. This needs to change. I spent over a thousand dollars on my account that was banned four years ago. I thought about all the time and money I'd wasted on League of Legends just to lose all of it because a singed on my team decided to intentionally feed for 20 minutes.

Just my two cents.

TL;DR: Riot should encourage the use of the mute button and stop permabanning valued players who have invested time and money into the game - instead, focus on dealing with trolls and feeders.

Edit: Yeah I know, controversial. Understand that flamers who say things like: "I hope you die of cancer" and constantly flame are not people I'm talking about. I'm speaking on behalf of the players who are frusterated in some of their games in which they have a troll or a player sabotaging the team.

50 Comments

Kei14311 votes

oh .. so spending money allows you to be toxic to the non-toxics who've also spent money?

I think it's wise for them to protect the one that are paying AND not causing trouble instead of the small population that may pay money and are toxic.

King Moka IV1 votes

I never said it was ONLY the people that were paying for the game. My post is directed to all players.

Kei1431 votes

so how is it fair that toxics can ruin our game experience? paying or not, its not right to do so.

Arakial5 votes

Use the "Mute" button, I dont get it... Every post i see about this topic... ALWAYS... There is someone saying" No you are wrong im a perfect person and i dont like harsh words" "stop flaming and ruining my game" ... typical riot brainwashing if you ask me. Dont want flame? Mute the person.. Or maybe think about why you are being flamed. Are you playing a champion for the first time in ranked? Are you playing something way off meta and refusing to coordinate with your team? Or maybe you are just having a bad game? sure everyone has a bad game.. someone flames? MUTE them... the tribunal is a joke honestly. it should be there for INT feeders and cheaters, NOT someone flaming in chat. If you want the tribunal for chat punishments and permabans for chat use.. then you need to remove the MUTE button as it is useless.. all it does is shield a player until the game is over.. Riot acts like they are going to lose a massive player base because of toxicity .. they are wrong.. they lose players due to perm bans from chat use. Knock it off direct your time spent to the INT feeders and people that are actualy ruining the game.. not someone that has tried to communicate what is wrong in the current game to the player doing poorly and getting no response or " dont tell me how to play" and then an arguement starts. there are players out there that will agg a person on just to get that juicy report after the game. It's just silly. Toxicity isnt the problem Poor play is and int feeders are. QUIT BANNING PLAYERS FOR GETTING UPSET AND TALKING IN GAME.

MoistThickness2 votes

Perfectly said.

Deep Terror Nami7 votes

No amount of time or money spent makes it ok for you to be toxic. Muting is not an excuse either, as by the time someone is forced to mute you, you've already become a problem. Muting is to prevent further chat issues in the current match, and being punished for it is to keep you from doing it in the future.

Riot used to not ban for chat offenses; they would simply give you another chat restriction, and they would endlessly stack. This, however, was not conducive to reforming players and many would just stack up hundreds or even thousands of chat restrictions and continue being a problem because they didn't care.

If you think permabans are so harsh, wouldn't one think you'd improve your behavior before you got escalated to it? Couldn't be too bad if you ignored the threat of it.

King Moka IV1 votes

It's only understandable to be upset if your team was cheated of a victory, which you spent 20-60 minutes of your time trying to win: in which case, one of the players on your team is intentionally feeding or trolling. It's NOT understandable if there is a player on your team screaming: "I hope you die of cancer" every 5 seconds. Those players deserve permabans - but we need to draw the line. Not all players who are toxic should be thrown in the same pile.

Deep Terror Nami5 votes

Not all players who are toxic should be thrown in the same pile.

And they aren't. It takes a lot to actually ever get punished. You must be consistently toxic to ever get punished just once for minor offenses, and you have to work through multiple tiers of punishment to even get banned for it. Severe offenses can skip past the tiers to a ban immediately.

http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/Boqd81O0-upcoming-upgrades-to-chat-restrictions

King Moka IV2 votes

14 Day Ban to Lifetime Ban is quite a big change. What if 14 day ban went to a 30 day ban, to a 6 month long ban. For some people, it takes longer to change - I spent 5 years of my life playing this game every single day, without a social life. Yep, I was addicted. To have something I loved so much taken away from me really bothers me. Should I have been more cautious after the first couple warnings? Absolutely. But what about the time I lost ranking my account up? The skins, the champions - all of which I earned. I'd understand if I fed intentionally and flamed for absolutely no reason, but either way, 14 day-ban to life ban is ridiculous.

AeroWaffle2 votes

I believe they had some ban steps after the 14 day at some point.

They found that any player that continued the behave poorly after the 14-day ban was unlikely to stop.

King Moka IV1 votes

[deleted]

AeroWaffle2 votes

I don't have, apologies. They changed to the ban ladder system a long long time ago and I only remember from a single post from Lyte when he was explaining the ban change. Consider the statement without proof since I'm far too lazy to search for it.

