Got a 14-day suspension by a teammate on purpose

xxdestratimonxx·Oct 19, 2017·136 votes·83,104 views

Hi everyone, I just recieved a 14-day suspension for verbal abuse by a player who was playing Thresh (Username not disclose to follow the board rules) . This started during a ranked-game which I am currently on a promo serie and only needed one more win to move from Silver I to Gold 5. During the ban pick/champ select phase, he made a remark in chat which starts something like this: "My name neck yourself. If you say this four times during the game then I will promise to leave your lane and not feed." Now, I didn't want to dodge the game due to the fact that it'll count as a loss in a promo serie, so I thought I'll just play along to ensure that he doesn't demoralize the group dynamic. Below is the chat log from my in-client behavior reform card: Game 1 xxdestratimonxx: neck yourself neck yourself neck yourself neck yourself xxdestratimonxx: can you leash for me? xxdestratimonxx: ty xxdestratimonxx: <3 xxdestratimonxx: gj xxdestratimonxx: fffff xxdestratimonxx: care xxdestratimonxx: 3 mid xxdestratimonxx: yeah xxdestratimonxx: grou pup

So unfortunately it didn't show the complete conversation, but at the beginning of the game, the Thresh player was peer pressuring everyone by insisting people to follow his instruction while sitting at mid lane ready to ruin the game experience for everyone. Now, I don't know if there was a algorithm that picks up certain words then you automatically gets a suspansion or the thresh player sent a report and I got banned from that. But the fact is he was framing this from the beginning because right after I said "neck yourself", Our top laner who played fiora, explained to me that I just fell into thresh's trap and I probably will receive penalty for it. Unsurprisingly, I got the suspension right after the game ended. Again, I'm not a type of person who likes to verbal abuse other players. I just don't want one player's selfish idea to ruin other people's gaming experience, expecially in a rank game when every game count. And unfortunately I was the victim in this case.

I wish Riot support group could investigate this, maybe go through the chat from the champion selection to in game chat. Because there are other people who are encountering the same thing from this thresh player and this need to be stopped. I felt like I'm innocent yet helpless in this whole situation. It would be great if my suspension could be lifted, but I also know that the company have policy guidline to follow so I don't expect myself to get a pass. I would appreciate the help or response by the staff. Thanks.

_Update: I've never gotten warning nor chat restriction prior to the suspension. So the phrase probably got picked up by the system and deem as extreme hate speech/threats. _

Update 2: I would like to thank everyone who came and contributed to this discussion. I would never imagine these many support/comment from the community. I would also like to give special thanks to the Rioter for lifting my ban as well as continuing with the investigation. It's an awesome feeling to know there are people who stand for the integrity of this game and making sure this type of behavior do not happen again.

310 Comments

DrugothOct 19, 201729 votes

https://theterrellmims.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/dont-feed-the-trolls-meme-03.jpg?w=640

lazerateOct 20, 201716 votes

Same shit happened to me. Best part is. I will not see my Unbanning. Life sucks. I was about to be Silver 5.

RiotRiot TantramOct 20, 2017146 votes

Got you taken care of too. Verified.

My weekend is going to consist of making sure the people starting this stuff are held accountable.

hold my beer.

RàinbowOct 20, 201719 votes

You're the man, Tantram

[slayer-pantheon-thumbs]

DrugothOct 20, 201730 votes

^This guy, needs a raise.

Mysticman89Oct 20, 20174 votes

So with stuff like this, I always wonder about the victims who didn't speak up. Maybe they don't use forums, maybe they just figured that yeah they did say the stuff so accepted their fate, or maybe they don't even realize there is an appeal process, but whenever I see stuff like this I feel bad for anyone who may have been affected who doesn't have the damage undone.

Is there any process you guys do to try to fix all the affected, or does each player need to do their own appeal through support in order to get sorted out?

RiotRiot TantramOct 20, 201750 votes

We are able to determine who was affected by this. I'd certainly open a ticket as well to be 100% certain we have visibility on the issue.

