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Valendrome··3 votes·3,206 views

Right, so, I'll get straight to the point.

The way that Riot handles a fair bit of these bans is pretty shitty. They aren't really banning the right people sometimes. I'm not here to say I'm a perfect person or anything, but I'm not the type of guy that's going to give someone shit unless they deserve it. I'll be toxic towards others who are being toxic. The only times I ever get mad at people are when they're trolling, being toxic, or when I asked them not to do x thing and they continually do it and end up not helping the team in any way. I do not yell at every player. In my last match, I was mad at 2 of my teammates. I had 2 other teammates that were doing just as bad, but I did not say things to them. Why? Because they weren't toxic and talking shit. I got mad at the people who were, and yet I'm the one who gets a ban? For what? I'm not the one even starting these flame wars. I don't care to report the people who are starting shit since I'm just not going to let affect me after the match, but I get reported by tons of butthurt trolls and now I've been perma banned because of it.

I believe in my 14 day ban email (I am now perma banned) there was a quote saying that people from both parties would be punished equally. Now, in the match that I was reported for, I actually did report the other party in the argument. One of the few times in which I do so. Turns out he never even got a 1 day ban since I checked him up on some league stat site (Can't recall which one) and saw him playing the next day. So the fact that Riot lies about how they handle cases, and how they don't look at both sides of the case just shows me that they don't know what they're doing.

This isn't really a post to get me unbanned. I should not have been banned in the first place, but whatever.

Thoughts would be appreciated.

51 Comments

Hellioning2 votes

Maybe it was their first offense, and they just got chat restrictions?

And people don't get punished for one game. Maybe they were just really bad that game and weren't toxic the other games.

Regardless, just because someone is being shitty to you doesn't mean you need to be shitty back. That just makes things worse for the other three people on your team, or the other 8 people in the game if you're doing it in all chat.

Valendrome1 votes

Punishment needs to be consistent for both parties when they have the same offense. They need to take what people say seriously. They don't look at both sides of an argument.

The Ashe and Teemo in my match would both have agreed with me. I was toxic to neither of them during the match. Only the Rengar and Yasuo (mostly Yasuo). It mostly took place in team chat.

Hellioning2 votes

If Person A has clearly demonstrated that they're toxic over many games, and Person B is a first offender, to treat both of them the same way is completely unfair to one of them. Either Person A gets a slap on the wrist, or Person B gets overly punished.

And whether or not you were toxic to them, specifically, it still filled the team chat with whatever toxicity was occuring. If you had just ignored them, there would have been a lot less yelling, maybe even none.

Valendrome1 votes

There's still a difference in being toxic to random people and being toxic to those being toxic. I'm not necessarily saying that it's right, but if you're going to say that to treat them both the same is completely unfair, then wouldn't that be the case with this too?

Yeah, maybe. Something I need to work on probably, but I hope you can still see why it is that I get upset back.

Hellioning2 votes

Honestly, there's not as much difference as you'd think. Being toxic back doesn't hurt them in any way. Someone's who's angry and raging already won't be affected much by someone making them angrier, and in the mean time, you're just making things worse for the other 3/8 people in the game.

No one's saying you can't be upset; I get upset at toxic people too. But try to avoid being toxic back; just mute them, report them after the game, and don't validate their toxicity. If you have to rage, rage at your monitor, not your teammates.

Valendrome1 votes

Well usually it starts off with me explaining why what they said is incorrect using facts about what just happened or whatever, and then they just say I'm wrong and give me more shit for it. Brushing it off with these people isn't going to make them change. Banning may not do the trick either, so I try doing something about it.

Whatever, still don't think I should be the one stuck with the perma ban at the end of the day, but I guess I just have to live with that. I'll try muting them.

Thanks for the thoughts.

Hellioning1 votes

Never, ever try to explain to people that are raging. If they're at that stage, they don't care about logic or reason.

It doesn't matter if they change or not. Unless you're in their premade, you'll probably never see them again. Don't worry about strangers.

Valendrome1 votes

Nah, I pretty much just soloq which is why I end up in a lot of scenarios with toxic players.

