Boards›Player Behavior

Absolutely unwarranted ban.

Azuk REFORMED··5 votes·928 views

Just received a 25 game chat restriction. Was playing flex queue when our support locked in Zed. I guess explaining to Shyvana that Zed Support doesn't warrant a ban is now banworthy?

I honestly can't believe that this warrants a punishment at all. This is by far the tamest chatlog I've ever seen included with a ban message. The only cuss word throughout the entire chatlog was "pissed." I never attacked a player on my team verbally. The entire chatlog is just a justification of offmeta picks and why they aren't bannable.

Can someone clear this up?

Game 1 Azuk REFORMED: i dont blame him Azuk REFORMED: autofill sucks Azuk REFORMED: so long as hes going botlane Azuk REFORMED: idc Azuk REFORMED: he did Azuk REFORMED: he is going bot Azuk REFORMED: you have no right to be pissed at him for it Azuk REFORMED: literally everyone d3+ is Azuk REFORMED: people get more and more onetrick-y as you climb Azuk REFORMED: im not duo with him Azuk REFORMED: he just makes sense Azuk REFORMED: check op.gg Azuk REFORMED: check op.gg lol Azuk REFORMED: ward deep Azuk REFORMED: i can tp Azuk REFORMED: got to save it since i pushed Azuk REFORMED: let em push Azuk REFORMED: its flex Azuk REFORMED: there is no elo in flex lol Azuk REFORMED: its glorified normals Azuk REFORMED: u really are a negative nancy huh Azuk REFORMED: report shyv int lol Azuk REFORMED: you also cant report for picking zed supp lol Azuk REFORMED: there is no "trolling" report category Azuk REFORMED: only intentionally feeding, which he didnt Azuk REFORMED: griefing is under inting Azuk REFORMED: and regardless he didnt grief Azuk REFORMED: just picked what he wanted to play Azuk REFORMED: you're getting reported for verbal abuse though (: Azuk REFORMED: and? Azuk REFORMED: he made his pick and tried his hardest to win Azuk REFORMED: so it isnt reportable Azuk REFORMED: no such thing as a "troll pick" Azuk REFORMED: you can pick whatever you want Azuk REFORMED: yes really Azuk REFORMED: singed smite support isnt bannable Azuk REFORMED: neither is zed support Azuk REFORMED: so long as you're trying to win Azuk REFORMED: it doesn't matter Azuk REFORMED: does picking ashe constitute trolling then? Azuk REFORMED: its handicapping your team versus picking kog Azuk REFORMED: offmeta does not equal bannable Azuk REFORMED: we will Azuk REFORMED: he wont get banned Azuk REFORMED: lol Azuk REFORMED: ive gone through this with riot multiple times Azuk REFORMED: i used to onetrick udyr support Azuk REFORMED: it doesnt matter if its a waste of resources it isnt bannable Azuk REFORMED: illaoi support used to be meta Azuk REFORMED: she doesnt provide cc Azuk REFORMED: not bannable Azuk REFORMED: the pick itself is never bannable, the gameplay has to be Azuk REFORMED: ? Azuk REFORMED: whatever u say bud Azuk REFORMED: lol Azuk REFORMED: he didnt feed Azuk REFORMED: he tried his best under the circumstances Azuk REFORMED: he has 2x your kill participation Azuk REFORMED: are you trolling? Azuk REFORMED: so? Azuk REFORMED: is kass trolling? Azuk REFORMED: am i trolling? Azuk REFORMED: if the only difference is the pick Azuk REFORMED: it isnt bannable Azuk REFORMED: theyre not enforceable by ban though

31 Comments

YerroFever4 votes

[{quoted}](name=Azuk REFORMED,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=rJcctA1i,comment-id=,timestamp=2018-02-05T20:25:50.339+0000)

Just received a 25 game chat restriction. Was playing flex queue when our support locked in Zed. I guess explaining to Shyvana that Zed Support doesn't warrant a ban is now banworthy?

I honestly can't believe that this warrants a punishment at all. This is by far the tamest chatlog I've ever seen included with a ban message. The only cuss word throughout the entire chatlog was "pissed." I never attacked a player on my team verbally. The entire chatlog is just a justification of offmeta picks and why they aren't bannable.

Can someone clear this up?

Your thread title is "unwarranted ban" but you say you get a chat restriction... and then you claim you're getting bans...