I have also already deployed a system to log all accounts participating in this behavior. It will result in a direct permanent ban.

iamthegoatofwarOct 20, 20173 votes

Tantram you're head of player behavior correct?

RiotRiot TantramOct 20, 201744 votes

Nope. I'm the technical lead for the player behavior team.

I architect the systems.

rtbf225618241Oct 20, 201718 votes

You should have just said:

"Hello, IAmTheGoatOfWar,

I am the Architect."

lazerateOct 20, 20171 votes

Still banned tho? :( re logged and everything....

RiotRiot TantramOct 20, 201736 votes

I double checked. You're unbanned.

Kei143Oct 21, 20176 votes

Justice question, and if you can't answer it due to privacy policies, I understand.

Would you be tracing those accounts down to the main account as well? Cos I'm sure those trolls are not using their main accounts to do this.

Also, this fellow was also a victim of such scheme. I hope you can unban him as well, if he hasn't been unbanned already.

He writes that the troll had a compliance and was doing it for giggles to show on discord as well, and I wish all the compliances will also be punished.

CowseedOct 19, 20176 votes

If someone tells you to say something or else X mute them. But if you're planning to play along out of fear look for keywords "neck" or the pronoun "yourself"

Neck here is most obviously referring to hanging. Don't type anything that refers to the anatomy of vita organs or body parts associated with suicide attents.

As another guy said just don't say anything. But I'm gonna add only if you're not sure. I'd say that around 70% of the time you press enter in game and say something you are reported by some troll or hypersensitive snowflake.

HalcyonDwellerOct 19, 20178 votes

That thresh wasn't a 'snowflake' that thresh was a malicious sack of garbage.

~~Don't use this poster's situation to further the cause of labeling everyone a 'snowflake' just for wanting a game they can have fun in without worrying about abuse.~~

Edit, that was rude and inflammatory, I apologize.

The people you refer to as 'snowflakes' are nothing like the malicious trolls who actively try to get others banned.

CowseedOct 19, 20171 votes

Yes the people I'm refering to as snowflakes are like the malicious trolls. I'm talking about people that will look at stray comments not directed at them and get offended when the inteded recipient/rest of the team can understand the humor and exaggerate the issue for attention or to satisfy some wierd 'justice' fetish.

I never called the thresh a 'snowflake'. The word snowflake is two words across from the word 'troll' ~~which you obvious know I'm refering to him as but ironically are trying to use this to further your cause.~~ I'm not doing anything of that sorts. I'm being realistic because it's common knowledge that people like this are rampant in the world an especially on the internet.

I'm not talking about legit abuse like being harrassed and griefed all game. I mean the salty dude that will report you for typing "?", or "whew" in all chat when you manage to survive a gank or burst combo with 3 hp. ~~So please don't let this drag on to the point where you'll list a bunch of sob stories and call me toxic. That's how these usually go and I'm not in for that today.~~

General Esdeath Oct 19, 20175 votes

Or don't be dumb and report him at the end for a permaban?

xxdestratimonxxOct 19, 201719 votes

I didn't have a chance to report him because I immediately received a message that my account is suspended and the game signed off. When I restart the client I got the banned reform card and no way for me to get to end game menu and file report against him

General Esdeath Oct 19, 20174 votes

No as in, don't say anything so you WON'T get banned.

xxdestratimonxxOct 19, 201710 votes

{quoted}

No as in, don't say anything so you WON'T get banned.

Thanks that would probably be the smartest choice. I was just under alot of pressure during that game due the fact that it's a promo serie and I only need to win one more game to advance makes it's really hard to deal with trolls sometimes.

DuskDaUmbreonOct 19, 20171 votes

I didn't have a chance to report him because I immediately received a message that my account is suspended

Then it wasn't for this game. It was for a different one. It takes a few minutes for a report to clear.

Telephone BoothOct 19, 20174 votes

{quoted}

Then it wasn't for this game. It was for a different one. It takes a few minutes for a report to clear.