Hellioning1 votes

Then there's no need to try and improve someone's skills unless they ask for assistance.

Valendrome1 votes

Not about their play, just them as an individual so that they wouldn't have to be toxic.

Hellioning2 votes

That's even less likely. No one likes strangers to tell them how to live their lives.

Yes, the irony is not lost on me.

nerak231 votes

The thing is you can't fight shit with shit ! I could quote you and say w/e and I could dispute things you say in your OS, But the fact is: Be the bigger person and try to be decent.

14 day ban is one off a perma so please don't come on saying that you did Nothing wrong, You did something against the TOS many times and did so in a fashion that people turned you in.

I say something to every nasty person in game and Yet I never receive even so much as a warning, So everyone can stand up to the bullies you just can't be an ASS...Put up Chat Logs please.

Valendrome1 votes

I'm actually perma banned now. Also, I never said I never did anything wrong. I told you I wasn't perfect. I call people dumbasses, and argue with them. However, I only do that after they're toxic or start to flame. It's not easy for everyone to just ignore it.

Is that really something to ban me over though? If you don't want to have this kind of toxicity in the game, don't ban me. Ban the people who are starting it with others. As far as being nice goes, I'm up there, but obviously that doesn't mean a whole lot on here.

Oh, and the only people that I've actually been reported by were the flamers/people being toxic. I can guarantee you the other 2 people in my match that happened 20 minutes ago did not report me. It was either one of the people I told off. I have a good habit of pissing toxic players off.

If you can tell me how to get the chat logs of both other players from the match, I will gladly post the entire conversation. Both sides included. Also, the Ashe gave up halfway through the match and just simply afk'd. I didn't even get mad at her because she wasn't an asshole.

Also, don't you think that they should be receiving the same punishment for doing the same thing as me, but also starting it? (Not trying to do the blame game).

EvilDustMan1 votes

{quoted}

I'm actually perma banned now. Also, I never said I never did anything wrong. I told you I wasn't perfect. I call people dumbasses, and argue with them. However, I only do that after they're toxic or start to flame. It's not easy for everyone to just ignore it.

Is that really something to ban me over though? If you don't want to have this kind of toxicity in the game, don't ban me. Ban the people who are starting it with others. As far as being nice goes, I'm up there, but obviously that doesn't mean a whole lot on here.

Oh, and the only people that I've actually been reported by were the flamers/people being toxic. I can guarantee you the other 2 people in my match that happened 20 minutes ago did not report me. It was either one of the people I told off. I have a good habit of pissing toxic players off.

If you can tell me how to get the chat logs of both other players from the match, I will gladly post the entire conversation. Both sides included. Also, the Ashe gave up halfway through the match and just simply afk'd. I didn't even get mad at her because she wasn't an asshole.

You have the incorrect assumption most people do. That if you get a punishment, the other person doesn't.

Often, both people get punishments. If you failed to report them, they'll probably get reported by someone else, and the system will spit them out eventually.

Valendrome1 votes

Umm? I told you I looked them up. This was well into my ban too. I can provide you proof of this if you want it.

I'm 100% sure that I did report them after the match.

Edit: Just looked him up again to make sure. I can confirm that he has been playing the entire time of my ban.

EvilDustMan1 votes

{quoted}

Umm? I told you I looked them up. This was well into my ban too. I can provide you proof of this if you want it.

I'm 100% sure that I did report them after the match.

Edit: Just looked him up again to make sure. I can confirm that he has been playing the entire time of my ban.

It also may be their first punishment. You just don't know. It's not your business. You are supposed to keep control of YOUR behavior.

Valendrome1 votes

Level of punishment should not have anything to do with this. The actions were the same, so the punishment itself should be the same for both players. It was not in this case. That is one reason why I say that Riot doesn't seem to take this seriously.

EvilDustMan1 votes

{quoted}

Level of punishment should not have anything to do with this. The actions were the same, so the punishment itself should be the same for both players. It was not in this case. That is one reason why I say that Riot doesn't seem to take this seriously.

