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Players With Mental Illnesses: Your rights are being violated

engager08··5 votes·4,033 views
Americans with Disabilities Act

Riot took down the original post, I guess for fear that it might rally too much support.

So I am just going to say this. If you have contacted riot on multiple occasions regarding your illness, provided documentation, reminded them of their legal responsibility to provide reasonable accommodations, and asked for such accommodations (such as being put on permanently restricted chat) and received template answer after template answer and eventually radio silence, your rights have been violated. If you have sunk more money than you can count into this game over 4 years and been outright IGNORED by it's proprietaries, your rights have been violated.

I gave riot a plethora of documentation, as well as reminded them of their legal responsibility to provide reasonable accommodations under the ADA, as well as reminded them that the clauses in their terms of use that are usurped by the ADA are not legally enforceable, I was met with template answer after template answer and eventually radio silence.

I don't deny my part in it, but I have extreme obsessive compulsive disorder, and riot was asked multiple times to put my account on permanently restricted chat and reminded of their legal responsibility to provide reasonable accommodations, I was outright ignored. Riot makes so much money that it allows the abuse of its players, and when those players who are sensitive to abuse finally snap, it bans them. First for a few days. Then for a few weeks. Then, even after MULTIPLE pleas to put my account under restricted chat, I was permanently banned for an explosive argument I had with my jungler over a bad invade.

26% of Americans live each day with a mental disorder. Riot is owned and operated in the states. They should be forced to deal with these people and make reasonable accommodations. Some of these people have a reason they play this game specifically.

Riot, PLEASE, when you get an email asking for support, your patrons deserve MORE than a template answer by a "behavior specialist" who won't actually help them with their problem, even when their request is TOTALLY reasonable.

Also, you shouldn't be allowed to call yourself a "behavior specialist", legally, without a degree in that. In fact, I'm pretty sure you're not supposed to.

Don't allow your rights to be violated. Support this post. Tell Riot mental health is real and that yours has been threatened.

Not to mention, riot, you are severely disillusioned if you think those of us you permanently ban can't turn around and log into our smurf.

You are abusing your players. It needs to stop. We deserve retribution.

147 Comments

Firu29 votes

That deals with selection practices, as in hiring for a job. That does not in anyway involve people playing a video game voluntarily. This is pretty much a complete strawman argument.

engager081 votes

this falls under the area of "public accommodation" and "communication"

Firu6 votes

No, it really doesn't.

Surr20plz20 votes

{quoted}

this falls under the area of "public accommodation" and "communication"

No it doesn't. You don't work for Riot or attend school at Riot.

You're not obligated to play this game.

engager081 votes

The ADA does not strictly fall within hiring or school practices. It also includes business practices. Unless you wanna deny that riot is a business...

Surr20plz15 votes

{quoted}

The ADA does not strictly fall within hiring or school practices. It also includes business practices. Unless you wanna deny that riot is a business...

No, because with your bullshit logic they could also have to guarantee that you win all your matches to avoid you being a toxic bitch baby.

engager081 votes

{quoted}

No, because with your bullshit logic they could also have to guarantee that you win all your matches to avoid you being a toxic bitch baby.

Title 3 calls for an accommodation outside of their normal way of doing things.

It doesn't matter that you don't believe in what I'm asking, I am correct on all my legalities. I'm a student of copyright law. I know better than Joe Blow here on his PC.

{quoted}

No, because with your bullshit logic they could also have to guarantee that you win all your matches to avoid you being a toxic bitch baby.

Joe Blow being you.

Nik Nikerson6 votes

Being a student of copyright law has little bearing on this, as the ADA has nothing to do with copyright law. That's like a podiatrist claiming they are qualified to perform brain surgery. Yes, they may have a better general knowledge of medicine and biology, but that doesn't mean they know everything about neurology.

Best Darius KR5 votes

You are a student of copyright law, and still, you are failing to convince any of us.

I don't think you are a very good student.

redniwediS7 votes

Now this explains it! You're a student, so now you know everything there is to know about law.

