Boards›Player Behavior

Invalid Instant Feedback Escalation

The Art of Wards··3 votes·758 views

tl;dr Instant Feedback will give you a 15 day ban if you type 'kys', even if you're quoting someone that literally told you to do it, and not actually encouraging someone else to commit suicide

I think there's a problem with Instant Feedback. I recently received a (deserved) 10-Game Chat Restriction. I played through that, tempered my behavior (not enough, obviously), and continued.

Tonight I logged in with a 2-Week Suspension. According to the Instant Feedback FAQ, this is the appropriate escalation path:

First Offense: 10 Game Chat Restriction Second Offense: 25 Game Chat Restriction Third Offense: Two Week Suspension Fourth Offense: Permanent Suspension

'However, it is possible to skip to a Two Week or Permanent suspension based on the severity of the behavior in the game. Excessive negative behavior can result in a Two-Week or Permanent suspension at any time without having a chat restriction on the account.'

So, apparently, the Instant Feedback System thinks that my behavior was so severely awful that it skipped the 25-Game Restriction and jumped straight to a two week suspension. Now, I'm not disputing that my behavior wasn't potentially deserving of another Chat Restrictions, but this system lacks context, and that's a problem. Had I received a Chat Restriction, I could have powered through the games with Mute-All and actually gotten the Ranked Rewards I earned this season. They might only have been Silver Rewards, but I started in B5 this season and the climb was a big deal for me.

I'm nearly 100% certain that the system saw 'kys' in the chat logs, and instantly escalated that to a two week suspension based on that fact alone. The problem? I was quoting someone else that told me and our top lane to kill ourselves, not telling anyone else to do it.

The following are the games that got me banned - I'd like to reiterate that I understand some sort of punishment was justified, but I think the system saw 'kys' and automatically escalated to a 2 week suspension despite the context

Game 1 [A couple of people are pinging our AFK Kayn and Trist at the start of the game. Kayn comes in and tells everyone to shut up, Trist jumps straight to 'KYS'] Jånnå: That's a little rude for the first thing to be said, don't you think? Jånnå: Right then. Jånnå: Well Jånnå: I knwo someone going on mute and getting reported Jånnå: Yeah and your duo is a toxic pos who just told the team to kill themselves. [I get it. I shouldn't have engaged with them.] Jånnå: I knwo who I'd rather be duoed with Jånnå: Muted. [I unmute Kayn because he wasn't actually with Trist, he continues being extremely toxic to the rest of us - fun fact, we also got Instant Feedback Reports after this game that action was taken against at least one of them.] Jånnå: well here I thought I'd take you off mute since you weren't duo with the toxic trist Jånnå: But I guess not Jånnå: No Jånnå: Yeah peopel get upset at jerks. Weird. Jånnå: He's got everyone on mute, so type to him until your fingers fall off. [Referring to my own Duo Partner. I should have done this too, not disputing that] Jånnå: You're gonna have to go back on mute. Jånnå: Then you should have used it. [Kayn complains that when people have him muted, he can't communicate with them so he won't gank any lane that has him muted. I actually never put him back on mute, despite saying I would. If I had, this probably would have been avoided. I get that.] Jånnå: TIL pings aren't communication. Jånnå: lol Jånnå: because that made sense Jånnå: If he muted your pings, don't you think I'd tell you that when I told you he muted you8? Jånnå: Right Jånnå: And you can Jånnå: Smart. Jånnå: A good jg knows when lane needs help Jånnå: Sall Im saying Jånnå: How has he been an asshole when he's not even engaging with you? Jånnå: And I'm the triggered one. Aiight. Jånnå: He called the people pinging you clowns. Jånnå: You don't know how to read. [Kayn continues to complain about our top.] Jånnå: Or he's. You know. Pushing top while they're all busy elsewhere. Jånnå: Imagine doing something that isn't being an asshole. Jånnå: Wow [Kayn Goes AFK for 3 Minutes] Jånnå: Guess yo8u're being reported for afk as well as being toxic. cool. Jånnå: He called you a 12 year old because the first thing you said to your team was 'shut up' when we pinge dyou into game Jånnå: Knock it off, jfc. Jånnå: Hates toxic people like you and trist. Jånnå: Yeah. Funny how that happens. Jånnå: 'kys; is toxic, trist. yeah. okie indeed [This is the part that I think caused the punishment to escalate past a chat restriction and onto a suspension - I said KYS, but I was quoting someone else] Jånnå: ... Yes. Jånnå: Yes, when trist syas 'kys' Jånnå: And teemo says 'saying kys is toxic' Jånnå: What? Jånnå: Are you TRYING to make sense? Jånnå: Alright. You're not trying to make sense. Alright. Jånnå: lol. Yeah, the 1/4/19 raka troleld all game. Jånnå: Make more sense.

I'm posting the other two games on the report because I have nothing to hide, I understand my behavior was out of line but it doesn't call for a 2 week suspension (skipping the 25 game chat restriction).