That's not how the system works. It goes 10 game chat restriction, then 25. Then 14 day ban, then permanent ban. If you are particularly toxic, you can skip stages. So they could be on a chat restriction stage. The earlier stages are there as warnings that your behavior is unacceptable.

Valendrome1 votes

I know. I'm saying that's how it needs to work. Level of punishment shouldn't have to do with a first time offense.

The logic you're using is that if I kill one person, I get a warning, but if I kill a second person, I get 14 years in jail. That's not how it works. If you kill one person, you go to jail.

EvilDustMan1 votes

{quoted}

I know. I'm saying that's how it needs to work. Level of punishment shouldn't have to do with a first time offense.

The logic you're using is that if I kill one person, I get a warning, but if I kill a second person, I get 14 years in jail. That's not how it works. If you kill one person, you go to jail.

Right, but if you make a traffic infraction, you get a fine, and if you get multiple traffic infractions in a short period, you get your driver's license taken away because you are obviously not showing respect for the rules.

Valendrome1 votes

Yes, and for each traffic violation after that you also get a fine. You see how it's consistent? We're not talking about the ban after the 3rd or 4th violation. We're talking about how it needs to be consistent for both parties for the same offense.

LaoBushido1 votes

After reading all your reaponces ,You seem to be making the assumption the other party continued this type of behavior after your game with them. You have said you have done bad thing as such your punishment was in order, but you have no evidence that the other party is still doing the toxic behavior.

Valendrome1 votes

Well of course they did. It's reasonable to assume that this is the case when they're the ones who are toxic and start shit with other players. They don't care about the team. The Yasuo complained after every death and gave us shit for trying to help. Are you going to say that he doesn't do that in his other matches? No one gave him any shit before this, he started it on his own.

The person I got the 14 day ban from (He was another Yasuo) had also started giving me shit for something that was out of my control. I respond back and an argument ensues. He should had received the same punishment as I as we said similar things and he had instigated the problem in the first place. If I could show you his chat logs from that match (I have mine from the match) then I would show you, but I don't know how to get logs of his chat.

Lew1 votes

{quoted}

Umm? I told you I looked them up. This was well into my ban too. I can provide you proof of this if you want it.

I'm 100% sure that I did report them after the match.

Punishments are usually issued in an escalating path

10 restrictions 25 restrictions 2 week ban Permaban

It could be the other players were lower on the punishment system and is why they didn't get a ban at this time or it could also be the system is still building a case and in the future they will be banned.

Valendrome1 votes

Read what I posted above this.

Kei1431 votes

if you've been toxic more frequently than then, you'll get banned first, as more games play = more reports against you, assuming you were at the same level of toxicity.

Of course it'll depend if you and them are on the same punishment tier:

  1. 10 game chat ban
  2. 25 game chat ban
  3. 14-day ban
  4. permaban

If they've only been 10 game chat restrict, their next punishment is 25 game chat restrict.

you've been 14-day banned before, so your next punishment would have been a permaban. Btw, only takes 1-2 games of being reported to activate the punishment, as opposed to 10 games (for example, I don't really know the exact number) when you are at the lower punishment tiers.

All this is assuming you are at the same level of toxicity, and if you have been reported by the people of the same report weight rating.

You just don't have enough information to say that they weren't punished.

Valendrome1 votes

Maybe they did in fact receive a chat restriction. However, since they were the ones who started flaming, it would be safe to assume that this is how they normally act. I did not go out of my way to start slandering people first. Since we know that this is how they normally act, they should be receiving the same punishment for the same offense. If they're the ones that go out of their way to start shit, they should be receiving even more of a penalty than me regardless of whether or not it even was their first punishment.

I'd say at least 95% of the people who reported me were toxic players who wanted to start shit, lol.

Kei1431 votes

again, you don't have enough information that they continued with that behavior, you don't know how often they play.

btw, if i see someone starting a flame war, and another person (you in this circumstance) continuing the flame war, I'll report both of you. So your 95% reported by "trolls" assumption isn't correct either. Just a note for you, there are alot more people like me around.

Valendrome1 votes

You can check how often they play on certain sites. If they're the ones who are wanting to start things, then yes, they did continue that behavior. I continued my behavior on being an asshole back to those who are that way to others.