First, you didn't get a ban and what you did get is a chat restriction. Stop calling it a ban. Stop saying you're getting banned. You're just wrong on what happened. You got chat restricted. You didn't get a ban and you should stop saying you did because all it does is discredit yourself in the eyes of the forum. You got a chat restriction and that should be the end of this discussion. Calling it a ban will just further ruin your own credibility because calling a chat restriction a ban is mis-characterizing it and sounds like an attempt to grab sympathy by exaggerating what happened instead of actually appealing to reason and stating accurate facts about what happened. A chat restriction is the equivalent of a slap on the hands.

Second, did you say something pre-game or post-game? Although they're not included in the reform card, they are still reviewed and Riot has said they're working on making it clearer and showing what text offended since pre and post game chats are not currently displayed in the logs they send out.

Third, addressing your chat logs:

Game 1 Azuk REFORMED: i dont blame him Azuk REFORMED: autofill sucks Azuk REFORMED: so long as hes going botlane Azuk REFORMED: idc Azuk REFORMED: he did Azuk REFORMED: he is going bot Azuk REFORMED: you have no right to be pissed at him for it Azuk REFORMED: literally everyone d3+ is Azuk REFORMED: people get more and more onetrick-y as you climb Azuk REFORMED: im not duo with him Azuk REFORMED: he just makes sense Azuk REFORMED: check op.gg Azuk REFORMED: check op.gg lol Azuk REFORMED: ward deep Azuk REFORMED: i can tp Azuk REFORMED: got to save it since i pushed Azuk REFORMED: let em push Azuk REFORMED: its flex Azuk REFORMED: there is no elo in flex lol Azuk REFORMED: its glorified normals Azuk REFORMED: u really are a negative nancy huh Azuk REFORMED: report shyv int lol

Remember that Riot has said that asking for reports isn't inherently a punishable offense, but if you use that as a jumping off point for other toxic behavior, you will get punished for that toxic behavior and it will also include asking for the report.

Azuk REFORMED: you also cant report for picking zed supp lol Azuk REFORMED: there is no "trolling" report category Azuk REFORMED: only intentionally feeding, which he didnt Azuk REFORMED: griefing is under inting Azuk REFORMED: and regardless he didnt grief Azuk REFORMED: just picked what he wanted to play Azuk REFORMED: you're getting reported for verbal abuse though (: Azuk REFORMED: and? Azuk REFORMED: he made his pick and tried his hardest to win Azuk REFORMED: so it isnt reportable Azuk REFORMED: no such thing as a "troll pick" Azuk REFORMED: you can pick whatever you want Azuk REFORMED: yes really Azuk REFORMED: singed smite support isnt bannable Azuk REFORMED: neither is zed support Azuk REFORMED: so long as you're trying to win Azuk REFORMED: it doesn't matter Azuk REFORMED: does picking ashe constitute trolling then? Azuk REFORMED: its handicapping your team versus picking kog Azuk REFORMED: offmeta does not equal bannable Azuk REFORMED: we will Azuk REFORMED: he wont get banned Azuk REFORMED: lol Azuk REFORMED: ive gone through this with riot multiple times Azuk REFORMED: i used to onetrick udyr support Azuk REFORMED: it doesnt matter if its a waste of resources it isnt bannable Azuk REFORMED: illaoi support used to be meta Azuk REFORMED: she doesnt provide cc Azuk REFORMED: not bannable Azuk REFORMED: the pick itself is never bannable, the gameplay has to be Azuk REFORMED: ? Azuk REFORMED: whatever u say bud Azuk REFORMED: lol Azuk REFORMED: he didnt feed Azuk REFORMED: he tried his best under the circumstances Azuk REFORMED: he has 2x your kill participation Azuk REFORMED: are you trolling? Azuk REFORMED: so? Azuk REFORMED: is kass trolling? Azuk REFORMED: am i trolling? Azuk REFORMED: if the only difference is the pick Azuk REFORMED: it isnt bannable Azuk REFORMED: theyre not enforceable by ban though

If I were in this game, I would have muted you and shyv. This whole chunk is lots and lots of arguing. You say you recently got off the 10 game chat restriction and you showed that you're still argumentative in chat, so that's probably why they gave you another chat restriction.

If this continued further in post game, then Riot definitely is telling you that you arguing doesn't help anything and you should just mute, report, and move on. If two people contribute to a toxic situation, both people get punished.

This is Riot's way of saying, "Mute and move on. Filling the team chat with arguing does no good for anyone. It distracts you from playing and the person you're arguing with, it distracts your teammates from playing while reading the argument. This isn't a heinous offense but cut it out and move on and play the game."

