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Permanently banned, absolutely disgusted...

Snäkë··2 votes·2,269 views

Does anyone know any other game in the world where you spends hundreds on what is basically new colours and then the game developers just remove the game from you? I find it absolutely disgusting that I spend so much money with them, but the fact I'm a rather competitive 23 year old that likes to use rash words in any game or sport means I'm not allowed to play their game. I can't help the way I am... to be honest I'd prefer a permanent chat ban, I can still use pings to assist the team, yes I can /mute all but some games I prefer to leave it on because there are some genuinely nice people out there but I can guarantee if you check all my chat logs there is someone provoking me. That's like saying someone just hit me first but because I hit him back twice as hard and broke his nose I'm the one that gets the blame, because i'm the one that stuck up for myself instead of just walking away. People deal with things in different ways, people have different emotions, some can't just easily walk away.

I just can't believe they can take away all your money like that... I find it so unfair... if people don't like the way I speak in the game why don't they just mute me then? Everyone is happy then.

I wish for my ban to be lifted or a refund of course but I know I will only get a generic reply. My point is, I don't think there should be bans at all... what does it achieve? I can make a new account... I'm still just as toxic, except I will spending no money at all with them now... Every time I got banned it just aggravated me even more, so whats all the rubbish about its meant to reform me? As you can tell now, it only makes me more annoyed.

You need a different system to 'reform' players cause all you are doing is losing money and still having those players around on different accounts...

I prefer constructive criticism. Not blind accusations.

54 Comments

Sarutobi5 votes

Basically any other service (video game, streaming service, anything) has a ToS like this. Play any other online game and break the rules you will not get anything you spent money on. its basically common sense at this point. But overall you did accept the terms of service, and in turn you broke the rules. Now I dont know how you did it, but i can only assume you were toxic in numerous games. Unless you show us your reform card/email which gives evidence of this, then there is nothing we can do. But all in all, every other ToS has some form of this, so why people are up in arms about this now is kind of mind boggling.

Snäkë1 votes

{quoted}

Basically any other service (video game, streaming service, anything) has a ToS like this. Play any other online game and break the rules you will not get anything you spent money on. its basically common sense at this point. But overall you did accept the terms of service, and in turn you broke the rules. Now I dont know how you did it, but i can only assume you were toxic in numerous games. Unless you show us your reform card/email which gives evidence of this, then there is nothing we can do. But all in all, every other ToS has some form of this, so why people are up in arms about this now is kind of mind boggling.

It's not the money, do you know any other game that just says 'you can no longer play this game', what exactly does it achieve if I can actually just make another account? If anything I'll be more bitter. I'm basically poking holes at the 'reform' system. I am a toxic player I admit that, I am in anything, I like to win, I am competitive, I can't help that. I just don't see why 'perma banning' me is going to make any difference? It makes me worse, but on another account. You see?

Z Statistic5 votes

Then you'll be banned. The cycle continues until you simply don't want to play anymore. They've already exhausted their means to try to reform you; this is basically an amputation, and you're effectively being a rather annoying piece of necrotic tissue.

Snäkë2 votes

And so back to my point, what have they achieved? What has this system done? Made the game more toxic. This is my point of the entire argument.

SmokedAlmonds6 votes

In your specific case, maybe it accomplished nothing. But the system is much bigger than any one case. Most people learn their lesson and change after the lesser punishments. Most players will never get to the point of being permanently banned.

If you have no desire to follow the rules then there really isn't anything riot or anyone else can do to change that. People being able to create new accounts are just a downside of the game being free to play.

I'm sure riot would love to be able to require something like a social security number so that they could bar permanently banned players from making new accounts. But people wouldn't go for that.

Snäkë1 votes

{quoted}

In your specific case, maybe it accomplished nothing. But the system is much bigger than any one case. Most people learn their lesson and change after the lesser punishments. Most players will never get to the point of being permanently banned.

