Boards›Player Behavior

My Thoughts/Comments on my Own Perma and Why I Believe it to be Unjust.

RemoveEnterKey··6 votes·1,214 views

So for about 2 Years now, I've been trying to get my account un-Permabanned, after it was compromised without my knowledge and then subsequently permabanned due to said other person's behaviour.

Riot Games tells me that they can't unban me despite how obvious it was that it was another person playing (Decline in Elo from Gold to Silver within a week, Different Typing Patterns, IPs etc....), which I think is completely unfair. But the real kicker is that they won't give me any sort of way to prove my innocence.

They simply say "No Can Do" every time I ask, with no actual reasoning to back it up. So I thought I'd take this to the forums to have an actual conversation with a Rioter about Dragonsin Wrath's ban and why I can't get it unbanned despite the fact that it was another person that put the final nails in the coffin of my account.

Edit: Due to the high amounts of downvotes I thought i'd elaborate further.

  1. I've attempted to contact Riot several times with them ignoring me or outright treating me like I'm the bad guy. I even once encountered a Riot member who flamed me for even daring to ask for my account back.

  2. The Password was Bruteforced, and I had no way of avoiding it. I understand that my having Pax Jax made the account a target but I did not assume people would go so far, nor that it was even possible.

  3. Yes, I understand the summoner's code and I personally did not violate it in order to get banned. I know several people are going to attempt to comment on this with ignorance of my situation, so I would like to ask that if you have nothing constructive to say, don't say it at all, I created the poll for a reason.

Edit 2: Just got threatened by a member of support on live chat for asking about the same thing twice because the previous guy LITERALLY admitted there was someone else on my account and did nothing.

https://gyazo.com/edd9dc2480557c8453fbb16c62b5e2db

https://gyazo.com/7dd5bc3644b6bfdb550bcc867eb66c08

(Notice how this dude blatantly misuses the word context, nice support team training, Rito).

63 Comments

Brotha7 votes

It's extremely rare for a permabanned account to be unbanned. I don't know how your account was compromised without your knowledge, but it may be in your best interest to let it go.

General Esdeath 3 votes

Your account security is your responsibility.

RemoveEnterKey1 votes

Riot's servers get compromised, that means they have to leave this game behind right? They can never develop it or touch it again, right? Because something out of their control happened to them.

General Esdeath 2 votes

As far as I know, Riot never let anyone have a username/password to the game, not that one exists. Did you give anyone your user info/use an easy password?

RemoveEnterKey1 votes

Nope. I'm assuming my having Pax Jax just made it a wanted target. I would have been able to secure the account had I not been on vacation as it was happening, I guess that's just unlucky :/. In the end I found a very nice Riot member from the support team who was willing to help me change the pass even though it was perma banned, and when I told him my situation, he said for me to explain it to player behavior and surely they'd understand. Sadly that was the only decent human being I've encountered from Riot support.

General Esdeath 2 votes

lol that's a cute story but I can tell it's fake for 3 big reasons.

  1. Nobody would know your username, password, or e-mail just from playing with you unless you shared it.

  2. Nobody from Riot tells you to come here, because we can't do anything.

  3. I'm pretty sure Riot doesn't let you change usernames, only passwords.

Given these lies, I'm lead to believe you're lying in the original post and were just banned for toxicity or letting someone else on your account.

RemoveEnterKey1 votes

https://gyazo.com/ed025a55c40147e2e63511faba302bc1

Before running your mouth and making wild accusations you should understand that I don't lie.

Nobody would know your username, password, or e-mail just from playing with you unless you shared it.

Hm, Nobody and Never are words that seldom actually apply to what the person is saying. They just simply say that something with a low chance to happen is never.

Nobody from Riot tells you to come here, because we can't do anything.

https://gyazo.com/965d6783c90f30108fd7b2534a91cf71

"Explain to player behaviour" as in a support ticket numb skull.

General Esdeath 3 votes

"I don't lie"

-Gives no evidence that a username change was made, no evidence of a brute force hacking.

So you're telling me you knew he meant a support ticket, and you're still shocked I called you out on it? Also, why is that last bit cut off from the rest?