No, my 95% statistic is probably pretty accurate. Whenever I end up with the report message, the flamer usually will tell others to report me and will say it in all chat/after the match. And if what you said is the case, then from what I've seen you're one of the few people who do that. You have as much to go on with that as I. We do not meet the same people.

nerak231 votes

If you can tell me how to get the chat logs of both other players from the match, I will gladly post the entire conversation

If you are now perma banned then you can get your chat logs from the e-mail that you received. Post them as soon as you find them or ask Riot to since you are on here.

Valendrome1 votes

This only shows MY chat. I want to show you the chat logs of both the Rengar and Yasuo as well.

nerak231 votes

I'll be toxic

Your quote....nothing else has to be said !!

Valendrome1 votes

Toxic to individuals who have no regard for how they act towards other players. Do you have a problem with that? Why should I show respect to someone who doesn't show respect to others in the first place, Nerak.

DexterousGecko1 votes

why do people think that retaliation is an appropriate way to handle toxicity? This isn't the old testament with an eye for an eye. Regardless of how someone treats you, you are still responsible for how you treat them.

Valendrome1 votes

People are different. In my opinion people are never going to stop being an asshole unless they realize how they're acting. If you just brush it off, they're never going to change.

Also, if you believe this to be the case, why was he not banned along with me?

DexterousGecko1 votes

Again, all you're concerned about is his behavior, not your own. Show us the entire chat logs where he was just as toxic as you? Maybe he had one bad game and usually he's very well behaved.

About assholes needing someone to be an asshole to them, no. That's not how behavior modification works. Yes, they need to realize that the words they're saying affect others, but using the exact same language to them will only reinforce the way they act, not make them rethink how they speak.

Valendrome1 votes

If no one is an asshole, then I have absolutely no issues with playing together as a team and talking. I'm not saying it's necessarily right, but it is different because I'm not the one that ends up picking these fights with other people. I'm hoping you can understand that.

I asked my Rengar to come gank and he sat there, so I said this in all chat "What the fuck was my Rengar doing?". The Yasuo was up against a Fiona on mid, and he went 1-3 and complained each time he died. On his 4th death, Rengar and I were on our way to gank, and he starts giving us shit and told us not to gank so I respond with "The gank was fine, you were going to die. We came after your death." He said one other thing and I responded with "Stfu. That has nothing to do with us". From this I can tell that he's like this normally. He loves to complain.

In regards to behavior, yes, you are right, maybe it's not the best course of action for me to be an asshole back, but you can surely at least understand why, yes? I don't think you're right in saying that it will reinforce them. I guess it is dependent on the person.

I can admit that I'm angry, so that's why I end up cussing a lot as it's the easiest way to let it out.

nerak231 votes

This only shows MY chat. I want to show you the chat logs of both the Rengar and Yasuo as well.

As harsh as this may sound to you right now, It Makes No difference what anyone else says. I'm sorry you don't understand.

You are responsible for you and only you. You Can Not excuse what you have done and Blame it on others !!!

Put up your RC now that you say you have it please.

Valendrome1 votes

That's not what I'm saying. What I tried to say was that I would like for you to see both sides of the conversation, so that you can see that I'm not blatantly going out of my way to talk shit to people. I'm doing it because that's what they try to do. I'm not saying it is their fault for the way I respond. I'm the one that chooses to say what I say. I don't disagree with you.

I'm just saying that I'm not the real bad guy here. I'm not the one that disregards the feelings of random people.

nerak231 votes

Valendrome (NA) - 2 minutes ago People are different. In my opinion people are never going to stop being an asshole unless they realize how they're acting. If you just brush it off, they're never going to change.

THIS is 100 % true and it starts with people like you ! You have to realize how your acting and reacting in-game. You are just as much the Ass as the others !

If you brush it off then you don't start a flame war ! Every time someone reacts with a rude comment then they set it up for a flame war and anyone who partakes in this is just as culpable !