I suppose you'll know all about the inner workings of the human mind if you take a psych 101 class too.

Get over yourself. If you really think you're on to something here try talking to someone who actually knows a thing or two about law. You know, someone who isn't a student and instead has a degree and work experience.

DrCyanide2 votes

Actually, I think they might break the ADA if they chat restrict you because of your disability (is OCD even considered a disability?). They'd know you're disabled and keep you from talking at all because of that, which sounds like discrimination to me.

scazzman1 votes

{quoted}

Actually, I think they might break the ADA if they chat restrict you because of your disability (is OCD even considered a disability?). They'd know you're disabled and keep you from talking at all because of that, which sounds like discrimination to me.

not if the reason for the chat restriction is to keep the person able to play the game. it would be the same as if the person had a service animal

DrCyanide3 votes

How is that remotely like a service animal?

If anything, it's like someone in a wheelchair asking you to serve them through your drive through. You tell them no because it's dangerous to them and it could end up causing you terrible problems if something happens.

YumScrumptious9624 votes

You agreed to the terms saying you wouldn't be abusive towards other players yet you got banned for it. Don't use mental illness as your way of saying "You can't blame me because I have X" that's the most craven thing I've seen. You deserve the ban since you can't seem to press mute or forgive someone for a bad invade.

redniwediS14 votes

Permanent restricted chat is not something they do. It's not that they denied you of this, it's that it's not something they do.

According to the agreement you signed when you started playing this game the responsibility to keep yourself within the code of conduct lies fully on yourself. If you find yourself in a compromised state it is your job to stop playing.

If this state is literally all the time then it is your job to not play. Sorry, but your words hold absolutely no weight here.

So please, don't try to be one of those people who abuse systems made to help people simply because you did not get your way. You are the reason those systems have so many problems and red tape.

engager081 votes

{quoted}

Permanent restricted chat is not something they do. It's not that they denied you of this, it's that it's not something they do.

According to the agreement you signed when you started playing this game the responsibility to keep yourself within the code of conduct lies fully on yourself. If you find yourself in a compromised state it is your job to stop playing.

If this state is literally all the time then it is your job to not play. Sorry, but your words hold absolutely no weight here.

So please, don't try to be one of those people who abuse systems made to help people simply because you did not get your way. You are the reason those systems have so many problems and red tape.

Title 3 of the ADA say that it would be outside their normal business practices.

AKA, doesn't matter if it's "something they do"

redniwediS5 votes

You're still using it completely wrong. Read everything before you jump to conclusions please.

LittleLantanas11 votes

i feel like i just read one a script of a "do you need a lawyer" ad on tv

ThePartyLeader9 votes

Just out of curiosity what part of it effects you and league. Employment Transportation FCC Justice

Also what part of your chat is it that they need to accommodate for? You can just move it off the screen if you don't want to look at it.

ModMod Curator9 votes

{quoted}

Riot took down the original post, I guess for fear that it might rally too much support.

I checked your removal history and you have had zero posts removed on this account.

If you want me to look into why this was removed to clarify it for you, you'll need to post the account you actually made the discussion on.

Sun Wukong Sun8 votes

Actually, you relinquished those rights when you signed up for this game. Remember when you made an account and said you accept their terms and conditions? Remember when you swore to the way of the Summoner's Code?

Playing this game is a privilege, one that can be taken from you if you don't honor your word.

Having a mental illness that makes you subject to outburst is ok when orally expressed. Fortunately for the League community, that argument wouldn't hold in court because it isn't considered impulsive when you type/text/write it out. There's a thought process behind it, meaning even if you were Mr. Hyde, you'd have time to consider your actions before you finished your message and pressed enter.

Lastly, if your rage really did fall under a mental category, typing spiteful messages wouldn't be a symptom. You'd be more likely to break your keyboard and smash your computer to pieces. Also, if mental illness were the case, your doctor would advise you to stay away from gaming since it's the source of your most recent episodes. With that said, you'd also be in violation of your rehabilitation.