Stop arguing with people and don't bother telling people they're getting reported and don't ask for reports. All it takes is 1 report in a game to get it reviewed which means muting them and reporting them after the game is just as effective as arguing with them and reporting them, except when you argue with them, you give them ammo to report you and get you in trouble... like they did here.

Azuk REFORMED2 votes

{quoted}

Your thread title is "unwarranted ban" but you say you get a chat restriction... and then you claim you're getting bans...

First, you didn't get a ban and what you did get is a chat restriction. Stop calling it a ban. Stop saying you're getting banned. You're just wrong on what happened. You got chat restricted. You didn't get a ban and you should stop saying you did because all it does is discredit yourself in the eyes of the forum. You got a chat restriction and that should be the end of this discussion. Calling it a ban will just further ruin your own credibility because calling a chat restriction a ban is mis-characterizing it and sounds like an attempt to grab sympathy by exaggerating what happened instead of actually appealing to reason and stating accurate facts about what happened. A chat restriction is the equivalent of a slap on the hands.

This first paragraph feels very... angry. I didn't mean to use the wrong word I guess? I've always just called any punishment received a "ban" because it's shorter than typing out "chat restriction" every time. I don't mean to play wordgames, I just thought that most people would grasp the pragmatics of what I was saying without focusing too hard on the semantics.

Second, did you say something pre-game or post-game? Although they're not included in the reform card, they are still reviewed and Riot has said they're working on making it clearer and showing what text offended since pre and post game chats are not currently displayed in the logs they send out.

Nothing was said pre-game to my memory, maybe "gonna be a tough lane" but definitely nothing toxic. Post game was essentially the same as in game. Something in the vein of "Zed won't get banned because it's not a bannable offense, but flaming will probably get you banned."

Third, addressing your chat logs:

Remember that Riot has said that asking for reports isn't inherently a punishable offense, but if you use that as a jumping off point for other toxic behavior, you will get punished for that toxic behavior and it will also include asking for the report.

I addressed this below, but it was satirical. Shyvana obviously wasn't inting, just like Zed obviously wasn't trolling. I was attempting to prove a point like "are we just reporting people for things they didn't even do?" (hence the "lol" right after... obviously an automated system can't detect satire and that doesn't help my case.)

If I were in this game, I would have muted you and shyv. This whole chunk is lots and lots of arguing. You say you recently got off the 10 game chat restriction and you showed that you're still argumentative in chat, so that's probably why they gave you another chat restriction.

Muting is a fair response to argumentative chat. I just don't feel that argumentative chat is banworthy so long as you keep to attacking the argument rather than the arguer. Humans tend to have opinions and disagreements, so I don't really see how it's fair to expect people to abandon their humanity whenever they hit the "enter" key, and resort to only using the chat for robotic functions like calling cooldowns. Players are people, and so long as you keep yourself in line I think it's fair to use chat for whatever you please. The problem here is where that line is drawn...

If this continued further in post game, then Riot definitely is telling you that you arguing doesn't help anything and you should just mute, report, and move on. If two people contribute to a toxic situation, both people get punished.

The argument did continue in post game for a message or two until we both disconnected, but it didn't escalate further into cussing or anything.

This is Riot's way of saying, "Mute and move on. Filling the team chat with arguing does no good for anyone. It distracts you from playing and the person you're arguing with, it distracts your teammates from playing while reading the argument. This isn't a heinous offense but cut it out and move on and play the game."

I can agree to that. The arguing definitely isn't helping the gameplay of our team. I'd also agree it's probably a minor detriment. However, I think defending a teammate from unwarranted verbal assault in as polite a fashion as possible is justified and potentially worth the detriment to gameplay, given that most people on our team didn't seem too focused on winning the game at this point anyway (lol)

Stop arguing with people and don't bother telling people they're getting reported and don't ask for reports. All it takes is 1 report in a game to get it reviewed which means muting them and reporting them after the game is just as effective as arguing with them and reporting them, except when you argue with them, you give them ammo to report you and get you in trouble... like they did here.

I guess you're right. The absolute easiest solution would have been to totally ignore the Shyvana, allow her report against Zed to do nothing, and avoid reports myself. Hindsight is 20/20 I guess. In the moment I just felt bad for the Zed, because I used to play almost purely offmeta picks and experience a lot of the same flaming. I really just wanted to try and logically explain to our Shyvana why offmeta picks aren't punishable, so that maybe someone in the future could avoid being flamed by this same person. It's not a pleasant experience, but I guess my whiteknighting wasn't worth the tradeoff or I wouldn't be here.