Game 2 Jånnå: ? Jånnå: Good ward clear. Jånnå: They came because they knew you were going there. Jånnå: That's the first time they've been here tho lol Jånnå: They cam ebecause they knew you were going there. Jånnå: Does it feel good to finally be relevent? Jånnå: Well, numbers say we're winning, so. Jånnå: And the kills Jånnå: And the lack of deaths Jånnå: Those too Jånnå: ONLY A LITTLE Jånnå: I think we're still winning Jånnå: We didn't kill you with jg lol Jånnå: That was all varus Jånnå: Let's not foccus the tank supp when we go in on them, y eah? Jånnå: Can we not all be in one lane Jånnå: When they're pushing Jånnå: Please Jånnå: Normal != make bad decisions Jånnå: That doesn't mean people should make bad decisions. Jånnå: Who's his other 3 kills, huh Lux? Jånnå: Ya'll turning toxic for no reason Jånnå: lol Jånnå: 1 != 3, sorry Jånnå: No Jånnå: I just told you guys that not everyone needed to be in one lane while thye were pushing Jånnå: There's nothing toxic about that. Jånnå: You turned it toxic. Jånnå: But no one's mad. Jånnå: ^ Jånnå: And you're on mute. Jånnå: Children. Jånnå: lol Jånnå: You're on mute now, too. Jånnå: Everyone's so toxic for a normal game Jånnå: Who the hell is bitching? Jånnå: The only thing we're doing is responging to your two friends here. Jånnå: If they can't take it, don't dish it. Jånnå: You learn that when you're ten. Jånnå: I guess everyone's going on mute and being reported. Jfc. Jånnå: It's normals. All I did was make a statement. Jånnå: You all turned it toxic. Jånnå: Lol. Jånnå: Apparently we're toxic for pointing out one bad call earlier. Jånnå: So yeah, need to let loose. Jånnå: Oh, I'm sorry. You did in private, mb. Jånnå: No, we got quiet because our team went toxic, and it was better to say nothing to no one at all. Jånnå: Yeah, that's why. Jånnå: Not too good because you couldn't push nexus. 😕 Jånnå: Talk to my Varus. He decided being toxic with his trio was more important than actually playing for objectives. Jånnå: Hey yeah I didn't run in to die

Game 3 Jånnå: very nice, sir Jånnå: omfg. Jånnå: can we like Jånnå: try pushing or something? Jånnå: Bard's never here to protect her Jånnå: Beautiful boys Jånnå: For...what? Jånnå: it is Jånnå: Literally every bard supp I have ever seen roams Jånnå: lol no you haven't Jånnå: Well it seemed to work out for you mid lane so Jånnå: I'm unsure why you're upset Jånnå: ....? Jånnå: What ar eyou talking about this time? Jånnå: Poorly, apparently, because nothing he's saying is making sense. Jånnå: Mute. Move on. Jånnå: Hey guys Jånnå: Keep your bitching to team chat Jånnå: Because I see toxicity Jånnå: And it's not from Bard Jånnå: Well then follow his example Jånnå: Because you're on the road to getting YOURSELVES r eported. Jånnå: Mute each other. Jånnå: Move on. Jånnå: You can be toxic to me all you want. I know what a mute button is Jånnå: You can push if you want kog Jånnå: I can hold bot Jånnå: wow. Jånnå: But not quite. Jånnå: I wasn't even there in time. That was kog.

17 Comments

EvilDustMan3 votes

Send a ticket to Riot. You probably deserve a punishment but not an escalation.

The Art of Wards2 votes

I did submit a ticket, with most of this information (the main points being that yes, I did technically type that, but it was without context). Mostly I'm posting here in the hopes that this might be addressed by a Rioter faster than a support ticket (which is apparently backed up due to high volume of tickets at the time).

NightSpectre3 votes

LOL. I feel you bro. My account got permabanned. There's a lot of illogical things that happen. I just gave up on League afterwards; didn't want to go through the gruesome process of getting it unbanned. Not my mess to clean up. At the end of the day, most people who play are like under 15, children basically. Can't afford to hurt their feelings. Just watch your language and you should be fine.

Anastaecia2 votes

"I know what a mute button is"

Do you? Because if you did, you wouldn't have a bible of chat for each game. Not sure how the system works, but I don't think you got it for the quoted KYSs. Just general constant harassment all game. Just stop typing and play. You even mention it's normals. Why are you getting all upset about it that you need to type that much?

Homiedinger2 votes

Instant Feedback is literally just a bot, so the odds are decent it was for the KYS actually.

Anastaecia2 votes

They wouldn't list other games without "kys" if they weren't part of it.

The Art of Wards1 votes

There was profanity in the other two chat logs, which is probably what it picked up on (that deserves a chat restiction if considered 'constant harassment', sure, but not straight to two week account ban). I also recently found out that 'asking for other players' to report someone is considered harassment. Even though I didn't do this, I did point out that I would be reporting [said person], or that, in the case of Game #3, the enemy team (who was harassing their Bard in All Chat for roaming) was on their way to earning their own reports for said harassment.