Wrong

DuskDaUmbreonOct 20, 20171 votes

Erm. I've heard it from other officials, so...

TrulyBlandOct 20, 20175 votes

And there's another official right in this thread that unbanned OP because it was exactly like they said it was. newer and more specific source > older and more general source

I mean, what you said is probably true-ish, in that it usually takes a bit of time for the system to review a game. But in this case the logs were extremely short and a zero-tolerance phrase was repeated four times in the very first line of chat. That's not a review that should take a lot of time for their algorithm.

Colgate GatorOct 19, 20175 votes

INB4 OP isn't an innocent dove and whoever upvoted this feels like a foo'.

But hey, I could be wrong and you actually were...uh..entraped? Time will tell.

HalcyonDwellerOct 19, 201727 votes

Best thing we can do in this situation is upvote it, that way Riot Tantram will see it and respond. Then if they are innocent then they will be helped, and if they are guilty then they will be publicly punished for being a manipulative twat. Either way, upvoting is the best choice.

xxdestratimonxxOct 19, 201730 votes

Thank you for the support. You guys are awesome

RiotRiot TantramOct 19, 2017128 votes

You're unbanned, and I've re-instated your honor level. I'll take care of this issue.

xxdestratimonxxOct 19, 20177 votes

On my profile it still stated my honor level at 0. Maybe it takes a while for the system to re-register?

RiotRiot TantramOct 19, 201751 votes

Try and relog. There is a bit of caching that takes place in the client that the system normally updates. Those cache update triggers don't get execute when manual ninja skills are employed.

Jo0oOct 19, 201715 votes

Whoa, didn't expect that. What went wrong?

RiotRiot TantramOct 19, 2017115 votes

They were held hostage by a player that coerced them into saying zero tolerance phrases under threat of feeding.

I'm working on a systematic solution for this atm. We can also easily query for players doing this and they will be perma-banned.

ModPeriscopeOct 19, 20173 votes

Doesn't have the word "ninja" in it, but still awesome.

nGioOct 19, 201713 votes

Cool move. It's nice to see someone from Riot swing in to save a dude's account so quickly, when he didn't deserve a ban.

themachampOct 20, 201715 votes

[{quoted}](name=Riot Tantram,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=OeZ3ipZB,comment-id=000700000000000000010000,timestamp=2017-10-19T22:07:02.851+0000)

They were held hostage by a player that coerced them into saying zero tolerance phrases under threat of feeding.

I'm working on a systematic solution for this atm. We can also easily query for players doing this and they will be perma-banned.

whoa whoa whoa!....hold on now....

(Before i continue. I'm not for or against the OP) Wtf, people get baited and trolled all the time from other people ruining their games and getting them to flame/be toxic. When we write in to Riot about it, we basically just get the cop out( lazy) response of "you are responsible for your own chat no matter what anyone else SAYS or DOES, yata yata, mute and ping to communicate ". This un-banning is just a slap in the face to riot's own posted rules in the support section and echo chambered by every player support staff i have ever wrote into. How come I have to shut up and take it every time i get a troll/am held hostage/flamed etc. and if i say anything i get banned but this player gets a free pass for an apparent escalation ban? Does this mean riot will finally take context into account? Or is this just a case of a lucky player getting upvoted and actually get a real investigation into his case? I mean if this player gets a pass because he was trolled/held hostage then I implore you to change your policies so that everyone can get a fair judgement.... because typing back to an oppressor gets a lot of otherwise good players punished.

RiotRiot TantramOct 20, 201782 votes

Getting baited into lashing out, or raging at people is completely different than someone specifically telling you that you are REQUIRED to say SPECIFIC zero tolerance phrases or they will feed.

Hexs FortuneOct 20, 201736 votes

[{quoted}](name=Riot Tantram,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=OeZ3ipZB,comment-id=00070000000000000001000000030000,timestamp=2017-10-20T02:27:56.103+0000)

Getting baited into lashing out, or raging at people is completely different than someone specifically telling you that you are REQUIRED to say SPECIFIC zero tolerance phrases or they will feed.