Please, keep throwing insults, it helps your case, a lot :)

RemoveEnterKey1 votes

Also, why is that last bit cut off from the rest?

Because there was personal info in the email, such as payement ids, last 4 digits of cards, etc... I had to do a lot to recover the pass.

Username change

I'll give you that one, I didn't change the username, but that hardly matters to the point at hand. At this point you're just using semantics to "Ha Gotcha!" me and then wondering why I'm being so passive aggressive. Like you go out to incriminate me with no idea of what you're talking about and then you get butthurt when I call you out.

So you're telling me you knew he meant a support ticket, and you're still shocked I called you out on it?

What are you on about?

Please, keep throwing insults, it helps your case, a lot :)

Please, keep invading on my non-aggression principal and bullshitting in the comments to place yourself in between something that doesn't concern you. If you have nothing constructive or remotely intelligent to say, and you're just throwing around accusations, why are you here?

General Esdeath 1 votes

You can black those out. Those aren't some catches for personal points, I just feel people who exaggerate details like that might be making up way more. This doesn't concern anyone, but you were told to come here, and most people don't believe/support you on it either.

RemoveEnterKey1 votes

You can black those out.

Suppose I could, but I don't really owe you anything.

but you were told to come here

No, I was told to go to player behaviour as in the support team. I came here because I was tired of getting shut down repeatedly without being allowed a single chance. I'm looking for a platform, not a mob to jump behind me like Tyler1. All I'm asking for is a Socratic discussion with a Riot Member.

General Esdeath 1 votes

Hold on, player behavior support team? I don't think they're really here, except Tantram. And he's usually in the threads with chat logs.

archerno13 votes

This sounds to me like u tried to sell/sold account with Pax Jax on it. Later u found out it got permad and now you are faking how it got "bruteforced" to get it back

RemoveEnterKey1 votes

If that's the way it sounds to you, it can sound that way, as I said, if you have nothing constructive to say, you're wasting breath.

archerno12 votes

[{quoted}](name=DragonSin Wrath,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=aM0u21AQ,comment-id=00060000,timestamp=2017-11-19T01:19:15.071+0000)

If that's the way it sounds to you, it can sound that way, as I said, if you have nothing constructive to say, you're wasting breath.

Its actually constructive, unfortunately for you. Thats one of reasons they wont unban you. Because scenario i presented is one of possible and most common scenarios. There are plenty more: You paid for a boost and got scammed and account stolen. You let your friend play on your account, he broke rules and got it banned. You went to another country/city, for a while, got yourself banned, moved back to your original location and made up story to get account back. There are many scenarios that are FAR more likely than your account being "Bruteforced". IM sorry but rule is: You are responsible for anything that happens on your account.

RemoveEnterKey1 votes

Because scenario i presented is one of possible and most common scenarios

Maybe for EUNE.

You paid for a boost and got scammed and account stolen

Once again, false accusations with no weight, there's no evidence for it.

You let your friend play on your account, he broke rules and got it banned.

Once again, false accusations with no weight, there's no evidence for it.

You went to another country/city, for a while, got yourself banned, moved back to your original location and made up story to get account back

Once again, false accusations with no weight, there's no evidence for it.

Everything you're saying is based on assumptions and intuition. You use no Empirical evidence and you ignore my own evidence.

archerno12 votes

[{quoted}](name=DragonSin Wrath,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=aM0u21AQ,comment-id=0006000000000000,timestamp=2017-11-19T01:42:23.263+0000)

Maybe for EUNE.

Once again, false accusations with no weight, there's no evidence for it.

Once again, false accusations with no weight, there's no evidence for it.

Once again, false accusations with no weight, there's no evidence for it.

Everything you're saying is based on assumptions and intuition. You use no Empirical evidence and you ignore my own evidence.

Riot DOESNT NEED evidence. If they suspect any of these scenarios they can revoke your license to use account. Also im not accusing you of anything, im explaining you why they wont unban you.

RemoveEnterKey1 votes

Riot DOESNT NEED evidence.