So yes. I understand that through my own fault, I probably deserve a chat restriction, because I'm easily engaged with and need to constantly remind myself to USE the mute button. I also understand that I probably used some picked-up on trigger words in some of these chats.

But not within the context deserving of skipping a second offense 25-chat restriction straight to a two week account ban.

Anastaecia1 votes

I actually read these threads to try and figure out Riot's system, since it is so sketchy. I would like to know as well. I would think that using quotes around something would negate it, but then again, Riot might see that as a way to circumvent the punishment. I know in one of my previous games, using asterisks manually to hide a word was punishable.

NightSpectre2 votes

I think that the problem is that there simply are too many people who can't deal with insults. So to resolve issues and complaints in a rapid method, they just have a bot look for keywords and give punishment accordingly. Unfortunately, context isn't considered. Here's my post on the problem if you want to read it, https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/player-behavior-moderation/VqHFwLc3-the-holistic-approach-to-the-instant-feedback-system

Homiedinger2 votes

So I obviously don't work for Riot, but I do work on automation like this and Riot has been fairly open with how the system works in the past. Here's the flow as I understand it:

• Someone is reported and a bot reviews the case. • Bot searches for abusive keywords. If a certain threshold is met, the game is flagged and a 'case' is started. • After enough games, (usually when the case is 3-5 games long), an automatic punishment is triggered. • Tier of the punishment is based on prior punishments, except if any of the games include 'excessive negative behavior'. Again the way to track this is either an excessive number of games added to the case in a short period of time (not the case here, this is at the 3-game minimum) or, again, based on keywords. The keywords to search for for something like this would be 'kys', hate speech (common racial or homophobic slurs) etc. Either case results in a skip to either the two-week or permanent ban. If their system works anything like the stuff I've worked on, a permanent ban likely has to go through human review first, but the 2 week one doesn't. • The Player is informed of their punishment, and all games in the case are listed.

This is pretty easily verifiable, since you can find plenty of reports of people that were instantly two-week-banned without even a single chat restriction for saying 'kys'.

Anastaecia1 votes

I know "kys" is a thing. My point is that it was probably a combo of that and the harassment in the other 2 games...otherwise why would the system post them in the punishment notification. Think about it...why not post some random game with no punishable material? Because it's not relevant.

Homiedinger2 votes

Not sure you're listening, neither myself nor OP have claimed the other games aren't punishable.

The claim is that the KYS inclusion inappropriately escalated the punishment to a 2 week suspension when the next tier of punishment should have been a 25 game chat restriction.

Anastaecia1 votes

And my point is that maybe the "KYS" alone wasn't the reason for the 2-weeker. AGAIN, why would they post 2 other games if they weren't part of the overall picture?

Homiedinger1 votes

They are part of the case that triggered an automatic punishment.

An automatic punishment that was escalated by inappropriate keyword detection. As described above, each game isn't its own case. A case was already building for the next tier of punishment, but the most recent game - the one with kys - finished it up and escalated the punishment.

They're included because, like I said, all games that contributed to the punishment are included in the 'report card'.

There's absolutely nothing in the rest of the games that should call for a 2 week suspension; it's only supposed to skip a tier if something more extreme or severe is detected. The other games contain no hate speech, and it's not a matter of volume (since the report card is at the three game minimum.)

The only 'extreme' or 'severe' toxicity present in any of these is 'kys'.

Anastaecia1 votes

And you know what Riot considers "severe"? I just looked into the system. The thing learns (words and phrases) based on previous reports. There isn't just a standard list of "bad" words, which I already said. SO, again my point is that all 3 games are part of the punishment. Perhaps the "kys" since it was in quotes (or other punctuation) wasn't the cause.

I'm not here arguing whether the OP deserved the escalation or not. Doesn't seem like it personally (again, this is purely based on past chat logs I've read and the punishments that went with thiem). I'm just discussing why the system did what it did.

The Art of Wards2 votes

According to the Rioter who serviced my ticket on this issue:

"I reviewed this with my team and we've decided to reduce this 2 week suspension.... The reason you were issued it was because you were quoting another player who was saying "kys" so I would avoid doing this."

So yes - there was a running ticket going, because someone had reported me previously (those two listed games), probably for harassment (because people tend to do so when you tell them you're going to report them, because muh feelings or something). That third game, that included that quote, was the minimum threshold for an open case being punished. I highly doubt it would have been punished at ALL, had it been another case of 'this person harassed me' and that particular quote HADN'T been flagged by the system.

But it was there, it was recognized, and so not only was the case in 'punishable' territory, but it was escalated to the next tier because of that one word.

So, tl;dr - as stated above, the 'KYS' was the ENTIRE reason for the 2-week ban.

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