If you have no desire to follow the rules then there really isn't anything riot or anyone else can do to change that. People being able to create new accounts are just a downside of the game being free to play.

I'm sure riot would love to be able to require something like a social security number so that they could bar permanently banned players from making new accounts. But people wouldn't go for that.

So people who are verbally abusive get tarred with the same brush as those that intentionally ruin games? Well that's one way to solve the problem I guess. So if we nuke Syria and kill all the country, that would get rid of the terrorists right?

Jorencice4 votes

Except than analogy is wrong.

That would be like banning people that didn't do anything either.

It would be more like giving the death penalty to everyone that has more than 20 year sentence.

They are still bad guys. Just maybe not bad enough to warrant a death penalty.

And I'm completely fine with that.

SmokedAlmonds3 votes

Both ruin games. Both are unwanted. Both are considered unacceptable. So yes, the end of the line for each of them is permanently removing them.

Your nuke analogy is awful. You aren't collateral damage of a system targeting trolls. You are the target of the system. You weren't standing in the wrong place and got hit by a nuke, you were taken out by a sniper shot. Maybe if the policy was to ban all 10 players in every game that has someone who is verbally abusive in it then your analogy might work.

Sarutobi1 votes

{quoted}

It's not the money, do you know any other game that just says 'you can no longer play this game', what exactly does it achieve if I can actually just make another account? If anything I'll be more bitter. I'm basically poking holes at the 'reform' system. I am a toxic player I admit that, I am in anything, I like to win, I am competitive, I can't help that. I just don't see why 'perma banning' me is going to make any difference? It makes me worse, but on another account. You see?

Then the cycle will only continue, and if anything you will just get ban faster. Its suppose to be a punishment, you break the rules, you get locked out of your account. You can choose to make a new account, but if you continue this type of behavior you will only get ban again!

Snäkë1 votes

{quoted}

Then the cycle will only continue, and if anything you will just get ban faster. Its suppose to be a punishment, you break the rules, you get locked out of your account. You can choose to make a new account, but if you continue this type of behavior you will only get ban again!

So really they haven't achieved anything, they just made the game more toxic, and can't be arsed dealing with the problem is what you are saying?

LostFr0st1 votes

Out of sheer curiosity, how would you want them to deal with the problem?

Snäkë1 votes

{quoted}

Out of sheer curiosity, how would you want them to deal with the problem?

I actually prefer it when I have the chat ban... I'd prefer to be put permanently on a chat ban... at least first...

Deep Terror Nami5 votes

If you prefer it, it's not much of a punishment.

Snäkë1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Deep Terror Nami,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=UEE0g3QV,comment-id=0001000000010000000000000000,timestamp=2016-02-29T14:20:02.557+0000)

If you prefer it, it's not much of a punishment.

But when I have a chat ban something says to me that if I need to communicate with my team I must use tehm efficiently... so it does in fact reform me... its as soon as the chat ban goes that I lapse into being abusive again. Understand?

DrCyanide1 votes

The old system just stacked the chat restrictions. Players would get hundreds or thousands of games with chat restrictions, but they'd use their limited words the same as always, harassing their teammates. Honestly, there's no real reason to believe you'd behave any differently than they did.

Competitive and harassing teammates don't need to go hand in hand you know.

Deep Terror Nami4 votes

http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/f/cIfEodbz/d/45xUUKxk?comment=000400000001

LostFr0st2 votes

When they give you your initial chat restrictions, do they suggest in the text to try explaining to your team that the chat distracts you (don't tell them why) and saying you're gonna 'mute all' as the game is starting? My friend did that and it seemed to work for him. I'm wondering if that would work for other people too if they suggested it.

On a side note: my cousin had a chat ban for a while (he's super competitive and plays a ton of sports; was calling people 'kiddo' in-game rofl), then he got a string of people that put him on tilt and learned spam ping language.

I didn't even know that spam pingers had their own morse code until then.