Yes they do, because if they don't use evidence they're breaking the mutually binding agreement that is the summoner's code.

archerno11 votes

[{quoted}](name=DragonSin Wrath,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=aM0u21AQ,comment-id=000600000000000000000000,timestamp=2017-11-19T01:52:07.800+0000)

Yes they do, because if they don't use evidence they're breaking the mutually binding agreement that is the summoner's code.

They aren't. They have proof that account broke rules. They banned account, not you.

2.1.2. Us.We may terminate or suspend your account if we determine, in our sole discretion, that: (a) you have violated any part of this Agreement; (b) we have stopped offering the Riot Services in your region; or (c) doing so would be in the best interests of our community, the Riot Services, or the rights of a third party. We may make such determinations, among other ways, by using automated systems and machine learning tools.

In our sole discretion means that Riot is sole deciding factor whether account is gonna get banned or not.

RemoveEnterKey1 votes

They banned account, not you.

I am the account. The account has my identity in it, it has my cards attached to it, I spent my money on it.

archerno11 votes

[{quoted}](name=DragonSin Wrath,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=aM0u21AQ,comment-id=00060000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2017-11-19T05:16:50.421+0000)

I am the account. The account has my identity in it, it has my cards attached to it, I spent my money on it.

Maybe you view yourself as that. But legally, all accounts are owned by Riot. So Riot just banned their own account. If they banned you, you wouldnt be allowed to make new account ever, and would be banned on sight.

RemoveEnterKey1 votes

But legally, all accounts are owned by Riot.

Riot invested no money into my account, how can they own it? Because of what their TOS says? They don't even follow their TOS.

If they banned you, you wouldnt be allowed to make new account ever, and would be banned on sight.

I haven't made any new accounts to know if this is true. But this doesn't change the fact that the ban was against their own TOS. I sent them paragraphs of evidence, screenshots, timestamps etc... and they sent me nothing but someone else's chat logs in response. How is that fair?

archerno11 votes

[{quoted}](name=DragonSin Wrath,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=aM0u21AQ,comment-id=0006000000000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2017-11-19T23:55:08.379+0000)

Riot invested no money into my account, how can they own it? Because of what their TOS says? They don't even follow their TOS.

I haven't made any new accounts to know if this is true. But this doesn't change the fact that the ban was against their own TOS. I sent them paragraphs of evidence, screenshots, timestamps etc... and they sent me nothing but someone else's chat logs in response. How is that fair?

You gave them evidence that rules werent broken on that account?

RemoveEnterKey1 votes

Yep.

Ekitaih1 votes

[{quoted}](name=DragonSin Wrath,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=aM0u21AQ,comment-id=0006000000000000,timestamp=2017-11-19T01:42:23.263+0000)

Maybe for EUNE.

Once again, false accusations with no weight, there's no evidence for it.

Once again, false accusations with no weight, there's no evidence for it.

Once again, false accusations with no weight, there's no evidence for it.

Everything you're saying is based on assumptions and intuition. You use no Empirical evidence and you ignore my own evidence.

You haven’t posted any evidence actually. Just because you make a claim doesn’t make that evidence. You have actually refused to post any evidence when we have asked you to try and provide some. You’re responses are you just dodging any claim or request for more information. Where is your evidence? Where is your proof? We have nothing but your word. Stating things like “I don’t lie,” doesn’t make your claim fact.

RemoveEnterKey1 votes

Actually I gave several Gyazo's in this thread, stop talking out of your ass.

Ekitaih1 votes

[{quoted}](name=DragonSin Wrath,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=aM0u21AQ,comment-id=000600000000000000010000,timestamp=2017-11-19T23:51:37.867+0000)

Actually I gave several Gyazo's in this thread, stop talking out of your ass.

Which were all proof of nothing. No proof that your account was stolen, as you say. No proof that your account was brute forced. No proof that a rioter flamed you. No proof of anything other than you submitting a couple tickets and you changing your password. You say they spammed you. Where’s that proof? You posted one picture which isn’t even evidence that they spammed you.

So, I’m not really talking out of my ass. The only Gyazos you posted were showing you changed your password and where you received a single message from a rioter telling you that they could not help you. So again, where is all this evidence you presented? Because I’m having a hard time finding it.