HexaDecimel3 votes

you are correct, they found that the vast majority of players that didn't try to improve their behavior after a 14 day ban were unlikely to in the future.

They even had a challenge to earn accounts back for players that had their accounts perma banned. Players had to rank up an account to level 20 without receiving a punishment. Out of everyone that entered the challenge to earn their accounts back, only like 1 or 2 players actually managed it.

So Riot basically decided on the current system, it wasn't worth the hassle of dealing with players that were likely never to change. And players that genuinely do change will just start a new account.

Limmie1 votes

If you didn't stop being toxic after getting banned for 14 days, you're not gonna stop being toxic ever. You're just not the kind of person able to grasp the concepts of self control and social awareness. They might as well permaban you after that and save everyone (you included) the hassle.

Hryna6 votes

It's not controversial. The community doesn't want you to be here.

Bídoof4 votes

"Sense I don't tell people to kill themselves, I should not be perma banned for endlessly harrassing all of my teammates"

King Moka IV1 votes

That's pretty much what I'm saying. Good job! You just regurgitated what I wrote into a poorly formed sentence.

S0kaX3 votes

How about people not flaming?

King Moka IV1 votes

It's easy to ignore flaming. They are just giving their criticism, some harsher than others. It's not fair to have your account locked forever because of something you said and is easily avoidable with the mute button.

How about the feeders and trolls that haven't even gotten banned once because they don't speak in chat? Ruining games for everyone and it CAN'T be avoided.

S0kaX1 votes

Some people may have a bad game while you think they are trolling and maybe you don't know they got banned because you weren't the last that reported them. Also criticism is a thing, flaming is another. Learn the difference

King Moka IV1 votes

Implementing a permanent chat restriction into the game instead of a permanent ban allows the player to still play the game he/she loves, without putting players in a bad mindset or tilting teammates with what he/she says. Flamers and people who speak up about allies bad plays are still valued league of legends players, and permanent chat restriction ensures that there is no more toxicity.

People who get upset from people that talk shit in a video game was simply weak minded lol. It's another story if the person intentionally feeds and sabotages you.

S0kaX5 votes

RITO did this thing a long time ago and about 90% of the people perma chat banned started to troll because they couldn't flame.

King Moka IV1 votes

Okay? So then ban them. I've been fighting for TROLLS to get banned. I'm talking about the ones who will cease to flame because they can't, so they will continue playing without sabotaging teammates.

AeroWaffle3 votes

Why give them that chance?

If they've already shown to be incapable of controlling themselves, it's already likely that they'll troll once they're chat banned.

Detecting and catching trolling is infinitely more difficult, especially if they're trying to avoid detection.

Not only would they still show poor behavior, but it becomes harder to remove them with proof.

DrCyanide3 votes

Which is easier for a computer to detect, inappropriate language or inappropriate actions? Language, by far, so Riot's first pass at an automated player behavior system uses that. It's Behavior counterpart lags behind it by quite a bit, but you still see people come to these boards banned by it from time to time.

It's easy to not flame in chat. It's so incredibly easy to avoid ever getting a chat restriction (let alone a permaban), it's not even funny. You can even give criticism and feedback freely, you just have to be mature about how you do it.

King Moka IV2 votes

I actually agree with a lot of the points you brought up. My concern is with the idea of permanently banning a player. Wouldn't it be better to test the player with a year long ban, two year long ban, etc. After another long ban, they will eventually learn. But after a 300 year long ban? Where is the learning curve if 14 day ban isn't enough. It's very obvious to me that this is not a popular matter - or a topic in which people can speak freely on without getting bashed, but I'm sure people that have been permabanned before: with an account they have spent years of their time and (perhaps) thousands of dollars on, will understand where I'm coming from.

Hambone20134 votes

They are given 4 chances to reform. If those are ignored too bad

DrCyanide3 votes

From what I've observed, the general problem with the punishment system is that people don't take it seriously enough when the warnings start to come in.

Tell me if this sounds familiar, either for your case or your friends:

  • People think that the 10 game chat restriction was a mistake
  • They then think the 25 game chat restriction was a joke/whatever punishment, and that they're still fine.
  • They get the wake up call with the 2-week ban, and try to change
  • Despite making steps to improve after the 2-week ban, they still fall into old habits at one point or another and get permabanned

I think if the 10 and 25 game chat restrictions were taken more seriously (perhaps a warning that "the behavior that lead to this punishment will get you permabanned if continued"), they'd start reforming earlier and be able to avoid the permaban.

BladeSteel1 votes

"GET OUT OF MY LANE YOU USELESS SUPPORT" when the adc is 0-4 because they're diving into the enemy team isn't giving criticism, its toxicity.... "IM BETTER THAN YOU" when someone is 1-10-0 and flaming their team because they aren't "helping" them dive into the enemy team 1v5 isn't criticism. And I have gotten feeders and trolls banned. Reported them, got the message saying someone had been punished, and looked at their match history. After I got that message that account was never played on that account again...ever...to this day. Stop spreading lies kid.