Savage Devi1 votes

Who's to say people with permanent chat bans aren't just going to find new ways to vent, like feeding or ping spamming? Essentially, you just want another step on the ban-ladder, which is a terrible idea. The more chances you give to toxic players, the more they will ruin games. The 3 punishments before a permaban are enough second chances already.

Deep Terror Nami1 votes

That is exactly the reasoning Riot had for removing stacking chat restrictions (essentially perma restrictions for those that didn't change);

http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/f/cIfEodbz/d/45xUUKxk?comment=000400000001

Snäkë1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Savage Devi,realm=EUNE,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=UEE0g3QV,comment-id=0001000000010000000000000002,timestamp=2016-02-29T14:36:16.783+0000)

Who's to say people with permanent chat bans aren't just going to find new ways to vent, like feeding or ping spamming? Essentially, you just want another step on the ban-ladder, which is a terrible idea. The more chances you give to toxic players, the more they will ruin games. The 3 punishments before a permaban are enough second chances already.

Yes but someone who is only being verbally abusive shouldn't be persecuted with the same restrictions as some one who is actually doing something intentionally to ruin the game... at THAT point I can understand perma banning people you see what I'm getting at?

Awkward Couch1 votes

{quoted}

Yes but someone who is only being verbally abusive shouldn't be persecuted with the same restrictions as some one who is actually doing something intentionally to ruin the game... at THAT point I can understand perma banning people you see what I'm getting at?

If it's to the point where you're toxic enough for me to report you, you are ruining the game for me. I've had it happen more than once where I've gotten told "your mother should have aborted you" or "you should go hang yourself for wasting my time you worthless piece of shit". I have suffered from depression for quite a while, almost 10 years, and have had to go to the mental hospital 3 times under suicide watch. So someone who is "competitive" and "toxic" telling me to kill myself since I ks'd them once, especially when I am already depressed, you ruin the game for me.

Savage Devi1 votes

Actually a majority of permabanned players do leave forever. Can't do much about the ones than don't but this is the most effective measure.

Snäkë1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Savage Devi,realm=EUNE,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=UEE0g3QV,comment-id=00010000000100000001,timestamp=2016-02-29T14:23:21.581+0000)

Actually a majority of permabanned players do leave forever. Can't do much about the ones than don't but this is the most effective measure.

See theres the problem I'm getting at, people who are just verbally abusive are getting tarred with the same brush as those who intentionally ruin games, understand?

1374342 votes

People who are verbally abusive to the point where they earn perma bans are ruining games, so who cares if they are getting tarred with the same brush. I don't care if you intended to ruin my game or not. Listening to teammates harassing each other, or enemies harassing us on all chat, or enemies harassing each other in all chat, is annoying.

Awkward Couch1 votes

{quoted}

It's not the money, do you know any other game that just says 'you can no longer play this game', what exactly does it achieve if I can actually just make another account? If anything I'll be more bitter. I'm basically poking holes at the 'reform' system. I am a toxic player I admit that, I am in anything, I like to win, I am competitive, I can't help that. I just don't see why 'perma banning' me is going to make any difference? It makes me worse, but on another account. You see?

The hope is, that you either learn from your mistake or you just leave the game all together. Riot doesn't care if you start another free account, so if you so wish to, start another account and don't spend a dime on the game.

I understand that you are competitive, and that's perfectly ok. The problem is, how do you portray your competitiveness? Because this is a team game, not an individual game. What good does it do to rage at the mid lane who give up first blood? In the end, you might feel a little better typing out your frustration, but how does that help your team in any way?

Finally, Riot can't really stop you from making a new account if they really wanted to. Because of things like VPN's, families who share 1 computer, or even dorm rooms, Riot can't ban out IP's.

proud and bronze2 votes

there is no other game in the world that will ban you for saying 'you are bad'

Savage Devi1 votes

Their loss. Well, of course many of those games simply don't have a reason to do so, getting insulted means much less in say a shooter where you can leave any time you want or an mmo, but in a Moba, you're stuck with that player for 20-40+ minutes, so we're going to have to be strict.