Love, An Educated Gamer

scazzman2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Irelia Wukong,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=XUdyOQH6,comment-id=0009,timestamp=2016-06-05T06:33:22.263+0000)

Actually, you relinquished those rights when you signed up for this game. Remember when you made an account and said you accept their terms and conditions? Remember when you swore to the way of the Summoner's Code?

Playing this game is a privilege, one that can be taken from you if you don't honor your word.

Having a mental illness that makes you subject to outburst is ok when orally expressed. Fortunately for the League community, that argument wouldn't hold in court because it isn't considered impulsive when you type/text/write it out. There's a thought process behind it, meaning even if you were Mr. Hyde, you'd have time to consider your actions before you finished your message and pressed enter.

Lastly, if your rage really did fall under a mental category, typing spiteful messages wouldn't be a symptom. You'd be more likely to break your keyboard and smash your computer to pieces. Also, if mental illness were the case, your doctor would advise you to stay away from gaming since it's the source of your most recent episodes. With that said, you'd also be in violation of your rehabilitation.

Love, An Educated Gamer

actually. the ADA act is one of the few things a company cant weasel thier way out of with "i agree" example : if a restaraunt had a policy of "no service animals" or "no wheelchairs" they would shut down very quickly even if they had a sign in bold letters on the lawn

Nik Nikerson1 votes

Yes, but there's not a denial of services based upon your disability, so Title III doesn't apply.

engager081 votes

[{quoted}](name=Nik Nikerson,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=XUdyOQH6,comment-id=000900000000,timestamp=2016-06-05T08:10:15.882+0000)

Yes, but there's not a denial of services based upon your disability, so Title III doesn't apply.

It's the denial of service based on the lack there of an accommodation. it's the denial of services based on symptoms of my disability, so it is the EXACT same.

I can keep at this all day. Wanna keep bullying me?

Awkward Couch5 votes

{quoted}

It's the denial of service based on the lack there of an accommodation. it's the denial of services based on symptoms of my disability, so it is the EXACT same.

I can keep at this all day. Wanna keep bullying me?

Disagreeing =/= bullying. Nik was neither abrasive nor bullying.

engager081 votes

[{quoted}](name=Irelia Wukong,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=XUdyOQH6,comment-id=0009,timestamp=2016-06-05T06:33:22.263+0000)

Actually, you relinquished those rights when you signed up for this game. Remember when you made an account and said you accept their terms and conditions? Remember when you swore to the way of the Summoner's Code?

Playing this game is a privilege, one that can be taken from you if you don't honor your word.

Actually, signing something does not relinquish any rights. If you relinquish your civil right, it is not legally enforceable in court. Also, you don't know what my doctor advised. I sent a note from my Doctor to league of legends where he requested my chat be removed, as the toxic exchanges are the only thing wrong. He viewed the game as otherwise being therapeutic for me.

Because it's a typed message it's different? I don't think any court would see it that way.

Sun Wukong Sun3 votes

Honestly, you can be taken to court for violation of their rules/laws and you'd lose because you're under contract.

You can also be charged with assault, depending on what you said, it may be a felony charge.

Stop making excuses for yourself. Like I said, just stop playing the game. Nobody is forcing you. You're torturing yourself.

Reket DeAlk5 votes

Don't think you actually read the link you posted. All that says is that no one with a mental disability can be denied a job because of said disability. No where does it say anything about online interactions on a game.

scazzman2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Reket DeAlk,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=XUdyOQH6,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2016-06-05T05:07:20.471+0000)

Don't think you actually read the link you posted. All that says is that no one with a mental disability can be denied a job because of said disability. No where does it say anything about online interactions on a game.

a business also cannot deny a person with a service animal. or kick them out simply because they're disabled, and are required to provide reasonable accommodations such as wheelchair ramps to customers. a similar scenario with league. is if a person with autism can't use chat without getting triggered by people taunting or provoking them. and muting is too easy to turn off. a manual removal of chat is a more than reasonable accomodation.