Valendrome1 votes

I realize this, but I don't care since I'm being an asshole to assholes. There have been plenty of matches where I have people who play and don't talk shit, and guess what, I don't say anything rude to anyone in those matches. If I brush it off, the person will never change. If I talk back to them, there's at least the chance that they'll get the memo. This is why I'm saying they're banning the wrong people. Ban the people who are wanting to be toxic towards others.

I don't want to be that way, but if that's how people are going to act then tell me why I should show them any respect. If they want to be toxic to the other team, okay, there's nothing I can do about that, but when the player is being toxic towards my teammates?

nerak231 votes

Why should I show respect to someone who doesn't show respect to others in the first place, Nerak.

Because you are being defensive right now meaning that you likely understand that you overstepped and now are sorry for it, and I understand and feel for you to an extent.

Just step back for a day and think about it , put up those chat logs and look at them when you are not so hopped up and I would hope you have a different opinion when you create another account.

I am trying to be respectful to you as you seem to be to me so far, so you can be polite just use that and don't take such offence, please man

Valendrome1 votes

The only reason I'm even sort of sorry is because I got a perma ban for it. I still feel that a permanent ban is unjust, and that they need to take these bans more seriously. The people I end up talking shit to deserve it. I don't get mad at anyone else.

Like I said, I'm a nice guy, I have no reason to be a dick to you, so I'm not going to. It just bugs me that people are the exact opposite and don't care about being an asshole to random people. That's why I get pissed and say shit back to them.

nerak231 votes

I don't want to be that way, but if that's how people are going to act then tell me why I should show them any respect

Because You want respect, you have to show some to get some.

Valendrome1 votes

I get respect all the time. I'm not an asshole to everyone like I said. Just the people that deserve it.

nerak231 votes

Like I said, I'm a nice guy, I have no reason to be a dick to you, so I'm not going to. It just bugs me that people are the exact opposite and don't care about being an asshole to random people. That's why I get pissed and say shit back to them.

This is simply Not the truth though, I get mad ! I want to say nasty shit ! I do say it, but I Simply Don't Fucken Type it in-game !

I'm Not a nice guy !! and I am the kindest Jerk you'll ever meet, I will defend others but not often myself, Yet I don't feel the need to be rude to people in a hour or less game.

I'm giving you the best advice you apt to learn in life ....You are not a hard ass by being a dick in a Video game.

Valendrome1 votes

As long as you aren't an asshole and give other people shit, then I have no problem with you or how you play (unless you don't help in team fights). I can't help but talk shit back to the people who talk shit. It probably stems from some personal issues, but regardless of that I'm still not the one who starts crap with other players. I have no reason to do so and I don't get anything out of it.

Maybe I do need to learn not to type back and just ignore it, but why should I get punished for it?

nerak231 votes

Punishment needs to be consistent for both parties when they have the same offense.

Yes, your right here !! However, you and I don't have access to the records !! You just said you now have a perma and you have to go out of your way to get one...

It is no longer, I defended my teammate in a game, No when someone gets permanently banned they were being an extreme Ass in game. I wish I had been able to talk to you before you got this permanent ban because I could have told you how to play the game and have FUN and at least Not get that. As it is I can only hope others will look at this section of the board and understand.

Valendrome1 votes

Yeah, but it's not like I want to make people feel like shit just because they do bad. I ended up getting the perma ban, but that doesn't necessarily mean I deserved it.

Like I said, if any of you can tell me how to get chat logs for the other players in my matches, then I'll gladly post the entire conversation. I'm not going to just post my logs as most of you will judge me only based on what my responses were and not what the conversation was and that's unfair.

nerak231 votes

Yeah, but it's not like I want to make people feel like shit just because they do bad. I ended up getting the perma ban, but that doesn't necessarily mean I deserved it.

But see it does mean you get the perma and I think your a person who can reform...

I think many times we forget that people are just that ! Feelings and pressure and You my Friend can make a new account and use what other are telling you to help, if you want to.

Beware though, Riot is making a bold new step and leading the pack on the internet gaming I for one am glad about it. Don't mistake the banns for being harsh as they are long in coming and people are going to have to relearn how to behave.

Good Luck

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