Snäkë1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Savage Devi,realm=EUNE,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=UEE0g3QV,comment-id=000100010001,timestamp=2016-02-29T14:33:27.316+0000)

Their loss. Well, of course many of those games simply don't have a reason to do so, getting insulted means much less in say a shooter where you can leave any time you want or an mmo, but in a Moba, you're stuck with that player for 20-40+ minutes, so we're going to have to be strict.

Thats a fair point I can understand that. Still my point being is that I'm being tarred with the same brush as those that intentionally ruin games whereas I am just being verbally abusive. I still try to help win the game, they could simply mute me and there would be no problem for them. You see what I mean?

Bettnachleger1 votes

And you could simply stfu and there would be no problem for them. You see what I mean?

Savage Devi1 votes

You are intentionally ruining games.

proud and bronze1 votes

i would agree with you IF there wasnt a mute button. no one has to be insulted more than once unless they want to be.

Savage Devi2 votes

Mute button doesn't justify it. Some guy comes next to you as you're sitting on the bus or something and starts yelling at your ear, and everybody around is simply supposed to accept it because they can plug their ears and listen to their iPod playlist to mute the noise? Fuck. No.

proud and bronze1 votes

yelling in your ear is not quite the same as typing a sentence on your screen. especially when you can stop him from doing so any time you choose with one click.

Savage Devi1 votes

It is the same; assholes doing asshole things and you telling it should be allowed because one can choose to ignore it. That description fits both scenarios.

Dominick Destine3 votes

{quoted}

Does anyone know any other game in the world where you spends hundreds on what is basically new colours and then the game developers just remove the game from you?

Literally any MMORPG.

If you act like a sufficient enough puncture, you will be removed.

Laughing Fish2 votes

If you just act decent and show at least the smallest amount of respect for your fellow player you will not get banned. They permanently banned you because you still refuse to admit fault. They have determined (correctly, it would appear) that you are never going to change, and thus they just want you gone completely. Also, you own nothing in the game. You are renting all content for a duration determined by Rito.

Gene Freakz1 votes

You mention fighting back in real life as an analogy to the game. I wouldn't agree with you. Someone punching you threatens your physical well being and could be a danger to others as well. Pacifists such as Gandhi promote non-violence across the board. Words are just words, though. I think that the league community needs to be a little bit tougher in ignoring toxicity that comes their way. We all, however, have agreed to RIOT's term and conditions. It's that simple, if you want to play the game, you have to follow the code. This however does not apply 100% of the time. RIOT allows sparse raging. For the most part, if someone has been permanently banned, they have received ample warnings in order to correct their behavior. I hear that certain hate speech grants one an instance permaban, but these instances vary. It says in their terms and conditions exactly what you have experienced. They are not treating you in any way that they have not already specified. Downvotes are not a reliable indicator of reality, but your post has received a relatively high number of downvotes. Those who are on the forums i.e. your gaming peers, seem to disagree with you.

Snäkë1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Gene Freakz,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=UEE0g3QV,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2016-02-29T14:28:24.642+0000)

You mention fighting back in real life as an analogy to the game. I wouldn't agree with you. Someone punching you threatens your physical well being and could be a danger to others as well. Pacifists such as Gandhi promote non-violence across the board. Words are just words, though. I think that the league community needs to be a little bit tougher in ignoring toxicity that comes their way. We all, however, have agreed to RIOT's term and conditions. It's that simple, if you want to play the game, you have to follow the code. This however does not apply 100% of the time. RIOT allows sparse raging. For the most part, if someone has been permanently banned, they have received ample warnings in order to correct their behavior. I hear that certain hate speech grants one an instance permaban, but these instances vary. It says in their terms and conditions exactly what you have experienced. They are not treating you in any way that they have not already specified. Downvotes are not a reliable indicator of reality, but your post has received a relatively high number of downvotes. Those who are on the forums i.e. your gaming peers, seem to disagree with you.