RemoveEnterKey1 votes

Which were all proof of nothing.

You're entitled to that opinion.

No proof that your account was stolen,

Riot has it all, the IPs, the high Elo Decline in the specific time frame I set for the ban etc... I'm trying to be cautious, if I release too much info, I may never get my account back. I may already be on thin-ice with Riot, and I genuinely think they want any reason to say I broke TOS to tack onto the behavioural ban.

Listen, you don't wanna believe? Fine by me, I would prefer you trusted me, as I don't wanna look like a disingenuous person to anyone but I'm not God and I can't do it all.

You posted one picture which isn’t even evidence that they spammed you.

I don't know site policy on links, once again, I'm being cautious, spamming people with gyazo links is not what I came here for. I wanted an open dialogue with a Rioter, sadly none have come, and it seems that none are going to come. Oh well.

RemoveEnterKey1 votes

Just went in live chat and asked about it, was threatened by a member of the support team and he instantly left. The previous member of support admitted to there being multiple users on the account, yet did nothing.

Ekitaih1 votes

[{quoted}](name=DragonSin Wrath,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=aM0u21AQ,comment-id=00060000000000000001000000000001,timestamp=2017-11-22T04:58:15.434+0000)

Just went in live chat and asked about it, was threatened by a member of the support team and he instantly left. The previous member of support admitted to there being multiple users on the account, yet did nothing.

Eh. No proof. So I really don’t care what you have to say. I don’t believe anything you’re saying at this point. So I’m done with this conversation. Have a good one.

RemoveEnterKey1 votes

Eh. No proof.

You mean like the two links I posted in the main post the second I responded to you? I obviously accounted for that smart guy.

Sarutobi2 votes

Well we cant really have a discussion if you cant give us anymore details. Like how did they come to getting into your account? If your password was that easy to guess thats your problem for using an easily guessable password. If you knowingly gave your account information to anyone for any reason again that is your fault and is against the rules.

RemoveEnterKey1 votes

My account was bruteforced, obviously, Riot tells you if your pass is weak or strong and when I made mine it was Green and several characters long.

But even with your logic.

If your password was that easy to guess thats your problem for using an easily guessable password

That's like saying the girl wearing revealing clothing deserves to get molested because she's wearing revealing clothing. If you're not gonna add anything to the discussion and simply victim blame, why even make a comment in the first place?

General Esdeath 1 votes

First off he said problem not fault, secondly, you can't brute force a password if it's unique. If my password was SRWMFJ2017, NOBODY would guess that by chance. After 10+ password tries, I believe Riot sends you an e-mail about someone logging into your account and locks it.

RemoveEnterKey1 votes

you can't brute force a password if it's unique.

Yes you can, do you know how bruteforcing works? Unless you have a password specially made to not be bruteforced, which is overkill in my opinion as some of them have to be put in notepad anyways and the files can be corrupted etc...

After 10+ password tries

Still awaiting said email then.

General Esdeath 2 votes

A brute force would require someone to sit there and try every single password, which would take about 2 years.

Clearly your account password was given to said person.

RemoveEnterKey1 votes

You do realize there are automated bruteforcing tools (that can guess hundreds of passwords in a minute), correct? Why are you making statements on things you have no idea of? I'm genuinely confused. Also, note that this was Season 5/Pre-Season 6 and the security then may not have been as optimized.

General Esdeath 1 votes

Which, again, would trigger the e-mail. If you haven't gotten it, they didn't use it. The security has been the same from season 5 iirc.

Ekitaih2 votes

So what you’re telling everyone is that someone thought your account was so interesting that they decided to brute force it, which I’m sure took quite a while, then after going through all that trouble, they just banned it? I’m not really buying it, which is probably the same thing Riot is thinking. If this story is true, im sure it’s very frustrating. But the bottom line is this: if it can’t be proved without a shout of a doubt, they shouldn’t unban your account. Because this opens up a new way to abuse the system. “Darn. I got banned. Oh I know! I’ll just tell them my account got hacked!” You see why this can be abused? They probably hear this same story in about 50% of band. That’s probably lowballing it too.

RemoveEnterKey1 votes

they just banned it?