Stuff like this makes me sick. Thanks for correcting this.

themachampOct 20, 201713 votes

[{quoted}](name=Riot Tantram,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=OeZ3ipZB,comment-id=00070000000000000001000000030000,timestamp=2017-10-20T02:27:56.103+0000)

Getting baited into lashing out, or raging at people is completely different than someone specifically telling you that you are REQUIRED to say SPECIFIC zero tolerance phrases or they will feed.

Different...but similar in many ways as well, but nevertheless, it clearly violates(bullet points taken from the support website):

-Remember that you are fully responsible for all activity on your account, and if suspensions or bans are incurred, we will not be able to modify them.

-Should you encounter a particularly toxic player, remember that silence is a powerful tool. You can utilize the /mute and /ignore functions in game to avoid viewing further negativity. You can also make use of the Smart Ping feature for communication with the rest of your team.

You alone are responsible for your actions within the game.If you encounter a toxic player like this, the best option is to simply report their behavior and move on.

Either the rules apply to everyone or they don't. If Riot picks and chooses what rules to follow then it erodes player confidence and diminishes Riot's credibility.

So, if this is not considered to be baiting or lashing out then...what is it? Being held hostage? If so, I assure you there are plenty of players out there who got punishments( that were never overturned) because they said something to their hostage taker.

No flash no lifeOct 20, 20176 votes

{quoted}

-Remember that you are fully responsible for all activity on your account, and if suspensions or bans are incurred, we will not be able to modify them.

Actually if it's proven to be a mistake then the ban can be lifted.

You alone are responsible for your actions within the game.

Either the rules apply to everyone or they don't. If Riot picks and chooses what rules to follow then it erodes player confidence and diminishes Riot's credibility.

You have a very good point there that I want to discuss. Indeed, even if let's say someone points a gun at you irl and threatens you to flame, you're still going to receive the consequences because you did flame at your teammates regardless. However, that no longer holds true if the context of hate speech doesn't serve the purpose of flaming.

Say, you're the only one left alive and half dead after teamfight, 4 of your opponents are pushing to win and 1 is chasing you down to enemy tower, should you struggle to survive? No, you need to die so you can respawn asap and protect your nexus, assuming walking back isn't an option.

In that kind of situation, if your dead teammates tell you to kill yourself, do they deserve to be banned? Hell no.

Similarly, when our OP here typed in the hate speech, does he/she actually mean harm? Quite the opposite, the OP simply gave what his/her teammate demanded for, attempting to bring the game toward the right direction, and it wasn't directed at anyone else, so there is no flaming context to anyone in the game and a ban due to verbal abuse does not apply.

Or what, if I type "lulu u so cute I wanna kyss u" I deserve a ban?

themachampOct 20, 201714 votes

[{quoted}](name=No flash no life,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=OeZ3ipZB,comment-id=0007000000000000000100000003000000010000,timestamp=2017-10-20T04:02:11.140+0000)

Actually if it's proven to be a mistake then the ban can be lifted.

You have a very good point there that I want to discuss. Indeed, even if let's say someone points a gun at you irl and threatens you to flame, you're still going to receive the consequences because you did flame at your teammates regardless. However, that no longer holds true if the context of hate speech doesn't serve the purpose of flaming.

Say, you're the only one left alive and half dead after teamfight, 4 of your opponents are pushing to win and 1 is chasing you down to enemy tower, should you struggle to survive? No, you need to die so you can respawn asap and protect your nexus, assuming walking back isn't an option.

In that kind of situation, if your dead teammates tell you to kill yourself, do they deserve to be banned? Hell no.

Similarly, when our OP here typed in the hate speech, does he/she actually mean harm? Quite the opposite, the OP simply gave what his/her teammate demanded for, attempting to bring the game toward the right direction, and it wasn't directed at anyone else, so there is no flaming context to anyone in the game and a ban due to verbal abuse does not apply.

Or what, if I type "lulu u so cute I wanna kyss u" I deserve a ban?