Kei1433 votes

the way you ask for report is a form of bullying / harassment. So this is a warrented punishment.

Azuk REFORMED1 votes

The only time I "asked for a report" was when I said "report shyv int lol." It was satirical because she was threatening reports on others for no reason. She wasn't inting, I just said it to prove a point (i.e. "are we just reporting people for things they didn't do now?")

Kei1432 votes

Azuk REFORMED: you're getting reported for verbal abuse though (:

Certainly bullying method of saying it.

Infact why even ask for reports? 1 report = 9 reports. Why even tell him he is getting reported? Just tell him that what he is saying isn't cool.

Azuk REFORMED1 votes

I didn't ask for a report though. Was just letting him know that I planned on reporting him in hopes that he would stop flaming everyone. I know "asking for reports" is bannable, and one report is weighted the same as many, so it makes no sense to ask for them for any reason other than to flame. To simply inform someone that I don't appreciate their toxicity and plan on reporting the behavior seems like quite an overstep to ban for.

Kei1432 votes

Then just tell him that what he is saying isn't cool and can get him punished.

That way it's not offensive to him and won't get you in trouble.

Azuk REFORMED1 votes

I would've done that if I had known it was bannable. Riot is totally clear about asking for reports being bannable, but I've never heard that informing someone that they're being reported is bannable. Learn something new every account I guess...

Kei1432 votes

The system Is not just a keyword search filter. It takes into context the phrase ( or several phrases) and understands whether or not you are harassing / insulting other people.

In this specific context you were using it to counter bully him, like "na na na na naaaahhhh, I'm telling the teacher and you can do annnyyythinnnggg about itttt" (read that with zoe's voice please).

That said, for you to be punished for this, there should be a history of similar behaviour. You might want to get that fixed, else it will escalate to a 14-day ban next punishment.

Xidphel1 votes

Haven't gotten heard her yet (haven't played in a while). How grating is her voice?

Kei1431 votes

YouTube lol skin spotlight Zoe interaction.

Azuk REFORMED1 votes

Not sure if that's the best analogy, because obviously something could've been done about it (i.e. thinking logically about the situation and not flaming our helpless Zed who just wanted to have some fun and play his champ...) but regardless, if you think the ban was warranted from those few potentially inflammatory messages, (which I still don't fully agree were inflammatory at all) then I guess we'll find out. I filed a support ticket, so maybe a manual review of the logs will shed some more light on this.

Kei1432 votes

I think the defense for other player is good, that won't get you punished. Though it is annoying in it's own way, cos you seem to be hung up on proving him wrong instead of just dropping the argument and playing the game. Once is a fair point, multiple times is a nag and gets annoying.

I stand by what I say, I believe the way you said you were reporting him is what got this report to be valid.

This along with many games of similar attitude would get you punished.

You contacting support and asking for a manual review is a good call. Make sure to ask them for a bunch of chatlogs that were also included for your punishment. They certainly have more information than what was just listed in your reform card.

Azuk REFORMED1 votes

I would hope so.

Xidphel1 votes

He ain't gonna stop though, even if you do threaten to report. All you have to do is mute the person who starts flaming and report later on. No need to mute all.

Jo0o3 votes

This log is reasonably tame. Hard to say where the line was crossed here. Possibly in pre-game or post-game chat, which currently is never included in the logs.

You should submit a support ticket and respectfully ask for clarification. How recent was your 10-game restriction?

Azuk REFORMED1 votes

I sent zero messages in the pre-game lobby. I can't remember exactly what I said post-game, but it was to the effect of everything else in the chatlog(i.e. that Zed won't get banned, and that flaming will likely result in their ban instead). Still no cussing or personal attacks.

YOU SO BAD3 votes

Welcome to league 2018 where stating the fact of what you plan on doing is harassment lol.

FOR JUSTICE2 votes

Ok im not gonna lie, this isnt as toxic as what i have seen, but just to be sure, have you gotten a 10 game chat restriction recently? Because although its not too toxic, it is still harassment of your teammates, and things like this stack up over time, so i suspect a string of mild toxicity.

Azuk REFORMED2 votes

Yes, I did receive a 10 game recently for LEGITIMATE toxicity. Which is why I was watching my step here. I made sure not to cuss, not to insult my teammates, and try to defend our support who just wanted to play the game in the nicest way possible. Apparently it wasn't enough.