Well they had no means of keeping the account as the second I realized it was compromised I could just have recovered it. It's likely a case of "If I can't have it, you can't have it either".

But the bottom line is this: if it can’t be proved without a shout of a doubt

Ip Addresses, High Elo Loss in Short Time, Sporadic Behavior, Different Champions played, Different ways of typing, etc...

If I could show you the chat logs without getting banned, you wouldn't believe for a second that I was the person typing. Sadly, he decided that his favourite word would be a particularly sensitive racial slur, so I can't post up the chat log.

Ekitaih1 votes

[{quoted}](name=DragonSin Wrath,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=aM0u21AQ,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2017-11-18T08:53:49.936+0000)

Well they had no means of keeping the account as the second I realized it was compromised I could just have recovered it. It's likely a case of "If I can't have it, you can't have it either".

Ip Addresses, High Elo Loss in Short Time, Sporadic Behavior, Different Champions played, Different ways of typing, etc...

If I could show you the chat logs without getting banned, you wouldn't believe for a second that I was the person typing. Sadly, he decided that his favourite word would be a particularly sensitive racial slur, so I can't post up the chat log.

Even if you can prove it wasn’t you how do you prove you just didn’t give away your account? If it was brute forced, like you said, Riot would be able to see that. If you have thousands of attempts on your account, that kind of throws up red flags. Which begs the question. Did you give away your account? That’s the assumption that I’m going with. I don’t know you, thus I cannot vouch for you even if I see your chat logs. You said the account was banned 2 years ago and a lot could change in those 2 years. Maybe you think you’ve reformed and you’re trying to get your account back? Who knows? I don’t know this situation so I certainly cannot say whether or not you are that person in the chat logs. Also, gold to silver is not high elo loss. That’s fairly normal. And finally, your first comment. That literally makes no sense. Obviously you could have taken the account at anytime. So again, why go through all that trouble? Really this whole situation is suspect at best.

RemoveEnterKey1 votes

you’ve reformed and you’re trying to get your account back?

If I was toxic and reformed in this situation, I would just be honest. I honestly wish my account wasn't compromised so I could say "hey Riot, I'm reformed, I want you to look at my current chat logs and see this and give me the account I spent 3k$ on". But I can't lie about that with clear conscience.

Obviously you could have taken the account at anytime.

I was on vacation at the time of the compromise (happened during/around the time of my Winter Break), so even if I was aware of it while it was happening (which I wasn't) I don't believe I could have stopped it.

Imperial Pandaa2 votes

My issue is that the compromiser didn't follow other norms. Once you gain an account via hacking, usually the next step is changing the email and password.

If Riot follows other designs, requesting an email change will still send an email to the original/current email to kind of confirm it.

Resetting the password, definitely does that. As I had gotten an email about resetting my password when I didn't make such a request. Made sure the link that was in the email was legit and everything before I changed the password just in case.

RemoveEnterKey1 votes

My issue is that the compromiser didn't follow other norms. Once you gain an account via hacking, usually the next step is changing the email and password.

I mean, I'm not a psychologist, so I can't exactly tell you what was going in his mind, but his changing of the email would involve actually having access to my email, which he didn't. He did change the password, which is why I requested a new one, as shown in the screenshots another user asked for.

Imperial Pandaa1 votes

Now I am basing it off my experience; but when I have wanted to change my password, I was sent an email with information about a password change request. I hadn't done anything of the sort.

RemoveEnterKey1 votes

Well if you tell Riot that your account was compromised and that you can't get in and need your password changed through email, they're obviously going to want some verification.

Finn Teh Human2 votes

I wouldn't say a Rioter flamed you and put it on the boards without some sort of snapshot for proof. Not saying it couldn't have happened, but if you want people on your side you need to give us some proof. Also, if your account really was hacked Riot would most likely look into it. (Unless they had found evidence that you had given your account information to someone.) You're not posting any of the convos you had with support.

SeductiveCelery2 votes

This is bullshit, you deserve an unban if you're being honest

RemoveEnterKey1 votes

Thank you brother, I appreciate the trust and the understanding. I'm even willing to give dating advice to these Rioters so they can get GF.

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