Limmie1 votes

[{quoted}](name=King Moka IV,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=wmqXwmbQ,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2016-11-01T20:26:34.846+0000)

How about the feeders and trolls that haven't even gotten banned once because they don't speak in chat? Ruining games for everyone and it CAN'T be avoided.

That's a false dichotomy. That's like saying you shouldn't be arrested for robbery because there are people that managed to get away with embezzlement.

Flaherty3 votes

Riot does eventually ban those players though. And what's more important is that being toxic to a player, even if he deserves it, creates an atmosphere in the game that negatively affects every other player and adds to their own frustrations and potentially makes them toxic as well. If someone has a contagious disease a doctor doesn't just leave it there untreated and says that everyone should just avoid you, they try to kill the disease which is what Riot does by punishing players. Yes muting players is the right decision but unless someone mutes every player immediately as the game starts they will always get at least a small dose of that toxicity and that still builds up. The solution is, and should be, cut out the disease and remove it from the community. If you can't learn to change your unacceptable behavior after being permanently banned once, and banned enough on a second account enough times to be permanently banned again you do not deserve to play this game and you deserve to lose all the money you spent on it.

Colgate Gator3 votes

Hahahahano.

Joseph Gladstone2 votes

lol

Big Lincoln2 votes

difference between banter and being a dickhead

your friends were being dickheads, so they get b&

xkillertenzo2 votes

Why if you talk crap then you deserve the ban hammer to the face

P00tality2 votes

The problem with bans is it goes based off number of reports, I got a 14 day ban cuz told team in select I was muting them to protect my self from raging out, they reported me sending me into threshold of ban status.

Deep Terror Nami2 votes

Reports flag matches for review and trigger a review when you have received too many in too few games. If you did not do anything wrong then the report will be thrown out. You are not punished based on report volume, but on your behavior in the reported matches.

If you believe your punishment to be an error then I recommend posting the chat logs you received. We would be happy to look over them and help determine what negative behavior may have resulted in the punishment. If the punishment was an error then you can submit a ticket for a manual review to have it removed.

Also, if you received a 14 day ban this would've come after multiple prior punishments or the offenses were severe enough to warrant the escalation. There are 4 tiers of punishment to go through, with a 14 day ban being the third.

P00tality1 votes

Where would I submit those to? As definitely feel was a bit harsh based on the chat logs given from the ban

Deep Terror Nami1 votes

https://support.riotgames.com/hc/en-us/requests/new

You can always find it by clicking "Support" on the top of this page, logging into the support site, then selecting "Submit a Request".

Limmie1 votes

Reviews are triggered based off the number of reported games, not off the number of reports. Being reported 9x on the same game means you only got reported on 1 game, and is the same as if you were reported only 1 time that game.

Verxint1 votes

I talk shit all the time, I've never been banned.

Though it does help to spend 5 seconds thinking of something creative instead of just making some fetid mixture of "cancer" "noob" "retard" "boosted" "kys" "bronze" "trash". Really, I think that counts for a lot in both not getting banned and making it clear that while you're being a dick, you're not actually trying to hurt anyone's feelings.

Ruin Lance1 votes

"riot games needs to stop permabanning players for ruining the experience of others"

scazzman1 votes

i honestly feel like the strike system just encourages people to be toxic without typing

midnight oil241 votes

So if someone is having a bad game I have the right to be a jerk? Also, by your logic you could go into an amusement park, spend $500 on tickets, and then punch people and they wouldn't be able to remove you because of how much you paid. They would have to tell people to ignore the person punching them in the face.

Arakial1 votes

Why are you comparing in game flame and someone being frusterated in a game to a real life case? LMAO jesus there are some really soft people out there.

Warwick the OP1 votes

[{quoted}](name=midnight oil24,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=wmqXwmbQ,comment-id=0010,timestamp=2016-11-02T19:15:38.199+0000)

So if someone is having a bad game I have the right to be a jerk? Also, by your logic you could go into an amusement park, spend $500 on tickets, and then punch people and they wouldn't be able to remove you because of how much you paid. They would have to tell people to ignore the person punching them in the face.

yes you do. you should make them feel bad for wasting your time, god this community is full of pussies. its his fault for feeding and for that he should be flamed and be made to regret his lack of skill. Sometimes I have bad games and I get flamed, and I know I deserve it because im not doing good, so does everyone who feeds.

Corsair00011 votes

So after reading this and other threads as well as being on both side of these experiences I believe I may have a realistic solution. Have an option, default pg rated and a second R18 with unrestricted chat.

Toxic chat on pg would follow current rules etc but r18 for those that prefer.

What do you think?

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