Hethalean1 votes

Azuk REFORMED: report shyv int lol

probably it

EDIT: or this

Azuk REFORMED: you're getting reported for verbal abuse though (:

Azuk REFORMED1 votes

I'm not going to re-type what I said below, but it is really a stretch if Riot had to go so far as those two statements to find ANY toxicity in that game. Pretty sad really.

Hethalean2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Azuk REFORMED,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=rJcctA1i,comment-id=0001000000000000,timestamp=2018-02-05T20:38:52.938+0000)

I'm not going to re-type what I said below, but it is really a stretch if Riot had to go so far as those two statements to find ANY toxicity in that game. Pretty sad really.

No, it's not that. It's that it is toxic (if even very minor), and when you're on chat restrictions already, you're on thin ice. That just means that it doesn't take as much to continue it onward the punishment line.

It is an automated system. It's just that people don't quite grasp the system, and what thin ice means. You were trying to be helpful and it's unfortunate that this happened. I wish you luck.

Azuk REFORMED1 votes

Appreciate it, man. I'm hoping a support ticket might clear things up. If it doesn't, I guess I just have to be extra careful and hope my punishment tier goes back down.

FOR JUSTICE1 votes

No its not just the fact that you got off a 10 game, (but im glad to hear youve shown SOME degree of reform by holding your tounge) i mean its because, say someone reports you for harassment in a game. Now, if you actually were toxic, but it was super light, the report IS in fact still noted as valid, just no punishment is issued. After enough "light" toxicity, it will punish you as If you were fully toxic

Azuk REFORMED1 votes

Unfortunate. I've never really experienced the progression of chat restricts like this because my previous accounts always skipped straight to 14 day bans for inting. I've been trying to shape up but I guess I need to be more careful...

OnlyYouCanHearMe2 votes

Hmm. I would send in a ticket to Player Support on this one. While you do spend most of the game "arguing" with the Shyvana about whether or not the Zed's actions are reportable, you're not being rude or toxic about it. You're actually being quite polite, and you're defending another player on your team.

Sure, at some point in the match, if I was another person on the team I would probably have wanted you both to be quiet, I still have to give you a lot of respect for what you were trying to do, and if I had been that Zed, I would have MASSIVELY appreciated what you did. You went out of your way to defend someone that you were not duo queued with, because someone else was harassing them. You literally went above and beyond to try and ensure that Zed was not reported or punished unfairly. And that's honestly one of the biggest, most impressive things that you can do to show that you are serious about reforming and not being toxic. It's the embodiment of the spirit of the Summoner's Code, and that's what it means to be a good teammate.

I would never report somebody for defending another player like this. And what you did was genuine defense, pointing out other scenarios like Illaoi support, referencing how good the player is with that champion, pointing out that the player is genuinely trying to win, etc. I just can't agree with this chat restriction.

formerly VentressRedeemed

AnataBakka2 votes

the only negative thing you said is that people should report her, that's all

anyway care, riot permabans if you complain too much in chat. If the only things you say aren't "baron please" "gg" you will be banned

SoulAced1 votes

Since you mentioned you got a 10 game chat restriction recently you account as probably being monitored more closely and the fact that you more fed a troll and repeated that you would report him instead of just muting them is probably what did it. It seems like a common thing for chat bans after looking at this board for awhile.

TheProfezzor1 votes

Doesn’t warrant chat restriction. That being said why do you feel the need to defend some random person on the interview? Like why do you care ? Just tell zed to mute shyv and you do the same. Asking for reports is reportable.

Azuk REFORMED2 votes

For my first 2-3 years playing I only played offmeta shit (think Mordekaiser Jungle, Udyr Support, Sion Mid) and received a lot of the same sort of flaming. My thought process in the situation was "maybe if I can explain to Shyvana WHY this sort of thing isn't reportable, I can potentially stop someone else from getting flamed in the same fashion in the future."

It's kind of petty because it's not my place, but I honestly just felt bad for the guy because I've been there.

More from Player Behavior

The indefinite banning of Tyler1
Player Behavior4,799 comments
2,942
votes
14 day ban because playing Nunu Support with Smite is "stealing other people's roles"...?
Player Behavior1,525 comments
1,086
votes
Riot should add monthly status cards
Player Behavior241 comments
843
votes
Reminder that we haven't gotten our Summoner report cards yet :/
Player Behavior145 comments
619
votes
I'm not "triggered" by you throwing insults.
Player Behavior361 comments
548
votes
Black Alistar, King Rammus!!!!
Player Behavior462 comments
503
votes