I agree with about 95% of what you said. Here is the big issue for me:

1st off, it is good that this form of trolling is finally being addressed....props. The issue i have is that riot selectively took context into account when they have clearly stated that it doesn't matter and you are 100% responsible for what you do and say. Look at it like this...player A get deaths threats from a pre-made and says some things back to them then gets banned. He writes in to riot support and basically gets an "fu banned deserved" and is told context and what other people say don't matter, the only thing that matters is what he said. Now player B is trolled by having some guy to threatening to run it down mid less they say hate speech. He reaches out and is told.."hey man we took everything into account and even though you used hate speech we will un ban you and erase it from your account."

Now player A really feels like crap because riot basically said that saying "fuck you" to someone threatening to come kill you is not excusable... but saying hate speech is, if someone threatens to run it down mid if you don't say it. Riot literally just justified saying something to/for a troll threatening to ruin your game but will keep you banned if someone threatened your life and you said something.

tl;dr: Context should be taken into account for everybody or nobody. You can't just go....oh you were a victim of this type of trolling? here is your unban....while telling everyone else that context doesn't matter and you are 100% responsible despite all circumstances.

No flash no lifeOct 20, 20178 votes

{quoted}

tl;dr: Context should be taken into account for everybody or nobody.

This was actually one of my concerns when I was making my point, that some of us might get a bit confused about which context matters and which doesn't.

Context of others are not taken into consideration when you meant harm, but context of your words are taken into account to determine whether you meant harm or not.

To present in a simpler manner:

Case 1. "f u kys"
"dafuq u biatch report x9"

both punished because both contexts meant harm, regardless of what the cause was. Just because someone punched you doesn't mean you can punch it back, that's not how things are appropriately dealt with.

Case 2. (2 monkey teammates died, other 2 defending inhib turret) "singed u useless piece of ** never group, come and def with us now or report x9"

(teammates got caught before teleport could complete, 0 chance to defend 3v5 so singed is proxy stalling) "I'm running down mid"

If you take it by facial value, what singed said can be interpreted as int'ing, hence punishable. But in reality that's not what he meant. He meant good will by all means, and that is when his context proves him innocent. This is basically what OP did. OP didn't mean for the teammate to kys when he typed " neck yourself", the message OP delivered is "okay if you insist I'll give you what you want if that's what it takes for us to enjoy the game together".

TL;DR context of your words matter, but context of others' words/actions don't.

Marios Half BroNov 3, 20171 votes

So, this is really late, but I'm just curious to hear your response. You say the rules apply to everyone or they don't, and I just have to ask why. If you can have a moral judgement that the rule is wrong in specific cases and right in others, why isn't that ok. It's not like anything bad happens, either the rule stands, as you want it to, or a person is manually judged to be in the right, in the moral clear.

There are situations where rules have to be rules, you can't say no, I don't think 2+2 will equal 4 today, its just a moral gray area, but a cop can issue a parking ticket instead of a speeding ticket if he deems that you're not a bad person, just unlucky or having an off day. I think it applies perfectly here, if Tantrum deems that this specific situation is totally morally clear, then so what, a few people who aren't toxic anyway get their accounts back. Its a win/win in my book.

themachampNov 3, 20174 votes

[{quoted}](name=Marios Half Bro,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=OeZ3ipZB,comment-id=0007000000000000000100000003000000010002,timestamp=2017-11-03T08:50:32.371+0000)

So, this is really late, but I'm just curious to hear your response. You say the rules apply to everyone or they don't, and I just have to ask why. If you can have a moral judgement that the rule is wrong in specific cases and right in others, why isn't that ok. It's not like anything bad happens, either the rule stands, as you want it to, or a person is manually judged to be in the right, in the moral clear.

There are situations where rules have to be rules, you can't say no, I don't think 2+2 will equal 4 today, its just a moral gray area, but a cop can issue a parking ticket instead of a speeding ticket if he deems that you're not a bad person, just unlucky or having an off day. I think it applies perfectly here, if Tantrum deems that this specific situation is totally morally clear, then so what, a few people who aren't toxic anyway get their accounts back. Its a win/win in my book.