Reket DeAlk7 votes

{quoted}

a business also cannot deny a person with a service animal. or kick them out simply because they're disabled, and are required to provide reasonable accommodations such as wheelchair ramps to customers. a similar scenario with league. is if a person with autism can't use chat without getting triggered by people taunting or provoking them. and muting is too easy to turn off. a manual removal of chat is a more than reasonable accomodation.

Except they aren't getting kicked out because they're disabled. They're kicked out because they go against the rules that everyone has to follow.

You can move the chat box yourself. No need for Riot to do it. Otherwise they would have to offer it to everyone. Then communication in a team game becomes harder.

Firu7 votes

Reasonable accommodation is a term used for selection and hiring practices by the EEOC, Scazzman. I know your situation and issues with dealing with the frustration. Trust me though, this OP is completely wrong and could not be more inaccurate in using this to justify toxicity.

engager081 votes

{quoted}

Reasonable accommodation is a term used for selection and hiring practices by the EEOC, Scazzman. I know your situation and issues with dealing with the frustration. Trust me though, this OP is completely wrong and could not be more inaccurate in using this to justify toxicity.

I'm not trying to justify my toxicity. I'm trying to say that when I asked riot for help, realizing that I had a problem, they refused to even answer me. The ADA goes beyond hiring practices. It also includes business practices.

scazzman1 votes

{quoted}

I'm not trying to justify my toxicity. I'm trying to say that when I asked riot for help, realizing that I had a problem, they refused to even answer me. The ADA goes beyond hiring practices. It also includes business practices.

he is technically correct

Firu10 votes

No, he isn't. The furthest it goes to is dealing with employees. Not customer interactions.

scazzman1 votes

{quoted}

No, he isn't. The furthest it goes to is dealing with employees. Not customer interactions.

Title III - Public Accommodations and Services Operated by Private Entities Prohibits places of public accommodation from discriminating against individuals with disabilities. Public accommodations include privately-owned, leased or operated facilities like hotels, restaurants, retail merchants, doctor’s offices, golf courses, private schools, day care centers, health clubs, sports stadiums, movie theaters, and so on. Sets the minimum standards for accessibility for alterations and new construction of commercial facilities and privately owned public accommodations. It also requires public accommodations to remove barriers in existing buildings where it is easy to do so without much difficulty or expense. Directs businesses to make "reasonable modifications" to their usual ways of doing things when serving people with disabilities. Requires that businesses take steps necessary to communicate effectively with customers with vision, hearing, and speech disabilities. Regulated and enforced by the U.S. Department of Justice (link is external).

its under title 3. straight from adata.org

Surr20plz5 votes

{quoted}

Title III - Public Accommodations and Services Operated by Private Entities Prohibits places of public accommodation from discriminating against individuals with disabilities. Public accommodations include privately-owned, leased or operated facilities like hotels, restaurants, retail merchants, doctor’s offices, golf courses, private schools, day care centers, health clubs, sports stadiums, movie theaters, and so on. Sets the minimum standards for accessibility for alterations and new construction of commercial facilities and privately owned public accommodations. It also requires public accommodations to remove barriers in existing buildings where it is easy to do so without much difficulty or expense. Directs businesses to make "reasonable modifications" to their usual ways of doing things when serving people with disabilities. Requires that businesses take steps necessary to communicate effectively with customers with vision, hearing, and speech disabilities. Regulated and enforced by the U.S. Department of Justice (link is external).

its under title 3. straight from adata.org

There is nothing in there that calls for the nonsense you're asking for.

scazzman2 votes

{quoted}

There is nothing in there that calls for the nonsense you're asking for.

Directs businesses to make "reasonable modifications" to their usual ways of doing things when serving people with disabilities.

Surr20plz3 votes

{quoted}

Directs businesses to make "reasonable modifications" to their usual ways of doing things when serving people with disabilities.

No. Just no.

What you're asking for is UNREASONABLE.

They have given you the button to turn off chat.

It ends there.

GG

NO RE

scazzman1 votes

{quoted}

No. Just no.

What you're asking for is UNREASONABLE.

They have given you the button to turn off chat.

It ends there.