Sorry for using the wrong analogy... My whole point is literally, nuke an entire country to get rid of the terrorists, does that seem fair? I am only verbally abusive, I don't intentionally feeding or anything, I am still trying to win the game, I just get a bit passionate. So why then am I being shoved into the corner with people who intentionally go out of their way to ruin games? You see?

DrCyanide2 votes

I am only verbally abusive, I don't intentionally feeding or anything, I am still trying to win the game, I just get a bit passionate.

"Passionate" to the point that you're hurting your teams chances of winning. Your teammates don't want to listen to you, possibly don't even want to help you with what you're saying. Soraka has a quote "I will not save you", and there are some players that have that mentality of you get on their nerves enough.

If you want to win more you'd knock it off, helping everyone on the team have a better experience.

My whole point is literally, nuke an entire country to get rid of the terrorists, does that seem fair?

You sure you're 23? I haven't heard anyone make a statement like that since I was in middle school.

Snäkë1 votes

{quoted}

"Passionate" to the point that you're hurting your teams chances of winning. Your teammates don't want to listen to you, possibly don't even want to help you with what you're saying. Soraka has a quote "I will not save you", and there are some players that have that mentality of you get on their nerves enough.

If you want to win more you'd knock it off, helping everyone on the team have a better experience.

You sure you're 23? I haven't heard anyone make a statement like that since I was in middle school.

What have you come here for then? To judge me?

DrCyanide2 votes

No, to tell you if you really want to win (rather than just get angry when you're not winning) you need to change what you say.

TrulyBland1 votes

I think you might want to stop using analogies, no offense.

Nuking an entire country to get rid of the terrorists is obviously not okay, because there is collateral damage, Innocents that get hurt. But you're not innocent; and Riot isn't using indiscriminate weapons. Riot specifically targeted you, as well as the "people who intentionally go out of their way to ruin games". You're also not shoved into the same corner. People who go out of their way to ruin games will likely start right off the bat with a 14-day ban, or worse: They're instantly permabanned for their behaviour. You didn't mention whether you received punishments before, but if you actually are not that bad a person, I'm going to assume you did.

Snäkë1 votes

Well if you all disagree that's fair enough, I find it quite sad that you have gone out of your way just to tell me this... the fact you spend your time scrolling league of legends forums just to do this is very sad. I just wanted to explain why I think the system is flawed, I didn't come here to offend you all... sorry for griping your beloved game. I didn't realise so many people would get their backs up about a game lol. However, thank you to those who did actually give constructive criticism rather than judgement.

FrankerX1 votes

seriously how come ppl up with the idea that riot steals money?

thats like you buy a car. and the car breaks one day. and you're like "give me my money back for the car or i sue you for stealing it" WHAT!? if you make a car crash and they take away your driving license THAT IS YOUR FAULT THAT YOU CANT USE YOUR CAR NOW noone stole shit from you YOU BOUGHT THAT CAR/SKIN ON YOUR OWN WTF???

GRVet3ran0sS1 votes

You got insurance

Colgate Gator1 votes

Reform card or go home.

Trylobyte1 votes

The way I see it is like this.

You go to a fancy restaurant and order a lot of super-expensive food with a non-refundable meal ticket. You then proceed to tell off the waiter, insult the chef, and threaten violence on another customer, so they have you kicked out of the building before you get your food. Then you go to them demanding a refund. You then learn what 'non-refundable' means. RP purchases are non-refundable, too.

Gimpy891 votes

you should have muted yourself after the 2 chat restrictions and 14 day ban.

Kieferr1 votes

I'm with you man. Sad really, that riot caters to cowards and weak willed pawns who can't handle being trash talked and are somehow still unaware of the existence of the convenient mute button right in front of them. But intentional feeders, afkers, and trolls get the green light. I've yet to see any of them banned, cause I have a few that I know whom I monitor occasionally... all still playing up to this day. Frustrating.

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