It's the fact that Riot just pick and choses at random. Example.....i get a tahm kench that trolls me all game by following me in the jungle and eating me so he can smite the buffs. I call him a pos and get banned. I write in and basically get told that im responsible 100% mute the troll and just take it up the ass. I report the troll with screen shots but nothing ever happens( that player never missed a day in nearly a year). I get no context taken into account or anything special.

Yet with this case they are being treated differently because they were ..i guess "trolled hard enough.....or trolled in a different way?" but at the end of the day they chose to type and got banned for it. Unbanning them makes all of their posts on toxicity mute as they are picking and choosing what players to save and which players get the big FU. When , at the end of the day.....a lot of the verbal abuse comes from non verbal trolling. Ik I can only speak for my games but its very rare to see a verbal abuser that was not preceded by some form of non verbal trolling.

Short version....if they make special exceptions for some they should make it for all. I don't have a probelem with them make moral choices but make it for everyone, not just a select few.

Marios Half BroNov 6, 20171 votes

But what I'm trying to say is, context was taken into account. Yes you were provoked, but even with that taken into account, you still said the words, you still put the energy, and the emotion behind them. This post is about someone saying key phrases to no one in particular, with no meaning, simply so someone else wouldnt troll. There's no ill intent in the posts situation, but when you call the trolling tahm kench a pos, you start to give up the moral high ground.

One situation is someone trying to prevent a troll, the other situation is giving in and sinking to their level. Special exceptions do exist for all, just for all people in the situation outlined. How long is it before we get trolls start to try to justify, 'they missing pinged me, so I int'ed, either we should both be banned, or neither should.'

themachampNov 7, 20175 votes

[{quoted}](name=Marios Half Bro,realm=NA,application-id=ZGEFLEUQ,discussion-id=OeZ3ipZB,comment-id=000700000000000000010000000300000001000200000001,timestamp=2017-11-06T18:34:38.639+0000)

But what I'm trying to say is, context was taken into account. Yes you were provoked, but even with that taken into account, you still said the words, you still put the energy, and the emotion behind them. This post is about someone saying key phrases to no one in particular, with no meaning, simply so someone else wouldnt troll. There's no ill intent in the posts situation, but when you call the trolling tahm kench a pos, you start to give up the moral high ground.

One situation is someone trying to prevent a troll, the other situation is giving in and sinking to their level. Special exceptions do exist for all, just for all people in the situation outlined. How long is it before we get trolls start to try to justify, 'they missing pinged me, so I int'ed, either we should both be banned, or neither should.'

The OP put the same effort into typing as I did. Even if they had no "targets" the robot that is the IFS still registers it. If i typed kys 3x and it was directed at no one....it is still registered as hate speech. Sadly this has nothing to do with a moral high ground or or anything as we are dealing with a robot.

That maybe true but nevertheless, Riot is still picking and choosing which accounts get saved while other get the same song and dance of you are 100% responsible for what is done on your account, under no circumstances will we overturn or reduce the ban, yata. On the support web site and in numerous Riot support emails they state to mute and report at end of game. In this case the OP chose to type and was not held accountable....according to Riot's very own support posts....he should have just let the troll run it down mid or w/e while muting him and reporting him. For 99.9% of all cases where people got mad/coerced/baited etc. Riot keeps the ban intact. tells us we are 100% responsible for what happens, and the way to deal with trolls is to basically mute, bend over and take it, then report after the game. Never any special consideration or mercy.

This Is Your DadOct 19, 20175 votes

Stories like this give me hope for the system. Just like any system, loopholes will be created and exploited, and a system that can fluctuate as a living entity, by evolving and getting "vaccinated", is a pretty damn good system.

FegoneOct 19, 20172 votes

I don't get why "neck yourself" would get you banned to begin with. But you're in an unfortunate situation. I dk what I would do, either risk getting banned or losing the promo game for sure.. tough choice..