GG

NO RE

they actually havent. /mute all is too easy to re disable to be considered an effective accomidation

Reket DeAlk6 votes

{quoted}

they actually havent. /mute all is too easy to re disable to be considered an effective accomidation

So if a person in a wheelchair knows about the access ramp but chooses to use the stairs, is that the fault of the business?

If you refuse to use what Riot has given you, that is on you. They are not accountable if you willingly ignore the solution given to you.

It's called "personal accountability". Try it.

Surr20plz3 votes

[{quoted}](name=Reket DeAlk,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=XUdyOQH6,comment-id=000600000002000100000000000000000000000100000000,timestamp=2016-06-05T06:56:01.072+0000)

So if a person in a wheelchair knows about the access ramp but chooses to use the stairs, is that the fault of the business?

If you refuse to use what Riot has given you, that is on you. They are not accountable if you willingly ignore the solution given to you.

It's called "personal accountability". Try it.

THIS ^

engager081 votes

[{quoted}](name=Reket DeAlk,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=XUdyOQH6,comment-id=000600000002000100000000000000000000000100000000,timestamp=2016-06-05T06:56:01.072+0000)

So if a person in a wheelchair knows about the access ramp but chooses to use the stairs, is that the fault of the business?

If you refuse to use what Riot has given you, that is on you. They are not accountable if you willingly ignore the solution given to you.

It's called "personal accountability". Try it.

No court of law is going to see it that way. Title 3 requires the accommodation be outside of their way of doing things. Such as, if the wheelchair ramp wasn't enough, and you needed an employee to push you up it. Just because there is an accommodation doesn't make it sufficient.

Reket DeAlk5 votes

{quoted}

No court of law is going to see it that way. Title 3 requires the accommodation be outside of their way of doing things. Such as, if the wheelchair ramp wasn't enough, and you needed an employee to push you up it. Just because there is an accommodation doesn't make it sufficient.

And no court of law is going to listen to you complain that you got banned from a game for breaking the rules of the game.

Riot hasn't discriminated you because of your disability. You were caught breaking their rules and banned. Simple as that.

engager081 votes

{quoted}

No. Just no.

What you're asking for is UNREASONABLE.

They have given you the button to turn off chat.

It ends there.

GG

NO RE

Title 3 calls for an accommodation that is different from their normal way of doing things. If it's available to everyone, it's not an accommodation.

Surr20plz5 votes

{quoted}

Title 3 calls for an accommodation that is different from their normal way of doing things. If it's available to everyone, it's not an accommodation.

HAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

You're a joke bro.

Nik Nikerson3 votes

Well, technically it can be. Say a business only has a ramp leading to it's entrance instead of stairs. That's an accommodation even though everyone uses it.

engager081 votes

{quoted}

No, he isn't. The furthest it goes to is dealing with employees. Not customer interactions.

"Title III covers businesses and nonprofit service providers that are public accommodations, privately operated entities offering certain types of courses and examinations, privately operated transportation, and commercial facilities. Public accommodations are private entities who own, lease, lease to, or operate facilities such as restaurants, retail stores, hotels, movie theaters, private schools, convention centers, doctors' offices, homeless shelters, transportation depots, zoos, funeral homes, day care centers, and recreation facilities including sports stadiums and fitness clubs. Transportation services provided by private entities are also covered by title III."

Yes, I am correct.

Firu4 votes

Reread what you just posted. You are interpreting it wrong.

engager081 votes

{quoted}

Reread what you just posted. You are interpreting it wrong.

Actually you are. I can get a lawyer to interpret it for everyone. Unless you wanna argue that riot isn't a business. There is no distinction made between an online or physical retail store, only that it must provide an accommodation.

Nik Nikerson5 votes

It's not a private entity that owns, leases, leases to, or operates facilities though. A door to door salesman may constitute a business, but that business is not subject to Title III, because there is no place of accommodation involved in that business.

According to the Ninth Circuit Court, Title III applies only when there is a “nexus” between a service offered over the Internet and a physical place of public accommodation. So there is that distinction.

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